Found Alive WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *Arrest* #41

[MsBetsy]

Regarding the planning of the crime, there seems to be some confusion between planning and risk. Military and law enforcement operations are well planned, but there is always risk involved, as evidenced by the dead and wounded.

Perfect explanation. I was thinking of that but could not put into words! No matter how well you plan, there are always things beyond your control that can occur. Imo

 

[mtnlites]

If the stairwell entrance was visible from any of the living room windows that may have been another good reason not to go that way. Run into the bathroom that's right next door or take a run for the basement stairs and risk being seen by the intruder. It would've been a decision that was made very quickly without much time to think.

 

[SeekingJana]

Here:

Imgur

OK, what I think is that maybe there are 2 different things in the photo. One is that the wood is different colored in several places on the inside frame. IDK why, it just IS.
The other is that there appears to be some sort of damage to the siding which fits up against the door on one side. It could be from birds or maybe storm damage. IDK.

The other issue with the photo is a cloudiness and dripping inside. I believe it well could be Luminol or another bio-reactive spray in the post- crime scene processing.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

LOL... welcome to the dark side.

The pink thing is a retractable dog leash.

Not condensation - it's on the outside.

If you look at the door starting at the outside rail down it looks like brown not white

 

[mtnlites]

Ok, to me it just looks like streaks of something, like maybe someone cleaned it and then left streaks of water mixed with dust and dirt from the way they wiped it. Or maybe water that drizzled down in a weird pattern and froze.

I'm kind of lost. Is there a reason why we're trying to figure out what that is? Just wondering if I missed something.

 

[MsBetsy]

Okay, but why on earth would they spray Luminol on the outside of the patio doors?

I can't remember what thread it was, but this was discussed ad infinitum for pages. Not that I had anything to do with all that or anything.

I thought you meant the front door until I saw the picture. But I remember LE did spend some time looking at the sliding glass doors.

 

[Gracie55]

I wonder how long they last, how many are burgundy, and how many last under the salt conditions of winter roads?

Are there more than a black unknown SUV?

Looks like one of the pumpkins had an "accident" IMO. The biggest pumpkin has a guilty expression, too. Just look at those eyes!. . . IMO LOL


ETA: here's the link to the image Dude posted
Imgur

I wonder who colored the pumpkin?are they store bought or leftovers from other times? Who colored them and when? And put them up? Was it more recent? If so it seems odd he'd decorate for Halloween but how telling if they're left up.

 

[peace9274]

Deleted

 

[Gardener1850]

Jayme survived what would have destroyed most people.

12 hours under his bed? The murders? Ride in a trunk? One minute of any of that would be more than I could bear.

Who knows what she was eating.

And the liquor bottles. They look like stuff teens drink. I wonder if he was getting liquid courage and also forcing her to drink it.

I wonder what kind of things he read. We know the survival manuals. I wonder what kind of stuff they say

I also wondered if he made Jayme drink or drugged her by putting something in her food? It would be another way to keep her from going anywhere when he was going to be out of the house. I thought of that when she didn't accept any food or drink from the people helping her after she escaped. Whatever she was given to eat by JTP she may never want to eat it again or she may struggle with PTSD whenever she eats some food similar to what he gave her. JMO.

 

[MsBetsy]

I'm kind of lost. Is there a reason why we're trying to figure out what that is? Just wondering if I missed something.

I have no idea. Someone asked what it was, maybe thinking it had something to do with evidence? I missed the start of the conversation.

 

[ilovechili]

I have to laugh. The juice box guy got his thread back to stairs and goop

I think it is a reflection of a tree lol. Or melted snowball. The mark on the bottom is unrelated or dripped and was still wet/froze. I could also see luminol, etc. being a possibility.

I am NOT joining in any hitch conversation if it goes there.

Just saying

 

[Gardener1850]

here we go again..lol...it is a dog leash I think is what was decided.

edit to add the pink thing is.

Dog leash makes sense. I hope Jayme has a new leash to walk Molly now. I hope she gets to take a walk or go in her aunt's backyard to play with Molly without the press hounding her.

 

[The Dude]

If the stairwell entrance was visible from any of the living room windows that may have been another good reason not to go that way. Run into the bathroom that's right next door or take a run for the basement stairs and risk being seen by the intruder. It would've been a decision that was made very quickly without much time to think.

