ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 55

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I think if there's one thing he did get right... its that he likely buried the knife and burned the clothes in terrain too hard to search thoroughly (near Johnson, ID)
just surmising as I believe he can plan/think better than he can act under pressure.
moo
 
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I actually wouldn't be surprised if he used a torrent browser, like The Onion Router, on his laptop to access the dark web/prevent being tracked.
Does anyone know if data can be recovered from searches on a torrent browser?
 
It can get pretty darned close. Moscow, ID has a *lot* of cell towers, multiple ways to triangulate location. I can walk into the next room and watch my Apple watch move on Google maps, even without the wifi on. Same with my phone. If I leave my phone in the car, I can see that it's marked as being in my driveway, etc.

When BK took his phone off airplane mode or turned it back on, it would likely have also sought a local router to hook up to. My phone suggests I join networks as soon as I drive down my street, which of course, I ignore - but I still can see the router names, so my phone is pinging routers as well as cell towers.

We just do not know all the forensic data LE has gotten, by now, for that phone. They only wrote down what they needed for the PCA.

So "just in the area" can be fairly specific - such as whether the car is up on Walenta or whatever that street is, or whether it's on King or Queen. I am guessing it's pretty clear when his phone is near 1122 and not just in the area of 1122 (on those times when he went over at night before the killings).

I still can't believe he only turned his phone off after he left his apartment. I thought for sure that *any* smart perp would leave their phone at home with youtube on autoplay. And put the autoplay on for nights and nights before the crime.

Then I learned more about BK and told my husband that I believed he'd need his phone to figure out where he was - and I bet that's true, now that we learn he took that long route home. He turns the phone on as he's headed southbound out of Moscow, into unfamiliar territory, right about at the intersection where he turns to go to Genesee.
Your watch and Google maps use GPS (satellite info) not cell tower data.

GPS works independently of cell towers and is very accurate.

It works in airplane mode. It works where cell service is not available.
It works on old phones which no longer have a carrier.

I have an app which uses GPS, but drains the battery because it is used outdoors for hours and requires the screen resolution at a very high setting. I use it in airplane mode to conserve the battery. Afterward, I sync my data once I've turned off airplane mode and accessed a network.
 
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I've seen that too, and I didn't get that from reading the AA. I think it leads us to believe one of KG/MM were the targets (perhaps even both) but I don't think the AA clearly gives us evidence MM was target.

My opinion of sequence of events:

4am~ doordash for Xana

4:04am he is seen parking. Leads me to believe earliest he is in the house is closer to 4:05/06am.

He heads upstairs first.

When DM is awoken "around 4" thinking she hears Kaylee playing with dogs - it's actually the attack/murders of MM/KG happening.

BK heads down stairs somewhere around or after 4:12am (probably closer to 4:17) since we know Xana was still using TikTok up until this time.

IMO Xana was up and heard something which makes her leave her room or perhaps was even just going back and forth to the kitchen to discard her doordash trash.

She sees/hears BK coming down the stairs and this is when DM hears someone say "there's someone here"

I think BK felt he had to kill her now.

I think the biggest question mark for me is the killing of X/E. Im beginning to think Ethan was probably asleep during most of this.
BK sees Xana goes to attack her and she bolts back towards the room (hence the AA making it seem like her body was more likely in the door frame or right at entrance).

In the midst of that attack Ethan wakes up and the killer obviously focuses his attention on Ethan. Kills Ethan, but Xana is still alive "whimpering/crying"

This is when BK says "don't worry I'll help you" that DM hears. I think he probably "finished her off" at this point. (As gross as that was to type).

The murders/attack of X/E happen at the 4:17am mark of when the neighbors cameras pick up the noise closest to Xana's room.

Also the direction the killer comes from in order to be able to "walk past" DM is obviously more so from the direction of Xanas room and not the upstairs.

Then at 4:20 car is seen leaving.

Nothing in the AA shows me or hints to me who exactly between M/K were targets. But I'd be interested to hear actual opinions/evidence that lead people to believe MM target.
Completely agree
 
I think if there's one thing he did right... its likely burying the knife and burning the clothes in terrain too hard to search thoroughly
moo
How do you know he did that?
 
