CO CO - Jaryd Atadero, 3, Comanche Peak, 2 Oct 1999

[HayLouise]

Thanks for that information @Thunder Street

I would definitely be interested in a live chat.

 

[whatsnext]

Me too, @Thunder Street , this case has just too many weird twists and turns, and I have to admit: Jaryd himself caught me with his smile, he's in m thoughts daily. To have some kind of closure for Allyn and the family would be a relief.

 

[K9Enzo]

@Thunder Street - thank you for answering all my questions and with the detail you did (especially because some you had already answered pages back and I overlooked them).

Regarding the sister. I find her statement credible about what her brothers cry sounded like to her. IMO, small children tend to say exactly what they see or hear, no filters. It would have given me pause if she recalled this years later but that was not the case.

I would like to think more on the scent trail between the campsites that the dog indicated on. There's so many variables to consider here. But it's certainly not as easy as the scent ended on a descent to a river, the child went into the water, end of story.

IMO, it's somewhat easy to draw suspicion to certain individuals in the group. These adults really lacked sound judgment. Then the hikers finding the clothing and actually removing some of it, instead of leaving it, marking the area. It makes it even worse that they absolutely thought they belonged to the missing child. They were absolutely aware of the case.

It just puts a pit in my stomach to think of this small child wandering around alone and how scared he had to be.

I will continue to check in on this thread.

 

[Thunder Street]

@K9Enzo,

And thank you for your interest in the case. I am pleased at how much activity has been coming through here lately. This is one of our primary goals at Thunder Street, to get more attention to the case. We couldn't have done it without people like you and the gang here.

I agree with you on all points. Initially the written statement from one of the guys said they deviated off the trail in one spot, where the other guy says it was five hundred feet before that. I highly recommend watching Missing 411 for their interviews alone. They start at about the half hour mark. Let me know what you think.

The question that has perplexed me is the escape route for the perpetrator. I know of only one way an individual or duo could have gotten away unseen (in either direction of the trail), but we have some ideas we need to be out on the trail to test. We hope this happens in late spring some time but nothing set.

I want to be very careful how much I reveal, as I stated above, it could lead to negative circumstances. Keep the questions coming in everyone!

EDIT: Are you an actual K9 handler?

 

[BlkMtnGirl]

@Thunder Street, since you’re asking for questions, the big question I keep coming back to is, why does Mr. Atadero think the sheriff was not interested in pursuing an abduction theory? If this is treading on thin ice, I understand if you don’t answer.

 

[Thunder Street]

@Thunder Street, since you’re asking for questions, the big question I keep coming back to is, why does Mr. Atadero think the sheriff was not interested in pursuing an abduction theory? If this is treading on thin ice, I understand if you don’t answer.

The sheriff made it very clear. He literally vocalized his refusal. He told Allyn he believed Jaryd drowned, but told the media it was a mountain lion, and when confronted on camera about the Mesa Verde sightingsighting he ended his rant saying "Are you as tired of this story as we are?"

He dropped the case after the remains were found. The FBI was never alerted, which is protocol in an abduction scenario due to abduction being a federal felony. Anytime abduction was brought up he would deny it.

 

[BlkMtnGirl]

The sheriff made it very clear. He literally vocalized his refusal. He told Allyn he believed Jaryd drowned, but told the media it was a mountain lion, and when confronted on camera about the Mesa Verde sightingsighting he ended his rant saying "Are you as tired of this story as we are?"

He dropped the case after the remains were found. The FBI was never alerted, which is protocol in an abduction scenario due to abduction being a federal felony. Anytime abduction was brought up he would deny it.

I apologize. I asked the question the wrong way. I agree with you and Mr. Atadero. My question is does he have any idea why the sheriff did not pursue any abduction theories?

 

[Thunder Street]

I apologize. I asked the question the wrong way. I agree with you and Mr. Atadero. My question is does he have any idea why the sheriff did not pursue any abduction theories?

