Found Alive WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *Arrest* #41

[Lillymac]

It was her dream if she got money. Her dream is being answered!

Be careful what you dream for...

 

[MsBetsy]

Yes, that's all it was is storage. The house I lived in was built in the 1980's. Closs home seems to be 1970's or 1980's to me but I don't know if we ever figured out when it was built. I recall they purchased the home in 2001.

I think it was built in the seventies. At least that's what was posted many threads ago. Imo

 

[Rubiconbob]

Okay, but why on earth would they spray Luminol on the outside of the patio doors?

I can't remember what thread it was, but this was discussed ad infinitum for pages. Not that I had anything to do with all that or anything.

Rule out repelling ninjas?

 

[Lillymac]

If people are going to send gift cards then IMO, something like the local cinema or her favorite restaurant, or even Amazon where she could get whatever she wanted would be more appropriate. I guess I don't really understand the sentiment behind sending strangers, especially kids, random clothing. If she'd lost all her clothes due to a natural disaster or something and the family was trying to replace everything, that's one thing. Just just as a random gift? I honestly have trouble wrapping my head around that. I have kids and nephews/nieces and it's hard enough knowing what they like one day to the next as it is-and I know them.

I think a college tuition fund or a savings account would also be nice.

 

[SeekingJana]

The family would still have two, front door and patio door. The guest would have the garage doors and windows is the way I meant it. At the very least. But there would be no access from guest to family inside the house. I don't mean built that way, I mean doing it for a temporary situation.

I don't understand your thoughts about how long the people would be in the basement to need a barrier to the rest of the house. I concede your point with good humor.

 

[mtnlites]

I think a college tuition fund or a savings account would also be nice.

That may be what they're going to do with some of the money from the fundraiser that's been created. It's a good idea.

 

[SeekingJana]

I think a college tuition fund or a savings account would also be nice.

LOVE this idea most of all, like 1000 times.
If there isn't already a college tuition fund started for her by relatives, it may be that they haven't gotten to it, but this is a clear and present need with a 13 year old.
James may have started one when she was very young, we don't know. In any case, it could be added to, or a new one started.

 

[Gardener1850]

This has been my whole issue with wanting to know where the stairs were. I can't offer criticism over what decisions were made in that house that night, but it would seem that the bathroom essentially sealed their fates. Had at least Jayme made a break for the stairs or patio, things may have turned out very differently. She would have only needed to evade this situation for about 30 seconds (all else being equal with the timeline), and bad guy would have been trapped there by the deputy.

I agree they had little time to make any choices and probably made the fastest one they could to hide in the tub in the locked bathroom, even pulling open the bathroom drawers to further barricade the door-- I thought that was very smart thinking. I think he would have chased them out the patio door because it seems likely it can be seen from the front door. Plus it was cold and they probably didn't have shoes on. Plus they didn't know how many bad guys there were or what they wanted. They made the best choices they could at the time and nothing they could have done could have changed things much since JTP went there prepared to murder. JMO.

 

[Lillymac]

LOVE 1000 times.
If there isn't already a college tuition fund started for her by relatives, it may be that they haven't gotten to it, but this is a clear and present need with a 13 year old.
James may have started one when she was very young, we don't know.

Yes, and just my feelings, this seems to be a very proactive family.

 

[ilovechili]

FWIW one of our windows has the exact same thing and it's stained the wood underneath. No idea what it is. Feels rough to the touch,like rougher soap scum, and no amount of scrubbing will get it off. In this case maybe it IS luminol. And yeah, before this convo completely derails the thread, I'm stepping out. I apparently missed out on a big thing when I took a few weeks' break from the board. I don't remember this convo from before so I wasn't sure how it played into anything.

It related in the sense of none of knew anything and were speculating about patio door entry and more. It could still possibly relate, it is difficult to say, to investigation, luminol, etc. Some of it is simply people lightening up and brought up what was talked about back when very little was known.

