Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #91

[Crazy4having3]

Some people here are saying they don't think there is anymore audio or video to release-but I recall LE near the beginning of the investigation saying something to the effect that the rest of the recording was "the thing nightmares are made of ", or something to that effect. I could be wrong...but that really sticks in my mind.

Last night I re-listened to the 2 part pod that True Crime Garage did on this case. They mention this as well. They seemed pretty adamant that there was at least 6 minutes of audio but probably more.

 

[cody22]

If they had a search warrant. But there would have to be probable cause for a judge to sign off on that.

Thank you....moo

 

[Yellow Rose]

I just can't understand how if the sketches were done at the same time, why does one show FLAT, STRAIGHT hair while the other shows KINKY, CURLY hair? It just doesn't want to compute with me. The only thing that comes to mind to me is sitting there in the morning in my bathroom with a flatiron straightening my hair and then it starts raining outside and my hair (which is naturally curly) immediately kinks up.

 

[matt johnson]

Hi All,

I’m from Australia, it just so happens I’m in Law enforcement and have experience with the Policing side of Homicides.

I can across this case from a podcast a few weeks ago, since then I’ve followed along to see how it progresses.

I’ve read a lot of responses from contributors on this thread. Fortunately I can clear a few things up, but unfortunately most of the cyber detectives are over analysing.

Remember this, ‘finding’ out who did this crime is half the process. The main process is ensuring a criminal conviction for police.

Therefore, the general public and even the victims families ARE NOT entitled or should be presented with evidence or possible suspects under any circumstances.

All evidence released, including sketches, audio, video, and in this case car siting, is to be done with a specific outcome in mind. e.g produce leads, further evidence, new suspects etc.

I saw people post, “why not release all the audio?”

Well... why, it obviously won’t help produce new leads. And/or the remaining audio evidence could taint jury if released. I understand you want to here and see the evidence, but bluntly, you have no right and all general public are to be treated as possible suspects/witnesses. Remember you aren’t trained investigators.

Finally, I watched the press conference and found it fascinating.

The press conference was directly aimed at speaking to the killer. My guess would be they have a short list of suspects or may even know 98% who it is.

Everything said in that press con was scripted by a FBI Profiler. It is designed to agitate and provoke the killer in to acting differently or saying something to someone that makes them stand out.

I’d also guess they may even have suspects under physical surveillance or recording devices.

Remember again, ITS ALL ABOUT THE CONVICTION. So they may only need some final concrete pieces of evidence.

That would fit in perfectly with the fact it was only 7 weeks ago they had the anniversary press con.

It’s sounds to me like things are very close.

- new audio, need another witness to come forward after recognise.
- new video, same reason as above.
- press con, push killer to say something on phone or start acting erratic, people notice.
- car siting, May need another witness to place killer in car earlier or leaving car. DNA.

My guess is that it was a random event, killer was probably driving past and saw them. Car won’t be registered so that is the reason it can’t be traced back to him and he dumped it. Killers act on impulse, very rare they plan.

Hopefully that helps! Be confident in the police, they are the experts. Let them do their jobs. Time to celebrate will be after the court hearings.

Thanks from Aus!

 

[Peppery]

I don't either. And I am having flashbacks of people in trees, trucks in the creek bed, ...

Ahhhhh, don’t bring that up!!! The levitating man in the trees made me leave this thread for a long time. Along with the puppy, exposing himself and RL.

 

[Boxer]

On the previous thread last night I was reading about how maybe the press conference was not directed to a particular killer in mind, but a profile of one. What if that is why the parents left upset/possible angry....so disappointed that there was in fact no real news after expecting a break through. Maybe LE is trying a totally different tactic to generate publicity. Let's use a sketch that could look like BG if he changed after the murders - shaved, lost weight, grew his hair - or wore a disguise. The sketch of him looking like BG is not working. Use a profile of killers - many insert themselves - and describe him very personally like it's not just a profile so people really think about who they know. Release a tiny bit more audio and video so people study it again. Be very emotional to get viewers invested. Charge people up to really think about outside of the box about who could have done this and not dismiss a friend/family member because he seemed too young, too skinny, too nice, etc. Could it all have been a ploy to drum up interest again? Or is that just crazy thinking?

I would agree with you except, they just had a press conference in February 2019.
So even if they are just approaching this investigation with the same old information they seem energized by having a new direction in their hunt.
And hopefully a bit of new evidence has actually come to their hands.

