Greece - Caroline Crouch, 20, Murdered, Athens, 11 May 2021 #3 *ARREST*

[TootsieFootsie]

I used an expression, I was meaning he was inhumane.

Oh, he is a human being all right. A man can be the most honourable and the most despicable being on Earth. Thats human nature.

 

[Estelle]

With very few exceptions (incl KTG), the diary excerpts were posted on all media, websites and blogs, were read in news programs and TV magazines. No prosecutor intervened, although they were part of the case file and contained sensitive private information of the slain woman.

Many Greeks on social media questioned the diary’s authenticity and some suggested the murderer and husband may have doctored it, as he had access to Caroline’s internet codes.

Skai TV is not the only mainstream television station, the main source of information of Greeks over a certain age. Like in a chorus line the country’s mainstream TV channels imply that the cold-blooded murderer who isolated his much younger wife from family and friends and had full control of her life was in fact a “caring father” who lost his temper in “the heat of the moment.”

Is there a systematic effort by the media to attribute the heinous crime to “a moment of heat during an argument” although all forensic evidence speak the opposite?

On social media some Greeks claim -even though without proof – that the killer, the husband, the commercial helicopter pilot has connections to local VIPs who protect him.

Others blame the “patriarchal mentality” that rules the society and some even “systemic xenophobia” as the victim was British-born and a mother from Philippines.

Why do Greek mainstream media try to “defend” Caroline ‘s murderer? - Keep Talking Greece

It should be recalled that “foreign nationals” and thus Albanian were initially blamed for the botcher “burglary” and now the community of Albanians in Greece demands an official apology from Police and other authorities.

 

[Estelle]

A good-looking Greek with a respected profession and obviously some wealth murders his wife and does his “best” to cover up. Does the conservative Greek “holy” society accept it? It’s not easy to break through century old stereotypes.
“He ruined his life,” an elderly and old friend shocked me on Saturday. “And the murder of his wife? Taking a life has no meaning?” I asked. “A, this too!” he responded.

It is not the first time, Greek mainstream media zealously try to white-wash the evil, and Greeks are right to suspect “protection”. Media did the same with other victims of heinous crimes such as the raped and murdered Eleni Topaloudi and the student who was bullied to ‘suicide’ Vangelis Yakoumakis. One of Topaloudi’s murderers had best connections to local community due to his father, while an MP from Crete intervened in favor of those accused of bullying Yakoumakis.

Why do Greek mainstream media try to “defend” Caroline ‘s murderer? - Keep Talking Greece

 

[Patrick Jane]

Your did a great job with the translation, Patrick, although I must admit that, before watching the video, I had no idea what you meant in the bolded out part. He must mean that those crimes, that she supposedly found out that B was involved in, shocked her/ drove her crazy and caused tension/fights between her and him (at least that's how I see it.).

Thank you! I prefer your translation. Idioms are the hardest thing to translate to English. I hadn't heard that idiom before. Based on the context it must mean something like you say.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

And had another crime pinned on him when he had nothing to do with that crime.

And yes, he was caught trying to flee the county with a fake passport. Imo

 

[caylee17799]

Thank you! I prefer your translation. Idioms are the hardest thing to translate to English. I hadn't heard that idiom before. Based on the context it must mean something like you say.

I had never heard of it either. I even had to resort to a google search that yielded no results about what it meant. But, ok, it's AK and we forgive him for using that highly untranslatable phrase that apparently no one has ever heard before
In other news, B's confession/apology is over, and he's now being led to the prosecutor.
Έγκλημα στα Γλυκά Νερά: Ολοκληρώθηκε η απολογία του Αναγνωστόπουλου

 

[Estelle]

Next to the burglary, the murderer has tabled several versions about his motive including the one that Caroline did not take care of the child or that she wanted to leave him.

Some media suggest that “Crouch may have threatened Anagnostopoulos with divulging knowledge of certain shady dealings he had been involved in.”

The deposition is expected to last several hours. He is said to have said that he wants to go to jail and then “deal with the upbringing of his child.”

Meanwhile, one of his two lawyers resigned from the case on Tuesday.

“I no longer want to be involved with the defense of this case, in any respect, for personal reasons,” Vassilis Spyrou said in a public resignation letter hours before the suspect was due to testify to an investigating magistrate.

