Found Deceased OH - Harley Dilly, 14, walking to Port Clinton High School, 20 Dec 2019 #5

[Seattle1]

It seems odd that his jacket and glasses would be next to the fireplace.

^^sbm
Since there is no fireplace inside the house, it would be very odd indeed.

 

[katydid23]

Harley was wedged into the space. So tight, his lungs could not expand. If that is the case, gravity would have no bearing. I don't know how Harley got into the house but I am doubting it was from the roof-top chimney.

JMO

Why do you keep saying that Harley had been inside the house? There is no evidence of that.

As for gravity, I was speaking about his glasses and coat falling through first.

And then, gravity did affect him too, AT FIRST, before he tragically became wedged into that tight space.

 

[cherrymeg]

I had wondered that too but assumed later that people with fireplaces probably know they don't stay wide open all the way to the top. I don't have a fireplace and I never knew myself until I was "this years old" and read about this stuff here. Websleuths encourages me to learn new things!

If I saw that chimney I wouldn't be sure if it actually went to a fireplace. When I heard about this originally I thought maybe he climbed into an older chimney or one under construction from the inside of a house and got stuck. I learned about flues when I lived in an apt building where they had working fireplaces and college students. Every weekend the buildings alarms went off because someone forgot to open the flue. Someone might have died from smoke inhalation once. It was on the other side of the building. I always thought that was the biggest issue with working fireplaces.

 

[cherrymeg]

sorry double post

 

[Seattle1]

BBM. His coat and glasses were found INSIDE the house. If the chimney opening prevented Harley from expanding his chest to breathe, I think it is highly doubtful he made it from the roof all the way through the attic to the second floor.

If there was no room for his chest to expand, there was no room for him to push anything thru a flue which I find it highly doubtful he even knew was there because it was pitch black. Even the chimney "expert" quoted in this news article wanted to remain anonymous. I can certainly understand why.

JMO
Expert explains chimney design to surmise how Harley Dilly's coat, glasses were on 2nd floor of house
“Over in the chimney Harley’s jacked and glasses were pushed from the chimney through a flue and into a second floor of the home," Hickman said.

The expert you cite in the link is very clear how if the glasses and coat were dropped, they would be deflected on to the floor -- which is where police reportedly found them.

Again, no indication that HD entered the house because he was stuck inside the chimney. I agree with the expert -- he dropped the items down the chimney.

The flue, which could be angled in the open position, is located there. If the glasses and coat were dropped, they would be deflected onto the floor. Besides the chimney opening twisting at that site, it also narrows to roughly six inches, making it impossible for anyone of any size to squeeze through that area.

ETA: Hickman quote in your post does not match the linked article or video.

 

[cherrymeg]

^^sbm
Since there is no fireplace inside the house, it would be very odd indeed.

Sorry I assumed from the description of the chimney and flue it was part of a fireplace.

 

[Seattle1]

Sorry I assumed from the description of the chimney and flue it was part of a fireplace.

Adds to the mystery. The homeowner made this very clear on the first day HD located. (linked upthread)

There’s no fireplace in the home and he said the chimney where Dilly climbed into wasn’t in use.

“The heating we have in the house, we have electric baseboard heating," he described.

 

[cherrymeg]

Adds to the mystery. The homeowner made this very clear on the first day HD located. (linked upthread)

There’s no fireplace in the home and he said the chimney where Dilly climbed into wasn’t in use.

“The heating we have in the house, we have electric baseboard heating," he described.

Was there a decorative fireplace? One video or article mentioned the house was pretty old was the chimney part of the original house? Did it lead anywhere? If they are saying his jacket and glasses fell out of the flue on the second floor that would mean there was some opening, right? If there wasn't an opening how does that work?

 

[Seattle1]

Was there a decorative fireplace? One video or article mentioned the house was pretty old was the chimney part of the original house? Did it lead anywhere? If they are saying his jacket and glasses fell out of the flue on the second floor that would mean there was some opening, right? If there wasn't an opening how does that work?

The house was built by the owners great-great- grandfather around 1850's and has been through several renovations. There are a few illustrations in the thread -- the interior opening from the original chimney would be similar to what would have housed a stovepipe, and the opening was left uncovered when HD dropped his items down the chimney.

