CANADA - shooter in RCMP vehicle & uniform, 22 killed (plus perp), Portapique, NS, 18 April 2020 #3

[Skibunny]

Is there any chance that the $475,000 was a payment to GW for the info he produced leading to the arrests in NB? Seems like a very high amount.

 

[Tighthead]

Is there any chance that the $475,000 was a payment to GW for the info he produced leading to the arrests in NB? Seems like a very high amount.

I would say next to zero.

I think he withdrew the cash because COVID turned him into a doomsday prepper type. To me he fits the profile of someone who operates under a "don't trust anyone" philosophy. His parking lot encounter with the HPD has a huge anti-authority vibe.

 

[jillybean51]

I would say next to zero.

I think he withdrew the cash because COVID turned him into a doomsday prepper type. To me he fits the profile of someone who operates under a "don't trust anyone" philosophy. His parking lot encounter with the HPD has a huge anti-authority vibe.

The article also says that it’s highly irregular for a citizen to get their money from Brinks..,

 

[Bo.Jack]

Curious..
Does CSIS pay their "associates" this way?

 

[SaintJohn2020]

I was told a long time a go by a teller at TD they flag anyone who takes 10k cash at once, and watch out for any patterns for possible money laundering. I didn't even think you could redrawth 500k from a regular bank. Brinks is in the cash business though... maybe it's easier and raises less reg flags

 

[Lexiintoronto]

I haven’t followed the story closely—did they recover the 475K?

I’m not convinced he was an agent of any sort yet. There could have been something about to happen involving a debt or lawsuit and he wanted to squirrel away money.

If—and I don’t know this—he was splitting with his common-law girlfriend, maybe he was going to hide assets?

If he was an agent of sorts, why didn’t the RCMP know of his replica cars and clothes. I’d think they would have checked out every detail about him.

 

[MistyWaters]

The article also says that it’s highly irregular for a citizen to get their money from Brinks..,

“Wortman, a 51-year-old denturist, is said to have arranged the withdrawal from Brink’s after transferring the cash from an account at a major Canadian bank.”

A lot of banks don’t hold a whole lot of cash on hand anymore because of the wide usage of credit and debit payments. They’d have to get it shipped in through Brinks and usually cash shipments to branches are not daily. So rather than GW waiting, I suppose it could be possible the arrangement was made for him to pick up the cash directly from Brinks.

 

[MistyWaters]

I haven’t followed the story closely—did they recover the 475K?

I’m not convinced he was an agent of any sort yet. There could have been something about to happen involving a debt or lawsuit and he wanted to squirrel away money.

If—and I don’t know this—he was splitting with his common-law girlfriend, maybe he was going to hide assets?

If he was an agent of sorts, why didn’t the RCMP know of his replica cars and clothes. I’d think they would have checked out every detail about him.

According to Maclean’s -

The Nova Scotia killer had ties to criminals and withdrew a huge sum of cash before the shooting - Macleans.ca
“It is not clear what happened to the money from the moment the killer took it out of the Brink’s location to the time he was shot by RCMP officers during an attempted arrest at a gas station in Enfield, N.S., on April 19.

The lawyer for family members of the killer’s victims said Wednesday that the estate filing at probate court lists a large sum of cash, which he believes was recovered by the RCMP.

“I assume the public trustee has it,” said Robert Pineo, who is suing the estate....”

 

[Oscarjackson12]

I was told a long time a go by a teller at TD they flag anyone who takes 10k cash at once, and watch out for any patterns for possible money laundering. I didn't even think you could redrawth 500k from a regular bank. Brinks is in the cash business though... maybe it's easier and raises less reg flags

Yes you can but the bank would need to order the cash so they wouldn’t deplete their regular available cash.

Any amount of $10,000 that is withdrawn or deposited you just need to sign a legal form saying where the money is from etc. That’s a legal requirement in Canada to prevent money laundering. For him I would assume it was his personal or business account.

 

[MistyWaters]

Yes you can but the bank would need to order the cash so they wouldn’t deplete their regular available cash.

Any amount of $10,000 that is withdrawn or deposited you just need to sign a legal form saying where the money is from etc. That’s a legal requirement in Canada to prevent money laundering. For him I would assume it was his personal or business account.

I’d guess the transaction was associated with his dental business and he may well have been involved in money laundering. This was not a person who was a law abiding citizen.

