Found Deceased Australia - Russell Hill, 74, & Carol Clay, 72, Wonnangatta Valley, 20 Mar 2020 #5 *charges*

[Motomike]

I believe you totally, I think maybe it was just another red herring or ploy.

Ok, no problem.

 

[emirates1957]

Lisa and I

Thank you for sharing what a beautiful looking young lady with her bubba.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Oh you mean abseil.


When I was thinking of another word to use, I thought of :"shimmy" but I guess serious climbers would frown on that. LOL

New word learned today. Thank you!

 

[Arboreal]

This is the spot. I camped there with Russell twice before he went missing and once since he went missing.

Hello Motomike
Thank you so much for posting that image and your recollections of Mr Hill. Your photo confirmed my friend's conjecture. She also watched 60 mins, and there is this scene, apparently, as I've not watched it, but it shows the detectives pointing to a map display and the image below is shown fleetingly. This is a screen grab.
What is interesting is the caption: "Campsite and possible cave site".
I'll have to watch it now.

 

[Motomike]

Hello Motomike
Thank you so much for posting that image and your recollections of Mr Hill. Your photo confirmed my friend's conjecture. She also watched 60 mins, and there is this scene, apparently, as I've not watched it, but it shows the detectives pointing to a map display and the image below is shown fleetingly. This is a screen grab.
What is interesting is the caption: "Campsite and possible cave site".
I'll have to watch it now.

View attachment 324380

In the 4 times I have been there I have never seen a cave there. I am sure others in our group who have been there more often than I would have mentioned a cave if it existed there.

 

[Arboreal]

LE said everyone else was accounted for, except for the blue Nissan Patrol.

I thought they said a white 4WD was unaccounted for. "In an update on Friday afternoon [05 March, 2021], Victoria Police said they had been able to identify all vehicles seen in the area near Russell and Carol’s campsite, except one car. Police described the vehicle as a white dual cab ute, with the exact make and model unknown."
Police spoke to Mr Lynn last year, meaning they had accounted for him back then.
I've wondered why, if Mr Lynn was in their wights in March they would say they were looking for the white 4WD. It may be to mess with his mind, but police generally do not release false information. It may be that they wanted completeness and to remove the possibility of blaming another person.

 

[Arboreal]

But he’ll be back at Sale Magistrates Court in May though, for a Committal Mention. He’s already showing in their daily lists.

In this ABC news article they say
“The Magistrates' Court does not have jurisdiction to hear bail applications for murder charges.”
Police release photos of dense bushland as search for bodies of missing Victorian campers continues

So no bail application next time either?

This link sets out the sequences of court hearings leading up to a trial, in Victoria.
Committal proceedings | Magistrates Court of Victoria

 

[Arboreal]

In the 4 times I have been there I have never seen a cave there. I am sure others in our group who have been there more often than I would have mentioned a cave if it existed there.

Thanks, Motomike. I understand this must be a difficult time and so appreciate your comments which have been very helpful.

 

[Arboreal]

Lisa and I

Alicia_elizabeth,
Thank you so much for sharing such a personal photo and your comments. This must have reopened so many distressing feelings and I hope you and your family are OK and supported. Take care.

 

[JudgeJudi]

I thought they said a white 4WD was unaccounted for. "In an update on Friday afternoon [05 March, 2021], Victoria Police said they had been able to identify all vehicles seen in the area near Russell and Carol’s campsite, except one car. Police described the vehicle as a white dual cab ute, with the exact make and model unknown."
Police spoke to Mr Lynn last year, meaning they had accounted for him back then.
I've wondered why, if Mr Lynn was in their wights in March they would say they were looking for the white 4WD. It may be to mess with his mind, but police generally do not release false information. It may be that they wanted completeness and to remove the possibility of blaming another person.

"Police have eliminated all other cars of interest from their investigation, except for the blue Nissan".

New clues in mystery of missing campers Russell Hill and Carol Clay

 

[Arboreal]

I read something earlier that the Magistrates court he appeared in doesn't handle bail matters.

I just looked it up. Here is a link to the bail act:
https://content.legislation.vic.gov.au/sites/default/files/2021-04/77-9008aa148 authorised.pdf
It says:
Treason, murder, certain other offences
(1) Only the Supreme Court may grant bail to a person accused of treason.
(2) Only the Supreme Court, or a court on committing the person for trial, may grant bail to a person accused of murder.
[I added the underline].
The committal hearing is some way off, but I do not know if that will be in a magistrates court or a more senior court.
However, this link, sets otu the process: Committal proceedings | Magistrates Court of Victoria
It seems that the hearing last week was the Filing hearing. Next comes the Committal mention, where information is given to the defence and other matters are determined. Then there is the Committal hearing, to decide if there is sufficient evidence for a trial.

 

[Arboreal]

Nah if he’d gone out south of Dargo he wouldn’t have been snapped. The camera’s aren’t for the National park boundaries, they belong to the Hotham Resort which is privately owned. The resort put numberplate recognition camera’s on the east and west boundaries so they can capture the deets of everyone entering and leaving the resort area during snow season so they can check if you’ve paid. (Unless you’re driving straight thru without stopping)

Basically it was just another source the coppers used to cross-reference who was in the area (as well as mobile phone tower pings, people coming forward, etc) . I guess the time it was there, and the fact it was seen in Gatta the day before, and heard leaving around midnight made it suspicious. Then they see it going past the cam on the Harrietville side just after sunrise, and start wondering what old mate was up to during the 7 or 8 hours it took him to get there.

edit: probably should add the Dargo High Plains Road meets the Great Alpine Road within the resort area, but the DHP road gets closed during snow season, so no need to monitor the south entry.

