ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 23

[Honest Abraham]

What I found confusing was SG described his PI as having 50 years of homicide investigation experience. But wouldn't this make the PI's age somewhere in his 70's or 80's? He had been pointing out the possible inexperience of the detectives on this case as due to their being in their mid-20's.

if you have a team of 2 and both have 25 years experience it is said to be 50 years experience.

 

[Emerald1328]

In regard to hiring a private investigator, if they find any crucial evidence beyond what the police have been able to find so far, would it be admissible in court? Or would the fact that the PI found it make it inadmissible, possibly ruining prosecution of the perp? It seems like there could be a lot of room for error on a PI’s part if they don’t follow proper procedure. This link is specifically referencing family law cases but I would imagine the standard would be a great, if not greater, in a homicide case.

“However, investigators can't enter private property without permission. They also may not access records that otherwise would need a subpoena. Also, while they may be able to determine the location of bank accounts or other records, the owner's permission or a court order often is required to access specific information.

It's generally not a good idea to hire an investigator yourself. If the investigator mishandles evidence or is unlicensed, what they end up producing may not stand up in court. Allowing the attorney to hire the P.I. works best. Attorneys forge relationships with trusted P.I.s. This helps ensure compliance with licensing requirements and proper techniques for handling evidence.”

Using a Private Investigator for Child Custody, Divorce, and Other Disputes - FindLaw

It's quite common to use a private investigator for various family law-related matters, such as divorce and child custody. Learn about this and more at FindLaw's Family Law Center.

www.findlaw.com

 

[MesquiteO21]

I would not rule out a female murderer

certainly not impossible, but not likely IMO.

 

[LizWords]

I'm thinking that they need to delve into all of them there is nothing to eliminate the possibility that it was an associate of one of the victims. I think it would be reckless for any investigator not to looking into all of them, and that is not to victim blame that is just common sense, as associates are not always a friends.

I know, they definitely do need to delve into all of them. And they have been making general statements about needing any info involving all of them since the beginning. But their verbiage has changed, as had their statement of need. They apparently have unsatisfactory gaps in X & E's timelines that, IMO, should have been stressed more specifically and more often before now.

It just makes me think that the evidence initially seemed to point to K & M being "targeted", but that hasn't produced any leads, so now more energy will be given to nailing down X & E's timeline, interactions, etc.

IDK. Just seems like they may be changing directions a bit.

 

[LooksSusToMe]

How long is it before a murder case officially goes “cold?”

 

[Janitor101]

if you have a team of 2 and both have 25 years experience it is said to be 50 years experience.

Oh, so there are two PI's working as a team?

 

[Bhodie]

How long is it before a murder case officially goes “cold?”

Every case is different they still have leads to follow and information coming in could be months could be years depends on the departments policy too

 

[MesquiteO21]

How long is it before a murder case officially goes “cold?”

i believe the general rule is a case is considered cold when detectives are not working on it every day. I could be wrong, i'm not LE.

 

[LizWords]

What I found confusing was SG described his PI as having 50 years of homicide investigation experience. But wouldn't this make the PI's age somewhere in his 70's or 80's? He had been pointing out the possible inexperience of the detectives on this case as due to their being in their mid-20's.

Is a 70 year old with 50 years experience somehow unbelievable? I'm not sure I understand why it's a negative to have someone in their 70s as your expert???

 

[Tillicum]

It seems like they might have a general idea, "home at midnight. watch a movie. run out and grab some food and get back to the house around same time K & M get home." But they're asking for "communications" throughout the night, which I find odd. IDK. It doesn't make me feel super confident about what the investigation has uncovered so far since this general timeline seemed to be sufficient for them for the last three weeks and is now the priority. Makes me feel like they thought K & M's movements/interactions were more important these last three weeks but that direction has not produced anything tangible.

Maybe a compelling, recent witness' statement contradicts previous witness statements?

 

[10ofRods]

SG has all but confirmed that K and M were both killed in the third floor bedroom first. With death times all between 3am and 4am it would make sense that was the case.

He has never said they were first, that I know of. None of us, including SG, seem to know that information.

 

[mayhem911]

SG never explicitly said that K and M were murdered first but he has implied that the room they were in was the target of the attack. I would assume then that the killer would want to kill the target first no matter what. LE has said explicitly 3am to 4am death times on all 4.