 

[Trudie]

I don’t think we can tell that from a sketch that could be flawed. And it seems LE would tell us that if it were a certainty or even probable.

I think they would have corrected the eye, if they didn’t think it looks the way sketched.

 

[Madison418]

In the new photo, besides the hair what ONE or two things stands out as PROMINENT to everyone? What would a witness have made a point to detail about his face? I’m curious to know your thoughts.

I think it sort of depends on whether a person has a distinctive feature or not. Distinctive meaning uncommon in general or uncommon for the demographic of the area. Given that this guy seems like the common demographic and nothing appears overly distinctive, I think I would notice the eyes first and foremost

 

[cody22]

I just can't understand how if the sketches were done at the same time, why does one show FLAT, STRAIGHT hair while the other shows KINKY, CURLY hair? It just doesn't want to compute with me. The only thing that comes to mind to me is sitting there in the morning in my bathroom with a flatiron straightening me hair and then it starts raining outside and my hair (which is naturally curly) immediately kinks up.

A hair net worn under that baseball cap ???....moo

 

[dotr]

Random thought/observation: I think the new sketch looks like a pompous frat boy.

So do I.

 

[TTF14]

Just posting this link as it has a google map and the location of the abandoned building where the car was interest was parked, if anyone’s interested. It’s reportedly a five minute walk to the trail system.

Community hopeful after new images, audio released of suspected Delphi killer

On that topic, just my thoughts.....For the first five months LE released no sketch. LE obviously hoped the photos and the audio would lead to an arrest. So then in July/17 came the first sketch, reportedly one or more witnesses only recently came forward claiming they remembered seeing the guy walking on the trail.

Now the latest sketch and LEs interest in this car that was parked but curiously, they’re not giving a description of it, no make, no model, not even the colour. The potential witness appears not to have been walking on the trail at all, rather someone who noticed the driver of this parked car for some reason. This is the “new direction” IMO. LE now have reason to believe the driver of this car committed the murders. That’s huge - if the witness saw what the driver looked like LE surely know a lot of information about the ID of the car as well.

“Indiana State Police say they are looking for the driver of a vehicle parked at the old CPS/DCS/Welfare building that was abandoned on the east side of CR 300 N next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway between noon and 5 p.m. Feb. 13, 2017. That's the day 14-year-old Libby and 13-year-old Abby went missing. Their bodies were found the next day just out of sight of the bridge. Police did not give a description of the vehicle.”
Community hopeful after new images, audio released of suspected Delphi killer

“The sketch released on Monday was drawn by Bryant on Feb. 17, 2017, a few days after the victims' bodies were found. The picture was based on the description of a person who saw something that the person felt needed to be reported, according to Bryant....”
Delphi murders: New sketch of killer, video from Libby's phone released

Trudie's post about the men having a rendezvous in the park got me thinking of this angle. I haven't personally witnessed two men going at it in a park, but I have observed the meetup several times. This is done all over the place and nobody really notices because they are not looking for it.

Maybe "John" and BG met online, on an app, on Craigslist, etc. Never shared real names, just chose a place and time to meet up for sex. Or even to buy/sell drugs. Something shady, anyway. After the girls are found, John decides he better contact LE and tell them he was there that day just to clear himself, and gives him a description and sketch of the guy he met up with. Tells him BG parked near that abandoned building, but he doesn't know what kind of car he was driving because he parked elsewhere and they met up at X location (shack?). LE doesn't think all that much of this since they were meeting up to see each other, not the girls. But John can't stop thinking about this guy because of what happened, and it's been nagging at him that the guys he met up with could be the killer. After all, he just zipped up his pants (or bought the drugs, whatever), and left. He has no clue what BG did after he left. He stays quiet for a while because he already did give that tip and it's not like he wants to be outed for whatever shady he was doing that day with BG. But eventually he goes back to LE with some information he omitted/failed to mention the first time......and it's exactly what LE needs to realize his rendezvous partner and BG ARE one and the same and that original sketch is the killer/more accurate sketch.

 

[Bellecent]

LE says the suspect is between 18 and 40. I haven't followed this case much but just watching the video I feel like his clothing, walk and voice make him seem closer to 40 or even older than 40, his jeans, jacket and hat seem like clothing a more middle aged person would wear.

