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CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #2
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Hi All... first time posting here I believe, but I have been disturbed and obsessed with this case since it aired on Disappeared so many years ago...
I know that the state is presenting the evidence regarding cause of death, the sledgehammer, the cut bra, etc in sort of a "this is obviously the murder weapon, and Summer may have been sexually assaulted because of the clothing, and the cause of death is blunt force trauma, etc", but I have some ideas/questions:
I strongly believe that CM knew sometime that day, if not before, that he was going to somehow do away with JM, given the situation with the theft and that JM would DEF be finding out. I also don't believe that CM is a total idiot, he seemed to have gone to great lengths to cover tracks. Isn't it a possibility that he knew he was driving there to kill JM and family and took certain measures? In my mind it is possible that when he showed up to the residence Summer and the kids might have been upstairs and Joey told her to stay up there while he deals with this conversation with CM either in the office or the garage, never thinking CM was going to surprise attack and kill him? CM seems to pride himself on the fact the he was taller and larger than JM and could have easily come from behind him to somehow strangle him with that electrical cord which would prevent JM from making noise that would alert SM and also would leave no blood. With JM out of the pic, he could then have easily gone after Summer and the kids. Any number of items could have prevented blood from being splattered everywhere, such as putting plastic bags over their heads before hitting them with a sledgehammer. Isn't even possible he may have strangled all of them and then hit them in the head a bunch of times in the head while burying them along with this hammer at the gravesite just to stage that it would be a bloody crime scene and there would be no evidence in the house? There are so many possibilities, I wonder if the experts can state for sure that the cracks to the skull happened before or after death, given the years of decomposition and that fact that there was barely anything left? How would they be able to rule out that the family members were smothered if there is nothing left of their throats?
I happen to believe that the cut bra is NOT a sign of sexual assault. This doesn't seem at all like a sexually motivated crime. I DO think though that she was wrapped in something, maybe a tarp or plastic, and then he needed to cut that off to bring it somewhere else to dispose of it because he couldn't leave something that might have his DNA at the gravesite. It is my assumption that her bra could have been cut in the process.
Anyway, just some ideas. CM knew that he was going to be a suspect for sure and I'm pretty sure that he had no intention of leaving a bloody crime scene anywhere because as long as there was no evidence of foul play, the family was just "missing". And that would buy him time to figure out his next steps...
I know that the state is presenting the evidence regarding cause of death, the sledgehammer, the cut bra, etc in sort of a "this is obviously the murder weapon, and Summer may have been sexually assaulted because of the clothing, and the cause of death is blunt force trauma, etc", but I have some ideas/questions:
I strongly believe that CM knew sometime that day, if not before, that he was going to somehow do away with JM, given the situation with the theft and that JM would DEF be finding out. I also don't believe that CM is a total idiot, he seemed to have gone to great lengths to cover tracks. Isn't it a possibility that he knew he was driving there to kill JM and family and took certain measures? In my mind it is possible that when he showed up to the residence Summer and the kids might have been upstairs and Joey told her to stay up there while he deals with this conversation with CM either in the office or the garage, never thinking CM was going to surprise attack and kill him? CM seems to pride himself on the fact the he was taller and larger than JM and could have easily come from behind him to somehow strangle him with that electrical cord which would prevent JM from making noise that would alert SM and also would leave no blood. With JM out of the pic, he could then have easily gone after Summer and the kids. Any number of items could have prevented blood from being splattered everywhere, such as putting plastic bags over their heads before hitting them with a sledgehammer. Isn't even possible he may have strangled all of them and then hit them in the head a bunch of times in the head while burying them along with this hammer at the gravesite just to stage that it would be a bloody crime scene and there would be no evidence in the house? There are so many possibilities, I wonder if the experts can state for sure that the cracks to the skull happened before or after death, given the years of decomposition and that fact that there was barely anything left? How would they be able to rule out that the family members were smothered if there is nothing left of their throats?
I happen to believe that the cut bra is NOT a sign of sexual assault. This doesn't seem at all like a sexually motivated crime. I DO think though that she was wrapped in something, maybe a tarp or plastic, and then he needed to cut that off to bring it somewhere else to dispose of it because he couldn't leave something that might have his DNA at the gravesite. It is my assumption that her bra could have been cut in the process.
Anyway, just some ideas. CM knew that he was going to be a suspect for sure and I'm pretty sure that he had no intention of leaving a bloody crime scene anywhere because as long as there was no evidence of foul play, the family was just "missing". And that would buy him time to figure out his next steps...
tmar
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Would there be photos of CM's tools: a similar sledge hammer amongst them.
Wonder if any prints are found on hammer.
