Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #50

[Tortoise]

I think that they really thought they could burn the bodies and voila! all traces of the kids would be gone forever. Evidently, none of these rocket scientists did any research on burning a human body in an open fire. It can be done but it takes several days. They didn’t have that kind of time. I think this is why they mutilated Tylee. I bet they thought smaller pieces might burn faster. Instead they ended up with a heinous mess. I think the burying was a last minute solution. Even they are not stupid enough to make burying at Chad’s a first choice. By the time JJ was dead, they just buried him. It seemed like an ok idea at the time.

I think they were hoping to make Tylee's remains indistinguishable from animal remains (on first sight), if they were excavated. Trying to burn her remains was probably for the same reason if they were found before decomposition but I expect he became nervous with the odor of the fire, and being interrupted before he'd finished. MOO

 

[Nikynoo]

Dean was also attacked by Prior for handpicking which Chad's messages to include in his report.

I wonder if another phone of Tammy's was seized that could show activity before Charles' death. It would be interesting to know if there were any messages/emails/calls from Charles to Tammy.

I think what stood out to me when Prior was cross examining Ben Dean, was that Prior did not understand (or did not listen) to what Bens role actually is. Ben is an analyst, looking for patterns, and just reported on the patterns he did find. I think Prior is out of his depth when it comes to electronic communications. The most obvious question to ask was, could the prosecution prove when the text from Chad was sent? As the examination (and therefore testimony) was in relation to Tammys phone, would that not only show when it was received by Tammy and not necessarily when it was sent by Chads phone?

 

[Nikynoo]

Will Alex's statements to MG be admissible in court?

Hmm, good question! I'm now wondering if MG recorded this call also?

 

[Nikynoo]

If she went to police on December 6, and recorded the call on December 8, it's likely (IMO) that she was prompted by police. If that could be proved by the defense, could she be accused of perjury?

From Lori's probable cause affidavit (BBM):
On December 6, 2019, RPD was contacted by Melanie Gibb and informed that both Chad Daybell and Lori Vallow called Melanie on November 26, 201 at separate times and asked her to tell the police that she had .V. even though J.V. was not with her. Melanie informed RPD that she declined Chad’s and Lori’s requests.
https://www.abc4.com/wp-content/upl...son-County-ID-Affidavit-of-Probable-Cause.pdf

The thing with probable cause affadavits is, that sometimes they are a little off. As far as I can recall, there was no evidence given by LE as to when the police interviewed MG in December. Obviously, this is something that can be teased out more during the trial.

 

[indicolite22]

Curious about the phone call MG recorded with Chad and Lori.
My take away was there is something murky involved with MG here.

Lori gave a clear direct "veiled'threat to MG IMO.
If you breath a word I will take you down with me.
Something like 'you will be judged too Melanie'....and she replies 'as you'....and Lori says '100% I am ok with that.'

At a guess ......LE knows exactly what MG's dirty laundry is.
Full disclosure has kept her behind out of jail on accessory charges.

I think Lori was implying that MG would be judged by God if she were in the wrong camp (despite knowing better) once the apocalypse started. She would be excluded from the chosen 144k. As far as MG being in danger, IMO Lori was referring to the people who were supposedly threatening Lori (Kay and Charles' relatives). Maybe the dirty laundry is about being with a new boyfriend before divorce and leaving her children behind, but we don't know the facts and Lori is the last person to preach about it.

 

[indicolite22]

The thing with probable cause affadavits is, that sometimes they are a little off. As far as I can recall, there was no evidence given by LE as to when the police interviewed MG in December. Obviously, this is something that can be teased out more during the trial.

BBM. Even when it comes to dates for which police records exist? Did the person writing the affidavit pull the date from memory? Just asking, not starting an argument.
Edit: typo

 

[Nikynoo]

BBM. Even when it comes to dates for which police records exists? Did the person writing the affidavit pull the date from memory? Just asking, not starting an argument.

To be honest, I don't know. I have noticed it in several affadavits for different cases on this site. Not everything in the affadavit matches with what comes out later. It could be an error by the author of the affadavit. IIRC, affadavits are done very quickly whilst evidence is being completed, so yes, I guess there is room for error. Also, IIRC, MG called Gilbert Police and not Rexburg?

ETA @indicolite22 my mistake, MG did contact RPD. I have no idea for the discrepancy.

 

[GRT]

the crime scene team would have been no doubt delighted (in terms of evidence) of the way JJ was disposed.
wrapped up fully contained .
the bow on top....Duct tape!.....and plenty of it! the gift that keeps on giving.

I'm going to place a bet....Lori's DNA and prints are going to be wrapped up deep in those rounds of duct tape.
Praying for it anyway.

moo

I think this is likely, along with Alex's DNA. I'm hoping they find CD's DNA on the outside of the packages as I believe in my heart that he helped with the burials and perhaps with burning Tylee's body as well.

 

[indicolite22]

I think they were hoping to make Tylee's remains indistinguishable from animal remains (on first sight), if they were excavated. Trying to burn her remains was probably for the same reason if they were found before decomposition but I expect he became nervous with the odor of the fire, and being interrupted before he'd finished. MOO

Warning-graphic
By the amount of remains alone it would probably not be mistaken for a small animal. On another note, wouldn't the fact that part of the remains were found uncharred support the theory that Tlyee's body was dismembered before it was burned? If that were the case, where would that have taken place?

