The Crown v Gerard Baden-Clay, 9th July - Trial Day 17

[Fluffykins]

A work colleague recently discovered a leech on her foot at 2:30 in the afternoon. It was inside her stocking. It had to have gotten between her toes at about 8am when she went outside in thongs to feed the chooks. Unnoticed. She put her stocking and shoe on over the top.

By discovery the leech was enormous. She had to pour the blood out of her shoe. And she had 3 obvious marks where she had been bleeding all day. It was still bleeding an hour later.

And she hadn't noticed it there for 6 and a half hours.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

:freakedout::freakedout::freakedout:

 

[Her Honour]

Is anyone left with any reasonable doubt that he killed her, based on the evidence presented in Court?

Really late in replying, but none whatsoever.

In fact, I am actually quite distressed by the vivid image I now have of Allison's last moments, as she realises what is being done and by whom. Rest in peace brave hearted woman.

 

[Makara]

I made this image a while back for Allison's girls.

May they always feel their mother's light and love. May they always dance to the beat of their own drum and may no man ever be permitted to drag them down.

I've also included one of my favourite songs at the link below. (The advertisement only lasts a few seconds). I sing this to my own daughter and I'm sure any mother can relate to the beautiful words of

I Hope You Dance.​

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RV-Z1YwaOiw

I Hope You Dance

LEE ANN WOMACK

I hope you never lose your sense of wonder,
You get your fill to eat but always keep that hunger,
May you never take one single breath for granted,
GOD forbid love ever leave you empty handed,
I hope you still feel small when you stand beside the ocean,
Whenever one door closes I hope one more opens,
Promise me that you'll give faith a fighting chance,
And when you get the choice to sit it out or dance.

I hope you dance....I hope you dance.

I hope you never fear those mountains in the distance,
Never settle for the path of least resistance
Livin' might mean takin' chances but they're worth takin',
Lovin' might be a mistake but it's worth makin',
Don't let some hell bent heart leave you bitter,
When you come close to sellin' out reconsider,
Give the heavens above more than just a passing glance,
And when you get the choice to sit it out or dance.

I hope you dance....I hope you dance.
I hope you dance....I hope you dance.
(Time is a wheel in constant motion always rolling us along,
Tell me who wants to look back on their years and wonder where those years have gone.)

I hope you still feel small when you stand beside the ocean,
Whenever one door closes I hope one more opens,
Promise me that you'll give faith a fighting chance,
And when you get the choice to sit it out or dance.

Dance....I hope you dance.
I hope you dance....I hope you dance.
I hope you dance....I hope you dance..
(Time is a wheel in constant motion always rolling us along
Tell me who wants to look back on their years and wonder where those years have gone)

http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/leeannwomack/ihopeyoudance.html

​

 

[Fuskier]

Beautiful Makara, and with that, goodnight. Until tomorrow.

 

[Zim]

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-allison-in-2012/story-fnihsrf2-1226982264933

Ooo la la !

 

[Fluffykins]

I agree with this - and it is also why he ditched the phone at that stage - he was going with the random stranger story at the start. IMO the suicide story came either from his family or his defence team or both.

I think the same. He forgot to take the rings off though. Might have at least looked like robbery.

I also thought he was initially hoping he could give the impression of a random stranger - perhaps an early stage serial killer. If he'd thought a little harder, he might have realised he was never going to cut it as a homicidal maniac with a weapons choice of pillows or cushions.

Fortunate that his dastardly cunning stopped short of remembering to remove her rings ... so if robbery were a motive, it was just someone who was really desperate for a phone. And who just happened to have a pillow handy.

 

[Her Honour]

would also explain why the girls heard nothing good thinking kg1, I have always thought they fought and he choked her but outside makes more sense

Sooo late tonight; bloody school holidays

Yes, KG & S, been thinking about outdoors as a possibility after the evidence (if it's to be believed) of A's demeanour upon discovering the affair (Mark I): she needed to physically distance herself, get out of the car, sit on the curb, shrug off the meaningless hug. She may have needed some distance that night too, on account of discomfort caused by the conversation I'm now certain they were having.

 

[Fluffykins]

Makara: what a lovely tribute. I hope Allison's girls get to see it. Thank you for sharing it again! :tyou::tyou::tyou:

 

[heloise]

Sorry, JBC, but I don't get where you are going. ??????? I cannot imagine many people cut themselves to the extent that blood dribbles down the door of their car (especially at the back of the car, if they are the driver!)..... and if there were any sharp edges anywhere inside that Captiva, GBC's lawyers would have picked it up - and/or GBC would be suing the manufacturers for millions. Where you are going with this. ?

