Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom, arrested* #18

[Angleterre]

I have to say that through this whole thread today I'm feeling a growing fascination with Island culture and life out there. And the guy trying to clean up his island asking chad questions as Chad drove off... yeah, now I want to visit Hawaii. I'm loving this sense of family they tend to have. Just have to say that I'm admiring quite a few things about the people of Kauai right about now.

It makes me really want to visit from my little UK home x

 

[divineappt]

My friend reading the case this am says: "She got rid of them all, she is the constant, She killed CV and made a deal with Alex likely with a payoff promise , she killed Tammy, her beautiful kids and then Alex." MOO. Feel sick.

And if the promised payout was from CV’s insurance, there could have been a war ready to ensue. So again there was a need to take out the problem. JMO

 

[Rush4087]

I agree. I think MG is a major hero in all of this, I don't think we can knock her for that time lapse while she did didn't know what was going on. MOO

That's fair. I simply asked the question. I don't think any of us know what her motivations were (or are), or why she was involved with that particular small group in the first place. I tend to think MG was just very gullible, but I am not yet willing to call her a hero.

Obviously, Chad and Lori thought (or at least hoped) that MG had drunk enough of the Kool-Aid to be willing to lie for them. I think that after the late Nov police contacts, MG went into hiding with a partner, and it was only after doing so that her partner convinced her to contact RPD. So, idk.

MG may very well turn out to be a hero for providing crucial evidence to LE since 12/6 (and not just about Lori and Chad). But she clearly was late opening her eyes. She did podcasts with two people I believe to have been deluded and dangerous at the time of the podcasts. Like many others I'm sure, I just wish she'd have said something sooner. Jmo

 

[LeBlack]

Nate Eaton @NateNewsNow
tweeted this 20 minutes ago:
Lori Daybell booked into the Kauai Community Correctional Center yesterday. A woman tells me she spotted Chad Daybell at the First Hawaiian Bank in Princeville around 4:30 p.m. Was he trying to get money to post the $5 million bond?

I know this is awful, but I hope he was getting money to attempt to flee. That will put a huge divide between the 2 and maybe someone will start talking.

 

[Angleterre]

Something I've wondered about. LE doesn't have to tip their entire hand. Do you suppose they've interviewed school staff from Rexburg? Jmo

Depends what you mean by that and it depends what the law is on disclosure of material facts in the USA
In the UK , you have to disclose everything and I mean everything because if you don’t, it can be argued at court that you haven’t provided the defendant with the opportunity to answer to some of the undisclosed information and evidence held and a case can be thrown out of court altogether and has been done so many times during the early days of the implementation of the disclosure act in 1997/8 when it wasn’t fully understood and since when there had been wilful non disclosure because it was deemed immaterial at the time but still should have been disclosed anyway.

 

[Christ is Truth]

I have a question about posting bail. I get the 10% rule and how he or she will be on the hook for the rest of the $5mil if she runs. Does he get the $500k when she shows up in court? Or is he out that money?

If he’s out that money and doesn’t get it back, he will be up a creek without a paddle when he’s arrested for his crimes. ?? MOO

AND...will she have to post bail again when she gets to Idaho? I would say he should save his money until he REALLY needs it.

 

[Alethea]

This has been one big Qmark for me... Did they have passports?? I have now seen conflicting information of needing a passport for Mexico. I assumed you need one...so now confused. But if they do not have passports.........duh. Why not. With all that appears premeditated, how would you not think about passports??? Because it would be a signal in the records? I just don't think that because I think they thought they were going to get away with all this (Thank heavens for the Woodcocks). confused...

You used to be able to enter Mexico or Canada by land just with a driver’s license (pre 2009). Now you can once again enter by land if your state has one of the security enhanced drivers licenses and you actually have one. They are only slowly phasing in because states are letting you upgrade at your next 10 year registration, not trading your license in immediately.

By air you’ve always needed and still need a passport though.

 

[yawningreyhound]

I think you nailed what I was trying to say. Sure, she's trim. But, a lot of women her age are. I'm older than her and I'm in great shape. But, there's a difference between someone being attractive just because they are, and because they rely mostly on hair extensions, coloring, and styling, inches of makeup, and trendy clothes and accessories. Any daytime TV show will prove that you can take any person and "update" them with the most current hair/makeup/clothing/styling trends of someone decades younger, and "most" people will agree that suddenly they're "more attractive". I'm not one of them. I wonder sometimes, how children would even recognize their mother sans hair/makeup? I don't know, do women like that manage to keep it up 24/7, or do they strip off the costume at night? I would find it very disconcerting to wake up in the middle of the night and see some scare-monster sleeping next to me!

This is interesting. (I hesitate to use "amusing" in light of the circumstances until we know fate of kiddos) But I just commented to my husband that those extensions were going to be problematic in jail. I don't think the cellmates are going to be sympathetic to helping her remove them, either. Ok, end of my snark. I so wanted the DA to comment to the judge that there was a trail of dead bodies a mile wide behind this woman, she ABSOLUTELY is a threat to society.

