10/28/11 Private Investigator Returns, Baby Lisas Family Leaves

They would have been better off hiring Tim Miller, Marc Klaas, John Walsh, or Beth Holloway as their "consultant". Oh, nevermind.....silly me. I forgot that those are people who actually want to find missing children, and we certainly can't have that.


have they not called tim miller? that always surprises me. I guess if I wanted to believe my child was definitely still living I might not even consider TES. I would really want answers though. I think.
 
would you let him run ahead of you if his baby sister had just gone missing?

I'm not being snarky - I honestly want to know. from you or anyone. I'm quite paranoid by nature - if one of mine went missing, I'd have a very difficult time letting the other out of my immediate reach for a very long time.

5 feet in front of me? 7 feet in front of me? 10 feet in front of me?

Absolutely.

20 feet if they were between me and our (presumably safe) front door with relatives inside?

Not a concern at all.

I'm not being snarky either, promise :)
 
I'm working very hard to keep myself on the fence, to not jump to conclusions every time I read something about these parents. It's really difficult because it is so easy to think they're guilty.

That being said, I think their problem is that they are uneducated, ignorant and for lack of a better term are hillbillies. Please don't take offense to that term but I really couldn't think of a better way to describe what I mean. I think they lack class and don't know much outside their little bubble. I think the mom initially lied to cover that she was drunk thinking that she'd be able to keep it to herself. I believe this is why she lied - is it detrimental to the investigation heck yes - did she think so at the time? I doubt it. I think she was so ashamed of being drunk, or worried about what people would think of her, that she was evasive and lied. I think she's up to something in her personal life that she's trying to prevent from being pulled out into the open. Again, is this detrimental to the case? Yes. Do I think she honestly realizes this? No. Do I give a dang about my thinking that she's acting like this to hide something - no I don't but most people would care and she knows this, especially now.

LE is looking for Lisa, the media is looking for dirt on her family. Not fair, but that's the way it is. Do I think they're guilty? I struggle with it. Do I think they do a piss-poor job of their public image? Absolutely. I really think she at this point is more concerned with making sure something is not uncovered in her life. That would explain the lie about the phone, the lie about the timeline, etc. Does this mean she harmed her daughter? No. She does lose out on the mom-of-the-year award though.

What does get me though is the cadaver dog's alert. I've never heard of a cadaver dog picking up the sent of clipped toenails and seems silly to me.

MOO.

BBM:
I don't think there was any alerting to clipped toenails by an HRD dog. I think that was just spin, for the sake of argument against HRD alerts.

If there was... then we got a serious problem with the dog(s) here.
 
Yes, and apparently the family is just walking from the car to the house in the photo? It's a very small distance, visible all the way, and you wouldn't expect for the children to come to any harm walking there. Nothing that walking between the parents would be likely to prevent anyway.

It would scare the children and make them think they're in grave danger if the parents suddenly started to insist that they must hold hands at all times.

The photo is just not an issue to me. Children of 6 and 8 have a mind of their own and even if the parents are inclined to keep them on a two-foot leash they'll take steps ahead and steps behind.

bbm see this is why I had to ask :blushing: I handhold mine til they're about 8, at least twas the case with the older - the younger is only 4 yet. well with these horribly narrow streets & sidewalks here with the busses literally 4 inches from your feet, I just cant stand the little one being out of reach while out.
 
No, she didn't walk up to the door on her own. She was with indepmo, as mentalsolstice correctly stated. Indepmo even posted about how he went to the house with her. Post 219: MSM coverage of Baby Lisa 10/28/11 - Page 9 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Even if the family didn't know what Indepmo's opinion of their innocence or guilt, certainly Tina Porter would have vetted whoever was accompanying her. If she was going with only good intentions of offering assistance, why would she be accompanied by someone who may have professed a belief that DB is guilty (again I apologize in I misunderstood Indepmo's post #9 in this thread, [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152914"]what are your thoughts now? *re-re-poll* - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]).
 
They would have been better off hiring Tim Miller, Marc Klaas, John Walsh, or Beth Holloway as their "consultant". Oh, nevermind.....silly me. I forgot that those are people who actually want to find missing children, and we certainly can't have that.

I wasn't aware these people had offered their services to the benefactor? I'll try to find a link.

:seeya:
 
BBM:
I don't think there was any alerting to clipped toenails by an HRD dog. I think that was just spin, for the sake of argument against HRD alerts.

If there was... then we got a serious problem with the dog(s) here.

