Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #35

[minni]

What is this phenomenom that keeps us glued to this forum, knowing that we have examined every theory every which way, the QPS are keeping tighter than a turtle's bum and MSM have gone home for the weekend? Can't someone just make something up? Surely SOMEONE saw the caterpillar driving the captiva!

haha we get in trouble for making stuff up!! Its the same thing that always keeps us here, but its not really tangible, its a desire and a passion to see 'right' and 'justice' done, for Allison and her children and parents and loved ones. I think its become more than just that now too, for many people here. Too late a and too hard to think about it now..but lots of people feel it I think

 

[MaxwellSmart]

BBM

Aileen Wournos first victim Richard Mallory decomposed under similar conditions in Florida 1989. He was under a tarp. Hands and head skeletonised due to predator activity. Can't link as I am using a printed book as reference.

God forbid, an old fashioned reference? A book? What is this "book" you speaketh of? Are they to be read or just take up space on bookshelves?

 

[ollijack]

Much love Bellgirl....I work, sometime's with people with Dementia.....it is an amazing disease....enjoy your mum's birthday..xxxxxxxxxxxx

 

[minni]

Hi Min!

I'm about 5 pages behind, but this topic is very close to my heart and I just can't ignore it.

A poster from here said they had heard that NBC has Dementia. A few weeks after this person posted this, we were all discussing why NBC hadn't been arrested yet. There were all sorts of ideas, but I was hooked on the fact that his 'apparent' dementia may have something to do with this. So, I asked (on the forum) this poster if they knew this for fact or rumour, or if they'd heard any more on this subject. They didn't answer my questions, for what ever reason. Maybe they missed these questions or maybe they didn't want to discuss rumours per mod rules. I totally understand and that's fine.

My Dad is in the final stage of Dementia. He has been suffering this terrible disease for nearly 20 yrs. In saying this, Dad could easily live on for another 20 yrs, as he is fairly fit and healthy. It's just his mind that has deteriorated. Sufferers of Dementia are constantly confused about where they are, what's going on and about the people around them. This often makes them aggressive and they will lash out verbally or physically, depending on the situation they are confronted with. If they are in professional care, they are given regular medication to calm them - and then they can end up sitting, dozing for many hours of the day.

Last year, my Mum eventually had to put Dad into a home in the Western Suburbs, after 50 yrs of marriage. She couldn't take care of him any more and was on the verge of a stroke or heart attack herself. This decision was very hard to accept by us 5 adult children and our husbands and wife. We understood why Mum had to do this for Dad and for herself, but to many of us, it's not 'the way' that your loving parents are supposed to end up. It's still heart breaking and still really hurts, but we all accept, understand and support Mum on her decision.

Min, my Dad is also a 'professional' at upsetting the nurses or other people in the home. He is often sedated or even admitted to Hospital for the night because he has lashed out. All large items in his room (that we've bought) have been conviscated as he could use them as weapons eg. vase, small tv, portable radio. Yet, he was the most gentle, loving, patient ......... best Dad ever.

My query with NBC having early Dementia is that he could have easily gone along with whatever GBC asked of him that night - to help with disposal of Allison at the creek, with the clean up, with the babysitting ........ whatever. He may well be physically able to assist with any of these tasks. But if he were pulled into a Police Station for questioning, or even on the stand in a Court of Law, would he be able to answer questions and remember what actually happened that night? If it were my Dad 10 yrs ago, he wouldn't have a clue what happened the night before.

For a number of weeks I have wondered if this is actually the case and this is why the QPS have not arrested NBC as yet. I have also wondered what would happen to him if he were guilty of being an accomplice in Allison's murder, and he had Dementia. It's a terrible thing to think of, so I mostly just move on from this thought.

I have also read the many posts that NBC is sharp and quick, on the ball etc etc (seems no Dementia) I hope so - for a quite a few different reasons. It has also been suggested that he hasn't been arrested because if he was, then he wouldn't have to answer any questions at GBC's trial. So maybe QPS are waiting for the trial, get him (and others) on the stand and then will arrest NBC. I'm not sure if this is right and how the Law side works.

For the record, I think NBC was an accomplice that fateful night. He helped GBC dispose of Allison's body and with the clean up after. I also think that NBC knew what he was doing and can remember it all. IMO. The Dementia rumour/theory just lurks in my mind.

Well, by now (this has taken ages to write and post) I'll be 10 pages behind. You brilliant people have well and truly moved on, you have probably found a cure for cancer, in addition to solving the mystery of what happened to Allison. I'm sorry!