ERT TV reported that it was his client who fired him. Spyrou was dealing with the part of the case referring to the custody of the 11-month-old daughter of the couple. Decision about the child’s custody was scheduled to be taken today, however, it may be delayed due to lawyer’s resignation.

According to media, both grandparents seem to have agreed to shared custody of the toddler that Anagnostopoulos placed on her dead mother’s body, most likely to have her quiet so that he can stage the burglary scene.

Meanwhile, the victim’s family has hired two lawyers who stated representation at the Civil Action against Babis Anagnostopoulos.

Crowd swears at Caroline’s murderer as he arrives for deposition, one lawyer resigns - Keep Talking Greece

 

[Estelle]

Upon the arrival of the helicopter pilot at the court, a crowd of people started to swear at him, calling him “monster” and “beast” and shouting “You should rot in jail, motherf***er!”

Crowd swears at Caroline’s murderer as he arrives for deposition, one lawyer resigns - Keep Talking Greece

 

[Dotta]

Δολοφονία στα Γλυκά Νερά: τι είπε στην απολογία ο συζυγοκτόνος
Apology

 

[Estelle]

The publication of such diary excerpts is an “affront to the deceased’s personality and may even contribute to generating a favorable climate for the defendant over the course of the criminal process,” Pliotas said. He also urged the journalist’s union to investigate possible code of conduct violations, state-run news agency amna and other media report on Tuesday. It is not clear who leaked selected excerpts from Caroline Crouch ‘s diary which is part of the case file the Police sent to the investigating prosecutor.

Angry social media users have accused police and the husband’s lawyer for the unlawful leaks and lashed out at media that published them. Some also questioned the authenticity of the diary and claimed the murderer had time to edit the content that was apparently available online.

A Supreme Court prosecutor on Tuesday ordered a probe

Prosecutor orders probe into leaks of slain Caroline’s diary - Keep Talking Greece

 

[caylee17799]

Έγκλημα στα Γλυκά Νερά: Δεν προσχεδίασα το φόνο λέει ο Αναγνωστόπουλος και ζητά να κληθούν μάρτυρες
He filed 2 motions to overturn the evidence that proves premeditation. He insists that he removed the SD card after the murder, and demands that the camera gets thoroughly examined by an expert, and he also requests that family members and friends are summoned as witnesses, so they can give their insight into the couple's relationship.

 

[Tortoise]

Thank you! I prefer your translation. Idioms are the hardest thing to translate to English. I hadn't heard that idiom before. Based on the context it must mean something like you say.

I think there are similar idioms in English, 'hit the roof' or 'go through the ceiling' mean to reach one's limit and explode with anger. That was what I assumed it to mean.

 

[tayaway]

By no means defending him but in Caroline’s reported diary entries she states she hits him. The relationship was utterly chaotic.

"By no means defending him but..." This is a classic example of victim blaming. It's like the "Ya, he raped you, but you were wearing a short skirt." or, "You look great in that dress, but..." or "I'm not racist, but... You see, your honor, he was a battered husband! As for the relationship being 'utterly chaotic,' she was 19 when she died, let me repeat that, 19. She was all of 19 (b. 2001) and he was 33 (b 1988). She was a teenager for their entire relationship, marriage, baby, murder. The human brain doesn't fully mature until on average, age 25 (see Big Think for a quick synopsis). There are expansive societal questions about the culpability of adolescents let alone a teenager that has spent years under the control of an older man.

We don't know if that diary actually belonged to her and if it did, had it been edited by B? She texted in Eng but wrote her diary in Greek before encrypting it? (eta: Let's assume she wrote it and it hasn't been edited in anyway.) I kept a journal when I was with my narc and never once did I write anything negative about him, even though he nearly crushed my soul into dust and he did so many controlling, cruel things. There was no physical violence, but, since I blamed all the fights/dysfunction/tension on myself and he was a saint to put up with me, if he had killed me before I left him, the journal would've gotten him off. "Yeah, he killed you, but you were a horrible person to be in a relationship with."

