Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom, arrested* #17

[nhmemorymaker]

It sure does make me wonder if anybody is looking out for the welfare of or keeping track of the spouses and the dependent children of that entire list of speakers.

How big is this group that CD is involved with?

Again, my very thoughts. .... currently trying to see divorces/marriages of said folks.. some similar behaviour as our POIs....

 

[caseface]

Are they dead or alive? Just a question - do we have proof either way? Have I missed something? I think truth be told for many it’s just a gut feeling one way or the other.

Some will say it is based on history or profiling, which can be true, but in the end is there enough triable truth available to us? And some are just crazy enough to not follow the guidelines of a profile! Shame on them!

I realize as humans we may have a tendency to want others to agree with us. We may also have a tendency to want to believe the best. But to find the truth, I believe we need to forget either of the above and only look at the facts as we know them. Or fight to find new facts!

I love the way we are picking at who may have been in the storage photos. Just as Nate and LE won’t say for sure who they are, we should be trying to figure out - as many are, who it could be. I think that is an important missing clue. I may be wrong, but other than opening the storage account, do we have enough proof with these grainy photos that the female is always Lori? Just a question? We need to sometimes even question the obvious.

Could it be someone else who has been in the picture but has tried to appear to be on the “good side” as a ruse? I would hope that LE has verified all whereabouts of friends and family. Though we may have rules of who is “sleuthable” - they don’t.

Here’s praying someone finds some answers (maybe someone here) and passes them on to LE!

ETA - JMO MOO Just musing

I agree. My primary interest is locating the children. We have no solid evidence that they are dead and no reasonable motive for Lori to off them (not that she's necessarily reasonable). I do some reasons for her to hide them based upon their beliefs, and the locations mentioned in the "prophecies" of this group, which are off grid. Nevertheless, even if there's a 1% chance the children are alive, I am going to be trying my best to piece together clues, following leads even if there's a small chance they are reliable. Either way, we need all the pieces working together to better understand what is happening. I believe that failing to be objective keeps our perspective narrow. Labeling Lori as vain and making fun of her hair simply isn't worthwhile in finding the children. The truth is the kids could be alive and in danger and that pulls at my heart.

 

[caseface]

The Japanese Coronavirus couple stayed at Kaanapali Beach Club, as I wrote earlier. And we now know Lori and Chad did not stay there.

I wonder if LE is planning staging a coronovirus quarantine to keep them from flying to mexico?

 

[divineappt]

Finally watched the Dateline episode, thought they did a good, solid summary of the events... but good grief, I hate hate hate her little baby I'm-so-innocent voice. Grr.

It was very, very carefully constructed, wasn't it? I almost feel like we know enough additional info here that we ought to be able to read between the lines of what they didn't say.

Good call. It “could” be considered odd that some people and some events were not mentioned. I am beginning to lean toward the “missing participant/s” scenario. Some of whom may not be able to be publicly sleuthed at this time until LE has further information. I believe that some of the rehashing that some may deem a waste of time could eventually - maybe even accidentally - find some missing answers. MOO JMO Just speculation

 

[Axie]

You cannot look at it like that. 10 decibel increase doubles the sound each time I believe, so the reduction of 21-26 dB would reduce the gunshot sound by approx 25-30% IMO. Then if the front door were closed or open there could be an additional reduction in noise. I believe neighbours thought it was fireworks being let off but I don't have links so this is IMO.

ETA A link re decibels might help. This seems to indicate 26 decibel reduction could reduce the sound of a .45 ACP to the sound of a .22 rifle.

How loud is your gun

From that link -

"How much noise does it make?
So you want to know which cartridge makes the louder bang?
Some technicalities are in order first.

Sound is measured in decibels (db), much like temperature is measured in degrees and speed in miles (or kilometers) per hour. Like most other units, the bottom of the scale or 0 db, is an arbitrary setting, which by convention is set to be the level of the sound that we can bearly hear, or our hearing threshold, as it is normally known.

One difference between the decibel scale and most of the other units we usually use in our everyday life, is the fact that the decibel scale is not linear, but logarithmic. In a linear scale, like velocity, if someone's car is moving at 100 mph, we know that he is moving at twice the speed of someone else who is doing 50 mph, i.e. 2x50 mph is double the velocity of the second car. In logarithmic scales a sound which is only 3 db higher than another, has twice the energy. For example, if you look at the table below, the 9mm Para cartridge at 160 db has twice the sound energy of the .45 ACP cartridge which is measured at 157 db.

Another complication is that the human ear does not hear linearly either. Although loudness is subjective, most people perceive one sound to be twice as loud as another, when there is a 10-fold increase in energy, or a difference of about 10 db. So a 60 db sound sounds twice as loud as a 50 db one, although there is 10 times more energy in it. Also, it is interesting to note that most people cann ot discern any difference in perceived loudness of less than 3 db. That means that the energy in the sound has to double, before someone can notice any difference.