Brumby Jack
Do you have a theory why the blue 4WD+Trailer went north toward Harrietville, rather than running south to Dargo and back to town?

 

[Satchie]

I thought they said a white 4WD was unaccounted for. "In an update on Friday afternoon [05 March, 2021], Victoria Police said they had been able to identify all vehicles seen in the area near Russell and Carol’s campsite, except one car. Police described the vehicle as a white dual cab ute, with the exact make and model unknown."
Police spoke to Mr Lynn last year, meaning they had accounted for him back then.
I've wondered why, if Mr Lynn was in their wights in March they would say they were looking for the white 4WD. It may be to mess with his mind, but police generally do not release false information. It may be that they wanted completeness and to remove the possibility of blaming another person.

Seems perhaps all they had was circumstantial evidence, so they worked to eliminate all other potential scenarios. Also to interview every potential witness. I guess one thing about a back country case is they can be completely thorough.

I was thinking about an earlier comment about gunshots - perhaps they were heard and presumed to be from hunters. Or so common no one really noticed.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

It's further back in the thread, where I posted that they were no longer looking for the white 4WD.
The occupants had come forward and were now ruled out.

I thought they said a white 4WD was unaccounted for. "In an update on Friday afternoon [05 March, 2021], Victoria Police said they had been able to identify all vehicles seen in the area near Russell and Carol’s campsite, except one car. Police described the vehicle as a white dual cab ute, with the exact make and model unknown."

 

[Arboreal]

"Police have eliminated all other cars of interest from their investigation, except for the blue Nissan".

New clues in mystery of missing campers Russell Hill and Carol Clay

Now, I [and my friends here] am perplexed and a tad confused, because as per link I posted, they were saying in March that they could not account for the white dual cab, implying all others had been accounted for.
Yet, in November, [as per link you posted] the police are saying they are seeking a "dark-blue four-wheel drive seen leaving a remote Wonnangatta Valley campsite on the day Carol Clay and Russell Hill vanished" and "Police have eliminated all other cars of interest from their investigation, except for the blue Nissan", which seems to suggest they have found and eliminated the white dual cab mentioned in the March article.
Assuming the press have accurately reported what the police were saying, it is possible that police had not connected Mr Lynn with the blue Nissan, because he resprayed it in April-May, 2020, just after the trip to the valley and police did not know he had done that. But, the police also said they had spoken to Mr Lynn in 2020 - different dates have been given from June through to November. One would assume they knew then what vehicle he was driving. For instance, if he said, "Oh, I was driving my beige nissan", they would have known there was no such vehicle in the valley at the time; but if he said: "My 4WD that was blue" then he would immediately become a person of interest - because polcie had, from mid 2020 witness statements of a blue vehicle and trailer parked in the vicinity of Mr Hill and Ms Clay.
In terms of police activity, it will be interesting to find out:
1. when police first identified the blue Nissan as being of interest
2. when police first became aware of Mr Lynne being in the valley
3. when police first spoke with Mr Lynn (note, spoke not interviewed, which is a formal conversation)
4. when police realised the Nissan was re-sprayed
5. when the police first identified the cctv picture of the Nissan.
I think for that we will need ot wait for the trial, then the book and then the miniseries!

 

[Arboreal]

Carol Clay and Russell Hill search includes Great Alpine gold mine area

Officers have taped off sections of the Grant Historic Area, and installed road blocks to prevent further chances of anyone tampering with a potential crime scene. But they do not yet have a precise location in the bush where the pair could have been left.

They may need search and rescue crews to abseil down the shafts of old gold mines.

I was wondering that. Folks here have been saying, like the press, "burried", by my understanding is the area is riddled with old mine workings. Is that correct?

 

[Arboreal]

It's further back in the thread, where I posted that they were no longer looking for the white 4WD.
The occupants had come forward and were now ruled out.

Thanks, TootsieFootsie. I'd missed that post. It still makes the "searching for a blue 4WD" odd, if they had only one vehicle still to account for in March....

 

[BrumbyJack]

Something I’m finding out by talking to people about this is that a lot of people assume the Hotham cams aren’t operating outside of snow season. Maybe thats it? He never even gave it a thought coz it was out of season? And maybe it was his preferred way to get there, via the Hume. Would be quickest/easiest from home without having to charge through the city, and not being able to get through to myrtleford he chose the next best way to get himself out and onto the Hume. If he didn’t give the cams a thought then he must’ve fair shat himself when there was a knock on his door.

Brumby Jack
Do you have a theory why the blue 4WD+Trailer went north toward Harrietville, rather than running south to Dargo and back to town?

 

[Walk A Mile]

Could it be a subtlety of wording?

They hadn't identified the white dual cab at one point, but they'd identified all the other vehicles (including GL's).

Later, they'd ruled out the involvement of all other vehicles, except GL's.

 

[Arboreal]

Something I’m finding out by talking to people about this is that a lot of people assume the Hotham cams aren’t operating outside of snow season. Maybe thats it? He never even gave it a thought coz it was out of season? And maybe it was his preferred way to get there, via the Hume. Would be quickest/easiest from home without having to charge through the city, and not being able to get through to myrtleford he chose the next best way to get himself out and onto the Hume. If he didn’t give the cams a thought then he must’ve fair shat himself when there was a knock on his door.

Thanks BrumbyJack.
Very helpful information.
Does anyone here know what route the Blue Nissan is believed to have taken into the valley and when it arrived?