 

[divineappt]

Thanks for this reminder. I know several of the people who have been discussed on this forum and I'm deeply concerned about the missing children. I just don't understand....and I just haven't figured out how to dial back my own sadness, frustration and anger. (<--Please tell me I'm not alone?) It's affecting my day-to-day life and it's obviously been informing how I post. I'm trying to figure out how to deal better, while also worry constantly that the next thing we learn will be The Worst. Sorry, everyone.

Totally agree. I believe that some of us will respond in print with humor and sarcasm as a release. Very few of us would probably ever do it other than in print, but when we begin to feel like the top of our heads are about to blow, we feel helpless and respond in that helplessness. Not an excuse, not necessarily true, noble, right, pure or lovely, but a sometimes natural response anyway.

 

[Angleterre]

Was she 60? I’m 62 and can finally get married without losing my pension and social security ( after getting divorced 20 years ago). The only catch is now I’m too old to! ( well, apparently I’m not exactly the same catch I was twenty years ago.) Social Security has a little sense of humor.

I’m sure that you are a better catch now than you were 20 years ago because I bet you are more confident and carefree and enjoy your time and don’t sweat the small stuff and have wisdom and humour aplenty with a twinkle in your eye

 

[RexburgSleuth]

Many reasons other than they are not legally married. We had this discussion last night. Here are the results:
1. She hasn't changed her name
2. Criminal Complaint filed from Idaho which lists her as "Lori Norene Vallow, AKA Lori Norene Daybell". Miss Vallow for simplicity's sake.
3. ???

I know I'm replying to myself. I think the definitive answer on the reason the court refers to her as Miss Vallow is on the Affidavit of probable cause page 2, paragraph 3: "Lori Norene Vallow, AKA Lori Norene Daybell (Hereinafter Lori Vallow or Lori)". Hawaii serving the warrant for arrest and holding the hearings would no doubt comply with Rexburg and Madison County Idaho's identification of her as well. I took it too far and assumed the name meant they didn't recognize the marriage. Sorry for causing the confusion.

 

[BigAl16]

Regarding Lori's bail, realise that the LDS wouldn't want to be associated with such a high profile case, but is there any chance that they could contribute behind the scenes, that's if Chad is still in good standing with them?
On the other hand, suppose there's not anything stopping individual members in their own capacity doing this, depending on what sort of respect/loyalty/following they still have for him...
Just got this awful feeling she might post bail somehow.

While the church/corporation in Salt Lake certainly has the money to post Lori's bail (they've been in the news lately due to the billions of dollars they have tied up in investments, not to mention the multi-billion shopping center in downtown Salt Lake) but no way are they going to. More local congregations don't have that kind of money as, at least in my understanding, the majority of the money taken in flows to the top and then may trickle back down in some cases.

Individual members seem unlikely unless there is some extremely wealthy benefactor behind the scenes that's involved in this fiasco. A rumor something like that has come up in these discussions a time or two, but it isn't clear to me what (if anything) that theory is based on.

 

[Redvines86]

Thank you for sharing. I’m Catholic, went to an all-girl Catholic school, grew up in South LA where a large majority of our area is Catholic. I’ve been fortunate to experience international travel. I’ve learned so much from those of you who’ve shared with us. Unfortunately I know little about the LDS religion and its tenets. The prepping seems so difficult to comprehend even of those not on the fringe. Thanks again for educating me/us.

I think, as with any religion, there are hobbies within that religion, for example, I live in Utah, go to church weekly, and I have no storage or prep stuff whatsoever, it's just not my thing, and no one knows or cares. Some people are into scouting, some into other things. The prepping aspect of it for some people is not a part of their religious life, MOO.

 

[10ofRods]

Depends what you mean by that and it depends what the law is on disclosure of material facts in the USA
In the UK , you have to disclose everything and I mean everything because if you don’t, it can be argued at court that you haven’t provided the defendant with the opportunity to answer to some of the undisclosed information and evidence held and a case can be thrown out of court altogether and has been done so many times during the early days of the implementation of the disclosure act in 1997/8 when it wasn’t fully understood and since when there had been wilful non disclosure because it was deemed immaterial at the time but still should have been disclosed anyway.

We have the same rules - but there is a set procedure for this (called "Discovery") that begins when the person is arraigned. She fled and has not been arraigned. She is under a warrant, she's arrested, now charges will be brought. At that point, she's entitled to the evidence against her. It does vary a bit by state, but that's the general pattern. She'll get everything that the prosecution intends to use in court. As the case progresses, the prosecution will always be required to share with her attorneys as new evidence appears, before the Court will allow it in evidence. Sometimes this means that court is postponed for an hour or a day while all of this takes place (as new evidence can appear even after trial starts).

Police do not have share evidence with a suspect before arraignment, that just wouldn't work. So our system is very similar to UK - I'd be surprised if Scotland Yard has to go to every single person they investigate and tell them what they're finding as the case is being investigated. It's only after it's in court that the rules of discovery apply.