 

[Tortoise]

Έγκλημα στα Γλυκά Νερά: Δεν προσχεδίασα το φόνο λέει ο Αναγνωστόπουλος και ζητά να κληθούν μάρτυρες
He filed 2 motions to overturn the evidence that proves premeditation. He insists that he removed the SD card after the murder, and demands that the camera gets thoroughly examined by an expert, and he also requests that family members and friends are summoned as witnesses, so they can give their insight into the couple's relationship.

He is ridiculous and that is the mildest I could come up with. It's very clear he killed the puppy 9 minutes after Caroline. That is not considering hiding her body and then coming up with another scheme, it's seamless. I knew the dog would give him away, because he could have invented any timeline he wanted if the neighbour hadn't heard Roxy's final cries and noted the time. (Plus the Apple watch of course)

 

[tayaway]

Έγκλημα στα Γλυκά Νερά: Δεν προσχεδίασα το φόνο λέει ο Αναγνωστόπουλος και ζητά να κληθούν μάρτυρες
He filed 2 motions to overturn the evidence that proves premeditation. He insists that he removed the SD card after the murder, and demands that the camera gets thoroughly examined by an expert, and he also requests that family members and friends are summoned as witnesses, so they can give their insight into the couple's relationship.

Can't wait to hear his brother, Fotis, give testimony. Mark my words. He's going to eat him alive. I'm assuming this because he stayed behind at the island to stay with C's parents, he also helped take care of the baby.

 

[MsBetsy]

And had another crime pinned on him when he had nothing to do with that crime.

He had no connection to Caroline's murder so he was never charged. LE said they questioned him and dismissed him as a suspect early on.

 

[caylee17799]

He is ridiculous and that is the mildest I could come up with. It's very clear he killed the puppy 9 minutes after Caroline. That is not considering hiding her body and then coming up with another scheme, it's seamless. I knew the dog would give him away, because he could have invented any timeline he wanted if the neighbour hadn't heard Roxy's final cries and noted the time. (Plus the Apple watch of course)

Not to mention that, according to the ME and C's smartwatch, she was asleep right before being killed, so there goes his argument about "doing it in the heat of the moment" as well. He really is pathetic. Even a toddler wouldn't believe his words.

 

[Patrick Jane]

I think there are similar idioms in English, 'hit the roof' or 'go through the ceiling' mean to reach one's limit and explode with anger. That was what I assumed it to mean.

That's a good point. As Caylee points out this isn't a common idiom in Greek (or even one that Google has ever heard of), so maybe AK is translating an English idiom into Greek. I know he's had further LE expert/specialist training abroad, including both in the U.S. (F.B.I.) and in the U.K. (New Scotland Yard), so he would presumably know English well and that would make sense.

 

[Dotta]

I wonder... If he asked for the testimony from family members and friends, it means he thinks they will be in his favour.
And I haven't read any negative commens from his circle so far. Quite the contrary - C's mother trusted him absolutely, C's friends envied the "fairytale romance", his bosses promoted him and praised him as an excellent employee, his friend of long duration (8 years) was absolutely shocked, said B was a gentleman, even his former gf talked about him in superlatives.
How is it possible that nobody noticed his disturbed personality?
I really don't understand.

 

[tayaway]

I wonder... If he asked for the testimony from family members and friends, it means he thinks they will be in his favour.
And I haven't read any negative commens from his circle so far. Quite the contrary - C's mother trusted him absolutely, C's friends envied the "fairytale romance", his bosses promoted him and praised him as an excellent employee, his friend of long duration (8 years) was absolutely shocked, said B was a gentleman, even his former gf talked about him in superlatives.
How is it possible that nobody noticed his disturbed personality?
I really don't understand.

His brother, Fotis, did.

The Sun Jun 21

The pilot has been told by his younger brother Fotis, that he only has sympathy for Crouch’s parents, Susan and David.

Anagnostopoulos’ brother has remained on Alonissos, the idyllic island where Crouch spent most of her life after her parents settled in Greece, to "comfort her parents."

A pal on the island told SunOnline: "He is in a state of shock and absolutely distraught. All of his sympathy is with Susan and David. He wants nothing to do with his brother."

Neos Kosmos June 21

The two families had very good relations. Haralambos’ brother, Fotis Anagnostopoulos, rushed to the Crouch family’s aid following the young woman’s death and took care of [the] little [baby].