I feel it is very possible that DM was on something the night this happened. I don’t mean that to vilify her at all - I say this because I was in college once and experimented on occasion as many students do. Lucky for me it was not a common occurrence, but I do know on those rare occasions that I did, I would have been pretty terrified to speak with police. Possibly she thought her fear was exaggerated by whatever she had taken that night (Molly or shrooms are very popular in the party scene and could provoke paranoia in certain people, or a sense of euphoria which would confuse the mind on what is really happening.) Of course this is just a guess. I do feel it would easily explain why she was hesitant to call police right away. It is not rare at all to feel a sense of panic or paranoia, especially if you rarely indulge in those types of drugs. I could be wrong, but my gut is saying this possibly played a role in her reaction to the scary situation. I also think she may not admit this possibility right away, because I know the times that I experimented, I wouldn’t have wanted family or friends to know. She may have not even admitted it yet, but it is important because it helps everyone understand what happened.

Even being tipsy or drunk could cause this too with exhaustion up late not sleeping enough due to school, work going out with friends. (All pretty normal college student behavior no judgment from me at all.)
 
What size area are we talking about when they say that his phone records show at least 12 occasions when his phone was “utilizing cellular resources that provide coverage to the area of 1122 King Road…?”


Would that be within a few blocks of the target house? Or, within a few miles? I live in a rural area and we don’t have a lot of cell towers, but the ones we have cover what seems to be as much as 5 miles or so.


How can we find out the size of those coverage areas?
That's a good question. I live in an urban area and we have towers about every square 1 mile or so. (1.5 million population)
So at the closest, I'm thinking the coverage in Moscow is also about a square mile, but likely about 2 square miles. Moscow is 6.91 square miles.
 
Reposting this for any that missed it.
Documents likely path of BK.
I do not believe he ever saw DM. Between darkness and concentrating on finding back door in an awkward layout (plus-speculating-in a degree of shock himself from initially unintended vics XK and EC), I just think his line of vision never went there. He may have thought room was empty since he passed it 3x at least...or, more likely, 1st/2nd floor was not his intended victims and due to seeing/hearing X (eating Door Dash in kitchen, or on Tik Tok, whatever) that changed. DM was apparently silent and simply never drew his focus.

I've said it before...I will not speculate or question DM actions, and please don't use this for that purpose. I think it just underscores how fragile life is--and simply choosing to use Tik Tok at 412 am instead of falling asleep can be the difference in life and death. So sad, so tragic. View attachment 393180

Just to bring a moment of levity in this incredibly sad situation and thread....

Yes, I know my photoshop of the floorplan is kindergarten-level. But also.... Wow.... there really is an Emoji for everything now!

I mean... man ("ninja") dressed in all black with a mask and a blade? A "hiding" girl? Crazy. I'm still pissed that no one has invented the "sarcasm" font for text messages yet...but we've come so far technologically.
 
I have the same questions. Right now, I don't feel we know nearly enough to say if ANY one person was targeted in that house and LE has never confirmed that an individual was targeted.

So, my own mind focuses on Targeting the House. Also, general victimology.

I believe he started out choosing U of ID as his target for his crimes, because he knew from his classes that when a killer goes out of one jurisdiction into another, it complicates things for LE. However, he wasn't paying close attention because Pullman and Moscow police have all kinds of connections and often operate smoothly and jointly, due to the nature of their towns. He ought to have gone further away, but I think he's very unaccustomed to being on his own or traveling far on his own.

Why choose a college town? First, there are lots of sketchy situations that students get themselves into (walking out late at night, not locking doors, not being particularly concerned about nearby strangers who look like students, etc). Second, I think BK hated the easy sociality of the undergrad population at the relatively compact and self-contained campus of U of ID. His own student housing was a couple of miles from the main campus; 1122 King Road was centrally located for student social life. He had been excluded (IMO) from an active student social life in high school, then again at community college (which was a commuter college), and then of course, by the hybrid nature of DeSales university where he didn't even meet some of his professors.