I see what you're saying. It was laziness and incompetence, and a large amount of narcissism. He displayed these characteristics on television and in the office, and this comes from an insider. That is all I can share.

 

[Thunder Street]

Some additional facts I can share is that Alderden and his old boys club always sought out the least political solution to an incident. He threatened two congressmen who were coming to the trail to offer their help. Alderden's gang wanted to be the heroes. It's hard not to think that he was misdirecting on purpose (like in the Johnny Gosch case), but it boils down to Alderden being consumed by his own image.

 

[K9Enzo]

@Thunder Street – I’m not a professional handler. K9Enzo was my husband’s retired dual purpose police K9. We lost him last year at the dignified age of 14. He’s always on my mind. No one could convince him to sit in the sun watching squirrels all day. In retirement, I kept his mind and body busy doing scent detection work for fun with him. I’m in the "working dog training world" you could say, with two dogs currently, that I do various venues with.

 

[Thunder Street]

@K9Enzo,

Thank you. The reason I asked is that a peculiar incident happened after the official search had ended. A scent dog was taken to some sites along a different road in Poudre Canyon some distance away from the Big South. On their way back down from their search area, the dog caught a scent while searching in cadaver mode which led them to the resolution of a 17-year-old murder mystery where a teenage drifter working as a handyman at a resort was murdered and thrown into a mine shaft, which was then dynamited by the perpetrator. The reason I bring this up on Jaryd's thread is because it is an interesting comparison between the search dog teams the Sheriff brought in vs the independent searchers. It adds a lot of weight to the fact that Jaryd was likely taken off trail.

We have a potential theory we're discussing and hope to share with you soon.

 

[MsFacetious]

I am watching the thread anxiously for the new theory. I hope it leads to resolution. I wonder if those same dogs could come back out again? That's pretty amazing they solved the other case.

@Thunder Street – I’m not a professional handler. K9Enzo was my husband’s retired dual purpose police K9. We lost him last year at the dignified age of 14. He’s always on my mind. No one could convince him to sit in the sun watching squirrels all day. In retirement, I kept his mind and body busy doing scent detection work for fun with him. I’m in the "working dog training world" you could say, with two dogs currently, that I do various venues with.

I was going to ask about your name myself. We lost our almost 16 year old Beagle in September, then my animal loving cousin a week later.

Our remaining Beagle doesn't do well alone. So we rescued a half beagle/half heeler with a little bit of border collie and coon hound. I've always had hounds but this dog can track like I've never seen.

Also, he is super FAST. We named him, ENZO. So your screen name caught my attention. Once he's a little older I have no doubt he could be a tracking dog. He doesn't just hang out either, he's got to have a job! That's the heeler in him. They are amazing animals for sure.

 

[K9Enzo]

@K9Enzo,

Thank you. The reason I asked is that a peculiar incident happened after the official search had ended. A scent dog was taken to some sites along a different road in Poudre Canyon some distance away from the Big South. On their way back down from their search area, the dog caught a scent while searching in cadaver mode which led them to the resolution of a 17-year-old murder mystery where a teenage drifter working as a handyman at a resort was murdered and thrown into a mine shaft, which was then dynamited by the perpetrator. The reason I bring this up on Jaryd's thread is because it is an interesting comparison between the search dog teams the Sheriff brought in vs the independent searchers. It adds a lot of weight to the fact that Jaryd was likely taken off trail.

We have a potential theory we're discussing and hope to share with you soon.

Interesting. Well trained dog, outstanding handler in this case. It sounds like this handler trusted his/her dog and allowed them to keep going. Another tragic story, a 17 year old murder victim.

My opinion only: there are so many situations in my mind that could have played out in regards to the dogs.

Did live find air-scent dogs and/or trailing dogs not find Jaryd because he was no longer on the mountain? The trail went cold.

