Cause of Death and Time of Death *MERGED* (Warning: Contains Graphic Content!)

[Aedrys]

I was thinking about this yesterday, and had a frightening flash. I saw EB sitting on a chair in Zahra's room, smoking a cigarette, just watching her. It was like she was waiting for the child to die. And the look on her face suggested she was angry this was taking so long. Even more frighteningly, this view was from Zahra's eyes. I could feel her pain, her confusion at why EB won't help her get better, and why her dad isn't there. She couldn't even speak to call out for help.

I sometimes wonder if she did get some kind of sickness or infection, and EB just let it go until Zahra died. Just sat there and watched and waited until Zahra was dead. Didn't feel any guilt because it wasn't her that killed Zahra, it was an illness. I do think she abused Zahra too, and probably didn't believe Zahra if she told EB that she was sick. And then one day EB realizes Zahra is sick and also dying. So she just waits and watches until the child dies, not doing a single thing to help her. It's sick, just sick!

 

[Mountain_Kat]

If I look at those pictures of her bedroom after LE had finished with it, there is just no earthly way I can reconcile myself to the idea that this child died of natural causes. I just can't.

MOO

 

[tlcya]

I honestly don't know what I think. Like you say MK, that bedroom. But then, I just don't know. No matter how that child died it is heinous. Just horrible.

yep, gonna be soup day.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Warning: GRAPHIC

If there was blood spatter all over her bedroom wall and floor, (and I believe there was), how can that be explained by a death from natural causes? Do you then assume the dismemberment took place in her bedroom, on her bed?

How many of you would de-bone a chicken on a bed in your house? I'd venture to guess not many. You'd do that where the mess would be easy to clean up...somewhere where there is tile, or a counter, some surface easily cleaned.

JMO, but again, there is no earthly way I can reconcile the idea that this child died of natural causes looking at that bedroom. There just isn't.

 

[tehcloser]

GRAPHIC

I think one of the places they were looking at for the possible area of dismemberment was the back yard. And then possibly the pieces were taken into the house to be frozen or something, maybe bagged up IDK. Or maybe they were looking in the back yard because something might have been cleaned up or washed off out there, like maybe the tarp or car cover or whatever it was.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Personally, I think she beat the child to death and glorified in the dismemberment. I can almost see her cackling with glee as she tore that baby apart...I really believe that she actually enjoyed it, I think she finally got to play out all her sick fantasies in real life and she loved every second of it.

And I think she's loving the notoriety now, which is why she's writing to that nasty little website. She's in her absolute element. She's the Demon she always wanted to be.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Personally, I think she beat the child to death and glorified in the dismemberment. I can almost see her cackling with glee as she tore that baby apart...I really believe that she actually enjoyed it, I think she finally got to play out all her sick fantasies in real life and she loved every second of it.

And I think she's loving the notoriety now, which is why she's writing to that nasty little website. She's in her absolute element. She's the Demon she always wanted to be.

I believe something horrific and violent occurred in that bedroom. The "what" and the "who", aren't at all clear to me. But, I do believe that whatever happened in there, BOTH Adam and Elisa Baker knew about it. And BOTH of them tried to cover it up.

JMO

 

[vjlaw]

I believe something horrific and violent occurred in that bedroom. The "what" and the "who", aren't at all clear to me. But, I do believe that whatever happened in there, BOTH Adam and Elisa Baker knew about it. And BOTH of them tried to cover it up.

JMO

I believe both are involved too. If they disposed of the mattress in the dumpster close to their house, would there be lots of blood on it? I would think they would be afraid someone would look in the dumpster and see a mattress with lots of blood on it. Maybe whatever violent that happened didn't necessarily involve blood. jmo

 

[tehcloser]

OT but UPI is saying the 3 bodies in Ohio were dismembered too. Can you believe 2 cases this close together?

The bodies of Tina Herrmann, 32; her 11-year-old son, Kody Maynard; and family friend Stephanie Sprang, 41, were found dismembered "in a wooded area inside of garbage bags in a hollow tree" near Fredericktown, about 12 miles from where the three disappeared eight days ago, Knox County Sheriff David Barber said.

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2010/11/18/Bodies-found-are-3-missing-Ohioans/UPI-84811290126303/

*SO FAR THEY ARE THE ONLY ONES REPORTING THAT.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

OT but UPI is saying the 3 bodies in Ohio were dismembered too. Can you believe 2 cases this close together?

The bodies of Tina Herrmann, 32; her 11-year-old son, Kody Maynard; and family friend Stephanie Sprang, 41, were found dismembered "in a wooded area inside of garbage bags in a hollow tree" near Fredericktown, about 12 miles from where the three disappeared eight days ago, Knox County Sheriff David Barber said.

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2010/11/18/Bodies-found-are-3-missing-Ohioans/UPI-84811290126303/

OT (cont) We just had one here too. Young white male - found his legs and torso in a rubbermaid tub halfway concreted in - floated up on a canal into some guys dock - then they found his head about 10 miles away in a different canal about 3 days later.

Dunno what's up with all this - maybe something in the water.

 

[ynotdivein]

Nope. Think anything related to Zahra's dismemberment is solely and only related to EB. (EY, EF, EA, ee-i-ee-i-oh).

