Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom, arrested* #19

[LHS]

Does Lori have any dark haired female relatives.

Yes - her sister.

 

[NvrEndgStry]

RE: WS and your phone: have you tried the human antenna trick?

Where you walk around the house and hold the phone high trying to generate a better signal?

 

[FindingJoLee]

In the divorce (and custody) documents filed in July? The kids weren't even missing then.

I don't dispute that the narrator of the video actually makes that statement, it's just that I don't understand it, as its illogical.

The divorce and custody issues were resolved and finalized by October. MB did not contest the divorce or seek custody, so why would there have been any changes made to the documents after they were originally filed in July - at which time the children weren't yet missing.

The only thing that makes sense is this is a later conclusion on Brandon's part, but that is totally unclear from the newscast. I'm not sure they are telling a linear story. This happened, that happened, another thing happened -- but not necessarily in that order. Even when you know quite a bit about this case, some of the news reports have been very hard to follow.

I tried to enlarge and read the document that was displayed as the newscaster was speaking...but couldn't.

 

[canyonoflight]

I'm interested too. Not a long period of time. IDK why he couldn't talk to his grandparents (only 30 seconds) but could have a babysitter that he might tell something they didn't want him to.

Dark thought: Maybe she told the babysitter his sister was dead like she told other people and that JJ hadn't processed it yet. The babysitter would buy it, the grandparents wouldn't. MOO

 

[CSIDreamer]

Re the custody dispute. I believe that thought began in Lori's mind when she discovered she was no longer the beneficiary of CV's life insurance. She knew that the Woodcocks wanted JJ so she kept him from them and then took him somewhere without telling them where. She then planned to be with Chad and get rid of Tammy for her life insurance. The coincidence is too bizarre to have been accidental. She has kept the birth certificates so she can continue getting any benefits for them. Whether she has paid someone to keep them or has arranged for their demise, I don't know. I hope they are alive.



The birth certificates mean benefits so I think that is why she has them. I am still thinking of the early November trip to Hawaii and the return trip in December. I am hoping they went to Hawaii at some point with the kids and that is why she had the birth certificates with her in the car. Why didnt they find them in the Rexburg search?

She was gone by then.

 

[canyonoflight]

Where you walk around the house and hold the phone high trying to generate a better signal?

More like where you stand like a flamingo in front of the tv so channel 9 isn't fuzzy.

 

[Sachi]

Right. While I haven't been to any, I'm positive they exist and can even guess where they would be to some degree (basically close to the areas where the high traffic ones are, but down whatever trail there is that is nearby and not as easily accessible). I think the bigger problem would be knowing which ones would do the intended job (which were acidic enough).

As far as that goes, the idea of hot potting might have been floated to Tylee and she jumped in (if the signage wasn't clear or she could be convinced that it wasn't as bad as the signs said). For that matter, Lori could say it was an accident, but she knew no one would believe her, so they didn't report it.

Feel sick reading this.

 

[spandangly]

It’s not thought that she went to the local congregation. Right?

It doesn't matter if she went, the Mormons will find you

 

[nhmemorymaker]

I have been lurking and trying to catch up for weeks, literally. But I finally have so I have another thought to add, just some cultural insight.

LDS people do believe in preparedness, and we are taught it's a good thing. We are advised to prepare financially to be out of debt and have some back up savings in case of long term illness or accident, or loss of employment. We are taught to have 72 kits or bug out bags and emergency plans in case of house fire, or natural disaster and so on. We are taught to have food storage in case of shortages, employment gaps, or even possible quarantine situations... Just general concepts of being prepared because it promotes faith instead of fear - and financially it's just wise.

Prepping is taking this to more of a hobby level and sometimes to extreme levels. My own father went through a prepper stage where he built a brick oven in the yard for outdoor cooking in case they needed it. They dug a well so they have water supply not connected to the city if they need it. They have a solar generator and battery storage unit in a faraday cage as well as about 2+ years food storage for them and many others. This is beyond what is currently counseled by the church. They have done so because they can and because they want to, but that level is not part of any of our specific beliefs.