But maybe this is what he wears when he plans on committing a crime. To throw off authorities. Since the last edit sketch shows a clean cut person. Have they circulated a phito to the hair salons? This person would need to get a trim what monthly? A case from my hometown the guy was a regular customer at a salon in the next town. That didn't solve the case but just saying by the recent sketch it seems this person is out and about in a community so he is going to the gas station, convenience store, work, college somewhere. I don't think he is hiding out.

 

[insatiable]

Did LE give details on his complexion, hair or eye color?

 

[holtzmann]

Hi All,

I’m from Australia, it just so happens I’m in Law enforcement and have experience with the Policing side of Homicides.

I wish I could quote this entire post a million times.

Thank you for backing up my suspicion that this is a final push for concrete grounds of arrest and conviction — I think we are very close.

 

[Jerrod]

Ahhhhh, don’t bring that up!!! The levitating man in the trees made me leave this thread for a long time. Along with the puppy, exposing himself and RL.

Don't forget the carpenter's square in BG's pants and the meth lab under the bridge!

 

[Peppery]

I just can't understand how if the sketches were done at the same time, why does one show FLAT, STRAIGHT hair while the other shows KINKY, CURLY hair? It just doesn't want to compute with me. The only thing that comes to mind to me is sitting there in the morning in my bathroom with a flatiron straightening me hair and then it starts raining outside and my hair (which is naturally curly) immediately kinks up.

I don’t think they were drawn at the same time. Original sketch was developed after months of investigation, new sketch was actually drawn 2/17/17, 3-4 days after witness saw him.

 

[Suglo]

I've been here from the beginning but don't remember ever hearing it was a work day. Does anyone else remember as AB does? TIA.

I do but very early on and it was only said once that I can recall. Someone linked the school calendar where it said it was an inservice day for the teachers.

 

[Peppery]

So where does everyone think the Trooper saw the killer?

They had to see them at the time wearing no cap.

Tia

It wasn’t the trooper who saw him, trooper is the sketch artist is how I understood it.

 

[Mercedes]

The chin stands out for me....moo

A very long nose and the little eye.

 

[GordianKnot]

Hi All,

I’m from Australia, it just so happens I’m in Law enforcement and have experience with the Policing side of Homicides.

I can across this case from a podcast a few weeks ago, since then I’ve followed along to see how it progresses.

I’ve read a lot of responses from contributors on this thread. Fortunately I can clear a few things up, but unfortunately most of the cyber detectives are over analysing.

Remember this, ‘finding’ out who did this crime is half the process. The main process is ensuring a criminal conviction for police.

Therefore, the general public and even the victims families ARE NOT entitled or should be presented with evidence or possible suspects under any circumstances.

All evidence released, including sketches, audio, video, and in this case car siting, is to be done with a specific outcome in mind. e.g produce leads, further evidence, new suspects etc.

I saw people post, “why not release all the audio?”

Well... why, it obviously won’t help produce new leads. And/or the remaining audio evidence could taint jury if released. I understand you want to here and see the evidence, but bluntly, you have no right and all general public are to be treated as possible suspects/witnesses. Remember you aren’t trained investigators.

Finally, I watched the press conference and found it fascinating.

The press conference was directly aimed at speaking to the killer. My guess would be they have a short list of suspects or may even know 98% who it is.

Everything said in that press con was scripted by a FBI Profiler. It is designed to agitate and provoke the killer in to acting differently or saying something to someone that makes them stand out.

I’d also guess they may even have suspects under physical surveillance or recording devices.

Remember again, ITS ALL ABOUT THE CONVICTION. So they may only need some final concrete pieces of evidence.

That would fit in perfectly with the fact it was only 7 weeks ago they had the anniversary press con.

It’s sounds to me like things are very close.

- new audio, need another witness to come forward after recognise.
- new video, same reason as above.
- press con, push killer to say something on phone or start acting erratic, people notice.
- car siting, May need another witness to place killer in car earlier or leaving car. DNA.

My guess is that it was a random event, killer was probably driving past and saw them. Car won’t be registered so that is the reason it can’t be traced back to him and he dumped it. Killers act on impulse, very rare they plan.

Hopefully that helps! Be confident in the police, they are the experts. Let them do their jobs. Time to celebrate will be after the court hearings.


Thanks from Aus!

BBM:
Welcome to WS!

Phenomenal first post!

Thanks for providing your professional insights and observations as a LEO.
You made a number of terrific, informative points.
Completely agreed with everything in your post, especially the bolded portions.

Professional LEOs like yourself are highly valued here.
Thank you again for your presence and active participation in the discussion.

JMO.