4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #81

[TL4S]

I'd assume yes, the plate was unreadable. What else could it be? Not sure there's much room for misinterpretation here. If they'd had clear enough footage to capture the plate number, - and assuming it was defendant's- BK would have been arrested far sooner IMO and that would have been in the PCA. MOO

No way was a plate ever identifiable, or like you said, he would have been arrested right away. I'm just not sure if the "with an unknown license plate" means that there was one unreadable plate (which I think was the case), unknown if there were any plates, or there were no plates.

 

[jepop]

No way was a plate ever identifiable, or like you said, he would have been arrested right away. I'm just not sure if the "with an unknown license plate" means that there was one unreadable plate (which I think was the case), unknown if there were any plates, or there were no plates.

Oh, ok got you! Speculating re removing plate so having no plates on the night.

ETA: I see what you might be getting at. The state's case is going to be stronger/or easier to prove BARD if they have a capture of SV1 that unambiguously shows that it did have a rear number plate. The quote from PCA above says the front plate is likely absent but doesn't say that the rear plate is visible. MOO

 

[MeadowMuffin]

Yes, parking somewhere else and walking or riding a bicycle seem like a possibility. But then again, so many ring cams and CCTV all around. And you cannot easily spot them all. He still could have easily been spotted by neighbours cameras and tracked back to his car eventually.

Reminds me of convicted mass murderer Chad Isaac. He parked about a mile away at a McDonalds. Walked to the business where he murdered 4 employees at RJR Maintenance & Management Co in Mandan, ND. Walked back, where his appearance caused an employee to report him to LE (balaclava in 40 degree weather,snow packed against license plate). Anyway he, like BK, drove miles out of his way to return home. Picked up by many businesses along the way. His truck was unique in that he had 55 gallon drums in the back, rust above a wheel, and a v-shaped patch of mud on the front driver's side bumper, so easy to identify.

 

[gremlin444]

Off topic but I wonder if anyone has written a book or researched the aftermath of a serial killer’s actions on their families? How do they cope? Do they abandon or support their child? Do they move? Change their names? Contact the relatives of their victims? Do they get divorced? Do they blame themselves? Do they feel guilty? Probably exists but I am unaware but I’m sure this group can point me in the right direction. Just curious.

The Happy Face killer's daughter actually created and ran a show on A&E about this called "Monster in My Family." It's two seasons long, the first episode is about her but the other episodes feature Gacy's sister and niece, Richard Ramirez's relatives, etc. Off the top of my head, I know you can find some of the full episodes for free on Youtube.

 

[jepop]

I do not have much knowledge of CCTV or any other such devices, but I have followed at least two other cases that involved footage of vehicles captured on surveillance camera, and never was a license plate known. If a camera is pointed straight towards the road, then I'm wondering if it's limited to capturing only the side of a car as it goes by. Or maybe the resolution isn't good enough to make out a plate, or it's a blur due to the vehicle moving at the time of capture. I would wager that BK knew this about the cameras he would drive past. LE canvassed the entire town and beyond, so even if he parked a distance away and walked, I think eventually the white elantra would still be suspect. Probably not as quickly or surely, though. I also think for anyone with some knowledge of crime, who plans to carry out a crime, they also might consider that walking would leave a scent trail for search dogs. JMO.

I don't mean to give BK too much credit. Maybe it all was a thoughtless process driven solely by homicidal urges. I just happen to think the entire planning process was just as motivating to him as the murders themselves. JMO.

RBBM: I'm such a middle ground type, I don't see why it has to be one or the other. People are (or can be!) complex. Stranger homicide would, perhaps more than other types, involve complex sub-surface motives. The alleged killer could have been battling/indulging in homicidal urges, feel driven to kill to satisfy some need in himself - whilst also enjoying, intellectually (might have also got something emotionally from this too) planning his crime and imagining its 'perfect' execution. MOO

ETA: or maybe this is just the classic chicken or egg situation.

