GUILTY CA - Gianni, 24, & Sal Belvedere, 22, Ilona Flint, 22, San Diego, 24 Dec 2013 - #3

[thebestinthewest]

I might be missing your point about the drugs in their system being somehow prescribed legally for some other reasons. How much did the doctor you spoke with know about this case? We can't ignore that according to LE's investigation what was revealed is that the drugs were being purchased on a steady basis illegally, and probably used as part of a drug habit. Is there some doubt about what the investigation uncovered?

MOO, I think it's somewhat unfair that the victims get labeled, and yet we know very little about CM, his drug inventory, his connections, life style, and activities. It will be even more unfair if drug use had nothing to do with why CM decided to practice being an assassin hitman.

He just started following the board he didn't know about it until a relative of the victims went into the clinic and mentioned it. That's all I know I am not sure how much he knows about the story or if he knows the victims or treated them.

 

[Barbarella]

He just started following the board he didn't know about it until a relative of the victims went into the clinic and mentioned it. That's all I know I am not sure how much he knows about the story or if he knows the victims or treated them.

Do you think that the victims families don't believe GB and IF were abusing drugs?

 

[TravelingBug]

So I just talked to someone who was reading the board that I know in real life that thought someone stole my identity to post on here because it seems very out of character for me to even use the Internet (not sure if I am offended or not) I'm hoping the person reading the board gets an account because he is a doctor with a practice in East County. But eureka! He made a very good point "What makes us think that the drugs in their systems was not prescribed to them for a car accident or something similar?" Opiates are hard to test the exact method of the opiate but certain things in certain medications are how they are tested such as the acetaminophen in Percocet which is 10mg or less of oxycoedine (oxycontin) but let's say someone is taking Tylenol with it and taking more than the recommended dose you can't be sure. I've heard that before on the development side of drug manufacturing but I think it's changed with the delivery device of oxycontin where the capsule is designed to be tamper resistant. When you are injured in a car accident or similar you will often be prescribed Xanax with your opiates. I am not sure of the victims medical history but it's still a good point

Ignoring what seems to have been pretty strong evidence that has LE certain of the history of the regular transactions to get drugs for it to even have come up...

Wouldn't LE look into/know that? :waitasec:

And if they didn't somehow and that even had the possibility of being a factor, wouldn't the family and/or doctors immediately go to LE / investigators / legal players once the drug issue was raised and inform them and/or ask them to ensure perhaps that anything actually prescribed wasn't somehow impacting results? Or ask them to retest or reexamine or do additional tests or something if it were possible a prescribed medication could possibly impact anything else showing up in results?

Although I'm unclear how that could really even be an issue since I know at least with doctors who deal with chronic/severe/long-term pain, you nearly always have to submit to random drug tests and/or bring in your meds periodically so they can be sure they aren't being abused / taken too often / taken with other drugs (prescription or not) etc. And in most of those cases you also sign some sort of contract/agreement/etc.

If doctors can discern that much from the far less extensive testing, I'd think an ME and investigators would certainly be able to determine even more (as in anything prescription based or even just things in particular combinations)

Especially since that scenario would mean that'd have to be the case with more than just one of them, which seems even less improbable, no?

 

[TravelingBug]

He just started following the board he didn't know about it until a relative of the victims went into the clinic and mentioned it. That's all I know I am not sure how much he knows about the story or if he knows the victims or treated them.

Ok, admittedly I'm a little confused, but it's 4 am so...hey

He didn't know about the case or he didn't know about the board

As in what is the "it" he didn't know about until the relative told him?

My brain is sleepy and I took "it" differently upon a second reread :crazy:

 

[Curious Me]

Man accused in triple murder to undergo mental competency exam
http://www.cbs8.com/story/26555338/man-accused-in-triple-murder-to-undergo-mental-competency-exam

"Also on Wednesday, Erickson filed two stipulations ordering DNA testing on evidence in the case, including an "ulta high voltage stun gun" found in Mercado's Mira Mesa garage, as well as a Bic lighter and black wristwatch found in Mercado's white SUV. The parties stipulated the items be tested at an independent lab in Virginia because it is likely the DNA analysis "would consume the entirety of the items."

BBM

Interesting. These items were not listed in the 'receipt and inventory' list for warrant #47060 (Mercado's house and vehicle). There was a watch listed from the SUV but it was a "Counter Culture" which I thought was a Casio G-Shock, not a Mossimo which is sold at Target.