PS. It's Mum's 70th B'day on Sunday and Dad's coming. We're hoping for a really special day - for all.

:grouphug: thanks Bell, xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx biggest hugs and love

 

[Makara]

I don't believe you! Where's ya wheelie bin?

Here tis. :floorlaugh:

 

[pulpfiction]

I suppose pulp you have not seen me in action with my Chinese cleaver, sharpened every week. Big ribs take me two good blows. A pig's tail like fingers I would be gentle with as I wouldn't want to damage the chopping board too much. I suppose what I am saying is it depends on what you use.

Ps no forensics for me just an avid foodie!!

Hmm...yes good point. The only thing is unless you are a butcher, a surgeon or a mafia good fella it's the psychological aspect also that makes it very difficult to cut off hands regardless of the weapon and sheer brute strength. I'm not saying GBC couldn't have done it but any form of dismemberment takes a certain type of person. Often they are cold and detached types or have no connection to the victim. But anything is possible The other theory of course if it did indeed happen is that another party could have done it. However, if there was an accomplice and that person was a relative say...then you're back to the probability that it's a very personally gruesome thing to do to a relative even if you're adept at hunting and have scouting background - so that lowers the likelihood again it would seem Fingers is bad enough but cutting off hands is really taking it to the next level beyond what is already a horrific crime especially when he would know QPS would definitely question the marks and find his stories um a little bit colorful and quite coincidental.

Also, if indeed Allison was smothered then that often shows that the perpetrator has chosen that means of ending a life for a variety of reasons one of which is that it's one of the less messy/violent ways when compared to stabbing, shooting, bashing etc. This is often seen in cases like GBC. Of course the struggle can be brutal but if a person is drugged or asleep then the violence is further reduced - the element of surprise assists if the person is asleep/drugged and a pillow is used. In cases where a plastic bag or bath water/strangling occurs then the struggle can be especially violent with the perp. frequently having many tell tale injuries. If the hands were cut off then it's dreadful but if a perp. is angry or in a rage then that again makes the act somewhat easier although it is still a very macabre thing to do especially when they were perhaps rushed and she was the mother of his children and his wife.

I have to wonder also about the whole dementia thing with NBC. Not saying its not possible of course but I think it's more probable that he may have become confused if he was in fact in that location. I think he, and anyone else, would be so very, very rattled and definitely in a state of shock. That's when the planning element goes into chaos and mistakes happen as reasoning and planning are significantly affected by shock. The ability to read, judge and execute things is compromised. Hence, the conflicting stories, the pretty silly (IMO) wording in the texts & possible reasons for GBC scratches etc. But to him it might all be logical, yet he doesn't strike me as the organised type even if it was premeditated - at least from what I've seen on tv, heard via the grapevine and read in the newspapers. One day we will find out but right now we are just hypotheticizing a lot Wish I worked for QPS right now lol.

 

[possumheart]

God forbid, an old fashioned reference? A book? What is this "book" you speaketh of? Are they to be read or just take up space on bookshelves?

Do you prefer the Harvard Referencing System?

 

[Mani]

Hi Min!

I'm about 5 pages behind, but this topic is very close to my heart and I just can't ignore it.

A poster from here said they had heard that NBC has Dementia. A few weeks after this person posted this, we were all discussing why NBC hadn't been arrested yet. There were all sorts of ideas, but I was hooked on the fact that his 'apparent' dementia may have something to do with this. So, I asked (on the forum) this poster if they knew this for fact or rumour, or if they'd heard any more on this subject. They didn't answer my questions, for what ever reason. Maybe they missed these questions or maybe they didn't want to discuss rumours per mod rules. I totally understand and that's fine.

My Dad is in the final stage of Dementia. He has been suffering this terrible disease for nearly 20 yrs. In saying this, Dad could easily live on for another 20 yrs, as he is fairly fit and healthy. It's just his mind that has deteriorated. Sufferers of Dementia are constantly confused about where they are, what's going on and about the people around them. This often makes them aggressive and they will lash out verbally or physically, depending on the situation they are confronted with. If they are in professional care, they are given regular medication to calm them - and then they can end up sitting, dozing for many hours of the day.