 

[Rubiconbob]

I think a college tuition fund or a savings account would also be nice.

I’m conflicted on tuition or savings account.
At some point your gonna want nothing tied to this...

If you have tuition or savings account... your essentially locking that to horrific memory.
Someone asks her at 21 why she doesn’t have to worry about tuition... awkward link..
Sentiment is good.... I just think u would not want everything and every event tied to tough 90 days.. guess if it was all paid to aunt she could allocate as needed to help ..

Dunno it’s an odd donation..

 

[The Dude]

Rule out repelling ninjas?

repelling? I thought they were ATV ninjas?

This did get me thinking that maybe there might be people who may be unfamiliar with what bad guy was wearing, as in a balaclava.

Balaclava (clothing) - Wikipedia

Of course, this is not to be confused with baklava, which is a tasty pastry and hard to wear on your face.

Clowns, however, are still on my radar.

 

[ilovechili]

I don't understand your thoughts about how long the people would be in the basement to need a barrier to the rest of the house. I concede your point with good humor.

lol. i have no doubt i am not coming across clearly or something. i guess what i mean is inspectors do not live in a home. i was just thinking that if for some reason the family could not get down the stairs fast (if it crossed their mind), maybe it was blocked, locked, etc. maybe no one lived down there but maybe it was just shut off. they are still with exits on the main level. or that maybe they let someone stay and shut off the basement access for safety and privacy.

i will let it go as well if i am still not putting it correctly. i know of people who lived in someone's garage and paid rent (unattached garage) for years. the regulators either never knew it or ignored it. just saying yes, there are codes but the regulators of those codes do not live there. i have seen fully finished basements with bedrooms people stayed in that there are no windows big enough for an adult to get out of and no exit other than the inner stairs.

in the closs house, if a person was downstairs living or sleeping, there are garage doors if they have a remote or access to open and there are egress sized windows, necessary to have a bedroom in a basement.

just trying to clarify my thoughts and what i meant but if we miss each other still, that is fine

appreciate all of your well thought out posts.

 

[SeekingJana]

I agree they had little time to make any choices and probably made the fastest one they could to hide in the tub in the locked bathroom, even pulling open the bathroom drawers to further barricade the door-- I thought that was very smart thinking. I think he would have chased them out the patio door because it seems likely it can be seen from the front door. Plus it was cold and they probably didn't have shoes on. Plus they didn't know how many bad guys there were or what they wanted. They made the best choices they could at the time and nothing they could have done could have changed things much since JTP went there prepared to murder. JMO.

I've lived in 2 very large houses with basements... Both post- trauma.. I was leery of any sound or anything because of the very clear and easy access -one had French doors and patio sliders and the other had a huge custom made door at street level which once was the family's garage door. You couldn't tell as the house had been remodeled professionally by the original master builder.
It might be that Jayme ( or Denise) or both didn't want to go down into the basement when JP was blasting in their door. I just don't know. Maybe he's a lying liar who lies and kills and Jayme did make it to the basement but not out of it. I don't think she did, but we really don't know if he subdued her and got out in 4 minutes just because he says so. Or that she never made any moves out of the bathroom but I'd have stayed with my mother at that age...

JP went into a fairly ooey gooey descriptive term for a fresh multiple murderer when he said Denise had Jayme in a " bear hug". It's a warm and fuzzy description, at least in my personal vocabulary, when they were his prey.... Things like this in his narrative in the official CC make me think he's saying what people think he should say based on movies and things. A Sociopath will MIMIC from movies and TV very often.