 

[TL4S]

RBBM: I'm such a middle ground type, I don't see why it has to be one or the other. People are (or can be!) complex. Stranger homicide would, perhaps more than other types, involve complex sub-surface motives. The alleged killer could have been battling/indulging in homicidal urges, feel driven to kill to satisfy some need in himself - whilst also enjoying, intellectually (might have also got something emotionally from this too) planning his crime and imagining its 'perfect' execution. MOO

ETA: or maybe this is just the classic chicken or egg situation.

You know, I love when my notifications say, "@jepop quoted your post"...

You make me think with different perspectives, which I like.

It's funny because I was actually asking myself the chicken or the egg question this morning. I was wondering if BK was fantasizing about murder, and then picked a victim(s), or if something about the victim(s) triggered the murder fantasy. Or, like you said, it was sort of a combination.

 

[TL4S]

Do we know exactly where he allegedly parked that night?? I was wondering if he reversed in as well???

RSBM. In re to where he parked, I don't think we have been told that information. My theory is he parked behind the house, because there were trees all around, it was not a through street, he could take the wooded area directly to the house and back, and having driven past the front and around the back, he could be sure when all the lights were off in the house. JMO.
-Red X is the King Rd house
-Blue line is where he drove and parked
-Yellow line is where he walked

Just my own speculation.

 

[jepop]

You know, I love when my notifications say, "@jepop quoted your post"...

You make me think with different perspectives, which I like.

It's funny because I was actually asking myself the chicken or the egg question this morning. I was wondering if BK was fantasizing about murder, and then picked a victim(s), or if something about the victim(s) triggered the murder fantasy. Or, like you said, it was sort of a combination.

That's kind of you to say. Your posts activate my thinking processes, and help me similarly to see wider angles, so I appreciate that and thank you!

 

[Megnut]

One murder??? As in, one big multi murder???

Or it was supposed to be just one murder, who he allegedly targeted, and the rest of the victims were collateral damage???
And once the killer was there, and murdered one person, he perhaps lost control, after the first one??

Which ever way is horrendous ….
IMO

I think he had one target M. Didn't expect K to be there-- which resulted in a messier scene, the shed sheath and noise. I don't think he anticipated X and E at all. I think he had full confidence in his stealth. To his detriment. And theirs.

Jmo

 

[TL4S]

Oh, ok got you! Speculating re removing plate so having no plates on the night.

ETA: I see what you might be getting at. The state's case is going to be stronger/or easier to prove BARD if they have a capture of SV1 that unambiguously shows that it did have a rear number plate. The quote from PCA above says the front plate is likely absent but doesn't say that the rear plate is visible. MOO

Sorry for being a post hog today. :/

In re to the evidence and BARD, we have footage of a specific vehicle on location both immediately before and after the murders. That vehicle could belong to anyone who owns, borrows, or steals a white elantra. If no white elantra was reported stolen, that's a tentative check off. Now, that elantra didn't have a front plate, and if it didn't have a rear plate, or it was unknown if there was one, then that lack of plate info isn't helpful because anyone could remove the plates.

But, if that elantra did indeed have a rear plate, that narrows it down significantly when in a state that requires both plates. Being a college town, cars with only a rear plate is probably not uncommon, but that kind of situation would be highly indicative of a student, imo, because who would most likely be in a college town with out of state plates (a state that only requires a rear plate)? Process of elimination would come to play, I would imagine. Then when LE finds a match with WA plates on WSU campus, they look up and find out the WA plates were put on only 5 days after the murders, replacing PA plates, which only require rear. Boom. *ETA: @NCWatcher, thank you for correcting me on this. BK's PA plate was still on the car when LE spotted it.

Then you have cell phone data that parallels the car activity, at least before and after the murders, and conveniently turned off during the murders. You have cell phone data that put him close enough to "touch" one of the victim's wifi/bluetooth on previous occasion(s). The person who owns the elantra owns the phone. And the person who owns the elantra and phone also owns the DNA on a sheath discovered next to one of the bodies. And this is only the evidence we know.

*To make a long story short, I believe he left the rear plate on, which ultimately helped pinpoint him specifically. JMO.