Not saying others aren't involved because IMO they are but.... "E'lesa" is the nexus of all these folks' involvement.

No reason for LE to remove all those wall and floor panels and skirting boards from Zahra's bedroom if the only thing that went on in that room is her quiet demise from "natural" causes.

As for the removal of the bathroom sink unit and the kitchen sink pipes and the kitchen lino and the carpet in Zahra's room... well, IMO none of that adds up to a peaceful death in her bed.

JMO and if someone can give me good reason to think that "they really didn't kill her" means they let her die of natural causes I am ready to entertain those notions. But those explanations will have to include the taking of the bedroom walls & flooring and the bathroom and kitchen plumbing...

 

[tehcloser]

Nope. Think anything related to Zahra's dismemberment is solely and only related to EB. (EY, EF, EA, ee-i-ee-i-oh).

Not saying others aren't involved because IMO they are but.... "E'lesa" is the nexus of all these folks' involvement.

No reason for LE to remove all those wall and floor panels and floor boards if the only thing that went on in Zahra's bedroom is her quiet demise from "natural" causes.

As for the removal of the bathroom sink unit and the kitchen sink pipes and the kitchen lino and the carpet in Zahra's room... well, IMO none of that adds up to a peaceful death in her bed.

JMO and if someone can give me good reason to think that "they really didn't kill her" means they let her die of natural causes I am ready to entertain those notions. But those explanations will have to include the taking of the bedroom walls & flooring and the bathroom and kitchen plumbing...

BBM

I have to agree, for awhile I thought there was and then I thought there wasn't but now, I really think there was a third party.

 

[raisincharlie]

BBM

I have to agree, for awhile I thought there was and then I thought there wasn't but now, I really think there was a third party.

Me too - third party...one good reason for EB to sing like a canary. The one who sings first gets the best deal, and EB hasn't been singing unless there was something in it for her, I'm thinking she is feeling some pressure and a deep need to cover her tracks. She's playing against someone and I don't think it is AB alone.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I believe both are involved too. If they disposed of the mattress in the dumpster close to their house, would there be lots of blood on it? I would think they would be afraid someone would look in the dumpster and see a mattress with lots of blood on it. Maybe whatever violent that happened didn't necessarily involve blood. jmo

You can wash a mattress. You wouldn't be able to remove everything, but it would be pretty easy to remove enough of a stain that one couldn't tell what it was from by sight alone. In fact, I've scrubbed similar stains out of my own mattress over the years.

And if any traces WERE left to the visible eye, well hey...got that covered too. "My daughter is entering puberty, I think..."

 

[tlcya]

snipped from ynot,

EB. (EY, EF, EA, ee-i-ee-i-oh).

:floorlaugh:

 

[tlcya]

sorry, but I needed a good laugh at this point.

 

[Mish]

OT (cont) We just had one here too. Young white male - found his legs and torso in a rubbermaid tub halfway concreted in - floated up on a canal into some guys dock - then they found his head about 10 miles away in a different canal about 3 days later.

Dunno what's up with all this - maybe something in the water.

Clicked on the link provided...they have removed the word, "dismemberment"...perhaps they reported it incorrectly OR were told to remove it due to the investigation protocol??? (there have been others on that thread who wondered if the guy got the "idea" from Zahra's case)

 

[panthera]

I'm not feeling that they would "waste" their drugs on Zahra either, if that is the case and they were both dealing and using (which I believe they both were--meth, oxy)

I also believe drugs are the reason for the entire "family scramble" of lies, tall tales, and stories.... from the internet to statements on Nancy Grace.

I still believe that Zahra died of a combination of severe physical abuse, AND gross medical neglect.

JMHO

BBM

Exactly - that is my opinion also.

 

[panthera]

(respectfully snipped to address)

As to the prosthetic fitting, needing fitted, causing pain.

1) LE cannot even determine when Zahra was last seen alive. The photos we have all seen of Zahra are not date stamped and we have no way of knowing if any of those smiling photos are recent. I have seen no claims from anyone anywhere that any of those photos are from within the last six months.

2) This is a child who survived childhood cancer, an amputation and hearing loss. She is used to making lemonade out of lemons in her life. I do not think her smiling in photos can be taken as evidence that Zahra may not have been uncomfortable or worse, in pain.

Others may interpret the facts differently. This is simpy mine.

This is why I would be interested in the observations of those who say they saw Zahra in the furniture store on 9/25. IIRC, they said they noticed her prosthetic leg. Why? Was it because Zahra was wearing something (such as shorts) that made it obvious, or was she walking in a manner that drew attention to it? Also, what about her demeanor when she finished the school year this past spring? Was it difficult for her to walk? Did she seem to be in pain? :waitasec: I also agree that having survived cancer, twice, she may have developed a resiliency to pain and camouflaged it well. MOO

 

[tlcya]

I will check for links. I thought the salesclerk explained that she noticed Z and was sure it was her because she had noticed her odd gait and then noticed it was due to a prosthetic. She walked right past Z, even placing a hand on her shoulder.

I will search for link. Maybe that is ONE thing I will do right tonight.