HelenK
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That was his plan, no doubt, but the earth was harder than he expected it to be. He could not take the time. Burying four murder victims is not something that one does at one's leisure. He had to beat it out of there.
tmar
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Welcome Heidi with your first post.
I think your idea that CM may have staged his murders to appear as a bloody crime scene is very plausible, using the hammer at the burial site.
MOO.
Did anyone else catch something weird during Sequidas testimony? Part 1, right around the 22 minute mark. Maline is asking him if chase ever talked to him about his and Joey's relationship .. Pros is objecting, overruled and then Sequidas says something like: "he (chase) said they discussed business which seemed awkward, lying in bed...."
Am I hearing this right?! That chase told Sequida he and Joey would lie in bed together and discuss business? Almost implying Joey and chase were more than friends?? Somebody help me out here and tell me I'm crazy.
Am I hearing this right?! That chase told Sequida he and Joey would lie in bed together and discuss business? Almost implying Joey and chase were more than friends?? Somebody help me out here and tell me I'm crazy.
18 inches deep? Is that—sorry for being morbid—the total depth of the grave, not the amount of soil over the bodies? In any case, the more shallow the grave, the more likely it seems that Merritt had no helper.
HelenK
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Maybe I'm delusional, but wasn't it the defense that said a knife was found in one of the graves? - this being based on a purported confession that DK made to one of his rather compromised girlfriends, who showed up at the last minute, that he had murdered the whole family? I have followed this case from the beginning, and am not aware of the existence a knife ever being mentioned by SB.
I want to see that knife produced, and the girlfriend plunked on the stand. And most certainly the jury will want to see both. Otherwise, the defense can say adios to its credibility.
missy1974
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You are not crazy! LOL I heard it too... it was ... odd and seemed to be glossed over!
I think that could really backfire on Merritt. In the past, hasn’t his defense claimed that he wasn’t physically fit enough to dig the graves?
missy1974
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So, I have just listened to Sequieda's testimony from today. What I came away with was.... Sequieda's father also had issues with Joseph, he was not happy that Joey wasn't sharing the selling price with them, he even called Joey a crook.
Sequieda talked about CM being "gone" in the time leading up to the family's disappearance... the defense seemed to elude to the fact that CM may have been gone away to install water fountains.
The defense was also trying to get it out that the "missing cheque" was actually about a dispute over some insurance money. A water fountain was damaged during shipping, the insurance paid for it, and they rebuilt it, and hadn't been paid for that.
It seemed like the pro's were trying to get Sequieda to say more about why he didn't trust CM but just couldn't get it out of him!!!
Sequieda talked about CM being "gone" in the time leading up to the family's disappearance... the defense seemed to elude to the fact that CM may have been gone away to install water fountains.
The defense was also trying to get it out that the "missing cheque" was actually about a dispute over some insurance money. A water fountain was damaged during shipping, the insurance paid for it, and they rebuilt it, and hadn't been paid for that.
It seemed like the pro's were trying to get Sequieda to say more about why he didn't trust CM but just couldn't get it out of him!!!
That makes sense. But, if you had any place to temporarily hide the bodies, (and I know no evidence of this,) it might feel safer to dig the graves without the bodies present. Then if someone sees you—what can they do? There might be laws against digging holes in the middle of the desert, but I’m sure the penalties aren’t severe. Then, graves dug, you can do the dangerous part fast.
Edited to delete quotes I didn’t mean to include.
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missy1974
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On the timeline in the other forum, it's listed as January 28th...
No Time - Passport search on family desktop - Someone using the McStay's computer search for information about travel to Mexico and passports for children days before they disappeared. Also, a search of the McStay's computer showed someone had gone to the information website About.com to inquire about travel into Mexico and passports for children.
Looking at the communication between JM and CM that day, I don't know that CM would have been in their home that day?
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/threads/mcstay-family-comprehensive-timeline.285143/#post-14733757
Texas Red
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If you dug the graves without backing in your actions would be exposed to anyone that happened to drive by.
Plumeria5
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Could something like that be done remotely? I know when I have had computer problems a tech can control my computer and they sounded like they were from India.
missy1974
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For that to happen, you have to "allow" access. I am not sure how computer savvy Merritt was or is? I don't know if there is any situation that Joey would allow Merritt control of his computer.
It is possible that it was just Joey or Summer. I know that years previous, Summer didn't want to take the kids there, but that doesn't mean she didn't change her mind later on... and it doesn't mean that Joey didn't look it up out of curiosity. He also could have been looking to take his oldest son there. IIRC Joey still went down to Mexico to go surfing with his buddies.
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The more likely explanation would be, it was done after the crime by locally accessing the computer and then backdating the search data to create the deception of the family traveling to Mexico, thus enhancing the value of dumping the Trooper at the border.
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