My reason for being interested in this case is that I'm not close enough to be a VI sort of person, but I'm one step away in many directions. I'm part of many groups of people who study the end times prophecies, and have heard a lot of these various ideas. I have rejected the ones that are not doctrinal and more extreme... but I have been invited to events by that company we don't name, and I have been invited to join AVOW by various people. I have an uncle who goes to AVOW to talk with his ham radio buddies. (another prepping concept) I know two authors that published through Chad personally, and one of them is a VERY close friend an she was the one who told me about this case. We talk at least weekly. Facebook seems to think that Jason Mow should be my friend as he's at the top of all the suggestions they give because of so many mutual friends.

Because of that.. here's what I'm seeing - There are many who study and are interested in the end times type things in the LDS church. There are three types. The first type sticks only to scriptures and prophetic sayings. The second type looks beyond that and includes personal revelation, discussion with others about non doctrinal speculation... and the third type is so HUNGRY for this kind of stuff not coming directly from the church leadership and the pulpit that they cling to anyone claiming to have more info, people like JR the author and Chad and so on... Lori fits this third type to a T but add in some serious psychosis and fanaticism. It's that third group that are the ones who go off the rails and go looking for anything to satisfy curiosity and impatience in this regard. I recently explained to someone else that though the LDS church says "latter-day" referring to last days type of things, they were named this back in 1830... it's been almost 2 centuries of "last days". This third kind of person is not always involved with AVOW and with that group we don't name or even with cultish behavior - BUT a subset of that sort is! I've suddenly become aware of how many on my friends lists on social media are in that kind of mindset. It's made me a little sick to see how close it is to me all over the place.

The trend I've seen is that third group, especially when radicalized like Lori and Chad seem to be - tend to go pretty drastic and do really strange things believing angels and God are instructing them to do so. I learned yesterday there is a girl I grew up with who is also part of Chad's group, was told by this group that she is one of the 144k and so she divorced her husband and moved to Missouri and is in "waiting" to be called upon. This kind of behavior in the third type I named has been spoken against by church leadership over and over and over again as recently as last October's conference for the worldwide church.

Not sure if all this rambling helps anything... just some insight I guess. (I'm sorry I'm long winded)

long winded? Are you crazy? This has been totally enlightening to me... and thank you very very much. I feel your direct discussion, and even the dividing into groups is a way to better understand the various levels of acceptance of all this stuff. I feel some folks have been a bit offended about the interest from many of us for trying so hard to understand all of this....and their comments are more like the Church would never encourage such things, or the Church will never tell you what you can do or what you can't do... and this has nothing to do with the Church.... your explanations are more raw, but also more human. And I guess I am glad that the church leadership is speaking out. Having relatives in the LDS Church, they actually said wonderful things about the October conferences about love, peace and understanding our brothers and sisters. The outgrowths (that Hydra that I have discussed previously!! was not brought up!!) again, thank you.

 

[LHS]

long winded? Are you crazy? This has been totally enlightening to me... and thank you very very much. I feel your direct discussion, and even the dividing into groups is a way to better understand the various levels of acceptance of all this stuff. I feel some folks have been a bit offended about the interest from many of us for trying so hard to understand all of this....and their comments are more like the Church would never encourage such things, or the Church will never tell you what you can do or what you can't do... and this has nothing to do with the Church.... your explanations are more raw, but also more human. And I guess I am glad that the church leadership is speaking out. Having relatives in the LDS Church, they actually said wonderful things about the October conferences about love, peace and understanding our brothers and sisters. The outgrowths (that Hydra that I have discussed previously!! was not brought up!!) again, thank you.

What drew me into creating an account here and saying something was that I seemed to understand some of these levels due to the people I know... which btw.. for the most part are really good people, but I have been surprised to note how many seem to be of the third type who may or may not be involved in Chad's group as I've been calling it. I could see that there is a lot of justified confusion because LDS beliefs in this area are not well understood, and just simply saying "that's not what we believe" doesn't really help anyone understand this mess.

Most of the people I know fall in categories 1 and 2.. but I guess I do know some 3's, and that became interesting to me. On FB I'm a member of MANY communities and groups, most of which I lurk in. I learn a lot about various types of members and how they think and function. I don't think everyone in the 3rd category is off the wall nuts, but many are walking the cliffside on dangerous levels regarding some of this stuff. I had a heart to heart with my husband feeling sick at how close I was to so much of it, and yet I had never crossed that line or gotten that close to the cliff. I think it's because I have a pretty good grounding and moral sense.