Agree 110%.
 
I would like to clarify something..it was the statement of the poster I disagreed with,not the fact the family did not let her in-But I do think the family could have been a little kinder to her,instead of slamming the door in her face..Thank you!!
 
bbm see this is why I had to ask :blushing: I handhold mine til they're about 8, at least twas the case with the older - the younger is only 4 yet. well with these horribly narrow streets & sidewalks here with the busses literally 4 inches from your feet, I just cant stand the little one being out of reach while out.

I really think holding hands in their front yard is holding them to a very very rare standard of parental supervision. I mean, to read your post it sounds like you didn't allow your children to ride bikes, or have "races" with other kids in the park, or play soccer, which doesn't sound like it's probably right -

It's different if you are talking about navigating a very narrow busy alleyway - these kids are in their front yard, looks safe to me.
 
bbm see this is why I had to ask :blushing: I handhold mine til they're about 8, at least twas the case with the older - the younger is only 4 yet. well with these horribly narrow streets & sidewalks here with the busses literally 4 inches from your feet, I just cant stand the little one being out of reach while out.

Despite what I said, I don't think your children are scared because this is what you have always done, they're used to it, it's just a rule in your family.

But if they had been used to walking and running more freely and then suddenly their sister disappeared and consequently things changed it would be obvious to them that it's because of great fear.
 
I really think holding hands in their front yard is holding them to a very very rare standard of parental supervision. I mean, to read your post it sounds like you didn't allow your children to ride bikes, or have "races" with other kids in the park, or play soccer, which I know isn't true.

It's different if you are talking about navigating a very narrow busy alleyway - these kids are in their front yard, looks safe to me.

I can understand the difference if the front yard is on a very busy urban street, as opposed to a more quiet neighborhood street, as we have in this case.
 
I totally understand why they wanted to get out of there, guilty or not. I was having a conversation with my husband and brother last night and they were both so heated up and convinced that DB is guilty and think the husband is as well. They were actually talking about how they wished someone could just kidnap her and force her to talk, regardless of the consequences. Now, we are in another state, and neither my husband or my brother would ever actually do such a thing-it scares me that if they are just talking about it what if others are actually really thinking of doing something like that!


It is things like this that confirm my earlier thoughts that this family is in danger. There are quite a few people out there whose emotions are running high. People who are convinced of guilt by little more than their gut instinct. Who knows how many people think they should take the law into their own hands whether by kidnapping the boys to save them from their parents or kidnapping and torturing the parents in the false hope of finding the baby? You can just imagine the kinds of threats that are being made.
 
bbm see this is why I had to ask :blushing: I handhold mine til they're about 8, at least twas the case with the older - the younger is only 4 yet. well with these horribly narrow streets & sidewalks here with the busses literally 4 inches from your feet, I just cant stand the little one being out of reach while out.

Please know....I still reach for my 16 year old in busy areas. lol My neighborhood is not very busy. We have visited DC several times.... hold both my kids' hands much to their dismay. lol
 
I'm working very hard to keep myself on the fence, to not jump to conclusions every time I read something about these parents. It's really difficult because it is so easy to think they're guilty.

That being said, I think their problem is that they are uneducated, ignorant and for lack of a better term are hillbillies. Please don't take offense to that term but I really couldn't think of a better way to describe what I mean. I think they lack class and don't know much outside their little bubble. I think the mom initially lied to cover that she was drunk thinking that she'd be able to keep it to herself. I believe this is why she lied - is it detrimental to the investigation heck yes - did she think so at the time? I doubt it. I think she was so ashamed of being drunk, or worried about what people would think of her, that she was evasive and lied. I think she's up to something in her personal life that she's trying to prevent from being pulled out into the open. Again, is this detrimental to the case? Yes. Do I think she honestly realizes this? No. Do I give a dang about my thinking that she's acting like this to hide something - no I don't but most people would care and she knows this, especially now.

LE is looking for Lisa, the media is looking for dirt on her family. Not fair, but that's the way it is. Do I think they're guilty? I struggle with it. Do I think they do a piss-poor job of their public image? Absolutely. I really think she at this point is more concerned with making sure something is not uncovered in her life. That would explain the lie about the phone, the lie about the timeline, etc. Does this mean she harmed her daughter? No. She does lose out on the mom-of-the-year award though.

What does get me though is the cadaver dog's alert. I've never heard of a cadaver dog picking up the sent of clipped toenails and seems silly to me.

MOO.