But something I noticed contained in the released warrants iirc, police noted a female recorded voice indicating the denture business was closed due to COVID-19 and anticipated to reopen mid April. I’d guess this recording was placed around mid-March, when the closure of business began. I can’t remember the exact date it was to reopen and I will look later, but the date a few days prior to the gunman’s massacre. Given he appeared to be a compulsive sort of person I thought it was interesting that recording hadn’t been updated to a tentative future date.

So just based on that, the remote and far out possibility occurred to me the $475,000 cash on Mar 30th were proceeds of the sale of the business. Not saying I’m right, but that the abandoned business phone recording seems unusual to me. In one of the media reports was there also a reference to his impending semi-retirement at Portapique as well?

This is all purely speculation but as it’d be very easy to trace money sent by the RCMP or from any other source, I don’t think the $475,000 is destined to become an unsolved mystery intertwined with conspiracy theories involving the RCMP.

 

[Scoobydo2]

Crown says release of N.S. mass shooting details could harm 'massive' probe

CBSA investigating smuggling offences related to weapons used in Nova Scotia shooting

 

[tayaway]

Canadaland episode 267 (Jesse Brown & Desmond Cole) briefly explores the Macleans article about the RCMP informant theory.

Starts at around the 48:48 mark.

 

[Tilly23]

A new story at CBC:
N.S. gunman liquidated assets, stockpiled gas and food due to COVID-19 fears, RCMP say
Shooter told people he created a replica police cruiser to pay tribute to fallen officers
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova...investigation-gunman-covid-paranoia-1.5628184

an excerpt:

Campbell said RCMP discovered hundreds of thousands of dollars in a fire-proof container on one of the properties Wortman owned in Portapique. He said investigators are auditing his financial records and would not specify the exact amount of cash seized.

So far, he said they think the gunman believed it wasn't safe to leave his savings in the bank. ​

The article also addresses the Maclean's story. They interviewed someone who actually was police informant about how he received payments.

Worth a read!

MOO

 

[Oscarjackson12]

I’d guess the transaction was associated with his dental business and he may well have been involved in money laundering. This was not a person who was a law abiding citizen.

But something I noticed contained in the released warrants iirc, police noted a female recorded voice indicating the denture business was closed due to COVID-19 and anticipated to reopen mid April. I’d guess this recording was placed around mid-March, when the closure of business began. I can’t remember the exact date it was to reopen and I will look later, but the date a few days prior to the gunman’s massacre. Given he appeared to be a compulsive sort of person I thought it was interesting that recording hadn’t been updated to a tentative future date.

So just based on that, the remote and far out possibility occurred to me the $475,000 cash on Mar 30th were proceeds of the sale of the business. Not saying I’m right, but that the abandoned business phone recording seems unusual to me. In one of the media reports was there also a reference to his impending semi-retirement at Portapique as well?

This is all purely speculation but as it’d be very easy to trace money sent by the RCMP or from any other source, I don’t think the $475,000 is destined to become an unsolved mystery intertwined with conspiracy theories involving the RCMP.

Well the answering machine message wasn’t unusual because there was no business in Canada that knew when they would be allowed to re-open by govt. So it wouldn’t make any sense to leave a guessed at date.

 

[MistyWaters]

Well the answering machine message wasn’t unusual because there was no business in Canada that knew when they would be allowed to re-open by govt. So it wouldn’t make any sense to leave a guessed at date.

Yes I agree and that was my point, March 19th a recording saying the business was closed to Apr 15th when they would reassess, then no update. The shootings occurred Apr 18/19th.



page 15
Mass shooting search warrant documents released May 25, 2020

 

[Oscarjackson12]

Yes I agree and that was my point, March 19th a recording saying the business was closed to Apr 15th when they would reassess, then no update. The shootings occurred Apr 18/19th.


View attachment 253486
page 15
Mass shooting search warrant documents released May 25, 2020

I was pointing that out simply because you had mentioned that you were surprised that he hadn’t put a date. Geez I was so naive back then thinking that this - the closure of everything - would only last a few weeks. Nope.

 

[MistyWaters]

I was pointing that out simply because you had mentioned that you were surprised that he hadn’t put a date. Geez I was so naive back then thinking that this - the closure of everything - would only last a few weeks. Nope.

Yes, I understand what you meant and I thought I might’ve worded it wrong. I wasn’t expecting the business would’ve been opened, just that the phone message hasn’t been updated by April 15th. It is also my understanding dental/denturist businesses were indeed open only for emergency situations during that time but obviously not his business.

