ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 23

[drmrgrl]

I know there have been a lot of theories that mention the skill set of the murder. Were they experienced, were they sloppy and careless. To be honest to go into a house and murder four people, two each on two separate floors, not wake up the others in the house and escape into the darkness without a sight would seem to that there was some kind of experience involved. But, what if the murder just got lucky, what if everything just fell into place that enabled them to be able do what they did? Is it possible this was a first timer who had, for lack of a better term, beginners luck and might that emblazon them to do this again?

IMO, there is no skill set involved in using a knife when someone is in a rage. Think OJ, NBS, and RG

 

[Nash2019]

Alot going on. I keep going back to sick individual from the apartment complex with infatuation and got in over his head. Killer doesnt show up with only a knife intending to kill 4 imo. Why was K in M's room, did she walk in on assault. Did killer try to assault M and didnt know both girls were in her room and had to kill them both. Did killer go to assault K and found both in M's room. Does K being back in town spark opportunity and make her the target. Why wasnt there a party going on at the house that night,(Homecoming football game going on), does that spark opportunity. Was there a conflict the weeks prior at a house party and they calmed it down. Also being around halloween you know they had parties. And that brings up another topic. Halloween was 2 weeks prior, alot of new movies had come out and it may have inspired someone

The Bundy documentary also recently released

 

[seasideForest]

It occurred to me that LE is downplaying the pups role in this for whatever reason. It could be Murphy was loose and covered in blood. Victims and perps...maybe LE wants the perp to think they didn't find anything on him to tie him to the crime. Murphy may have been a quiet shy guy and didn't raise a stink when the murders were happening, but I can guarantee after 8 or so hours in a crate or closed off room, he would have smelled the blood and would instinctively be going nuts to find the source. JMO

Murphy was not covered in blood. There was an LE statement on that yesterday ? / the day before? I suppose I'd better go and look for it... Post 224 on media thread: Press Release from Dec. 5th, Moscow Police Dept https://www.ci.moscow.id.us/DocumentCenter/View/24875/12-05-22-Moscow-Homicide-Update

"There have been numerous requests about the dog found at the residence on the
morning of November 13th. Arriving officers entered the residence and found the
deceased victims. During the search of the home, a dog was found in a room where the
crimes had not been committed. Officers did not find any evidence on the dog and there
was no indication the animal had entered the crime scene. The dog was taken to Animal
Services and released to a responsible person." BBM

 

[NuttMegg]

Idaho is in the Pacific Northwest next to Washington State

Yeah, i grew up there, I know. The OP said Idaho is on the coast by Cali.

No importa.

 

[alex dvport]

Thank you for this clarification. Mentally ill, but for judicial purposes, not necessarily insane? I think?

Psychology doesn’t recognize the term insanity. That’s definitely a judicial term and rarely recognized by the courts. I just don’t see this killer being declared insane by the courts, but I could be wrong.

 

[Sunny Day]

I believe I read that a previous tenant, who had at one time lived in the first floor room, said that he could not hear anything going on in the upstairs areas.

 

[seemstome]

Maybe one of the two girls had a known or hardly known ‘guest’ over for the night whom (she) let into the house and slept with, but he left early in the am - before they woke and found and called in the ‘unconscious’ victim. Maybe she didn’t want to identify him because she was in shock and protecting him or protecting her parents from the info that she slept with him (or anyone) or is afraid of him now. Maybe she put two and two together and surmised that the killer gained entry to the house by romancing her that night, and when he got up, she thought nothing of it, nor did it surprise her when he moved around the home or took a shower and changed his clothes 20 minutes after getting up. Maybe these two girls are in a witness protection program right now. Idk just speculating.

 

[alex dvport]

There are a lot of things in the DSM that aren't actually formally mental illnesses. There's big debate in the forensic psychiatry community about whether or not antisocial personality disorder should even be included in the DSM. Most criminals are not mentally ill. Some criminals have a mental illness (such as anxiety or depression), but the mental illness does not make them commit the crime. Sometimes, criminality is criminality.

You’re right! I should have said that they had mental illness not mentally ill. That was poor execution on my part. I’ll correct.

 

[EmmieA]

Incredible amount of info and details. And your last paragraph is spot on. It’s already gone cold…and like the Delphi case will get icy (if) before anyone is apprehended.

A three week old case that has local, state & FBI resources is not a cold case!

I don’t understand the high expectations here. I have no doubt that LE is doing everything they can to solve this case. Do you think they like having an open unsolved mass murder on their books?!

MOO

 

[HopeValleyDevil]

A quick, quiet, stealthy kill is a skill.

Stabbed four people with a knife without waking others up, or allowing victims to scream.

Left two downstairs alive.

How long does that take to stab and kill four people without waking others?

#1122 #king #moscow

 

[CeeMDubs]

I know there have been a lot of theories that mention the skill set of the murder. Were they experienced, were they sloppy and careless. To be honest to go into a house and murder four people, two each on two separate floors, not wake up the others in the house and escape into the darkness without a sight would seem to that there was some kind of experience involved. But, what if the murder just got lucky, what if everything just fell into place that enabled them to be able do what they did? Is it possible this was a first timer who had, for lack of a better term, beginners luck and might that emblazon them to do this again?

I’ve speculated as such. The murderer may be sitting back in awe that he has gotten away with this so far. He may have been prepared to get caught, or go down in a hail of bullets, but it hasn’t worked out that way. It’s such a risky crime that it’s hard to imagine intricately planning this and expecting to walk away scot free. I’m inclined to believe the opposite-that this was a sloppy, impulsive act and he’s just gotten extremely lucky.