There is an old myth/story from years ago that is somewhat like a parable for this mess... it's about a couple who met at BYU and dated. He tells her "God told me we're supposed to be married." And she responds back with, "Great, we'll set the date as soon as He tells me the same thing!" The idea was not to take someone else's word for things, but instead to have that moral grounding, or personal relationship with God for yourself. In this convoluted case... it seems many have drunk the koolaid (which is scary when you consider that phrase actually comes from the Jones Town Cult who literally drank poisoned koolaid) without bothering to look further than the rim of the cup!

 

[divineappt]

The only thing that makes sense is this is a later conclusion on Brandon's part, but that is totally unclear from the newscast. I'm not sure they are telling a linear story. This happened, that happened, another thing happened -- but not necessarily in that order. Even when you know quite a bit about this case, some of the news reports have been very hard to follow.

I tried to enlarge and read the document that was displayed as the newscaster was speaking...but couldn't.

If you look at the video of the documents, it is the documents filed against Lori that got her where she’s at now.

 

[Christ is Truth]

Yes - her sister.

If you look at the Cox family photo of the mom, dad and four kids, Lori looks taller than her sister.

The woman in the video looks to be wearing heels and that might be why she’s flailing her arms on the snowy path. So if that’s the case, she might be more like 5’8” or so.

 

[tresir2012]

It seems to me LE have compromised here, assuming murder charges for Vallow are the real game in town.

But with LE already suggesting the kids may never be found, I guess they figure this is now the best move.

If Vallow has killed the kids, then of course she is never going to produce them or cop to it. BUT the upside for the state is that Vallow will struggle to offer any positive version at trial. She can hardly say the kids are safe but I'm not telling where. That will almost certainly lead to conviction on all charges.

This then drags out years, and maybe LE get some more breaks?

Personally I don't really understand why we are entertaining the idea the kids are hidden when LV has never said that herself, and there is no other evidence to suggest it.

Apparently, she told LE they were with Colby in Az and also told them they were with MG in Az. Wonder who was the first? Perhaps MG and then when she said no, she said CR but hadn't got round to even asking him to lie for her.

 

[utahobserver]

I read this today & thought- I wonder if his late afternoon bank run yesterday would have his parents wiring him money. I’m not sure what to make of this though;

KSL TV also spoke to Chad Daybell’s parents. They said they did not want to comment about the case but said they are watching it very closely and have talked to their son since Lori Vallow’s arrest.

They would only say their son is going to be OK.
Former Mission Companion Of Chad Daybell In Disbelief After Developments

That's a strange quote. Sounds like hopeful prayer. Chad lied to them - as reported in the affidavit of probable cause (page 10:READ: The documents charging Lori Vallow Daybell | East Idaho News) and they still think Chad is going to be okay. I wish them peace. I wish they would also encourage their son to tell the truth. These children deserve better. They need to be found.

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

I have been lurking and trying to catch up for weeks, literally. But I finally have so I have another thought to add, just some cultural insight.

LDS people do believe in preparedness, and we are taught it's a good thing. We are advised to prepare financially to be out of debt and have some back up savings in case of long term illness or accident, or loss of employment. We are taught to have 72 kits or bug out bags and emergency plans in case of house fire, or natural disaster and so on. We are taught to have food storage in case of shortages, employment gaps, or even possible quarantine situations... Just general concepts of being prepared because it promotes faith instead of fear - and financially it's just wise.

Prepping is taking this to more of a hobby level and sometimes to extreme levels. My own father went through a prepper stage where he built a brick oven in the yard for outdoor cooking in case they needed it. They dug a well so they have water supply not connected to the city if they need it. They have a solar generator and battery storage unit in a faraday cage as well as about 2+ years food storage for them and many others. This is beyond what is currently counseled by the church. They have done so because they can and because they want to, but that level is not part of any of our specific beliefs.

My reason for being interested in this case is that I'm not close enough to be a VI sort of person, but I'm one step away in many directions. I'm part of many groups of people who study the end times prophecies, and have heard a lot of these various ideas. I have rejected the ones that are not doctrinal and more extreme... but I have been invited to events by that company we don't name, and I have been invited to join AVOW by various people. I have an uncle who goes to AVOW to talk with his ham radio buddies. (another prepping concept) I know two authors that published through Chad personally, and one of them is a VERY close friend an she was the one who told me about this case. We talk at least weekly. Facebook seems to think that Jason Mow should be my friend as he's at the top of all the suggestions they give because of so many mutual friends.