 

[Satchie]

A new story at CBC:
N.S. gunman liquidated assets, stockpiled gas and food due to COVID-19 fears, RCMP say
Shooter told people he created a replica police cruiser to pay tribute to fallen officers
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova...investigation-gunman-covid-paranoia-1.5628184

an excerpt:

Campbell said RCMP discovered hundreds of thousands of dollars in a fire-proof container on one of the properties Wortman owned in Portapique. He said investigators are auditing his financial records and would not specify the exact amount of cash seized.

So far, he said they think the gunman believed it wasn't safe to leave his savings in the bank. ​

The article also addresses the Maclean's story. They interviewed someone who actually was police informant about how he received payments.

Worth a read!

MOO

Maclean's really went off the deep end with this story. Sorry to see MMM resorting to such desperate measures. I wonder if GW spent too much time reading sensationalist media stories about Covid-19.

I've know a couple of people, including one around that same time, get all worked up by the media and declare that it would be better to take your life savings out of the bank and hide it under the mattress. At least GW bought a fireproof safe - I guess he had a premonition someone would set fire to his house.

 

[MistyWaters]

Maclean's really went off the deep end with this story. Sorry to see MMM resorting to such desperate measures. I wonder if GW spent too much time reading sensationalist media stories about Covid-19.

I've know a couple of people, including one around that same time, get all worked up by the media and declare that it would be better to take your life savings out of the bank and hide it under the mattress. At least GW bought a fireproof safe - I guess he had a premonition someone would set fire to his house.

Yes, good conspiracies always spark interest.....it seems everyone loves a good conspiracy these days.

I wonder if GW was connected to other “COVID-19/great catastrophe” likeminded people, either personally or online, that fueled his paranoia or if he just built it up in his own muddled mind. Some of the fear mongering/conspiracy SM platforms on the internet really do a number on people, especially those suffering from mental illness. If he indeed participated in one, I hope LE will disclose and expose it.

My friends brother was an undiagnosed schizophrenic and for a time and fell into one that convinced him “the govt” was watching him through his cellphone and TV, even though he had no reason to be watched by anyone, let alone the govt. The result was he became even more withdrawn but luckily he eventually confided in his family and agreed to seek treatment. That same thought crossed my mind, that GW apparently did not have a cellphone.

 

[newguy123]

I have been away for a bit here fishing.....and returned to find no more facts but lots of speculation. It does sadden me to see so little info is forthcoming. I'd love to be one of the reporters at the infrequent press conferences and ask "my" questions! I just wish there was a timetable for info to be released.

* as awful as it is, when he set fire to his "warehouse" did he think he g/f went to the Blairs? Is that why he shot Greg and then went into the house?
* was McCully shot because she ran to the sound of the gunshots and was therefore in his way? Or did she go to assist when she saw flames from the warehouse? I have always wondered about putting her kids in the basement....if it was a fire she was worried about that is not something I'd do......but if it was a shooter, it makes more sense to me.
* Ellison was shot because he happened across the shooter in the pursuit of his crimes
* he escaped by driving across a field. I would like to know which field it was, show me on a map/satellite image his escape route.
* when he was at the warehouse area, the Blairs were killed, McCully was killed, and the Gulenchyn house set on fire. He then took a shot at the driver of the car which reported him in his police car at the Gulenchyn driveway. He went down toward the beach from there. Did he then set fire to the Zahl house, and work his way back up to the Bonds and then the Tucks? Why stop to set fires and shot people in their homes if you are escaping? I read the Tucks were shot in their home as though they had come to answer the door. What made him stop and kill others as he made his escape? (Yes I realise I am seeking logical thinking and answers in an unrational state of affairs......)
* he fled to Debert and spent the night. His showing up at the McCloud house was deliberate......so was the other "visit" where the people refused to answer the door. The murder of Bagley was probably because he was "in the way" as he went to help, just as I am guessing McCully was back at Portapique. The murder of the nurses was prob and the walker Hyslip were probably just because they were there. But, overnight it seems his rage did not subside, no cooler head prevailed, he deliberately went looking for further victims and took others by chance. Why?
* the run in with the RCMP and the killing of Stephenson was not something he sought but circumstances forced him to act. Same with Webber, who had witnessed the action and now the gunman needed a vehicle to escape with.
* Goulet was killed (in my own theory) because he wanted another escape vehicle and her remote location would give him a head start on the police who were headed in the other direction.

This is just a series of questions and babbling as answers are still not forthcoming. The CI stories and other related tangents are interesting and oftentimes fanciful theories, but these things grow in the void of information being released.