Deep inside, his identity formation has been squashed by lack of proper socialization as a regular student, he knows it, sees it and regrets it. Then, when the students he's TAing rat him out to the professor, his hatred of students goes up another notch.

I also believe he hates humans in general (rather obviously).

This was a crime against aspiring young people, their families - and his own family. It was a crime against all the people of Idaho, who were anxious and grieving along with the families (and all the rest of us who care). It was a crime against the partying culture of people he perceived as "not serious" students, not like him. He saw himself as better than those students, but they were the ones who (from his POV) were privileged and acting entitled. Doesn't even matter if any of the women ever ran into him, we know that he had had less than ideal interactions with other women and appears never to have had a GF or SO.

It was a crime against LE and criminologists, as well (the hatred bubbled up after the prof took the students' side in the grading matter). He had been planning hate-based crimes of annihilation in his mind (practicing them might be a better word), likely for years. Maybe most of his life. He was rejected as an intern by Pullman PD, etc. It was a crime against his own professors, whom he has made into caricatures, basically.

It was a crime against his mother and father and sisters, too. Perhaps they considered a college education to be a chief sign of success - well, he sure showed them, didn't he? And his anti-death penalty mother now gets to watch him be tried in a state that permits the DP and is only deterred from using it right now due to lack of means (proper chemicals cannot be procured).

He didn't need a specific victim. I believe he wanted to compete with Rader and Bundy and to confound criminologists and others who study crime with the peculiarity of his crime. Before he attacked, he thought he'd get away with it. He acted in a robotic manner during the crime, having practiced the physical parts of it back in his own apartment and mentally while boxing. He did manage to tie both Rader and Bundy for most victims at a single crime scene, if I'm not mistaken.

I would not be surprised (when he dumps his memoirs on the world) if BK actually had the number 4 in mind before he started out that night.

IMO.
Yes. This was his 'out', as sickening as it sounds. He could never live up to the expectations of his family, you can see in the police stops in Indiana, how proud his father is of his son, I'm sure his mother and sisters felt the same way.
 
I think this article is referencing the act of recovering torrent files that have been downloaded, rather than recovering something such as search history which would have taken place inside of the actual torrent file. I'm wondering if searches or activity would also be recovered if the torrent was redownloaded or if there is no way in finding what activity took place on a torrent browser. JMO
 
I know many have mixed feelings about Kaylee's dad and some of the things he's said, but this quote from the above article really struck me.

'If our daughters could switch places with him. And I'm saying Maddie, as my daughter would do it in a heartbeat if they could sit there and have three squares, a place to live and we could call them we could write them letters.

'They could watch TV they could get educated. I would love if Maddie and Kaylee were doing life in prison right now.

'At least we could talk to them. They'd be breathing, that's not a punishment equivalent to being killed.'
This is such a gutpunch. My heart just broke all over again in new places.
 
In the river with the knife
Which one, if that is the case then LE would have them and the Knife. They had weeks to search as they know the route he took home. Where did he change out of them?
 
I have the same questions. Right now, I don't feel we know nearly enough to say if ANY one person was targeted in that house and LE has never confirmed that an individual was targeted.

So, my own mind focuses on Targeting the House. Also, general victimology.

I believe he started out choosing U of ID as his target for his crimes, because he knew from his classes that when a killer goes out of one jurisdiction into another, it complicates things for LE. However, he wasn't paying close attention because Pullman and Moscow police have all kinds of connections and often operate smoothly and jointly, due to the nature of their towns. He ought to have gone further away, but I think he's very unaccustomed to being on his own or traveling far on his own.

Why choose a college town? First, there are lots of sketchy situations that students get themselves into (walking out late at night, not locking doors, not being particularly concerned about nearby strangers who look like students, etc). Second, I think BK hated the easy sociality of the undergrad population at the relatively compact and self-contained campus of U of ID. His own student housing was a couple of miles from the main campus; 1122 King Road was centrally located for student social life. He had been excluded (IMO) from an active student social life in high school, then again at community college (which was a commuter college), and then of course, by the hybrid nature of DeSales university where he didn't even meet some of his professors.