After this technical jargon, here is a table of loudness.



db Environmental noise
0 Threshold of hearing
10 Normal breathing
20 Rusting leaves
30 Whisper at 30 feet
40 Quiet street
50 Interior home noise
60 Conversation
70 Crowded restaurant
75 Kitchen appliances
80 City traffic
85 Hearing damage possible
90 Lawn mower
100 Chain shaw
120 Threshold of pain
120 Siren
134 .22 LR rifle
140 Jet engine at take-off
150 .410 shotgun
152 .22 LR pistol
153 20 gauge shotgun
155 .223 rifle
155 .25 pistol
156 12 gauge shotgun
156 .30-.30 rifle
156 .308 rifle
156 .44 Special revolver
157 .22 Magnum pistol
157 .45 ACP pistol
158 .380 ACP pistol
158 .38 Special revolver
159 .30-06
160 9mm Para pistol
163 .41 Magnum revolver
164 .357 Magnum revolver
164 .44 Magnum revolver "

Thanks. Made perfect sense to me.
Love target shooting at the range.
Last gun was a .4o cal pistol. Loud and heavy. 80 rounds.

AC killing CV and how SYG seems to be for only the person better armed.

Meaning you're attacked by someone and all you have to defend yourself is a bat; but he's got a gun. It's now the killers word against your dead body.

After the murder of a teenager here in Florida? This is not how SYG should work.

It is never supposed to be a replacement for an investigation.

It's supposed to be castle doctrine of the person. Not only the home.

SYG only prevents the shooter from being arrested immediately.

But they are still supposed to investigate it LIKE A HOMICIDE!

But lately we see the better armed person wins the day.

It literally just an easy murder method. Dead don't tell tales.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Thank you all. I'm hoping I'm wrong.

It sure does make me wonder if anybody is looking out for the welfare of or keeping track of the spouses and the dependent children of that entire list of speakers.

How big is this group that CD is involved with?

Since RexburgSleuth knew Chad, and I assume, some of these other folks...I hope he will help us know more about them........if/when we are allowed to discuss. So my question is how much CAN we discuss the activities of AVOW or the Doomsday events...if we don't identify people by name??? There is probably evidence in the travels/activities of many of them in this spider web that would provide more answers...
Justice for Tammy, JJ, and Tylee

 

[Rush4087]

This is why i believe we can't dismiss their beliefs outright. Now, there may be insurance policies involved in some but there does seem to be a trend of getting rid of husbands... perhaps in order to be wed to the apostles of the group, the new prophets...multiple marriages are allowable in their beliefs. Not that they are anything close to actual mainstream LDS.

I could be wrong, but I don't think most (or even many) people have dismissed their beliefs outright (as a key motivator for their actions). I for one think their beliefs were the very reason behind the murders: an attempt to raise money and assets quickly in preparation for the end times scenario they believed would begin in July '20.

 

[Gardener1850]

The difference between GMT and EDT (valid on October 16) is 4 hours. My guess is that the time shown is GMT unless you are logged in, in which case it's you local time.

Thank you, I think I've got it then. The times I'm seeing (not logged in) must be GMT. So I need to subtract 6 or 7 hours (depending on where we think Tylee's device was located) to get her actual times:
Time Zone Converter – Time Difference Calculator

@CSIDreamer
Is there a way to figure out when you are logged into Venmo which timezone Tylee's transaction's were made in?

ETA: And I don't know if it makes a difference but CR was receiving the money in another timezone (1 hour difference from AZ/ID in Oct). Do the transaction timestamps on Venmo indicate when the money was sent or is that the time when the money was accepted?

 

[Lyrarya]

One key take away I had though (after the reassurance that Lori was present) was: if AC lied (which he did), he either had to have personally known what happened to the kids, or Lori had told him a lie about something SHE had done with the kids.

I think, that "going to grandmas" was the original story LD and AC planned to use. I remember the neighbor saying the last time they saw JJ, he said he was going to grandmas. LD and AC probably had no idea that KL would sleuth out their location through Amazon and be the persons behind the welfare check and probably just assumed the questions, if any, would come from a more local neighbor or the school...MOO

 

[caseface]

It sure does make me wonder if anybody is looking out for the welfare of or keeping track of the spouses and the dependent children of that entire list of speakers.

How big is this group that CD is involved with?

From ldsavow.com Over 1 Million posts from more than 13,000 members. Now, how many of these actually buy in to the subgroup of Chad Daybell and the multiple other "visionaries" I do not know.

 

[caseface]

Book 'em Danno! Love that phrase from years ago.