ETA: The states in blue are the states that only require a rear plate.

 

[Sjöberg]

In re to where he parked, I don't think we have been told that information. My theory is he parked behind the house, because there were trees all around, it was not a through street, he could take the wooded area directly to the house and back, and having driven past the front and around the back, he could be sure when all the lights were off in the house. JMO.

There were skidmarks in front of the house, that initially gave me the impression that the car was parked very close to the beginning of these skidmarks. However, he might have parked elsewhere and caused these marks by accelerating later, I guess. Driving up right next to the house also can carry a risk of both 1) someone waking up/noticing the stopping car and 2) someone seeing his car specifically right in front of the house at the time of the murders.
If anyone has any input re: skidmarks/parking, it's super welcome!

 

[TL4S]

There were skidmarks in front of the house, that initially gave me the impression that the car was parked very close to the beginning of these skidmarks. However, he might have parked elsewhere and caused these marks by accelerating later, I guess. Driving up right next to the house also can carry a risk of both 1) someone waking up/noticing the stopping car and 2) someone seeing his car specifically right in front of the house at the time of the murders.
If anyone has any input re: skidmarks/parking, it's super welcome!

Maybe that's when he finally noticed the neighbors had a camera. Just kidding...kind of.

In all seriousness, I felt like the skid marks didn't really match to him parking there due to the details from the camera (4:04/4:20) captures. That's totally guessing, though.

 

[SpiderFalcon]

One murder??? As in, one big multi murder???

Or it was supposed to be just one murder, who he allegedly targeted, and the rest of the victims were collateral damage???
And once the killer was there, and murdered one person, he perhaps lost control, after the first one??

Which ever way is horrendous ….
IMO

After reading this artlicle, and others, regarding this, in MSM:

From: Idaho Murder Suspect: What We Know About Bryan Kohberger

Norton said Kohberger was "more of a loner in the program," and claimed that Kohberger made disparaging remarks about the LGBTQ+ community.

"I didn't socialize with him because he had made anti-LGBTQ comments and I am a queer Individual," Norton told PEOPLE. If indeed Kohberger committed the crimes, Norton said, "As a criminology student, I'm sure he knew what charges he'd receive."

I started to theorize, (COMPLETE SPECULATION) that perhaps he saw the two girls sleeping in the same bed together, and was "triggered" in some way. IMO MOO

 

[NCWatcher]

Sorry for being a post hog today. :/

In re to the evidence and BARD, we have footage of a specific vehicle on location both immediately before and after the murders. That vehicle could belong to anyone who owns, borrows, or steals a white elantra. If no white elantra was reported stolen, that's a tentative check off. Now, that elantra didn't have a front plate, and if it didn't have a rear plate, or it was unknown if there was one, then that lack of plate info isn't helpful because anyone could remove the plates.

But, if that elantra did indeed have a rear plate, that narrows it down significantly when in a state that requires both plates. Being a college town, cars with only a rear plate is probably not uncommon, but that kind of situation would be highly indicative of a student, imo, because who would most likely be in a college town with out of state plates (a state that only requires a rear plate)? Process of elimination would come to play, I would imagine. Then when LE finds a match with WA plates on WSU campus, they look up and find out the WA plates were put on only 5 days after the murders, replacing PA plates, which only require rear. Boom.

Then you have cell phone data that parallels the car activity, at least before and after the murders, and conveniently turned off during the murders. You have cell phone data that put him close enough to "touch" one of the victim's wifi/bluetooth on previous occasion(s). The person who owns the elantra owns the phone. And the person who owns the elantra and phone also owns the DNA on a sheath discovered next to one of the bodies. And this is only the evidence we know.

*To make a long story short, I believe he left the rear plate on, which ultimately helped pinpoint him specifically. JMO.

That all makes sense EXCEPT he did not put on WA plates 5 days after the murders. Some click-bait headlines make that claim but it's not true.