US prosecutors are rigorous about providing every single shred of evidence to the defense - that's one reason it often takes years to bring some complex cases to trial. Police do not follow the same rules as prosecuting attorneys in court, at any rate.

 

[Christ is Truth]

I am curious as I have no knowledge or experience with bail/ bonds. Forgive me if I sound completely ignorant. If by chance, Chad comes up with the funds to get Lori out of jail in Hawaii, does he then have to do the same thing again when she is taken to Idaho?

I just asked the same thing a couple of threads later (like around 70). This forum is moving too fast for me to keep up!

 

[Ohmeohmy]

Additional charges possible in Vallow/Daybell case

One of the charges against Lori states that both she and Chad tried to get their friend to lie about the kids’ location: a woman named Melanie Gibb who lives in Arizona.

If that name sounds familiar, that`s because she was their cohost on the “Preparing a People” podcast.

Our sources close to the family say Gibb has a lawyer and is cooperating with the investigation.
​

If the last sentence is true, I find that interesting. If she did not act in furtherance of Lori's solicitation to obstruct which is what the arrest warrant affidavit says then what other legal jeopardy does Melanie have? It may just be her being prudent but it could also be that she has some other involvement and cooperating is part of some deal to avoid prosecution.

Oh oh oh!! This is going to now start pulling in this little circle of trusted like minded friends and family

 

[divineappt]

Honestly? At first I was sure he didn't know about the kids. Then 50/50. Now? Attempted running from LE when questioned and lying about even knowing her phone number? I can't see how he didn't know about them.
None of this makes sense to me as the Chad I know/knew.
Apparently, the only thing I can understand is that he still walks the same as he always has.

“Oh what a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive.” It may have been somewhere around this time when he realized how deep the doo-doo he stepped in was.

 

[Angleterre]

So then you believe he knows exactly where the kids are and is a part of this crime? I find it hard to believe that he could live an entire life following the law, and being a part of his church and yet be that depraved. No, I think that he doesn't want to know the truth and is willing to accept whatever Lori tells him.

I understand what you are saying and I respect your viewpoint but I do wonder what you think and how you reconcile this man Chad , who has lived his entire life following the law and belonging to church life, with the alleged suspicious death ( albeit we do not know the evidential detail yet but we do know that he foresaw Tammys death and actually voiced the need to be rid of her), with the sudden death of his Wife of 30 years and his subsequent re marriage 17 days later? its a genuine question and not a question to call you out on any beliefs or otherwise that you may have.
With respect

 

[adot0902]

Once the coroner signed off on the death of Tammy Daybell as "natural causes". The life insurance company had no legal recourse to hold the funds.

The insurance company may have been part of the reason for Tammy's subsequent exhumation.

Currently, there are no charges against Chad Daybell in relationto Tammy's death. Legally there is no reason for a judgement or garnishment of the insurance money.

Who knows how much money will be left? Chad is blowing through cash.

Does Lori think that she committed the "perfect" crime? That lack of evidence will exonerate her?

A few pages back, attempting to catch up, but just wanted to say I agree. I've had insurance companies be royal pain in the butts about paying out policies.

Life insurance companies are essentially betting on your life, and using casino terms they are the house and the house ALWAYS wins. I had someone pass away about 1 month after I did a very large policy, the insurance company rated him untabled, basically they thought he was healthy and going to live a long time. There were a lot of questions and concerns, but they ended up paying out. So the issues would all come before the payout. What you also have to remember is this policy was through her employer. It's not good business practice to piss of teachers if you have a contract with a school, there are a million other companies who would love those contracts, so I'd assume unless it's a huge huge huge policy and a lot of red flags they would just want a certified death certificate and settlement paperwork. Most of the time it is done very quick because people get life insurance to pay for expenses at death, unless the are loaded and do it for tax free estate purposes (not this case). All this is MOO working in finance.

 

[carbuff]

The problem with Cave Falls is that I *think* it is not in Yellowstone (the campground is a national forest campground) and there is no "park entrance" where they would be taking video or pictures there. At least from my glance at the map I think you could hike in (and no doubt people do) but that's not what happened to get the pictures they're talking about. The entrances other than West Yellowstone and the south entrance between the two parks are the only logical entrances for them to have taken from Rexburg and I think you're right, West Yellowstone is by far the most likely.

I thought for sure we'd be on a new thread by now.

Yes, I think the campground is outside the park. You have to walk in past a ranger station to reach the park territory--but I don't recall it being very far or very hard. Of course I was younger then...

And yes, that is most certainly not where that picture was taken or where they were on video.

It occurs to me that the south entrance is unlikely because there isn't really much there, either. You can't get to it without going through Teton Park--there's a joint fee for both parks, as I recall, and you just drive through at the south entrance. Or am I remembering wrong? It's been like five years since I went south out of the park--usually loop around past the lake when we visit.