Deep inside, his identity formation has been squashed by lack of proper socialization as a regular student, he knows it, sees it and regrets it. Then, when the students he's TAing rat him out to the professor, his hatred of students goes up another notch.

I also believe he hates humans in general (rather obviously).

This was a crime against aspiring young people, their families - and his own family. It was a crime against all the people of Idaho, who were anxious and grieving along with the families (and all the rest of us who care). It was a crime against the partying culture of people he perceived as "not serious" students, not like him. He saw himself as better than those students, but they were the ones who (from his POV) were privileged and acting entitled. Doesn't even matter if any of the women ever ran into him, we know that he had had less than ideal interactions with other women and appears never to have had a GF or SO.

It was a crime against LE and criminologists, as well (the hatred bubbled up after the prof took the students' side in the grading matter). He had been planning hate-based crimes of annihilation in his mind (practicing them might be a better word), likely for years. Maybe most of his life. He was rejected as an intern by Pullman PD, etc. It was a crime against his own professors, whom he has made into caricatures, basically.

It was a crime against his mother and father and sisters, too. Perhaps they considered a college education to be a chief sign of success - well, he sure showed them, didn't he? And his anti-death penalty mother now gets to watch him be tried in a state that permits the DP and is only deterred from using it right now due to lack of means (proper chemicals cannot be procured).

He didn't need a specific victim. I believe he wanted to compete with Rader and Bundy and to confound criminologists and others who study crime with the peculiarity of his crime. Before he attacked, he thought he'd get away with it. He acted in a robotic manner during the crime, having practiced the physical parts of it back in his own apartment and mentally while boxing. He did manage to tie both Rader and Bundy for most victims at a single crime scene, if I'm not mistaken.

I would not be surprised (when he dumps his memoirs on the world) if BK actually had the number 4 in mind before he started out that night.

IMO.
Boxing...I wonder if we'll see bruising on the face/jaw/head on any of the victims autopsies. BK could have hit them and knocked them out to incapacitate them before he started stabbing them, JMO
 
I am assuming BK parked up the hill overlooking the KIng's Residence up on Queen Road?
I tried to look on Google Earth and they will no longer allow to drive up that road and look at the parking lot and see how easy it was to look into the house esp. KG's room, possibly X's room also on the 2nd level.
Yes, they can get a warrant and subpoena for his Google searches and cell phone data.
This local (Boise) reporter does a great job using Google maps street view to follow what the Affidavit states about the car.

Starting around 7:00
 
A developing hypothesis about who was targeted and "why"

What if M and X were BK's intended targets, because he desired them and could not have them (jealousy as well as humiliation).

He might have encountered them initially at Mad Greek before stalking them outside of that setting via a combination of SM and frequent drive-bys at 1122 King. I'm guessing BK's earlier exchange with the bar owner in PA, wherein the owner politely let BK know that his behavior towards the female servers was not appreciated/acceptable, may have humiliated BK and also prompted him to abandon that pattern of behavior, which clearly came off as creepy to others. Without the option of badgering and harassing women in bars/restaurants, he likely would have looked for an alternative. One alternative may have been to observe/identify women in public places (e.g., Mad Greek) and then watch/stalk them without their knowledge.

This hypothesis seems consistent with the sheath being found next to M's body, which to me signals that she would have been the/a primary target. It also would be consistent with the unsubstantiated reports/speculation that E and K may have received the most severe wounds. Because K and E--especially if they were both sharing beds with his primary targets M and X in that moment--were essentially rivals in BK's warped mind. They had the thing he wanted more than anything but could not have -- emotional and physical closeness with M and X. He killed the women he couldn't have and brutalized his rivals, and then he was done. No need to pay any mind to DM on the way out of the house.
 
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Can someone confirm to me the location of D.M.'s room? I had been working under the idea that it was on the first floor. Was it on the second floor? That's the only thing that makes sense with the info that the intruder passed by her and left through the sliding glass door.
Second floor. If you look through the last couple of threads, some folks have posted diagrams. There is also a video walk through of the house online that someone posted. It was helpful.
 
He might be the kind of person who can't see the trees for the forest.