The order for the DNA testing does not state where the items were seized from (and nothing was said at the hearing). Could Mercado have had them on his person when he was arrested? Sounds like there may have been blood on the watch.

From the order:

1. Evidence item barcode 10385816: Black "Mossimo" wristwatch with black elastic band and red-brown stains on the back;
2. Evidence item barcode 10382552: "PHX-800 Ultra High Voltage" stun gun; and,
3. Evidence item barcode 10388114: Pink Bic Lighter.
http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/kfmb/misc/dna_01.pdf

And here's the order for the testing of the .22 caliber Ruger handgun, silencer and two magazines: http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/kfmb/misc/dna_02.pdf.

Could he have used that stun gun? What are everyone's thoughts on whether he used the stun gun to subdue Gianni?

The pink lighter and wristwatch band which sounds like it had blood on it found in the white SUV?

LE never got to interrogate him as far as I know. BBM

 

[jash]

Could he have used that stun gun? What are everyone's thoughts on whether he used the stun gun to subdue Gianni?

The pink lighter and wristwatch band which sounds like it had blood on it found in the white SUV?

LE never got to interrogate him as far as I know. BBM

These specific items, and whatever the blood analysis/DNA might show, must be very important to the case (the order is signed by the DA, the defense attorney and the judge, with the prosecution and defense splitting the cost for the independent testing). I assume the DA/LE believe the items played a role in the crime.

So if the stun gun was used, I think it's more likely that it was used on Gianni (based on what we know about Sal and Ilona's crime scene, I don't see where it would fit in). I wonder if the autopsy could show marks from the stun gun, given that it took 3 weeks to locate Gianni's body.

From the warrants released, we know that Gianni called his cousin MD at 23:33 (MD believed GB was at the mall waiting to pick up Ilona). 9 minutes into their conversation, GB asks MD to wait or hold on, and then the call was disconnected. MD called back but there was no answer (per the warrants, GB's phone was turned off at 23:43). The fact that MD didn't hear anything in the background just before the call was disconnected (e.g. talking, a struggle for the phone) has always niggled at me.

I picture Gianni sitting in his car in the mall parking lot, maybe with the window down, calling his cousin to pass the time until Ilona gets off work. He must see or hear something (I'm guessing someone approached his car) which prompts him to tell his cousin to hold on. Whatever happened next, happened quickly (and relatively silently). Shortly thereafter, the call is disconnected/the phone is turned off.

If the stun gun was used on Gianni at that point, there must have been a reason to want him alive, at least momentarily. Otherwise why not just shoot him, like Ilona and Sal? After all, Ilona was shot while she was on the phone (and her phone was not turned off or taken). :thinking:

By the way, do we know what kind of phone Gianni had? Whoever disabled/turned off his phone knew how to do so quickly. IIRC, the phones seized from the Mercado residence were Samsung. (I have a Samsung and whenever I have to use an iPhone I'm totally lost).

 

[SDHELPS]

:goodpost: jash...yes this! It makes perfect sense that the stun gun would be used on GB just as you described. I'm not sure if any marks it might have left on GB would be identified due to the decomposition but perhaps the ME did note something in the autopsy that would indicate a stun gun was used. Of course the public is not privy to a lot of info that LE has.

Hitting the "thanks" button was not enough :tyou:

 

[tvscum]

These specific items, and whatever the blood analysis/DNA might show, must be very important to the case (the order is signed by the DA, the defense attorney and the judge, with the prosecution and defense splitting the cost for the independent testing). I assume the DA/LE believe the items played a role in the crime.

So if the stun gun was used, I think it's more likely that it was used on Gianni (based on what we know about Sal and Ilona's crime scene, I don't see where it would fit in). I wonder if the autopsy could show marks from the stun gun, given that it took 3 weeks to locate Gianni's body.

From the warrants released, we know that Gianni called his cousin MD at 23:33 (MD believed GB was at the mall waiting to pick up Ilona). 9 minutes into their conversation, GB asks MD to wait or hold on, and then the call was disconnected. MD called back but there was no answer (per the warrants, GB's phone was turned off at 23:43). The fact that MD didn't hear anything in the background just before the call was disconnected (e.g. talking, a struggle for the phone) has always niggled at me.

I picture Gianni sitting in his car in the mall parking lot, maybe with the window down, calling his cousin to pass the time until Ilona gets off work. He must see or hear something (I'm guessing someone approached his car) which prompts him to tell his cousin to hold on. Whatever happened next, happened quickly (and relatively silently). Shortly thereafter, the call is disconnected/the phone is turned off.

