2011.05.02 Sidebar Thread

[strach304]

If anything delays this trial there's going to be many angry people in Orlando! The court has blocked out rooms at an Orlando hotel for the jury for a specific time frame, has hired additional security for the juror's hotel, has made arrangements for juror's transportation and meals, and arranged for all the little details that go into a major trial, including building an outdoor media center for the expected media. Everyone is geared up for the expected trial and I expect a delay could end up costing money if things have to be canceled.

My feeling is that the media's appeal will be denied by the appellate court and it won't delay the proceedings.

I don't think it will. Hope not because personally I am the public and I could care less where the jury is coming from. I think jury selection could be the cause of a delay though.

 

[Oakley]

I also thought that CA did not look well today . . . she did appear to be shaking (could even be low blood sugar) . . .she was nodding in agreement with HHBP in addition to shaking . . . her earrings were flapping like a flag in the wind (well not quite) and that seemed to accentuate the look of the shaking. At least these were my observations when that was going on. CA did appear to be struggling with something today but we have no idea what that might be . . . physical, emotional, mental, social, environmental, . . .etc. . . who knows. We all noticed her struggling today and I appreciate Tulessa posting what she saw from the April video (great eyes Tul) and providing the video. We will just have to leave things at that and understand that today is not a good day for CA for whatever reason it might be. I am ok with everyone noticing differences but lets not speculate on what might be the cause . . . that is where we get off the train track and get sentenced to the basement and must pay penance with editing tags.

BBM Bumping this excellent post from earlier today. While it is interesting to speculate on the cause for the tremors, it is treading on potentially dangerous territory. We do need to be careful, fellow sleuths :websleuther:

 

[Whome?]

If this subject has been addressed in another post,please forgive. I saw the hearing today,(watched it live) and for some reason I believe that JB/CM have their hand in this media motion. When HHJBP after denying the motion asked the D/T in a very stern voice, "did you request a change of venue"? It was just the tone of that question that made me suspect the D/T. IMHO they wanted to know the location in order to prepare jury consultants. JP then "read" all in the courtroom about ICA right to fair trial,and JB sat there looking, he did not have the look of indignation that an atty would have if his client had been "set up".I think they knew,I think it was an underhanded trick and I hope it backfires on them. :twocents:

 

[OneLostGrl]

ITA Leila. Sure hope Dr Glass does an analysis of today's hearing.

Why bother, the poor woman.. she'll just be made fun of. Seems she is just torn to shreads every time she posts a blog and we get our hands on it. IMO

 

[Intermezzo]

Yeah, but I went back to the video. Judge Perry was not playing and said very clearly that if his decision was appealed, it would delay the trial!

At about 24:00 in this video - Judge Perry clearly states that this trial will be delayed if his decision is appealed!!!! He wasn't playing around!

http://www.wftv.com/video/27745104/index.html

Does the General manager of CF News 13 really want to be responsible for this?

I really, really, hope Ms. Mercier explains to this "General Manager" the repercussions of this appeal action! :banghead:
__________________

I was just watching part 3
http://www.wftv.com/video/27745342/index.html
starting around the 6:20 mark
IMO JBP was NOT pleased with all the distractions in this case, that his time was consumed by a Motion like this from the media.

 

[NocturnalLady]

Is it possible her meds have been changed again? Not being a smart a$$ but that's what it looked like to me. This would be a more stressful time for her also than the limbo that has drug on for so long. We've seen a lot of her lately at hearings, there's a substantial weight gain, etc. signs of new or different meds and the side effects that are possible. Her shakes today looked involuntary to me.

Oh sheesh. I hope "new meds" don;t become a reason for CA to be unable to testify (delay) or mis-remember/lie about more things (hoping for a mistrial). I truly believe the woman has got to be stressed beyond belief and thank goodness she has meds to be on but I don't think I can take one more "it was the meds" excuse.

 

[Melanie]

BBM Bumping this excellent post from earlier today. While it is interesting to speculate on the cause for the tremors, it is treading on potentially dangerous territory. We do need to be careful, fellow sleuths :websleuther:

Absolutely. I watched it on-line and didn't notice anything besides her shaking her head yes/no depending on the statement. I don't wish harm on anyone, and no matter how much I don't like CA, she's lost her daughter and grandaughter.

Interesting, my DH asked me to sign my MIL's mothers day card, and I just lost it, cuz I don't have a card to send to my mom. He ended up signing it for me.