Last year, my Mum eventually had to put Dad into a home in the Western Suburbs, after 50 yrs of marriage. She couldn't take care of him any more and was on the verge of a stroke or heart attack herself. This decision was very hard to accept by us 5 adult children and our husbands and wife. We understood why Mum had to do this for Dad and for herself, but to many of us, it's not 'the way' that your loving parents are supposed to end up. It's still heart breaking and still really hurts, but we all accept, understand and support Mum on her decision.

Min, my Dad is also a 'professional' at upsetting the nurses or other people in the home. He is often sedated or even admitted to Hospital for the night because he has lashed out. All large items in his room (that we've bought) have been conviscated as he could use them as weapons eg. vase, small tv, portable radio. Yet, he was the most gentle, loving, patient ......... best Dad ever.

My query with NBC having early Dementia is that he could have easily gone along with whatever GBC asked of him that night - to help with disposal of Allison at the creek, with the clean up, with the babysitting ........ whatever. He may well be physically able to assist with any of these tasks. But if he were pulled into a Police Station for questioning, or even on the stand in a Court of Law, would he be able to answer questions and remember what actually happened that night? If it were my Dad 10 yrs ago, he wouldn't have a clue what happened the night before.

For a number of weeks I have wondered if this is actually the case and this is why the QPS have not arrested NBC as yet. I have also wondered what would happen to him if he were guilty of being an accomplice in Allison's murder, and he had Dementia. It's a terrible thing to think of, so I mostly just move on from this thought.

I have also read the many posts that NBC is sharp and quick, on the ball etc etc (seems no Dementia) I hope so - for a quite a few different reasons. It has also been suggested that he hasn't been arrested because if he was, then he wouldn't have to answer any questions at GBC's trial. So maybe QPS are waiting for the trial, get him (and others) on the stand and then will arrest NBC. I'm not sure if this is right and how the Law side works.

For the record, I think NBC was an accomplice that fateful night. He helped GBC dispose of Allison's body and with the clean up after. I also think that NBC knew what he was doing and can remember it all. IMO. The Dementia rumour/theory just lurks in my mind.

Well, by now (this has taken ages to write and post) I'll be 10 pages behind. You brilliant people have well and truly moved on, you have probably found a cure for cancer, in addition to solving the mystery of what happened to Allison. I'm sorry!

PS. It's Mum's 70th B'day on Sunday and Dad's coming. We're hoping for a really special day - for all.

I hope you have a brilliant day on Sunday. Thank you for sharing your story about your Dad and for putting dementia into perspective for us.
I wonder if NBC does have some dementia, whether he has been taken advantage of? MOO

 

[ollijack]

Good point OJ - it feels awful thinking about it but you have a good point. MOO

I have not gone past the point of Allison being placed in or near water, when she had a fear of it and a possible connection to the Little Ugly Creek, when she has been a beauty pageant winner - there is something cruel and macabre about it. MOO

Enough to make a bunch of stout hearted women kick arse - God they wouldn't want to throw him to the women of Brisbane - there would be no skin left on his bones!!!! IMO

BBM


:floorlaugh: then, he would be a little bit hurt and would never be ok hmmmm nice thought :floorlaugh:

 

[Mani]

Hmm...yes good point. The only thing is unless you are a butcher, a surgeon or a mafia good fella it's the psychological aspect also that makes it very difficult to cut off hands regardless of the weapon and sheer brute strength. I'm not saying GBC couldn't have done it but any form of dismemberment takes a certain type of person. Often they are cold and detached types or have no connection to the victim. But anything is possible The other theory of course if it did indeed happen is that another party could have done it. However, if there was an accomplice and that person was a relative say...then you're back to the probability that it's a very personally gruesome thing to do to a relative even if you're adept at hunting and have scouting background - so that lowers the likelihood again it would seem Fingers is bad enough but cutting off hands is really taking it to the next level beyond what is already a horrific crime especially when he would know QPS would definitely question the marks and find his stories um a little bit colorful and quite coincidental.

Also, if indeed Allison was smothered then that often shows that the perpetrator has chosen that means of ending a life for a variety of reasons one of which is that it's one of the less messy/violent ways when compared to stabbing, shooting, bashing etc. This is often seen in cases like GBC. Of course the struggle can be brutal but if a person is drugged or asleep then the violence is further reduced - the element of surprise assists if the person is asleep/drugged and a pillow is used. In cases where a plastic bag or bath water/strangling occurs then the struggle can be especially violent with the perp. frequently having many tell tale injuries. If the hands were cut off then it's dreadful but if a perp. is angry or in a rage then that again makes the act somewhat easier although it is still a very macabre thing to do especially when they were perhaps rushed and she was the mother of his children and his wife.

