Found Deceased OH - Harley Dilly, 14, walking to Port Clinton High School, 20 Dec 2019 #5

[osu]

<modsnip: quoted post was removed>

I read in the police report earlier that the PCPD officer started calling around checking with all of Harley’s friends’ parents.

Did Harley’s parents ever call to check with any of these parents earlier that day/evening before reporting him missing to LE at almost midnight?

JMO

 

[v0x]

That addresses when covered entities may disclose info to LE, but there may also be limitations on how private LE must keep that info once they learn it, particularly since it wasn't until Jan 14 that it was known that Harley was no longer living.

And the info wasn’t released until after he was found deceased. Maybe that factors in somewhere? I’d edited my post to mention the PD disclosure.

 

[JaneEyre]

Okay everyone ... ease up on bashing the mom. You may not like her, you may not like what she may or may not have said/done, but she is still considered a victim by WS standards.

Further victim blaming posts may result in a thread reply ban.

 

[v0x]

Health Information of Deceased Individuals

The HIPAA Privacy Rule protects the individually identifiable health information about a decedent for 50 years following the date of death of the individual. This period of protection for decedent health information balances the privacy interests of surviving relatives and other individuals with a relationship to the decedent, with the need for archivists, biographers, historians, and others to access old or ancient records on deceased individuals for historical purposes. During the 50-year period of protection, the personal representative of the decedent (i.e., the person under applicable law with authority to act on behalf of the decedent or the decedent’s estate) has the ability to exercise the rights under the Privacy Rule with regard to the decedent’s health information, such as authorizing certain uses and disclosures of, and gaining access to, the information. With respect to family members or other persons involved in the individual’s health care or payment for care prior to the individual’s death, but who are not personal representatives, the Privacy Rule permits a covered entity to disclose the relevant protected health information of the decedent to such persons, unless doing so is inconsistent with any prior expressed preference of the deceased individual that is known to the covered entity.​

more at link. Still not sure if the police report would be considered a HIIPA violation. It’s just stating what was told to them by the father, so I’m leaning toward no.

 

[tresptip]

The only thing I find disturbing about Harleys mom is the fact the day her son never came home from school she went out for dinner and drinks that evening.Did Harley have a key to the house to get in while moms out having a good time? You'd think she would be waiting for him at home,and be there for him.Seems like he gets left out in the cold a lot.

 

[abanddb123]

<modsnip: quoted post was removed>

In one of Harley's videos he was stressed cause his mom had heart problems or a stoke. He loved his mom,

Ask the chief as to why that is not to inform the public to his autism...all that was stated was "no comment " when asked. Also he advised the public to not approach him due to he ( HD) does not warm up to others easily.

Maybe Harley was in the process of being diagnosed. My daughter is in the process. Does everyone she is working with think she does, yes. But Im not going to and i cant state as a fact till we get a complete diagnosis.

 

[PKnopf]

Where exactly did she specifically say high-functioning or low-functioning? It would not make any sense for him to be low-functioning, given his lifestyle. Is it confirmed that the mother said low-functioning?

Also on a side note, and not to be mean, but the mother does not seem to be the most educated person in the world. There could be a chance she does not know the difference.

If he was on the spectrum, I think she probably had to know he was in the high functioning. Dad seemed to know that. He was probably assessed/diagnosed in grade school or even before. I don't know the Port Clinton schools, but he probably had an IEP, at least in the grade school years, a parent advocate or other special needs mentor and other services that involved lots of parent/teacher planning meetings and discussion over the years. JMHO

 

[ReadySet]

Two things can be true at the same time, without one causing the other.

Parents can be disfunctional, careless, inattentive, and/or neglectful.
and
Their child can die an accidental death.
Those can both be true, but seperate issues from each other.

There are many teens who die accidently, who have parents who weren't the best.
And many teens who die accidently who had steller parents.

Some teens die in car accidents, from accidental gun shots, from diving into too shallow water, and a host of other causes, resulting from impulsive and poor judgement.

If a teen is known to have great parents, and then dies in an accident because they were speeding, are the parents suddenly now considered bad parents?

If those kids had "bad" parents, are the deaths always their fault?

No. And in this case, I think Harley made unforseen choices that led to his death.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Two things can be true at the same time, without one causing the other.

Parents can be disfunctional, careless, inattentive, and/or neglectful.
and
Their child can die an accidental death.
Those can both be true, but seperate issues from each other.

There are many teens who die accidently, who have parents who weren't the best.
And many teens who die accidently who had steller parents.

Some teens die in car accidents, from accidental gun shots, from diving into too shallow water, and a host of other causes, resulting from impulsive and poor judgement.