 

[Honest Abraham]

Looks like E and X first letters of their names too.

Sigma Chi - IFC | University of Idaho

Sigma Chi's mission is to develop values-based leaders committed to the betterment of character, campus and community.

www.uidaho.edu

 

[Zella]

SG never explicitly said that K and M were murdered first but he has implied that the room they were in was the target of the attack. I would assume then that the killer would want to kill the target first no matter what. LE has said explicitly 3am to 4am death times on all 4.

That's hardly a given. Danny Rollins killed the other people at crime scenes first to have more time with his chosen target. MOO

Also IMO all of SG's conclusions are hampered by the fact that, as he readily admits, he only knows about half the victims in the case. Who's to say that E and X weren't the targets and didn't sustain even worse wounds than his daughter? He doesn't know. His conclusions are based on incomplete information and I would caution against forming any conclusions with them as the basis for that reason.

 

[BlueTunes]

I wouldn't be so sure he's disposed of the knife to be honest. It could mean a lot to him. JMO.

JMO. Yup. Plus even if the knife had no sentimental value to the killer whatsoever, he may have chose not to throw it away simply because of how expensive It may be. Knives may be thrown at trees but they certainly don’t grow on them.

 

[squareandrabbet]

JMO Wherever the dog was I don’t believe he got near any of the victims. If so it’s likely he could have tracked blood as he walked throughout the house. But I don’t believe that happened. LE said the dog was sent to animal services and soon released to a “responsible party”. That time frame is much too fast to do a proper forensic evidence gathering exam on him if there was blood on his paws.

Maybe there was no blood on his paws because the killer took care to close Murphy into a separate room before the rampage.

...possible?? i grant I am not extremely "up" on this entire case, so ignore me if this is going to be entire balderdash on my part.

 

[Honest Abraham]

Oh, so there are two PI's working as a

i just gave an example

 

[SuziQ]

The local police reports in Moscow are now full of people reporting harassment related to this case, including someone being spit on and people coming to their homes.

MPD Press Log 12/02/2022

www.ci.moscow.id.us

Yep, if anyone has info, they will not want to be part of this circus. They will think twice before coming forward. And the circus has officially come to town. Imo.

 

[Scvanvliet]

It seems like they might have a general idea, "home at midnight. watch a movie. run out and grab some food and get back to the house around same time K & M get home." But they're asking for "communications" throughout the night, which I find odd. IDK. It doesn't make me feel super confident about what the investigation has uncovered so far since this general timeline seemed to be sufficient for them for the last three weeks and is now the priority. Makes me feel like they thought K & M's movements/interactions were more important these last three weeks but that direction has not produced anything tangible.

There have been several theories that the killer was known to one or more of the victims. Perhaps a person that LE is focusing on may have interacted with X and/or E (walking home from Sigma Chi, getting food, etc.) during this window between 9:00 PM and 1:45 AM. Does not mean that LE doesn't have solid information, but they need those pieces to fit together. I get the feeling this newly worded request is because they are looking for evidence of something very specific. IMO.

 

[LizWords]

Maybe a compelling, recent witness' statement contradicts previous witness statements?

Maybe, but it seemed more like they want to know who E & X may have talked to, interacted with in any way (face to face, via text, etc). Seems like they know where E & X were, when they were there, and generally what they were doing, but are now looking for any sort of interaction or event they're unaware of. I just can't imagine they don't have X & E's cell phone data yet, assuming they do, they know who they called, who they texted, what they said, and where they were and for how long...

It almost seems like LE is looking for something almost random (probably wrong word but best i can do atm), seemingly innocuous or innocent anything that could connect X & E or the house to the killer because they haven't been able to identify anything related to K & M.

I think they have a much more specific footprint of K & M's night than they have for X & E, probably because K & M were places with cameras (the food truck, the bar, cameras in businesses and on houses that K & M may have passed to and from places, etc). Because X & E were at a frat party, then home, then quick food run, they have a lot less specifics and a lot less camera footage.

Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but when I saw the direct statements about X & E's timeline gaps, my heart sunk, because it just seems like they thought they were going to find something with K & M and haven't and now need minutia on the two other potential targets.