MOO

 

[Seattle1]

HARLEY J. DILLY

2005 - 2020

14, of Port Clinton, Ohio passed away on Tuesday, January 14, 2020. He was born on August 12, 2005 in Fremont, Ohio, the son of Marcus and Heather (Styndl) Dilly. Harley was a Freshman at Port Clinton High School, and enjoyed various sports, gaming, robotics, making YouTube videos, and singing. He always felt like he was the underdog, and as a result, he had a very giving heart and became very brave. He hated to make mistakes, and was inspired to become a counselor or a leader in the future. Did you ever find a penny while walking through town Harley would drop pennies while walking, as pennies from Heaven for other people. He had a soft heart and wanted to be a blessing to other people. Every year during the Christmas holiday season, he would volunteer to ring the bell for the Salvation Army. He was a loving Son, Brother, and Grandson, and will be deeply missed by his family and friends, including his 3 best friends, James, Daniel & Junior. Survivors include his parents, Marcus and Heather; sister, Ashlyn ***; brother, Roary ***; maternal grandparents, Robert and Carolee *****; paternal grandmother, Mary ****; aunts, Meredith (Robert) ***** and Betty (Frank) ***; uncles, Raymond ***, Jr. and Christopher ***; niece, Rylee ******; as well as many cousins, and friends from school. He was preceded in death by his paternal grandfather, Raymond ***, Sr., and maternal great-grandparents, Robert and Rose ****, Sr. Visitation will be held on Saturday, January 25, 2020 from 11 am until 3 pm at the Gerner-Wolf-Walker Funeral Home & Crematory, 216 Washington Street, Port Clinton, Ohio. Funeral Services for Harley will be Private at a later date. Memorial contributions may be made to paypal.me/heartsforharley for the establishment of a scholarship fund in Harley's name. Online condolences may be shared with the family at www.walkerfuneralhomes.com

Published in The Plain Dealer on Jan. 17, 2020

ETA: family names edited by me for privacy.

View HARLEY DILLY's Obituary on cleveland.com and share memories

 

[cherrymeg]

The house was built by the owners great-great- grandfather around 1850's and has been through several renovations. There are a few illustrations in the thread -- the interior opening from the original chimney would be similar to what would have housed a stovepipe, and the opening was left uncovered when HD dropped his items down the chimney.

MOO

I don't get why he would enter voluntarily. I would think a jacket and glasses would be things you would leave on a roof if you were going to attempt to climb into a chimney. If you threw your glasses down first besides being worried about breaking them or falling on them and breaking them, wouldn't they kind of show you that what looked like the bottom of the chimney or entrance to the house wasn't? It would be like throwing a rock into a well sort of.

 

[katydid23]

I don't get why he would enter voluntarily. I would think a jacket and glasses would be things you would leave on a roof if you were going to attempt to climb into a chimney. If you threw your glasses down first besides being worried about breaking them or falling on them and breaking them, wouldn't they kind of show you that what looked like the bottom of the chimney or entrance to the house wasn't? It would be like throwing a rock into a well sort of.

But his glasses landed on the floor. I wonder if he heard them drop and So he thought it was open all the way down?

 

[catch_22]

The house where HD was found was reported as located on Fulton St. Did Harley live on Fulton Street or was his home on E. 5th St (around the corner versus across the street)?

Trying to determine if he had a chimney...

The best i can tell, the dilly house does not have a chimney.

From the vacant house, i believe the dilly house is across 5th street (north side of 5th st.) and east a couple houses. Right next door and east of what looks like a church. The vacant house is on the corner of 5th and fulton.

 

[catch_22]

Is it weird that the flue would be open when the house was unoccupied? An open flue lets in cold air. Animals like squirrels and birds get into chimneys most of the time a closed flue prevents them from getting into your home. My grandparents had dead squirrels removed from their chimney at least once. They got trapped. It seems odd that his jacket and glasses would be next to the fireplace.

My guess is that the flue had a cover on it that harley was able to open or remove (push out) from inside the chimney.

 

[HongKongPhooey]

I don't get why he would enter voluntarily. I would think a jacket and glasses would be things you would leave on a roof if you were going to attempt to climb into a chimney. If you threw your glasses down first besides being worried about breaking them or falling on them and breaking them, wouldn't they kind of show you that what looked like the bottom of the chimney or entrance to the house wasn't? It would be like throwing a rock into a well sort of.

But his glasses would be no use to him on the roof if he was inside. I'm v short sighted and my glasses (or lenses) are the single most important thing I own. I'm literally helpless without them.

I think the poor lad dropped them down wrapped inside his coat, thinking he would join them momentarily. The coat was used to protect them and also made him more streamlined without it on.

All just my own thoughts.

Desperately sad case. It's unbearable thinking of him trapped and panicked.

 

[catch_22]

I really can't imagine anyone throwing their glasses and coat down the chimney before him. What if he chickened out, changed his mind, or realized he couldn't fit in the chimney? "Well, my coat and glasses are gone......: (" It was like 15 degrees. I also kind of doubt he took his coat off. He may or may not would have put his glasses in his coat pocket before descending.