I think AC's autopsy is holding up announcing TD's. AC's has produced a drug of some kind, and TD's needs to be tested, but may be difficult due to embalming. Those who do this type testing know every step has to be documented for court. Good luck all the way! imo

Anything to get LD first. CD won't help as much if arrested but if they get LD, at least they can convict her of murder. I doubt she'll ever tell where the kids are. psycho.

If the kids are dead and Alex buried them, she could have told him not to let her know. That way, she can pass a lie detector test. She may very well not know at all.

 

[divineappt]

I still think any higher level manager could have easily met them at the bank on Monday...much more privacy, no people around....

Especially if there was something in it for said higher level manager!

 

[divineappt]

Thanks! Do you have a Venmo account and are you viewing Tylee's transactions while logged in? Perhaps that makes a difference and perhaps Venmo users will see the time the post was actually made rather than the time from their timezone?

ETA: Nevermind, I see you are logged in.

I do not have a Venmo acct, not logged in and it shows Same times as yours


ETA - clarification

 

[canyonoflight]

This is one of the weird things about Tammy’s funeral program in Springville; reportedly Chad prepared it, but none of the six pictures he chose included him. There was no family picture, and a few of their children and none of their grandchildren were included in any of the pictures. Many people noticed how weird that was.

That's really weird. When my mom died, I made sure the photos displayed around her urn reflected her as a professor, friend, wife, mother, and grandmother.

 

[indicolite22]

ETA: And I don't know if it makes a difference but CR was receiving the money in another timezone (1 hour difference from AZ/ID in Oct). Do the transaction timestamps on Venmo indicate when the money was sent or is that the time when the money was accepted?

But Venmo’s digital timestamp is not a receipt because it doesn’t include transaction details. It can’t be used to prove anything, except the date and time that cash passed between accounts.

If Your Business Uses Venmo, Read This Now | Mobile Law

 

[CSIDreamer]

Thank you, I think I've got it then. The times I'm seeing (not logged in) must be GMT. So I need to subtract 6 or 7 hours (depending on where we think Tylee's device was located) to get her actual times:
Time Zone Converter – Time Difference Calculator

@CSIDreamer
Is there a way to figure out when you are logged into Venmo which timezone Tylee's transaction's were made in?

ETA: And I don't know if it makes a difference but CR was receiving the money in another timezone (1 hour difference from AZ/ID in Oct). Do the transaction timestamps on Venmo indicate when the money was sent or is that the time when the money was accepted?

All I've found so far is default time is GMT

 

[indicolite22]

From ldsavow.com Over 1 Million posts from more than 13,000 members. Now, how many of these actually buy in to the subgroup of Chad Daybell and the multiple other "visionaries" I do not know.

I wonder how many of those believe that the world is ending this July.

 

[Gardener1850]

But Venmo’s digital timestamp is not a receipt because it doesn’t include transaction details. It can’t be used to prove anything, except the date and time that cash passed between accounts.

If Your Business Uses Venmo, Read This Now | Mobile Law

All I've found so far is default time is GMT

Thank you both! I've decided to go with times based on the timezone we think the sending device was located in when the transaction was made (for the purpose of the Timeline).

 

[caseface]

Book 'em Danno! Love that phrase from years ago.

I think AC's autopsy is holding up announcing TD's. AC's has produced a drug of some kind, and TD's needs to be tested, but may be difficult due to embalming. Those who do this type testing know every step has to be documented for court. Good luck all the way! imo

Anything to get LD first. CD won't help as much if arrested but if they get LD, at least they can convict her of murder. I doubt she'll ever tell where the kids are. psycho.

If the kids are dead and Alex buried them, she could have told him not to let her know. That way, she can pass a lie detector test. She may very well not know at all.

Okay, what if all this business with the kids is a smoke screen for something else?

What else? Beats me. But they're being just too public and brazen about this. It's like "Don't look at that man behind the curtain."

While some may disagree, i think their ability to be calm and collected is because the children are alive and the constitution is on their side. They are not your run-of-the-mill libertarians. They know the law and their rights. They also believe that they will be persecuted for their beliefs, like Jesus. So, the more pressure on them, the more they can convince themselves they are being faithful to God.

 

[divineappt]

If the kids are dead and Alex buried them, she could have told him not to let her know. That way, she can pass a lie detector test. She may very well not know at all.

Possible, but based on only how I suspect I would feel if the above situation was me, (I don’t think given AC’s historyI would think she would still have a viable reaction on a polygraph. Based on experience it doesn’t take much for a reaction.

If the kids are dead and Alex buried them, she could have told him not to let her know. That way, she can pass a lie detector test. She may very well not know at all.

How to Pass a Lie Detector Test (Whether You're Lying or Not) | Live Science

This article explains how a polygraph works.