If the stun gun was used on Gianni at that point, there must have been a reason to want him alive, at least momentarily. Otherwise why not just shoot him, like Ilona and Sal? After all, Ilona was shot while she was on the phone (and her phone was not turned off or taken). :thinking:

By the way, do we know what kind of phone Gianni had? Whoever disabled/turned off his phone knew how to do so quickly. IIRC, the phones seized from the Mercado residence were Samsung. (I have a Samsung and whenever I have to use an iPhone I'm totally lost).

I think this is a routine DNA check of items found. The defense and prosecution signed off on an independent lab because they though there would only be enough DNA to one test. In that case, both sides stipulate to an independent lab because the defense typically doesn't want the test done at the SDPD lab.

 

[geevee]

So I just talked to someone who was reading the board that I know in real life that thought someone stole my identity to post on here because it seems very out of character for me to even use the Internet (not sure if I am offended or not) I'm hoping the person reading the board gets an account because he is a doctor with a practice in East County. But eureka! He made a very good point "What makes us think that the drugs in their systems was not prescribed to them for a car accident or something similar?" Opiates are hard to test the exact method of the opiate but certain things in certain medications are how they are tested such as the acetaminophen in Percocet which is 10mg or less of oxycoedine (oxycontin) but let's say someone is taking Tylenol with it and taking more than the recommended dose you can't be sure. I've heard that before on the development side of drug manufacturing but I think it's changed with the delivery device of oxycontin where the capsule is designed to be tamper resistant. When you are injured in a car accident or similar you will often be prescribed Xanax with your opiates. I am not sure of the victims medical history but it's still a good point

BBM

So you're known as 'thebestinthewest' in real life? lol

From the search warrants it seems LE has other info about their drug use, dealers and such, and not just the autopsy/tox results.

 

[thebestinthewest]

I might be missing your point about the drugs in their system being somehow prescribed legally for some other reasons. How much did the doctor you spoke with know about this case? We can't ignore that according to LE's investigation what was revealed is that the drugs were being purchased on a steady basis illegally, and probably used as part of a drug habit. Is there some doubt about what the investigation uncovered?

MOO, I think it's somewhat unfair that the victims get labeled, and yet we know very little about CM, his drug inventory, his connections, life style, and activities. It will be even more unfair if drug use had nothing to do with why CM decided to practice being an assassin hitman.

Sorry I was at a wedding and typing on my lap. Always the bridesmaid never the bride lol the point if I remember right was they may have been prescribed the meds in their systems. More than likely they did have some of the drugs prescribed to them but tolerances build fast as do addictions. Imo it wouldn't be far fetched that CM posted an ad on Craigslist selling Xanax or whatever and Gianni replied to keep from coming down during the holiday time? I only thought of that when I saw someone selling other drugs in the beauty and health section. Also I wonder if Ilona had to pass a drug test to work at Cathy Jean, she worked their for 4 months prior to the shooting. It just drives me crazy trying to figure out why CM did this to these people in particular.

Ok, admittedly I'm a little confused, but it's 4 am so...hey

He didn't know about the case or he didn't know about the board

As in what is the "it" he didn't know about until the relative told him?

My brain is sleepy and I took "it" differently upon a second reread :crazy:

 

[Curious Me]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought Gianni already had a connection introduced from his cousin to get Xanax, and did that night. Why would he be foolish enough to try to purchase drugs via craigslist, as that's an easy way to get busted? I don't know, Best, why CM went after them. I guess anything is possible, but the way the investigation revealed the drug use of the victims does seem to indicate they investigated that the most, at least in the beginning. Letting the public know about the victim's drug use with no other info on the suspected killer leaves this in limbo for awhile.

All just my own thoughts.

 

[thebestinthewest]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought Gianni already had a connection introduced from his cousin to get Xanax, and did that night. Why would he be foolish enough to try to purchase drugs via craigslist, as that's an easy way to get busted? I don't know, Best, why CM went after them. I guess anything is possible, but the way the investigation revealed the drug use of the victims does seem to indicate they investigated that the most, at least in the beginning. Letting the public know about the victim's drug use with no other info on the suspected killer leaves this in limbo for awhile.

All just my own thoughts.

Best way to say it! The one drug dealer had nothing to do with them his DNA was found on a baggie I just don't see why they felt it necessary to release that. I can't help but imagine if CM would not have been pulled over on Jan 18 would LE have indicted the father? Can you imagine?