This has been my whole issue with wanting to know where the stairs were. I can't offer criticism over what decisions were made in that house that night, but it would seem that the bathroom essentially sealed their fates. Had at least Jayme made a break for the stairs or patio, things may have turned out very differently. She would have only needed to evade this situation for about 30 seconds (all else being equal with the timeline), and bad guy would have been trapped there by the deputy.

 

[MsBetsy]

I wonder who colored the pumpkin?are they store bought or leftovers from other times? Who colored them and when? And put them up? Was it more recent? If so it seems odd he'd decorate for Halloween but how telling if they're left up.

I'm assuming they were put up right before Halloween. The pictures were taken days after the murder. Imo

 

[SeekingJana]

Okay, but why on earth would they spray Luminol on the outside of the patio doors?

I can't remember what thread it was, but this was discussed ad infinitum for pages. Not that I had anything to do with all that or anything.

I thought you said it was on the INSIDE of the door. So sorry.

Could any kind of insect spray leave that kind of residue? Like if they saw an insect nest up high near the doors like we get here, spray it, some of it runs onto the patio door?

Could it be something like soap bubble residue from when Jayme was younger and had parties? Kids love soap bubbles until they're about 7, so 6 years ago, maybe? Not sure it would have clung on.. Also, no reason to think they were not neat and clean. The outside of their property looked like they cared very much about their property to me.

 

[mtnlites]

I have to laugh. The juice box guy got his thread back to stairs and goop

I think it is a reflection of a tree lol. Or melted snowball. The mark on the bottom is unrelated or dripped and was still wet/froze. I could also see luminol, etc. being a possibility.

I am NOT joining in any hitch conversation if it goes there.

Just saying

FWIW one of our windows has the exact same thing and it's stained the wood underneath. No idea what it is. Feels rough to the touch,like rougher soap scum, and no amount of scrubbing will get it off. In this case maybe it IS luminol. And yeah, before this convo completely derails the thread, I'm stepping out. I apparently missed out on a big thing when I took a few weeks' break from the board. I don't remember this convo from before so I wasn't sure how it played into anything.

 

[SeekingJana]

I also wondered if he made Jayme drink or drugged her by putting something in her food? It would be another way to keep her from going anywhere when he was going to be out of the house. I thought of that when she didn't accept any food or drink from the people helping her after she escaped. Whatever she was given to eat by JTP she may never want to eat it again or she may struggle with PTSD whenever she eats some food similar to what he gave her. JMO.

Her refusal to eat or drink anything at a safe place concerned me as well.. It could be that her " fight or flight" instincts which shut down our GI motility were still in action. If so, she'd likely not feel hunger or thirst.
There are also a few other possibilities related to food as a trigger but I don't want to go any further with it.

 

[ilovechili]

Might be a dog gate but IDK about barricading someone IN a basement because of exits in case of fire. They would have 1 exit but if it was large enough to live in, then it likely would need 2 entrances/ exits ( one being stairs) to meet basic fire codes.

The family would still have two, front door and patio door. The guest would have the garage doors and windows is the way I meant it. At the very least. But there would be no access from guest to family inside the house. I don't mean built that way, I mean doing it for a temporary situation.

 

[The Dude]

I'm kind of lost. Is there a reason why we're trying to figure out what that is? Just wondering if I missed something.

It undoubtedly has little or nothing to do with the crime. It's just one of those strange questions that hasn't been answered.

To the Mystery Machine!

 

[mtnlites]

This has been my whole issue with wanting to know where the stairs were. I can't offer criticism over what decisions were made in that house that night, but it would seem that the bathroom essentially sealed their fates. Had at least Jayme made a break for the stairs or patio, things may have turned out very differently. She would have only needed to evade this situation for about 30 seconds (all else being equal with the timeline), and bad guy would have been trapped there by the deputy.

Yeah, in hindsight that would have made sense. But at the time she had no idea who else might be lurking on the patio or back behind the house. They may not have known it was a "bad guy" until they heard the gun shot and at that point only had a few seconds to react. Even JC thought it was LE outside. JP said he searched all the rooms upstairs so he may have gone downstairs, too, if he hadn't found her. Maybe LE would've been there by then, but maybe not.