 

[Nikynoo]

Warning-graphic
By the amount of remains alone it would probably not be mistaken for a small animal. On another note, wouldn't the fact that part of the remains were found uncharred support the theory that Tlyee's body was dismembered before it was burned? If that were the case, where would that have taken place?

I was thinking along the same line. I am willing to await autopy report to find out.

 

[mrjitty]

What was the date of each burial please?

 

[k-mac]

Personally, I don’t see MG as nefarious at all. I think she is not the brightest bulb on the porch And she got involved in some fringe beliefs and got sucked into Chad’s BS for awhile. I don’t know what her dirty laundry could be. I don't know what crime she would be an accessory to. The kids were long dead by the time Lori tried to drag her onto that crazy train. I don’t know how she could have saved the kids, especially from Arizona. Going to the cops and reporting that Lori called her kids dark zombies would have accomplished nothing.

snipped by me for focus

nafarious is your term.
agreed she isn't the brightest bulb on the porch which makes her extremely easily manipulated by someone she is infatuated with.
There is plenty of things MG might have been involved with through not fault of her own yet still could show culpability.
For example. She was well aware Lori was stating to her that her children were zombies.
She knew according to their cult what had to happen to zombies.
Compliant POSSIBLY. Enabling likely.

MG being at the premises the night JJ vanished and likely was murdered doesn't make her knowledgeable of such but it's fair to ask the question what did she know.

This is all kinds of shades of grey to me.

moo

 

[Nikynoo]

What was the date of each burial please?

Monday 9th September and Monday 23rd September 2019

 

[k-mac]

I think Lori was implying that MG would be judged by God if she were in the wrong camp (despite knowing better) once the apocalypse started. She would be excluded from the chosen 144k. As far as MG being in danger, IMO Lori was referring to the people who were supposedly threatening Lori (Kay and Charles' relatives). Maybe the dirty laundry is about being with a new boyfriend before divorce and leaving her children behind, but we don't know the facts and Lori is the last person to preach about it.

The more that gets released, the more doubled meanings getting exposed IMO.
Funny enough they NEVER discuss all the hog wash they supposedly buy into in any of the released vocab we have of them interacting together or to others like LE.
(zombies, dark light, previous lifes etc)

It sounds more and more ...the oldest reasons of time....sex love and money.
With a childish fantasy game being played as a cover by very immature adults.
Reminds me of kiddy stuff like a young boy suggesting playing mommys and daddys because deep down he just wants to kiss that girl but.....he has a cover amongst his friends to 'not look dumb' when she rejects him.

moo

 

[Tortoise]

Warning-graphic
By the amount of remains alone it would probably not be mistaken for a small animal. On another note, wouldn't the fact that part of the remains were found uncharred support the theory that Tlyee's body was dismembered before it was burned? If that were the case, where would that have taken place?

Quite. Hermosillo's testimony was that underneath the bucket was a partial human skull, and Daniels' testimony was that to the side of the skull was the mandible. I believe I have learned somewhere along my travels that it is very hard to break a skull. I'm surprised they didn't discover buried tools with the remains because those would surely have had a lot of evidence on them. moo

 

[indicolite22]

How unusual is it that MG remembered Chad's phone number? Did she call him regularly in the past?

 

[Twolabs]

@k-mac Im honestly kind of confused by this. In life she could be bothered to care for JJ and without Tylee she didnt appreciate having the burden of taking care of him. She told everyone how wild and uncontrollable he was. Yet, whoever buried him took alot of time and effort to make sure his body carefully wrap. It almost seemed, I dont know... loving? As opposed to Tylee, whose burial was clearly given no more than apassing thought

MOO is that Tylee was much harder to dispose of then perhaps they thought she would be. By the time they got to JJ they could have thought just easier to bury him as is BUT they did not want any leakage of body fluids or smell therefore wrapped and rewrapped so many times that nothing would have escaped. At least until the dirty deed was done. Figuring they got away with Tylee on Chad's property they decided to just bury JJ there too. Just some thought and MOO

 

[Tortoise]

I think what stood out to me when Prior was cross examining Ben Dean, was that Prior did not understand (or did not listen) to what Bens role actually is. Ben is an analyst, looking for patterns, and just reported on the patterns he did find. I think Prior is out of his depth when it comes to electronic communications. The most obvious question to ask was, could the prosecution prove when the text from Chad was sent? As the examination (and therefore testimony) was in relation to Tammys phone, would that not only show when it was received by Tammy and not necessarily when it was sent by Chads phone?

This was a back and forth exchange - Tammy responded to his message about showering and going to BYU, and he replied that he was back now. I don't think any significant delay in transmission of messages can be asserted.

 

[k-mac]

I think this is likely, along with Alex's DNA. I'm hoping they find CD's DNA on the outside of the packages as I believe in my heart that he helped with the burials and perhaps with burning Tylee's body as well.

yes!
cherry on top

 

[Tortoise]

Will Alex's statements to MG be admissible in court?

Yes - MG can testify what someone told her directly. The jury just has to decide if they believe her but it's for the purposes of why she then did or thought something, not for the truth of what he said.

IMO