 

[Her Honour]

Apparently "radiant orchid" aka purple is the Pantone colour of the year. Having said that, I'm seeing more coral than purple in the shops

Hmm, me too! Sorry if this has been added to The Color Purple dialogue in the 167 pages I've yet to read, but I had a (male) friend at Uni who always teased me if I wore purple, on the basis that it was 'the colour of sexual frustration'!!! (And no, I wasn't, then.)

 

[Fly]

Loved it! Thanks Doc

Sorry - sort of off topic, but only a little bit.
Medical "in-house" joke.

A GP, a specialist, a surgeon and a pathologist go duck hunting.

Something flies overhead, making "quacking" noises.

GP (excited): I think that's a duck! (turns to specialist): Do you think that could be a duck?

Specialist (looks carefully at the bird with binoculars): Well, I can't be 100% sure. I'll have to run some more tests. Sometimes what appears to be a duck can actually be an Eastern African Spotted Goose, or an Outer Mongolian Red-Footed Turkey, or a seagull. Let's not jump to any conclusions just yet.

Surgeon - points his gun at the bird and shoots. The bird falls out of the sky.
Surgeon turns to the pathologist and says: Run along and see if that was a duck, will you?

 

[Fly]

Well that certainly brought a few late night tears. Thanks Makara. It's beautiful. I wish there was someway they could see it when the time is right..

I made this image a while back for Allison's girls.

May they always feel their mother's light and love. May they always dance to the beat of their own drum and may no man ever be permitted to drag them down.

I've also included one of my favourite songs at the link below. (The advertisement only lasts a few seconds). I sing this to my own daughter and I'm sure any mother can relate to the beautiful words of

I Hope You Dance.​

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RV-Z1YwaOiw

I Hope You Dance

LEE ANN WOMACK

I hope you never lose your sense of wonder,
You get your fill to eat but always keep that hunger,
May you never take one single breath for granted,
GOD forbid love ever leave you empty handed,
I hope you still feel small when you stand beside the ocean,
Whenever one door closes I hope one more opens,
Promise me that you'll give faith a fighting chance,
And when you get the choice to sit it out or dance.

I hope you dance....I hope you dance.

I hope you never fear those mountains in the distance,
Never settle for the path of least resistance
Livin' might mean takin' chances but they're worth takin',
Lovin' might be a mistake but it's worth makin',
Don't let some hell bent heart leave you bitter,
When you come close to sellin' out reconsider,
Give the heavens above more than just a passing glance,
And when you get the choice to sit it out or dance.

I hope you dance....I hope you dance.
I hope you dance....I hope you dance.
(Time is a wheel in constant motion always rolling us along,
Tell me who wants to look back on their years and wonder where those years have gone.)

I hope you still feel small when you stand beside the ocean,
Whenever one door closes I hope one more opens,
Promise me that you'll give faith a fighting chance,
And when you get the choice to sit it out or dance.

Dance....I hope you dance.
I hope you dance....I hope you dance.
I hope you dance....I hope you dance..
(Time is a wheel in constant motion always rolling us along
Tell me who wants to look back on their years and wonder where those years have gone)

http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/leeannwomack/ihopeyoudance.html

​

 

[Her Honour]

Yep I think the bedroom too...only because there were more photos of that room than any of the others.

Not that we're likely to know what happened but I think, Allison, after the lengths she went to attempting to hold her marriage together, she somehow heard or found out GBC was once again back with TM.

And with all the talk about there not being a "prince" ...GBC may have thrown that at her just to be a <modsnip>

Yes, Marly, really the ONE outstanding question I have is what WAS that text ABC to GBC 18th April about? To the effect of 'I hope you're having fun with your companion and there are no seats down in the back of Snowy'. Was it ever established where the relevant parties were at the time? GBC was very evasive in cross-exam as to when he'd last seen/been 'intimate' with TM.

 

[Her Honour]

Me again The man many of you love to hate!

Kidding aside, while my opinion on the likely verdict hasn't changed, if he is indeed convicted I will say that I will lose no sleep over it whatsoever. Furthermore I was earlier concerned about a potential appealable error but after hearing more, my fears have been allayed. I'd still expect an appeal of course, it is almost inevitable in cases with mandatory life imprisonment but nothing absolutely stands out as reason for worry (in my non verified expert opinion).

I am however particularly concerned with the Crown's failure to adequately address how the blood came to be in the Captiva and the lack of plant material present. It is my (again, non verified expert) belief that the Crown's case becomes defective if they cannot establish that Alison was bundled into the Captiva postmortem and driven out to where she was ultimately discovered. The Crown did not (could not?) offer, at least to me, a reasonable and logical explanation as to how Allison's blood came to be in the car. There were no obvious wounds which would be consistent with what appears to be a not insignificant amount of blood, I guess one could make the argument that it could have been a facial wound which from what I can gather, would have been hard to identify after her discovery but even this possibility was not raised. As for the lack of plant material, the Crown has conceded that there was no evidence of a clean up and offered only the positioning of the toys as "odd".