If a teen is known to have great parents, and then dies in an accident because they were speeding, are the parents suddenly now considered bad parents?

If those kids had "bad" parents, are the deaths always their fault?

No. And in this case, I think Harley made unforseen choices that led to his death.

I agree.

Generally speaking, I think sometimes tragedy can be foreseen, too many people IGNORE countless red flags ...until it’s too late.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

This case is just so tragic and sad. Do I think the parents of HD dropped the ball in raising him? Sure I do but my opinion is just that... an opinion. No matter how much the mom and dad are bashed, it doesn't matter. These parents have already been given a life sentence..... because for the rest of their lives they will have to reflect on these past few weeks and what they could have done differently.

As parents, none of us are perfect and at one time or another we will make mistakes along the way. I just pray that none of us EVER has to endure a pain like this.

 

[simlyme]

For anyone still puzzled about how Harley COULD have pushed his coat and glasses out of the flue AFTER he was already in the chimney, I made a drawing using a stock illustration.

This shows how a stovepipe connects to a chimney flue.
View attachment 227115 View attachment 227116
If no stovepipe is connected to the flue, it is usually kept covered with something like this. It's like a tin saucer or plate, with flimsy wire brackets to hold it against the wall. It would be very easy to push this cover out from inside the chimney.
View attachment 227117

So for the chimney that Harley was found in, IF the "blockage" is about on the same level as the second story floor, then Harley could have reached the flue like this.
View attachment 227128

The illustration shows the sides of the chimney to be much thicker than normal. A normal chimney is only as thick as one brick, so the coat and glasses just needed to be pushed through a hole. For those still wondering how a bulky puff coat could go through a flue hole, I have observed that the new puff coats are much thinner than the ones from my childhood, and made of a slicker, sturdier fabric that wouldn't catch so readily on the bricks.

As far as to why Harley asphyxiated, it is my opinion that something changed after he got to the place in the chimney where he died. My morbid fascination with the horrible life of child chimney sweeps has led me to read about chimney construction. They don't get smaller as they go down. And I know the "cake pan" size of the chimney Harley was in seems small enough to sufficate a 14 year old, but it has been the standard size for hundreds of years. The same size the young chimney sweeps were forced to climb. Often near the top, they narrowed to 9x9" and they still had room to maneuver their arms enough to scrape and brush the chimney walls. There were two ways that I've read of that boys suffocated in a straight chimney. 1. If a large amount of soot fell on top of the their head and around their face. 2. Their body slipped downward past their knees, and they became jammed. The pressure of the knees against the chest prevented them from taking a breath.
View attachment 227183

These are all my own thoughts. I don't know that this is what happened. I don't know how Harley was positioned in the chimney, nor where the blockage or flue hole was.

Edited by me to fix minor typos.

WOW!! thank you for that drawing, I put some pictures up of my no longer in use flue up yesterday I believe and it does have one of those round covers on it and I also showed the pictures of that. I was able to take it off very easily with one finger and hardly any pressure. Your illustration shows exactly how I feel of what happened to Harley.

 

[v0x]

Contradictions are not necessarily “lies” especially when we’re relying on multiple MSM sources reporting. I’ve seen many a reporting mistake when it comes to details in my years on this site.

 

[bellyup]

They didn't need to and my first thought was HIPPA.

HIPPA does not apply to law enforcement and especially not when a child is missing.

 

[Sillybilly]

Thread is closed for review.

Check back later.

 

[Sillybilly]

Thread is open again.

Sorry that everyone received the same reason for deletion. With that many posts to remove I accidentally clicked the wrong button that caused all reasons to show as "Discussing moderation ...".

Most deleted posts were removed for victim bashing. (Yes, the parents are victims by WS standards, whether someone likes it or not.) To call them liars and blatantly accuse them is absolutely not allowed. While we may agree that they may not be model parents, they have a life sentence of knowing their son is never coming home. As for discrepancies in what they have said, put yourself in that situation and see if you can think straight and give precise answers to absolutely everything when you don't know what happened and are trying to process it.

Some posts were removed due to victim bashing AND circumventing WS board profanity filters.

Further posts that contain victim bashing, members will receive a permanent Thread Reply Ban without further explanation.

 

[Warwick7]

<modsnip: quoted post was removed>

I read in the police report earlier that the PCPD officer started calling around checking with all of Harley’s friends’ parents.

Did Harley’s parents ever call to check with any of these parents earlier that day/evening before reporting him missing to LE at almost midnight?

JMO

I wondered the same. We don't have anything saying they didn't.
Did HD have a key to his house? I mean if they went out to eat Friday night, did they leave the door unlocked, since he wasn't home yet?