 

[mtnlites]

lol. i have no doubt i am not coming across clearly or something. i guess what i mean is inspectors do not live in a home. i was just thinking that if for some reason the family could not get down the stairs fast (if it crossed their mind), maybe it was blocked, locked, etc. maybe no one lived down there but maybe it was just shut off. they are still with exits on the main level. or that maybe they let someone stay and shut off the basement access for safety and privacy.

i will let it go as well if i am still not putting it correctly. i know of people who lived in someone's garage and paid rent (unattached garage) for years. the regulators either never knew it or ignored it. just saying yes, there are codes but the regulators of those codes do not live there. i have seen fully finished basements with bedrooms people stayed in that there are no windows big enough for an adult to get out of and no exit other than the inner stairs.

in the closs house, if a person was downstairs living or sleeping, there are garage doors if they have a remote or access to open and there are egress sized windows, necessary to have a bedroom in a basement.

just trying to clarify my thoughts and what i meant but if we miss each other still, that is fine

appreciate all of your well thought out posts.

Oh yeah, people around here live in each other's basements, garages, extra rooms etc and nobody ever knows or asks any questions. Rent is collected and they have their own space but nothing official is ever done about it.

 

[ilovechili]

repelling? I thought they were ATV ninjas?

This did get me thinking that maybe there might be people who may be unfamiliar with what bad guy was wearing, as in a balaclava.

Balaclava (clothing) - Wikipedia

Of course, this is not to be confused with baklava, which is a tasty pastry and hard to wear on your face.

Clowns, however, are still on my radar.

I see through you competing for my award....

With regard to his mask though, there went the theories of many of us (and I had them at times too) that the parents were shot because they could identify the perp. He was masked, gloved, etc. so that does not seem to be the case. It seems he meant to kill no matter what.

 

[SeekingJana]

I’m conflicted on tuition or savings account.
At some point your gonna want nothing tied to this...

If you have tuition or savings account... your essentially locking that to horrific memory.
Someone asks her at 21 why she doesn’t have to worry about tuition... awkward link..
Sentiment is good.... I just think u would not want everything and every event tied to tough 90 days.. guess if it was all paid to aunt she could allocate as needed to help ..

Dunno it’s an odd donation..

I respectfully disagree because college is her FUTURE.
Doing something for her FUTURE is a very positive thing to do.

If we are going to try to think of everything that will or might be linked to a memory, I can tell you, it's massive for some people and part of post- trauma counseling has to do with focusing on the present and the future.

As Elizabeth Smart said because she also lived through such trauma, " creating a new normal".

 

[Lillymac]

I’m conflicted on tuition or savings account.
At some point your gonna want nothing tied to this...

If you have tuition or savings account... your essentially locking that to horrific memory.
Someone asks her at 21 why she doesn’t have to worry about tuition... awkward link..
Sentiment is good.... I just think u would not want everything and every event tied to tough 90 days.. guess if it was all paid to aunt she could allocate as needed to help ..

Dunno it’s an odd donation..

Just thinking practically. I really don't care. Not my business.

 

[Rubiconbob]

repelling? I thought they were ATV ninjas?

This did get me thinking that maybe there might be people who may be unfamiliar with what bad guy was wearing, as in a balaclava.

Balaclava (clothing) - Wikipedia

Of course, this is not to be confused with baklava, which is a tasty pastry and hard to wear on your face.

Clowns, however, are still on my radar.

Pastry humor aside, (pretty sweet post)

Balclava are popular around where I live..
But if I see someone on porch at 1 am I’m calling 911 even if they say car trouble.. this guy came to shoot in about 5 seconds so can’t fault James, and can’t fault phones being in kitchen, that likely kept family off Netflix @ 2 am.

I wonder if he truly had no clue on ring cam or not for closs home... that’s pretty ballsy to do what he did and disregard possible camera... but I guess 6 ft doughy white guys in Wisconsin doesn’t narrow down much.

 

[Bluebythec]

No. You can have the most well thought out plan in history and still make a mistake.
MOO

It seems to me that the part he *did* plan, the actual abduction, went perfectly for him. The failure was in the second part, which was keeping her. So if you look at it as two things, the first was indeed well planned and executed. The second, not so much and I think it's because he never thought beyond the "getting" and made good plans for the "keeping" MOO