Given that nobody heard or saw GBC leaving their residence, in transit to KCB, at the scene itself or returning home it must surely mean that Crown relies exclusively on the Captiva evidence which I fear is lacking to the extent that it is likely the undoing of the Crown case.

Quickly before court once again resumes, I have 2 questions that I would invite opinion on.

1. Why was Kholo Creek chosen when there are numerous secluded and rugged areas closer to the BC residence which are accessed along much less heavily trafficed roads? I am not a local but I do know the area fairly well, there are numerous areas within perhaps a 10 minute radius where a body may never even be found. It is odd that he took the chance to travel perhaps twice that distance, along much busier roads.

2. The prosecution alleges that Allison was dragged down an embankment, placed on a ledge and rolled off. Why is this the case when, not 20 metres away, GBC could have stopped the car momentarily on the bridge, removed Allison from the boot and thrown her into the middle of the river which at the time was within an hour either side of high tide and so would have been likely to sweep Allison's body away into the Brisbane River as the tide ebbed, possibly never to be seen again. Not only would this seem (to me) to be the most obvious and efficient method, it would have taken mere seconds whereas physically taking her down the embankment, at least partially, must have taken some minutes (not to mention greatly increasing the chance of GBC dragging some evidence of being in that location back into the car with him). The only possible reason that I can come up with, and I feel like I'm grasping at straws in the context of the evidence, is that he wanted her found which would indicate obvious premeditation and scope for perhaps a harsher penalty than the 15 year minimum which (in my opinion only) would seem likely otherwise.

Hello you; happy to grasp if you say so, I think even if not premeditated, it occurred to the 'perp' shortly after death that the victim's life was insured and that perhaps claim would be paid sooner with a body.

 

[Fluffykins]

I am also in the minority. I believe GBC probably is guilty but I still don't believe it has been proved beyond reasonable doubt. There may be many reasons a small amount of Alison's blood is in the car. Over my life I have probably had small bleeds hundrens of times--anything from a ripped finger nail, small cut, paper cut, knife cut, trauma etc. and I have bled in hundreds of places--inside, outside, in bed, at the table , on the floor, in cars etc. the very small amount of blood could have got there any time in the previous 8 weeks and is not necessarily associated with the night of Alison's disappearance.

I wouldn't call it a "very small" amount of blood. It's not a spot or a dab or a droplet; at the very least you'd have to call it a trickle, and Justice Byrne actually called it a rivulet. The police photos show it against a 30cm ruler and you can see it's smeared horizontally at the top for about 7cm, drips down a few cm on the right of that smear, and trickles down about 22cm on the left. It's quite a substantial amount.



If I somehow managed to bleed that much in the back of my car - in which I typically sit in the driver's seat anyway - I'd have that mess cleaned up as soon as I'd stopped the bleeding. It's just such a stretch to imagine Allison (not "Alison") leaving a trickle of blood there when all it needed was a quick swipe with a damp sponge to remove it. I mean - of all the hundreds of places in which you've bled, were there any times you didn't clean it up? When you just left it there, on your own property or anyone else's?

 

[Her Honour]

Sorry, double, webslomnia isotiredthankgoodnessjurysoutnow(DearMrFullerwouldbethemostreluctantofheartthrobs) *advertiser censored*

 

[Her Honour]

It was mentioned, but I remember whoever raised it specifically saying it was NOT menstrual blood. i.e. if it was it would contain endometrial cells, and we would have been informed of this, but it is not in the evidence.

Finally catching up, wish I'd done so earlier so I could have saved you all this trouble! It was an exchange between JCB and me, he (I think he?) had concerns about the origin/age of the blood and I was suggesting that the position of it (i.e. door/footwell) meant it was unlikely to be menstrual. Sorry! Wish I'd never raised it...

 

[FigTree]

Re: The Blood marking..
sorry I dont have a picture to post - there is one above in Fluffykins post.

That longer line of blood is so incredibly straight - parallel to the ruler.
Yet the shorter one in angled.

I think the short line of blood has fallen when the car has been reversing - the direction of the blood drip drawn to the front of the vehicle.
I think that when the car then moved forward a very short distance and stopped and went stationary, the source of the bleeding (the body) moved forward slightly causing a smear - allowing more blood to be released - continued to flow from the source and dripped down in a straight line.
Just a theory I had on that.

Now...
fftobed:

 

[Fly]

I know you are all in bed right now, but I'm overseas on a diff time zone and had to post after all the discussion about 'signs' today. I just noticed a 'rivulet' of blood trickling down my foot from my ankle. Not as much as in the captiva, but I have no idea how it got there!

 

[PlainJaneDoe]

With the 156 watchers on board let's all hold cyber hands and say in harmony "JUSTICE FOR ALLISON".

I hope I can still join you...I was asleep when you posted. I am not so good at "verdict watch".