The registration was changed to WA from PA on the 19th (6 days after the murder) When the PA plate (still on the car) was run in late Nov by LE it came back to BK and a new WA registration but he didn't actually get the WA plates until Dec per the PCA (Dec 5 is the issuance date.) He could have gotten the plate sooner by not doing stuff online & by mail. The WA DMV site clearly says it will take about 3 weeks for the plate to be mailed out of a person doesn't come in. But he didn't go in. So he apparently wasn't overly anxious about getting the WA plates.
JMO

 

[Sjöberg]

I also have a faint recollection of Maddies bf being out of town that weekend, but as I cannot remember how the articles referred to him at the time, I did not find a proof of that just now. I wonder, how often was her bf over at King Road while he was in town (were they long distance)? And if him being out of town was something the murderer knew beforehand - and that influenced his decision to enter the house that night.

 

[TL4S]

That all makes sense EXCEPT he did not put on WA plates 5 days after the murders. Some click-bait headlines make that claim but it's not true.

The registration was changed to WA from PA on the 19th (6 days after the murder) When the PA plate (still on the car) was run in late Nov by LE it came back to BK and a new WA registration but he didn't actually get the WA plates until Dec per the PCA (Dec 5 is the issuance date.) He could have gotten the plate sooner by not doing stuff online & by mail. The WA DMV site clearly says it will take about 3 weeks for the plate to be mailed out of a person doesn't come in. But he didn't go in. So he apparently wasn't overly anxious about getting the WA plates.
JMO

Good information, thank you so much! I imagine if by process of elimination they were looking for a student vehicle from any of the 19 states that only require rear plates, it wasn't a huge task to track one down, especially if one was a PA plate! JMO.

 

[Justice101]

No way was a plate ever identifiable, or like you said, he would have been arrested right away. I'm just not sure if the "with an unknown license plate" means that there was one unreadable plate (which I think was the case), unknown if there were any plates, or there were no plates.

Night video is blurry because auto-aperture increases the shutter open length... bottom line... you are not going to get a clear picture of even a lighted license plate at night with a moving vehicle.

 

[maskedwoman]

So it was entirely *after* the murders. He really did wait past what a reasonable grad student would do. However, they are students and often late with such things.

Appears to have nothing to do with the expiration from PA (which should have been good until April 2023). Interesting that he applied after the murders. I need to go check what people have been posting about when he got the new plate - it seems he did not get it until Dec. 5. While I guess this could be seen as some kind of attempt to cover his tracks (like the visit to the doctor), it's hard to say. Seems like it made him a bit more suspicious.

Maybe he was losing it.

IMO.

Catching up after a long weekend of manual labor at the homestead. I can totally believe he was losing it but it might have been a financial delay. I googled and think plates are only around $65 in Idaho, but if he was underwater financially, he might not have had a choice about waiting.

 

[NCWatcher]

Catching up after a long weekend of manual labor at the homestead. I can totally believe he was losing it but it might have been a financial delay. I googled and think plates are only around $65 in Idaho, but if he was underwater financially, he might not have had a choice about waiting.

True. Also remember he had to get a WA DL first and according to some internet sources, fees for those in WA are the highest in the nation. https://www.thenewstribune.com/news/state/washington/article273923140.html. We also don't know if he would have had to get new liability insurance that required an upfront payment. I can easily imagine a new grad student who moved across the country being squeezed on money. Also, his PA registration was not good until April as the post you responded to claimed. Per the PCA, it did expire Nov 30, 2022.
JMO

 

[10ofRods]

Catching up after a long weekend of manual labor at the homestead. I can totally believe he was losing it but it might have been a financial delay. I googled and think plates are only around $65 in Idaho, but if he was underwater financially, he might not have had a choice about waiting.

Well then, maybe he ought not to have been making unnecessary drives into Moscow from Pullman, nor shopping at Whole Foods (if he was - there was something about the "shopping being better" in Moscow, IIRC.

I'm only half kidding. It's apparently $43.20 in WA. I'm surprised that WA is lower than ID, but that's what google tells me.

I bet he spent money on nitrile gloves, a dark coverall, cleaning supplies, etc. He had his priorities, for sure. IMO.