So, yes, there could be very many environmental factors going on here. Mother's day being Sunday could be one of them.

Hugs,

Mel

 

[NocturnalLady]

Here's the scoop from the back row of the courtroom. When the court security guards opened the door, they directed the common public to the last two rows of the prosecution side, rows three and four from the front. All other rows were for media or attorneys. There were five of us common public and that is all. Of course CA and her BFF got to sit on row two of the defense side. CA sat with her BFF and two male attorneys. She was laughing it up before the hearing began..great mood, perfect hair and make-up.Very animated and happy happy happy. JA was in a good mood and relaxed. He was chatting happily with the court reporter before the hearing began. After a while, LDB, JA and CM began talking in a friendly manner about the Osama Bin Laden news. None of them had known last night and only found out this morning.There were four security guards in the courtroom today. One at each of the three doors and one on the side. They seemed hyper vigilent today scanning the crowd. This did not prevent CA and BFF from chewing gum or the girl behind me from bringing in a water bottle. There were big xeroxed notes taped on the back of each pew showing a comic and stating no chewing gum, no hands in pockets, no bottles, no cell phone use. Only the press is allowed to use laptops/texts. The minute HHBP took his seat, she put her face in her hands for the longest time. ICA was stone faced when she entered. She grinned a hi to CM but no greeting to JB. Jeremy L was not present. GA was not there. KB, BS, JL, Pippi, Bob K., Holly, J.Fell, retired Judge Eaton, etc. were all there. JB, CM and a female black attorney with short curly hair were all the defense had today.The female sat behind the other defense attorneys. During the media motion, Judge Perry said "I don't answer questions, I ask them" and CA mouthed "my gosh" with a surprised facial expression. When he said "are you aware I was spotted in WPB?" CA was vigorously nodding her head yes. Are you aware of the man on the street interview? Again CA is nodding her head animatedly. CM is clearly enjoying the tone HHJP is taking with this banter. CA is shooting daggers to HHJP. She stopped being animated and sat still as a rock staring at HHJP. ICA is stonefaced and not looking or talking to CM or JB. JB is smirking during the media argument. HHJP began talking about the defense wanted a change of venue and JB is shaking his head NO!! (?) The media attorney stated that the parents put themselves in the media and CA mouthed "EXCUSE ME" and then showing absolute hatred in her face, no smirk, no movement, just glaring hatred. When the discussion began about jury questions, CM enjoyed the banter, JB and ICA looked bored. There will be 100 seats available in courtroom 23 says HHJP. The media near me said only one row for the public. The press already has assigned seats. I saw the seating chart. Each station already selected will get one badge for admission. When the lecture began from HHJP about the fundamental right ICA has to a fair trial she began to get back pats and rubs from CM. Her "tears" came only when HHBP said Casey Anthony deserves a fair trial. She is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law based on the evidence. That was the only reason she teared up. She did not have any aha moment. The deputy near her left the room and came back with a tissue, but it looked large and yellow. CM had his hand on ICA's shoulder for at least 15 min if not more, patting and rubbing and sometimes just leaving it there. After the in camera meeting, HHBP told CA he'd like to discuss their motion of sequestration, but her two attorneys left during the "in chambers" meeting. She immediately got on her phone to text their office. This discussion must take place before this weekend and preferably by Thursday.
I overheard Judge Eaton say that if the media decision is appealed to the district court, it will be assigned to three judges and it only needs agreement by two judges, two out of the three. He said this could be done within a few hours. Just go and get the signatures and be done with it.
I was disappointed that there was no decision on Dr.Vass and sequestration today. HHBP was so different than ever before. He is always the one that says "one at a time, the court reporter can't do her job if you talk over each other" and yet he interrupted the media attorney constantly and talked over her and just wouldn't stop. It was as if an idea popped in his head and he wanted that transcribed as it came.
CA and ICA have not changed one bit. They are arrogant playing for the camera. They will lie as long as they have breath in them.

BBM - My thought was similar when I saw ICA tear up. She was emotionally affected by the thought of her innocence and how persecuted and mistreated she is - so much so that she can't even get a fair trial. Poor thing.

 

[Melanie]

Oh sheesh. I hope "new meds" don;t become a reason for CA to be unable to testify (delay) or mis-remember/lie about more things (hoping for a mistrial). I truly believe the woman has got to be stressed beyond belief and thank goodness she has meds to be on but I don't think I can take one more "it was the meds" excuse.