IMO it's a ridiculous claim, at least from what I've read. They can, however, pick up on blood that once belonged to a living human because it decomps once it leaves your body. IMO there are instances where blood gets on the carpet in various homes.

I think ti's pretty unlikely, but until there is more evidence or more from LE (whom I have no reason not to trust) I'm sitting in a "we need more data" position. Not even fence, because i'm not even trying to figure out if they did it yet- I'm still collecting data. Mostly I think that nobody really knows until we get more facts... in the mean time, I feel pretty strongly about objectivity.
 
I really think holding hands in their front yard is holding them to a very very rare standard of parental supervision. I mean, to read your post it sounds like you didn't allow your children to ride bikes, or have "races" with other kids in the park, or play soccer, which doesn't sound like it's probably right -

It's different if you are talking about navigating a very narrow busy alleyway - these kids are in their front yard, looks safe to me.

They're also being filmed by at least one camera crew, and are in sight of both their parents and their front door. They're perfectly safe, I don't understand the criticism of the parents actions in that photograph.
 
bbm

Agreed. And what do you know? Something did happen to her while DB was -(allegedly) incoherent. I don't understand why people are making excuses for her. What if she had crawled out into the street and got hit by a car while mom was drunk? What if she fell down the basement stairs while mom was drunk? What if she got into drugs that were left out while mom was drunk? I just don't think there is any excuse at all to be drunk when you are responsible for caring for small children. None! And I don't care if "everybody is doing it!" Sorry to get all school marm on y'all. But that is the way I see it.

It's not schoolmarm it's what Parents do. They Parent. Most Parents find when children are young they are your life. Adult time is dinner out with your hubby and or friends. If alcohol is involved it's a coupla drinks while out with a responsible sitter at the house and a cab ride home cuz that's the Law with drinking and driving. I cant imagine adult time being in charge as the only Parent present and defending it as a sense of entitlement. Not to mention getting up the next day and spending time with your children with a hangover. It just makes me crazy.
 
Even if the family didn't know what Indepmo's opinion of their innocence or guilt, certainly Tina Porter would have vetted whoever was accompanying her. If she was going with only good intentions of offering assistance, why would she be accompanied by someone who may have professed a belief that DB is guilty (again I apologize in I misunderstood Indepmo's post #9 in this thread, what are your thoughts now? *re-re-poll* - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community).

That is exactly my point. Although you can usually sense who believes you and who doesn't, it wasn't about the family knowing.

It was about making the choice to reach out to someone with the company of someone who thinks them guilty. It's not an objective and kind hearted choice, so I'm not sure we can paint her visit as objective or kind-hearted.

It may have been! I'm not going to say it wasn't objective and kind hearted either. Just that we can't presume it, based on the facts that we have. JMO.
 
Wow, I haven't heard that term used in ages....so appropriate when it comes to children. I'm not talking about these two boys, I mean in general. Abused children everywhere are classic examples of this. It's amazing to talk to a brother and sister who were raised by the same abusive parent at the same time - both abused in the same ways, and each has their own version of how it went. One's reality was they were bad and deserved the abuse, the other saw the abuse for the stark horror that it was. Classic term.

I haven't ever heard the term; would you mind to explain please? :)
 
If anyone wants to see the inconsistencies in DB & JIs statements, we have been told there is a thread for that. Having been here since the third day and reading or watching almost every media link and interview with the family, I can assure you that the list of inconsistencies is ever growing.

Not sure if this is the thread but this is a record of their changing stories.
compare the parent's statements to media here - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

The Bobo family version of what happened the morning Holly disappeared changed 3 or more times. Does that mean they're guilty?
 
Edited to remove quote. This post is meant as a rhetorical question for people who feel that the family was wrong not to let Porter in. I accidentally quoted the wrong post, many apologies.

So if your child was kidnapped at night, and a man and woman you've never met came to your door at night, you would ask the person answering to please let them in?

Alternatively, if your child had died in the night, and a man and woman you've never met came to your door at night, you would ask the person answering to please let them in?

Alternatively again, assuming they knew who she was, if you child were "missing" and people suspected you of being a child murderer (guilty or innocent) and someone who had both of their children murdered came to your door at night with a man you didn't know, you would welcome them in?

Whatever you presume about their guilt or circumstance, I can't imagine why ANYONE would have invited them in. JMO

ETA- and then of course they saw her walk away, talk to reporters in an upset manner and return. It certainly would appear to be a "situation" IMO.
 

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