The chimney "expert" was describing a generic chimney/fireplace setup and not the specific chimney in this house. There has been mention of chimneys "narrowing" as you go down (and I'm sure this is a thing with more modern chimneys), but this one was built in 1850. Why was the opening 9 x 13? Bricks. That is the size you get with a 2 brick by 2.5 brick structure. The chimney also (at least originally) went all the way down to the first floor. This leads me to think that the chimney was a vertical "column", and a consistent 9 x 13 from the first floor to the roof. Therefore, i question the compression cause of death determination.

My theory is as follows: Harley descended feet first. The space was so small that he descended with his arms above his head. Whether he "fell" or was able to control his descent, his coat was pulled off. The chimney was apparently blocked off at the second floor. So he gets to the second floor with his coat now sitting on top of his head. He realizes he is stuck and at some point feels the flue hole (which I'm guessing to be around 6 feet above the floor.....and right about where his arms above his head would be).

I originally thought that him pushing his coat out of the flue was because he was trying to leave "bread crumbs." I have since thought of a few other possible reasons. One is that his coat sitting on his head was annoying him and he got it out of the way by pushing it through the flue. The other possible reason is more disturbing. That possible reason is that the chimney was filling up with the carbon dioxide that he was exhaling, and he was having trouble breathing, and the coat was partially blocking the path to fresh air. Now I'm no scientist, so i really don't know how possible him asphyxiating in there due to him using up the oxygen is. The top of the chimney is open, but it was pretty far away. There was also the flue hole to let in air, so I'm not really sure about the science of it all. The inside of the chimney is a relatively small space with a limited amount of oxygen (if the oxygen is not replaced/air circulated). Supposedly carbon dioxide is heavier than air, and would theoretically eventually fill up the bottom of the chimney. Again, especially considering the flue hole, I don't even know if it would be possible for him to use up the oxygen.

If not possible, I would think that there is a good chance that he died from dehydration. I wonder if the autopsy can determine the difference between dehydration and asphyxiation with the amount of decomposition present?

 

[catch_22]

If he would have thrown his coat down first, he would have been standing on it. I dont think he could have picked it up. So i guess it comes down to if the flue hole was at his feet, or up around, or above his head. I feel strongly that the flue is near the ceiling of the second story because it was for the exhaust pipe of a stove. I am assuming that the chimney was blocked off right at the second story floor level, but this might not be the case.

 

[scdiv]

Harley was wedged into the space. So tight, his lungs could not expand. If that is the case, gravity would have no bearing. I don't know how Harley got into the house but I am doubting it was from the roof-top chimney.

JMO

Then how do you surmise that his body was found inside the chimney when the only opening to the chimney was from the rooftop??

 

[JDough]

Harley was wedged into the space. So tight, his lungs could not expand. If that is the case, gravity would have no bearing. I don't know how Harley got into the house but I am doubting it was from the roof-top chimney.

JMO

^BBM
Harley was not found deceased inside of the home. He was found deceased inside of the chimney. There are zero reports that Harley was ever inside of the home itself. If there is no access from the inside of the home to the inside of the chimney (other than the 8" flue(s) per homeowner), how would Harley get there? What are your theories if not through the roof top?

[...] Jim says the home has belonged to his family since it was built in 1852 [...]

"I was quite confident that there was no way anybody got in that house or they would have been able to tell because it was pretty secure," he said. [...]

"There was no openings in that chimney other than, like eight-inch diameter openings in different places throughout. You know, on the first floor and the second floor for a stovepipe to go into it," said Jim". [...]
‘Our family is heartbroken over this’: Owner of home where Harley Dilly’s body was found speaks out
He also says the home does not have a fireplace.

 

[cherrymeg]

But his glasses would be no use to him on the roof if he was inside. I'm v short sighted and my glasses (or lenses) are the single most important thing I own. I'm literally helpless without them.

I think the poor lad dropped them down wrapped inside his coat, thinking he would join them momentarily. The coat was used to protect them and also made him more streamlined without it on.

All just my own thoughts.

Desperately sad case. It's unbearable thinking of him trapped and panicked.

If, this is a big if , he was trying enter the house through the chimney he would unlock a door or open a window on the inside. His jacket would take up room on his body and chimneys are sooty or dusty or have dead animal remains in them - things he might not want on his coat. It could also get ripped or torn on something. Glasses i can see him keeping on if he needed them.
I still have a hard time understanding why he would get into a chimney. It seems suspicious. moo