Please, please, don't think I'm in a defend CA mood, but when my mum died, I went on Lexapro and Klonopin. Both drugs definitely fog the memory. Lord, if you were to ask me what happened in 2008, i'd have to say 'huh'.

At least there's testimony and depos to fall back on - thank goodness!

Mel

 

[Melanie]

I was just watching part 3
http://www.wftv.com/video/27745342/index.html
starting around the 6:20 mark
IMO JBP was NOT pleased with all the distractions in this case, that his time was consumed by a Motion like this from the media.

I pray the trial is not delayed because of the <unusual person> who was arguing the case today. There are too many Floridians who just want to put this behind them. And yes, I agree with JBP that ICA does deserve a fair trial. This woman was doing all she could to make sure that doesn't happen.

The evidence will speak for itself. We don't need all this nonsense. I think even JB was in agreement with that (when he said he had no comment). I thought he'd have something to say.

MOO

Mel

 

[dog.gone.cute]

:waitasec:

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...y-trial-friday-filings20110429,0,512553.story


Regarding CA's "reactions" in the courtroom this morning ...

I was wondering if CA has been "shaken up" since this past Friday when the State Attorney requested CA and GA's Transcripts from the recent Hearings ?

The "headline" in the OS (link above) reads:
Casey Anthony trial: State wants transcripts of George and Cindy Anthony's court testimony

While I am sure the SA is preparing for the Trial and needs ALL the Transcripts of All the Hearings ...

Is it possible that maybe an "ounce of reality" has set in and she is just starting to realize that the SA and Judge Perry are NOT playing around ? Maybe CA realized she can "play" all the games in the world with her daughter, GA and LA, but NOT with the Judge and the SA !

Maybe CA has had a "slight revelation" that her "always changing testimony" from her sworn statements and those given on the witness stand, WILL BE CHALLENGED at the Trial if she does NOT tell the TRUTH !

Maybe ... it has been pointed out to CA that she better NOT lie on the stand ... "perjury charges", Cindy.

On top of Friday's request ... Defense Motion after Motion has been denied ...

Today's "Media Circus Motion" has been denied ...

And CA KNOWS her motion regarding "Sequestration" for the Trial will be more than likely be denied ... His Honor is NOT playing around any more !

Maybe CA has finally realized her "Battle Plan" did NOT work ...

You should have put Caylee first, Cindy, and not your daughter ...

Justice is just around the corner for Caylee !

 

[OneLostGrl]

Thank you for the link and time stamp, Oak. I watched this about 20 times, taking steps away for a few minutes to look again with fresh eyes. I see someone who looks like she's having a depersonalization moment. Just MO as someone who sometimes suffers from this from time to time. I know it makes me shaky for a few seconds then I'll feel the out of body sensation. Considering the stress and anxiety she's likely under, I feel this is most likely the culprit for what we saw here. Again, JMO.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depersonalization


If you really look at her you see her shoulders come forward a bit at first. This to me shows a loss of control of some key central nervous system response. If I had not seen that, I might believe she was just nodding in agreement. The shoulders and the look in her eyes and face tells me, she's got the creepy crawlies under her skin. IMO, she attempts to nod to make it look like she's agreeing with HHJP.

To me, she seems to be in the same emotional state she was in during the "silent interview". [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FpteGu0PL0[/ame] I thought her problem then and I feel the same way after watching her today that her issue today and that day just may be LACK of anxiety medication. She was prescribed Klonopin back then- I don't know if she is still prescribed it but In my non-medicalprofessionalbenzoaddict opinion, that woman looks to be going through benzo withdrawal.. most likely imo tolerance withdrawal.

One of the Benzo withdrawl symptoms can be Depersonalization http://www.benzo.org.uk/der.htm"]http://www.benzo.org.uk/der.htm[/URL] as we see (well, you and I see it, I can't speak for others and I'm not trying to shove it down anyones throat) in these video's of Cindy.

http://www.benzo.org.uk/pws04.htm

http://www.addictionsandrecovery.org/benzodiazepine.htm

http://www.benzobuddies.org/benzodiazepine-information

http://www.benzobuddies.org/benzodiazepine-information/withdrawal-symptoms



[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SNRxxyIwIg&feature=related"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SNRxxyIwIg&feature=related[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGaR7aG6xHM&feature=related"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGaR7aG6xHM&feature=related[/ame] (You can choose to believe her or not-she is telling her story. I personally believe her but that's because I went through Benzo withdrawl- ya'll can make up your own minds.)