As sad as this sounds, it sounds like this may have been another time there was a conflict (parents and child) and the parents thought he was staying away on purpose.

I did some pretty stupid stuff when I was 14. That said, I wasn't one who had to come home and bathe as many times as he felt he had to tho.

The whole thing is sad....

 

[unitsix]

For anyone still puzzled about how Harley COULD have pushed his coat and glasses out of the flue AFTER he was already in the chimney, I made a drawing using a stock illustration.

This shows how a stovepipe connects to a chimney flue.
View attachment 227115 View attachment 227116
If no stovepipe is connected to the flue, it is usually kept covered with something like this. It's like a tin saucer or plate, with flimsy wire brackets to hold it against the wall. It would be very easy to push this cover out from inside the chimney.
View attachment 227117

So for the chimney that Harley was found in, IF the "blockage" is about on the same level as the second story floor, then Harley could have reached the flue like this.
View attachment 227128

The illustration shows the sides of the chimney to be much thicker than normal. A normal chimney is only as thick as one brick, so the coat and glasses just needed to be pushed through a hole. For those still wondering how a bulky puff coat could go through a flue hole, I have observed that the new puff coats are much thinner than the ones from my childhood, and made of a slicker, sturdier fabric that wouldn't catch so readily on the bricks.

As far as to why Harley asphyxiated, it is my opinion that something changed after he got to the place in the chimney where he died. My morbid fascination with the horrible life of child chimney sweeps has led me to read about chimney construction. They don't get smaller as they go down. And I know the "cake pan" size of the chimney Harley was in seems small enough to sufficate a 14 year old, but it has been the standard size for hundreds of years. The same size the young chimney sweeps were forced to climb. Often near the top, they narrowed to 9x9" and they still had room to maneuver their arms enough to scrape and brush the chimney walls. There were two ways that I've read of that boys suffocated in a straight chimney. 1. If a large amount of soot fell on top of the their head and around their face. 2. Their body slipped downward past their knees, and they became jammed. The pressure of the knees against the chest prevented them from taking a breath.
View attachment 227183

These are all my own thoughts. I don't know that this is what happened. I don't know how Harley was positioned in the chimney, nor where the blockage or flue hole was.

Edited by me to fix minor typos.

Excellent job on this. I am sure this helps clarify things about chimneys. You put the exact illustrations that I pictured once I looked at my own chimney as a reference.

 

[annemc2]

Excellent job on this. I am sure this helps clarify things about chimneys. You put the exact illustrations that I pictured once I looked at my own chimney as a reference.

Yes, that was brilliant @Songbird1973. Thanks so much for this. I can finally understand how this horrible event was possible.

 

[PKnopf]

To my knowledge, nobody has stated that he *wasn't* at home on Thursday night? And I can't see anywhere in the police report that his dad reported his son had spent Thurs evening at a friend's house? But yet he did report that his son has previously stayed out all night on a Friday night, but would return on Saturday morning. His mom reported to police that she had spoken to him early Friday morning and that to her knowledge he had then 'left' and gone to school. To me, all of the above might indicate that HD was home on Thursday night unless there is a reason to believe otherwise? Is there?

It doesn't seem there is any confirmation either way. Only mom's vague statement of talking to him between 6-7 am. They did call her after the report was taken. But nothing in the police report about when dad last saw him. I have to think that was the first thing they asked him, since he was right there filing the report and the first available parent to ask right away "When did you or your wife last see your son, Mr Dilly?". I'd think there would be something definitive in there they would have taken from the dad right then, like "my wife says she saw him in the morning. I was already at work, but I can tell you he was home Thurs night when I went to bed. He was only missing one night". There isn't.

Just this clarification to initial PD report that came publically much later when she said "I didn’t see him, I talked to him. There’s a difference."
Mother of Harley Dilly pleads for his safe return

Maybe this is significant, maybe not.. but. I'm sure this has been linked before: On Jan 2, there was an expanded time frame of the surveillance they were seeking at the PD, inclusive of the Thurs afternoon and overnight hrs that night. I'm thinking they weren't really certain at all where he was Thurs night after he left friends.

Port Clinton police seek security video footage from businesses, homes to aid in search for 14-year-old Harley Dilly

 

[Seattle1]

So if mom would have answered or called the school back she could have been out looking for him instead of "donating " to the salvation army. Just my opinion.

She donated bags of clothing and "blessing bags" there. Link provided up thread.

What exactly is the correlation? Trying to understand the derogatory tone about mom "donating" to a charity that by all accounts was very dear to HD? What would be the purpose of withholding from the Salvation Army?