Because of that.. here's what I'm seeing - There are many who study and are interested in the end times type things in the LDS church. There are three types. The first type sticks only to scriptures and prophetic sayings. The second type looks beyond that and includes personal revelation, discussion with others about non doctrinal speculation... and the third type is so HUNGRY for this kind of stuff not coming directly from the church leadership and the pulpit that they cling to anyone claiming to have more info, people like JR the author and Chad and so on... Lori fits this third type to a T but add in some serious psychosis and fanaticism. It's that third group that are the ones who go off the rails and go looking for anything to satisfy curiosity and impatience in this regard. I recently explained to someone else that though the LDS church says "latter-day" referring to last days type of things, they were named this back in 1830... it's been almost 2 centuries of "last days". This third kind of person is not always involved with AVOW and with that group we don't name or even with cultish behavior - BUT a subset of that sort is! I've suddenly become aware of how many on my friends lists on social media are in that kind of mindset. It's made me a little sick to see how close it is to me all over the place.

The trend I've seen is that third group, especially when radicalized like Lori and Chad seem to be - tend to go pretty drastic and do really strange things believing angels and God are instructing them to do so. I learned yesterday there is a girl I grew up with who is also part of Chad's group, was told by this group that she is one of the 144k and so she divorced her husband and moved to Missouri and is in "waiting" to be called upon. This kind of behavior in the third type I named has been spoken against by church leadership over and over and over again as recently as last October's conference for the worldwide church.

Not sure if all this rambling helps anything... just some insight I guess. (I'm sorry I'm long winded)

Very insightful and helpful, thank you for sharing.

 

[renarde]

I thought about the babysitter but this is a month later. It could easily be a member of the local congregation just checking in. The women are organized to do just that, though they typically come in pairs.

ETA: it could be almost anyone

So tall. It could be a man.

I'm sure that neighbor's Ring caught a lot more than what's been shared. Sad to see the footage of JJ playing so joyfully with his friend...

MOO

 

[yawningreyhound]

If Chad and Lori have known each other since 2018... Is it really possible he did not know she had children from that date to November 2019, which is more than a year? Chad knew J Mow and Melanie G and they both knew she had children. No one told him? He was too infatuated with Lori to question any of this?? No way! Imo. Could he possibly be charged with aiding and abetting in the abandonment of her children... Even though the children were not biologically nor legally his own??

I feel like I just read that they may have met earlier, like a few years earlier. I'll have to check now.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Thanks for your insights. They are really helpful to put it all in perspective. Please keep joining in, it helps us to understand what’s going on in their head.

Do you think those in the third example are still backing CD and LV? The impression I get is they’re distancing themselves from them. Do you think that there are people that might have an idea what happened to the children? Potentially would there come a point that they will speak up? MOO

Thanks again for joining in.

Great question.--distance or unwavering.

 

[Christ is Truth]

I don’t know how to link it, but Justin Lum said he has more documents. Fox 10 News Live after 6pm and again at 9/10pm.

ETA - Mountain time

 

[tresir2012]

It's unlikely to me that the kids are in hiding since they have a mother who has made ZERO attempt to fund them, or contact them. A teen with a license and who knows social media as well as Tylee isn't going to stop talking to everyone she knows, or stop fighting for her freedom. You'd have to lock that stubborn spirited girl down in chains to keep her from leaving or making contact with someone.

It's much more likely to me that the kids are gone. Chad and Lori are behaving and acting to others like they have no intentions of having minor aged kids in their life now or later. Chad lied to his own parents and to Tammy's sister about Lori having no kids that aren't already adults. If the kids someday showed back up that would be awkward to explain. I would imagine they plan on the kids not being part of their lives anymore at all because everything indicates that and nothing indicates they have plans to include kids ever again. I think the kids are gone And I think we may or may not find remains... I hate to have to say that. As a mother myself, it makes me sick... but that's what I believe at this point.

Why do you think she kept the birth certificates and JJ's iPads in the car with her and Jj's meds in the Rexburg house?