I can provide more links if anyone wants 'em. anyway, this is all JMO.

ETA- Sorry the silent interview doesn't work unless you go to youtube

 

[kaRN]

Please, please, don't think I'm in a defend CA mood, but when my mum died, I went on Lexapro and Klonopin. Both drugs definitely fog the memory. Lord, if you were to ask me what happened in 2008, i'd have to say 'huh'.

At least there's testimony and depos to fall back on - thank goodness!

Mel

It's the fact that time has improved CA's memory to details that's questionable IMO with or without meds. When you look back to the loss of your Mom (I'm really sorry Mel!! I lost my Mom in 2010 too so I can relate.) you mention you still have to say 'huh', when asked what happened. That's normal in my experience. What CA is proposing really isn't.
But.....CA is aware of her rights as a 'disabled' person and is milking her status to ensure she will not be held accountable easily for perjury. It could well be her recollection has nothing to do with the meds she was on then and everything to do with the ones she's on now. She was still able to work then and go back to work after febrezing and dropping dryer sheets all over the car, but since the fog then, is disabled now Hmmmmm.
Ok Cindy. :crazy:

 

[kaRN]

What I write may very well be my imagination running away. I did watch snippets of the hearing and i did watch CA's head tremors. I remember JP using an example if the trial was delayed and a witness was to die that their testimony would be lost. Could CA be ill? This is not to start a rumor only my thought.:waitasec:

:twocents: She is ill, but she's physically fit simultaneously. IMO BP was not referring to CA but maybe Dr Spitz or SP???? I really don't know. I found him a little crankily cryptic today.

 

[Melanie]

It's the fact that time has improved CA's memory to details that's questionable IMO with or without meds. When you look back to the loss of your Mom (I'm really sorry Mel!! I lost my Mom in 2010 too so I can relate.) you mention you still have to say 'huh', when asked what happened. That's normal in my experience. What CA is proposing really isn't.
But.....CA is aware of her rights as a 'disabled' person and is milking her status to ensure she will not be held accountable easily for perjury. It could well be her recollection has nothing to do with the meds she was on then and everything to do with the ones she's on now. She was still able to work then and go back to work after febrezing and dropping dryer sheets all over the car, but since the fog then, is disabled now Hmmmmm.
Ok Cindy. :crazy:

Really interesting points (and I'm so sorry you lost your mum too). It's not gonna be an easy weekend for either of us I can imagine.

Anywhoo - when CA said that memories are coming back to her in bits and pieces, I just don't know if I understand or get that. If she's off the meds completely now before trial, perhaps that's true. But if she's still on the Klonopin, her memory from 2008 should be rather foggy. Maybe that's why we saw the reaction we did today (withdrawal).

I don't know for sure - just a thought.

MOO

Mel

 

[Peepers McPeep]

Absolutely. I watched it on-line and didn't notice anything besides her shaking her head yes/no depending on the statement. I don't wish harm on anyone, and no matter how much I don't like CA, she's lost her daughter and grandaughter.

Interesting, my DH asked me to sign my MIL's mothers day card, and I just lost it, cuz I don't have a card to send to my mom. He ended up signing it for me.

So, yes, there could be very many environmental factors going on here. Mother's day being Sunday could be one of them.

Hugs,

Mel

I almost forgot about Mothers day..So did ICA
That S'plains why Faye Dunaway was hamming it up, taking an ax to rosebushes during yesterdays afternoon movie..
Hope the visual makes ya smile..
Loved ones will always shine, you feel the glow everytime you say their name. =)
G'day, all.

 

[kaRN]

I was just watching part 3
http://www.wftv.com/video/27745342/index.html
starting around the 6:20 mark
IMO JBP was NOT pleased with all the distractions in this case, that his time was consumed by a Motion like this from the media.