It’s certainly not impossible that this was a more thorough and planned operation, but I see sloppy and impulsive (and lucky) as more likely. JMO

 

[HopeValleyDevil]

I’ve speculated as such. The murderer may be sitting back in awe that he has gotten away with this so far. He may have been prepared to get caught, or go down in a hail of bullets, but it hasn’t worked out that way. It’s such a risky crime that it’s hard to imagine intricately planning this and expecting to walk away scot free. I’m inclined to believe the opposite-that this was a sloppy, impulsive act and he’s just gotten extremely lucky.

It’s certainly not impossible that this was a more thorough and planned operation, but I see sloppy and impulsive (and lucky) as more likely. JMO

If I was the perpetrator I wouldn't be sitting back just yet. Contemporary technology is going to build a picture of the perpetrator pretty fast.

DNA analysis must be eliminating suspects.

More so if they have criminal history.

Killing four people with a knife, not waking others and not having a criminal history - mmmm. imoo

#1122 #king #queen #moscow

King Road Homicides | Moscow, ID

www.ci.moscow.id.us

 

[Strong1]

IMO, there is no skill set involved in using a knife when someone is in a rage. Think OJ, NBS, and RG

I would agree if this was a single murder, but multiple murders in multiple locations? The killer may have raged against one victim, but then the rest turned into carry overs or thrill type of killings? Maybe all were thrill type killings? Raging against all four victims seems like a lot. But anything is possible.

 

[Trino]

Maybe one of the two girls had a known or hardly known ‘guest’ over for the night whom (she) let into the house and slept with, but he left early in the am - before they woke and found and called in the ‘unconscious’ victim. Maybe she didn’t want to identify him because she was in shock and protecting him or protecting her parents from the info that she slept with him (or anyone) or is afraid of him now. Maybe she put two and two together and surmised that the killer gained entry to the house by romancing her that night, and when he got up, she thought nothing of it, nor did it surprise her when he moved around the home or took a shower and changed his clothes 20 minutes after getting up. Maybe these two girls are in a witness protection program right now. Idk just speculating.

Who are the surviving roommates in Idaho?


DM and BF were named for the first time as the two University of Idaho students who survived the quadruple homicide that claimed the lives of their friends on Nov. 13.1 day ago. They gave statements Dec 5.

<mod note - please use only initials for the surviving roommates>

 

[hopewell]

There are a lot of things in the DSM that aren't actually formally mental illnesses. There's big debate in the forensic psychiatry community about whether or not antisocial personality disorder should even be included in the DSM. Most criminals are not mentally ill. Some criminals have a mental illness (such as anxiety or depression), but the mental illness does not make them commit the crime. Sometimes, criminality is criminality.

Indeed, a personality disorder is Axis II (DSM-IV) or a 'clustered' pathology (DSM-5) and is not a mental illness.

My opinion.

 

[drmrgrl]

If I was drunk and came home the first thing I would do is probably let the dog out to use the bathroom and then when the dog came back inside I would probably get really close to the dogs face and pet it. I have a hard time believing K and M came home after the bar and just ignored the dog or put the dog in a separate room from themselves. I would guess the killer or someone else placed this dog in the separate room which LE reported on December 5.

IMO, K may have placed the dog in her room and then went to sleep in Ms room. I have a sneaking suspicion tho, that the dog was extremely anxious, panting, whining and that’s why K slept in Ms room to begin with. I also suspect that the women slept in the same room together to feel safer or to sleep away from the whining dog. Sometimes, there is a lag in “ intuition” and sometimes things that are amiss don’t immediately register with the conscious mind. Although Goncalves family says that K and M would call 911 if they sensed danger, the conscious connection wasn’t made and the girls went to bed not knowing their fate.

 

[docfishbone28]

Another possibility.
What exactly was discussed in the convo at the food truck between JS and the other guy. Were they talking about the girls. Maybe someone there over heard JS explaining how one of the girls boyfriends was out of town and he was just there looking over them. Maybe explaining who these girls were and how they have known each other since they were yay high and they have the house over off king with all the parties. Maybe someone there overheard all this and took advantage

 

[PolarButterflie]

Yah it's definitely a big hunter area. Idaho is on the west coast next to California, but it along with Northern California are more akin culturally to the southern rural areas of the US. A lot of of country folks who hunt, fish etc.

I am posting a map just to correct a small geographical mistake. Idaho is not on the west coast and does not share a border with California.

 

[clearskies1]

I still think it was most likely a failed sexual assault with three of the victims killed because they were potential witnesses. Very difficult to solve if it's basically a stranger. Seems there were not many or any cameras in the area of the home. I fully believe that LE is doing their best.

 

[Liora Bentley]

Bottom line for me is still, what type of person even does this? If they are not well acquainted with human anatomy (a large number of people) then it's just "doing whatever they feel" at the time. But if they wanted a quick kill, abdomen is not the way to go for a person with basic knowledge of human anatomy. Upper torso includes heart and lungs - but lungs by themselves don't cause instant death. Almost sounds like "learning by doing"

Whether it was a planned killing or a rage induced spree, either way stabbing a person who is moving, possibly trying to fight for their life, in darkness would be a lot harder than someone could plan for.

Sorry if I've missed this - has LE released whether the victims all died where they were found? Were any of the bodies dragged?