He goes to the Nth degree to make sure he disposes of the weapon where it cannot possibly be found, wear black clothes and a mask so his face can't be identified... but yet not think to turn off his phone (or buy a burner phone).

He plans for some things but yet forgets the basics. He might be book smart.... but real world dumb.

So many graduate students like this, really. Since I was one, once, let me put it as best I can. Lots of people who don't quite know what to do with themselves, post-college, go to graduate school. Many never finish, as it turns out they are employable in some way (often at a university or college). Academic (as compared to professional) programs often contain people whose real world or common sense skills are not the best.

Some of these people remain in and out of grad school for years (we had one 13th year student in my program - who, btw, is now rather famous for the academic books he wrote which are indeed technical masterpieces). In my own cohort (8 of us) only 3 finished. One reason not to finish is that "forest for the trees" kind of thing. I had to be told many times to just end a chapter, just end the paper, just end the dissertation, quit bringing in more data/more theories, STAAHP. Fortunately, my best friend at the time had lots of common sense. She guided me and another friend through the process. She stuck to her dissertation outline and has since published more than 100 books and papers (unlike me, I only have a few).

One of the smartest people in our program never finished and it was because she absolutely could not resist revising her dissertation proposal multiple times, to the point that she never managed to finish it. She visited her proposed field site under the proposal of someone else, as an assistant and freaked out about living in that place and abandoned her entire 3 year attempt to write the proposal. She became an editor, eventually. She was in her 6th year of grad school when she went home for holidays and never came back.

Grad school is depressing, really. Hardly any jobs, even for people at top 10 or top 25 universities in their field. Professors can be oppressive, sometimes without realizing it. Grad students are often socially awkward (certainly in my field they are - we're known for it, it's why we are able to go to other cultures and attempt to fit in, we're used to it).
 
I was thinking about that. LIke, she was awake enough to hear stuff and get up and open her door 3 times, so she wasn't dead drunk. But her mind must have been altered to some point. I mean, seeing a guy all in black and wearing a mask wouldn't be a normal occurrence, even in a busy party house

People drunk or blacked out still can walk around and barely remember it the next day which is different from being passed-out drunk. I'm assuming she drank that night because she went out that night.
 
I've seen that too, and I didn't get that from reading the AA. I think it leads us to believe one of KG/MM were the targets (perhaps even both) but I don't think the AA clearly gives us evidence MM was target.

My opinion of sequence of events:

4am~ doordash for Xana

4:04am he is seen parking. Leads me to believe earliest he is in the house is closer to 4:05/06am.

He heads upstairs first.

When DM is awoken "around 4" thinking she hears Kaylee playing with dogs - it's actually the attack/murders of MM/KG happening.

BK heads down stairs somewhere around or after 4:12am (probably closer to 4:17) since we know Xana was still using TikTok up until this time.

IMO Xana was up and heard something which makes her leave her room or perhaps was even just going back and forth to the kitchen to discard her doordash trash.

She sees/hears BK coming down the stairs and this is when DM hears someone say "there's someone here"

I think BK felt he had to kill her now.

I think the biggest question mark for me is the killing of X/E. Im beginning to think Ethan was probably asleep during most of this.
BK sees Xana goes to attack her and she bolts back towards the room (hence the AA making it seem like her body was more likely in the door frame or right at entrance).

In the midst of that attack Ethan wakes up and the killer obviously focuses his attention on Ethan. Kills Ethan, but Xana is still alive "whimpering/crying"

This is when BK says "don't worry I'll help you" that DM hears. I think he probably "finished her off" at this point. (As gross as that was to type).

The murders/attack of X/E happen at the 4:17am mark of when the neighbors cameras pick up the noise closest to Xana's room.

Also the direction the killer comes from in order to be able to "walk past" DM is obviously more so from the direction of Xanas room and not the upstairs.

Then at 4:20 car is seen leaving.

Nothing in the AA shows me or hints to me who exactly between M/K were targets. But I'd be interested to hear actual opinions/evidence that lead people to believe MM target.
I personally have a few minor differences in time frame and speculation of events, but generally I'm with you on this
 
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