ITA. I watched the entire hearing again tks to your link. I noticed the CA head shake thing and maybe I'm just completely devoid of empathy for her, but felt it was put on. Notice neither her lawyer or BFF seem to notice or show the slightest concern for it whatever it was.
ICA on the other hand appears to be more upset that CM is touching her than at anything being said. There's actually little congruence between what's said and her reaction to it. If you turn off the volume and just watch, it's really creepy. The more patting and massaging he does, the more upset she gets. I'm pretty sure ICA can't say no, but her body sure seemed to scream it. When he removes his hand she relaxes again. It's very disturbing and begs the question.
If your client was allegedly serially sexually assaulted by her Father or any man for that matter resulting in PTSD, would you massage them in court??? I have no love for ICA but seriously the creepy old man needs to keep his hands to himself.

 

[Tulessa]

If anything delays this trial there's going to be many angry people in Orlando! The court has blocked out rooms at an Orlando hotel for the jury for a specific time frame, has hired additional security for the juror's hotel, has made arrangements for juror's transportation and meals, and arranged for all the little details that go into a major trial, including building an outdoor media center for the expected media. Everyone is geared up for the expected trial and I expect a delay could end up costing money if things have to be canceled.

My feeling is that the media's appeal will be denied by the appellate court and it won't delay the proceedings.

Not to mention ONE angry person in Kentucky. I have waited for this trial since 2008. My brother's murderers trial comes up in October, so, if it's delayed and I'm not here for it? You guys know why.

 

[kaRN]

Really interesting points (and I'm so sorry you lost your mum too). It's not gonna be an easy weekend for either of us I can imagine.

Anywhoo - when CA said that memories are coming back to her in bits and pieces, I just don't know if I understand or get that. If she's off the meds completely now before trial, perhaps that's true. But if she's still on the Klonopin, her memory from 2008 should be rather foggy. Maybe that's why we saw the reaction we did today (withdrawal).

I don't know for sure - just a thought.

MOO

Mel

bbm. Exactly Mel, me neither.

To nobody in particular but how do we know she is or ever was on Klonopin anyway? Did she say so during the Agent of the State hearings and I missed it or are we assuming?? I thought CA said she was depressed during the months prior to ICA's disappearance with Caylee and Klonopin is contraindicated in patients with a history of or current depression.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

Amil, I thank you for your inside insights....:hug:

Your post snipped for brevity...

The media attorney stated that the parents put themselves in the media and CA mouthed "EXCUSE ME" and then showing absolute hatred in her face, no smirk, no movement, just glaring hatred. When the discussion began about jury questions, CM enjoyed the banter, JB and ICA looked bored. There will be 100 seats available in courtroom 23 says HHJP. The media near me said only one row for the public. The press already has assigned seats. I saw the seating chart. Each station already selected will get one badge for admission. When the lecture began from HHJP about the fundamental right ICA has to a fair trial she began to get back pats and rubs from CM. Her "tears" came only when HHBP said Casey Anthony deserves a fair trial. She is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law based on the evidence. That was the only reason she teared up. She did not have any aha moment. The deputy near her left the room and came back with a tissue, but it looked large and yellow. CM had his hand on ICA's shoulder for at least 15 min if not more, patting and rubbing and sometimes just leaving it there. After the in camera meeting, HHBP told CA he'd like to discuss their motion of sequestration, but her two attorneys left during the "in chambers" meeting. She immediately got on her phone to text their office. This discussion must take place before this weekend and preferably by Thursday.

MY bolded portions....

It appears CA doesn't like to be told the truth. She contributed to this media frenzy and when it's pointed out, she will tell herself, hey, I did what I needed to to get the attention on Caylee...yet, there she sits in silence for Caylee and tries to twist her words in a nanosecond..I also feel she knew the SAs were asking for the transcripts of her and GA's testimony during the March 2-4 pretrial hearings and knew she'd be on point. Being told that in front of ICA irritated her for she and her daughters relationship is broken and this would add to that..hatred...ICA holds nothing but contempt for her and only thanked her for she told a mistruth for ICA...CA doesn't like admonishment, she's the only one who can do that...

I'm sort of on the fence with her sequestration motion and it being postponed due to her attorney leaving the courtroom...these folk like instant gratfication and this didn't give it to her...

I also hope that attorney for the media just signs the darn waiver and doesn't take it further...how incredibly selfish of them to risk a fair trial even if her parents, her attorney added to the frenzy.. I want a fair trial and I want Caylee to have the justice she so deserves...I truly hope they drop this...

With ICA and her back being patted and rubbed...her tears are all for her, I didn't move me one way or the other...I await the waterfalls on her hearing Guilty as charged..JMHO

Justice for Caylee