 

[Barbarella]

Best way to say it! The one drug dealer had nothing to do with them his DNA was found on a baggie I just don't see why they felt it necessary to release that. I can't help but imagine if CM would not have been pulled over on Jan 18 would LE have indicted the father? Can you imagine?

According to police, GB met with the female drug dealer (can't remember her name) to purchase heroin that night at about 7pm. He later met with Chance Feller at about 11pm to purchase Xanax. (GB was introduced to CF by Gianni's cousin MD - who GB was on the phone with at 11:30pm before the conversation abruptly ended). CF would have been the last person known to see GB alive. So, my point is that it seems GB would not need to get drugs from Craigslist. He had already met with his connections that night.

And as for the baggie with cocaine found outside the car in Mission Valley, they traced the fingerprints back to coke dealer Derek Padilla. Police had to investigate him to make sure he wasn't the murderer. But, the other two drug dealers did have contact with GB that night. So, again, I don't see why GB would seek someone out on Craigslist to buy drugs. He was already well connected with 3 known drug dealers.

 

[tvscum]

According to police, GB met with the female drug dealer (can't remember her name) to purchase heroin that night at about 7pm. He later met with Chance Feller at about 11pm to purchase Xanax. (GB was introduced to CF by Gianni's cousin MD - who GB was on the phone with at 11:30pm before the conversation abruptly ended). CF would have been the last person known to see GB alive. So, my point is that it seems GB would not need to get drugs from Craigslist. He had already met with his connections that night.

And as for the baggie with cocaine found outside the car in Mission Valley, they traced the fingerprints back to coke dealer Derek Padilla. Police had to investigate him to make sure he wasn't the murderer. But, the other two drug dealers did have contact with GB that night. So, again, I don't see why GB would seek someone out on Craigslist to buy drugs. He was already well connected with 3 known drug dealers.

The warrant says nothing about the relative being cousin MD.

"FELLER told Detective VALENTIN he knew Gianni because he was introduced to him by one of Gianni's relatives. The reason for their introduction was so that FELLER could supply Gianni with controlled substances."

http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/kfmb/misc/x_warrant.pdf

 

[jggordo]

So it seems that cousin MD introduced GM to Chance Feller. He was also the previous owner (manager) of the restaurant before GM's father bought it back. And also the person on the phone with Gianni before being disconnected, and knowing his whereabouts at the time more so than even Ilona or Sal. That conversation roughly 30 minutes after buying the Xanax from the dealer he introduced Gianni to.

I appears to me that drugs run a little farther in the family than initially anticipated and more intertwined.

JMO's

 

[Barbarella]

The warrant says nothing about the relative being cousin MD.

"FELLER told Detective VALENTIN he knew Gianni because he was introduced to him by one of Gianni's relatives. The reason for their introduction was so that FELLER could supply Gianni with controlled substances."

http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/kfmb/misc/x_warrant.pdf

The search warrant DOES say the relative/cousin was MD. See search warrant # 46712 - it states "The last call Gianni is known to have made was to his cousin Mario Donato."

http://www.cbs8.com/story/26453781/...dealers-investigated-in-christmas-eve-murders

 

[nikb]

This isn't a response to anything, just falls at random, but I think it's so odd in this case that there's been such a quick "NO, DRUGS AREN'T INVOLVED!" reaction. Maybe they are, maybe they aren't, I have no idea - but it makes more sense to me than most of the possibilities. I'm not thinking the drug dealer's word is all that reliable either, but I mean, the stuff was found in their systems and/or on them. I am not judging them for it - actually I feel really bad for them. Addiction is a horrible thing that happens to far too many people. But if it's not drug related, all three of them just got randomly shot to death on Christmas Eve? The whole thing is just weird.

 

[its_me]

Been lurking for awhile....just like to point out that I am hearing that the family had no idea that GB and IF were involved in drugs, but then it was reported that a "family member" introduced GB to someone to buy Xanax? Seems that the drug use was not a secret, at least with extended family.

 

[thebestinthewest]

Been lurking for awhile....just like to point out that I am hearing that the family had no idea that GB and IF were involved in drugs, but then it was reported that a "family member" introduced GB to someone to buy Xanax? Seems that the drug use was not a secret, at least with extended family.

Correct.

 

[thebestinthewest]

My app keeps messing up my messages and when I try to
scroll back to see my old messages to clarify it tells me I don't have permission so if I sound out of it or drunk
recently that's why :/