Was he still alive on the mountain during the official search but was not found because of various situations like; wind movement, a moving child being steps ahead, weather, dogs confused because of all the foot traffic, not the best dog/handler team, not a thought-out coordinated effort, the list goes on.

Then there's HRD dogs. Perhaps they weren't used during the official search? I can absolutely see why the family would want them during the private search where they had more control. But again, did HRD dogs not pick up on human remains because there were simply none in the vast search areas OR.... Then you have a HRD dog out searching for Jaryd and indicate on human remains of another victim. They really can smell remains over a LARGE area, they can zero in on just traces of remains as well, even YEARS later.

I wish the use of dogs was 100% fail proof. It's not, BUT with a well trained dog, partnered with the right handler, you have a solid force to be reckoned with.

 

[K9Enzo]

Can someone post a link to the interview with the hikers who found Jaryd's clothing? I did watch the missing 411 (8-9 min) video but never found anything with the actual hikers.

 

[Thunder Street]

@K9Enzo,

You have to watch it on Hulu or rent it on Google Play. I can't provide a link to it because it's not on YouTube.

 

[Thunder Street]

This is a theoretical demonstration of the potential escape route based on where Jaryd's scent was detected along the trail.

This is one of two theories we have developed, and the only one we can share at present.

Jaryd's scent was detected first at Campsite #2. The scent hits at #3 and #4 were detected on a separate search, with no scent trail leading from #2 to #3. Some problems with this theory include the fact that there were one or more people in the parking lot of the Big South Trail and an abductor would have been seen. So where could he/she have taken Jaryd? Perhaps he took a big risk and crossed the trail to the river, the latter of which had many shallow or bare spots where one could cross, and made his way to the campsites on the other side of the Cache La Poudre River. But we don't have anything solid to indicate a direction other than the scent hits themselves.

 

[neesaki]

This is a theoretical demonstration of the potential escape route based on where Jaryd's scent was detected along the trail.

This is one of two theories we have developed, and the only one we can share at present.

Jaryd's scent was detected first at Campsite #2. The scent hits at #3 and #4 were detected on a separate search, with no scent trail leading from #2 to #3. Some problems with this theory include the fact that there were one or more people in the parking lot of the Big South Trail and an abductor would have been seen. So where could he/she have taken Jaryd? Perhaps he took a big risk and crossed the trail to the river, the latter of which had many shallow or bare spots where one could cross, and made his way to the campsites on the other side of the Cache La Poudre River. But we don't have anything solid to indicate a direction other than the scent hits themselves.

Thank you for this information,TS. Are these campsites located right beside the trail? Also, re: point Jared was last seen, this is after he had passed these campsites? IOW, is campsite 1 the closest to the trailhead? I’m just having a bit of difficulty orienting myself to the scene, as in what direction Jared was going. Tia

 

[Thunder Street]

Thank you for this information,TS. Are these campsites located right beside the trail? Also, re: point Jared was last seen, this is after he had passed these campsites? IOW, is campsite 1 the closest to the trailhead? I’m just having a bit of difficulty orienting myself to the scene, as in what direction Jared was going. Tia

Sorry for the confusion. Campsite 1 is closest to the trailhead and Jaryd's group was walking south along the trail. The campsites are to the east of the trail about 100ft or less up the mountain.

The reason I oriented the image the way I did was to have a closer view of the area.

 

[neesaki]

Sorry for the confusion. Campsite 1 is closest to the trailhead and Jaryd's group was walking south along the trail. The campsites are to the east of the trail about 100ft or less up the mountain.

The reason I oriented the image the way I did was to have a closer view of the area.

I think what confused me was the point he was last seen in relation to the theoretical point of abduction. Thanks very much for the clarification, TS.

 

[K9Enzo]

I was able to watch the Missing 411 movie on Amazon Prime.

The interview with the two hikers that found Jaryd's clothing was interesting. They came off as a little smug (IMO) and I'm not sure why.