I have to wonder also about the whole dementia thing with NBC. Not saying its not possible of course but I think it's more probable that he may have become confused if he was in fact in that location. I think he, and anyone else, would be so very, very rattled and definitely in a state of shock. That's when the planning element goes into chaos and mistakes happen as reasoning and planning are significantly affected by shock. The ability to read, judge and execute things is compromised. Hence, the conflicting stories, the pretty silly (IMO) wording in the texts & possible reasons for GBC scratches etc. But to him it might all be logical, yet he doesn't strike me as the organised type even if it was premeditated - at least from what I've seen on tv, heard via the grapevine and read in the newspapers. One day we will find out but right now we are just hypotheticizing a lot Wish I worked for QPS right now lol.

Pulps - what do you make of placing Allison near or in water when she has a fear of it and also the Little Ugly Creek nearby????
Does that ping any thoughts about profiling for you?

 

[Keentoknow]

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

Here tis. :floorlaugh:

I prefer your crystal ball.

 

[DrWatson]

Methinks vertebrae at the back and sternum at the front - but not all

Yup indeed - good thinking 86

 

[Makara]

Prawns are bottom feeders. They dont come to the surface, hence the way they are trawled to be caught.
(our family are "prawnies")

MOO

Prawnies here too Amee. If the water is shallow enough prawns will feed on whatever is there. Allison may have been only partly submerged. I've been prawning in calf deep water and the little critters latched onto my leg. Not a nice feeling but they tasted nice the next day. The four to five days around the new moon are the best time to prawn. The prawns like the cover of darkness and prawning during a full moon is a waste of time.

MOO.

 

[MaxwellSmart]

Do you prefer the Harvard Referencing System?

Goodness me, way too complicated(as I am discovering with all my assignments). Despite web links being easy to link and refer to, they are buggers to put in the right order for the Harvard system!

 

[possumheart]

BBM

Aileen Wournos first victim Richard Mallory decomposed under similar conditions in Florida 1989. He was under a tarp. Hands and head skeletonised due to predator activity. Can't link as I am using a printed book as reference.

Correction. He was under a piece of cardboard for 12 days near a river in early winter. Skeletonised from collarbone to top of head due to insect and animal activity. Fingers were in tact.

 

[possumheart]

Goodness me, way too complicated(as I am discovering with all my assignments). Despite web links being easy to link and refer to, they are buggers to put in the right order for the Harvard system!

For the mods cos I can't link. 364.15230973 WOUR
(Dewey)

 

[J-Diggety]

Amee, don't they come up to the surface of the water on full moon???

Or have my friends been giving me the 'raw prawn' for years? LOL

4 days after, we usually just net bucket loads off the surface from our kayaks

 

[J-Diggety]

When you look at Rob Cheesman's fb page he has GBC proudly showing first on his friends list. pfffttt!

Not by choice, its random

 

[Thebuttlerdidntdoit]

I hope you have a brilliant day on Sunday. Thank you for sharing your story about your Dad and for putting dementia into perspective for us.
I wonder if NBC does have some dementia, whether he has been taken advantage of? MOO

I agree with the possibility that NBC was taken advantage of, manipulated, by GBC - if indeed he was an accomplice.

The more I think about it the more I see GBC convincing his dad that Allison committed suicide and how bad it'll look for him if the body is in the house.

I also wonder - after today's talk of GBC maybe pleading guilty - whether GBC (and his lawyers) is planning to plead not guilty to murder but guilty to the other lesser charge, interference with a body, ie, transporting Allison's lifeless body to Kholo Creek. He might think murder will be hard to prove because of the way he killed Allison. say he soffucated Allison with a plastic bag - because he knew that can look like a suicide. (long ago I knew of someone who committed suicide with a plastic bag). I wonder too whether the DPP charged him with this second charge just so he doesn't get completely off.

 

[Aunty]

Good point OJ - it feels awful thinking about it but you have a good point. MOO

I have not gone past the point of Allison being placed in or near water, when she had a fear of it and a possible connection to the Little Ugly Creek, when she has been a beauty pageant winner - there is something cruel and macabre about it. MOO

Enough to make a bunch of stout hearted women kick arse - God they wouldn't want to throw him to the women of Brisbane - there would be no skin left on his bones!!!! IMO

Oh. Mani. , :rocker: I agree , and his bones would be used as prawn bait in the amazon.