Australia Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #9 *ARREST

[jubillee]

Maybe if an immediate male relative was a complete fishing nut you would think he would almost certainly at the very least have access to a boat.

Yep I am aware that BE spent a lot of time fishing/crabbing in Mandurah area with a family member. (not TE). If the family member has a boat it is feasible that BE had access to it but if he was using it for something to do with crimes it would have to be when family wasn't actually there at the time..

 

[Meloljo]

Based on a post BE liked on FB I would suggest he loves his mum, and thus has a decent relationship with her.

Im not sure....I feel like there may be some mother issues however my feeling is speculation based on my experience and training in working in the psychology field. He may well have expressed love for his mother on facebook however I dont think its safe to assume much from that.

 

[JoeDetective]

Just speculating, but picking the guy that successfully defending Lloyd Rayney was probably a bit obvious due to the publicity of the case, but then who really did the legal work? Horses for courses. I wouldn't read into it a foreknowledge and preparation based upon choice of lawyers. Anyway, such opinionating guilt because of it, would be Subjudicial.
An acquaintance was going to getting a bit of bother with Crichton-Browne so he got Ian Viner QC and if you know the case, he was vindicated as he should of been.
Sent from my HTC 2PQ910 using Tapatalk

I’m not intending to imply guilt based upon who he selected as a legal representative. This is assuming he specifically selected SV as his representative.
Indeed we do not know any of the situation surrounding how his representation came to pass.

What I would say based upon what I have learnt about BRE is that if he was the CSK he probably would have been prepared for this potential eventuality and meticulously studied criminal case news in WA and had in mind who he would select to represent him.

I suspect BRE has not said a single thing to the police, considering the evidence we are aware of this is not surprising, I can't see how it would assist him talking to the police.

 

[janwa]

I’m with Klutch,

• where does speed come into this?
• speed would make it worse, more jittery, less predictible as he is not normally on speed
• why would an individual with control issues take drugs and risk being out of control?

vvv

I'm not talking about a speed freak. Selective use of certain drugs for temporary enhancement, disablement or death has it's own history

 

[JoeDetective]

Im not sure....I feel like there may be some mother issues however my feeling is speculation based on my experience and training in working in the psychology field. He may well have expressed love for his mother on facebook however I dont think its safe to assume much from that.[/QUOTEMother issues is almost a cliche in these kinds of cases, but the evidence I have seen is not that of someone who has mother issues, which is surprising as it would explain a lot, he is very careful about what he likes and does not like on FB, he has no need to support such positive comments about his mother on FB as I don't believe she would ever see it, additionally he doesn't appear to care much about what other people think and he certainly does not strike me as the type who is overly comfortable with PDoA. Maybe there are repressed issues there, who knows, certainly it's easier to rationalise his behaviour it there were significant issues with his mother.

 

[Klutch]

vvv

I'm not talking about a speed freak. Selective use of certain drugs for temporary enhancement, disablement or death has it's own history

You don't have to be an addict for the drug to effect you in a negative manner. I get what you're saying, and certain drugs can definitely give temporary enhancement...

Want more social skills? Drop MDMA.
Want to be creative? Have some acid.
Want to murder someone and get away with it multiple times? Don't do drugs that'll impair your ability to think and give you forethought.

In this case i completely disagree. I think any form of impairment while trying to cover/hide your tracks would not be beneficial in any way what so ever.

 

[JoeDetective]

There are 4 types of serial killers in terms of body locations, dumpers, dumpers/concealers, ones who leave the body at the kill site and ones whom leave the body at the kill site but try to conceal.

BRE was an organised killer whom dumped the bodies with little to no effort to conceal them, dumpers generally dump for one reason to put both time and distance between themselves and the victim or as an attempt to hide the fact they are serial killing because they don't want police swarming all over their hunting grounds. I personally don't think BRE visited the physical bodies after dumping but it is possible that he dumped in areas of some significance through work or recreation that could have allowed him to visit the general areas.

Do you think SS was dumped in a similarly remote location to CG and JR, if yes why has she not be found do you think? If no what do you think he did with SS?

 

[janwa]

You don't have to be an addict for the drug to effect you in a negative manner. I get what you're saying, and certain drugs can definitely give temporary enhancement...

Want more social skills? Drop MDMA.
Want to be creative? Have some acid.
Want to murder someone and get away with it multiple times? Don't do drugs that'll impair your ability to think and give you forethought.

In this case i completely disagree. I think any form of impairment while trying to cover/hide your tracks would not be beneficial in any way what so ever.

Going with the pedantic side he would know exactly how much to take, hav'nt you ever seen how fast a mob of pot heads can clean up a rental when an inspection is due.

 

[Klutch]

Going with the pedantic side he would know exactly how much to take

Yeah there would be benefits in small amounts - But i still think the negatives would outweigh any positives.
You might get a little bit more concentration and energy but it also comes with a false sense of your abilities..thinking you're doing a better job than you are, getting cocky, getting paranoid(and this is a big one! Ever seen a tweaker keep looking out a window constantly thinking he's heard someone walk down his driveway?) Constantly thinking you're hearing things or being watched is not something you would wan't while dealing with someone you just murdered.

This **** doesn't just happen to full blown addicts. I've seen casual users exhibit this type of behaviour. And they aren't even aware they're doing it. In their head its perfectly normal to be doing it.

hav'nt you ever seen how fast a mob of pot heads can clean up a rental when an inspection is due.

Ignoring this because you just compared pot smokers to speed users.

 

[CSK?]

The bodies would have stunk being left uncovered outside in WA, I don't see him returning to interfere as likely, if he wanted to do that I suspect he would have done things differently.
Unless the bodies were not dumped on the mornings of the attack but kept and then dumped. Maybe in a fridge on a boat.

I'm not disagreeing that he didn't return to the bodies, but I will state I don't think the state of decomposition would have much to do with it if post mortem contact and/or necrophilia were his thing, both Ridgeway and Bundy (and a number of other killers whom practiced necrophilia) would visit with/and have sex with the bodies months after being dumped. Based on what limited knowledge we have of KK victim BRE's primary objective was rape/control he dumped the girls afterwards with not a second thought, they had served his purpose.

 

[CSK?]

You don't have to be an addict for the drug to effect you in a negative manner. I get what you're saying, and certain drugs can definitely give temporary enhancement...

Want more social skills? Drop MDMA.
Want to be creative? Have some acid.
Want to murder someone and get away with it multiple times? Don't do drugs that'll impair your ability to think and give you forethought.

In this case i completely disagree. I think any form of impairment while trying to cover/hide your tracks would not be beneficial in any way what so ever.

Common sense would dictate not to take something that may impair your judgement however you would be greatly suprised at the amount of serial murders taken place while the killer is intoxicated. There is a very interesting research paper I'd suggest a lot of sleuthers on here read "Serial Murder - Pathways for investigation" aside from the fact it is just interesting it gives great insight into how a serial killer operates. everything from victimology to dumping the bodies. A quick google search should bring up a pdf for you to read.

Based from that research "A majority of these offenders (73.9%) also had some type of stressor at some time either prior to their murders or during their series of murders . These were very diversified, with alcohol or drug abuse (23.9%) and legal difficulties (16.7%), being the most prevalent."


We know that the stressor for BRE was marriage/relationship breakdowns, we can also summize from his high school yearbook quote that he was maybe somewhat of a heavy drinker. There never has been any proof whatsoever to suggest BRE took speed and as such is pure conjecture.

 

[janwa]

Yeah there would be benefits in small amounts - But i still think the negatives would outweigh any positives.
You might get a little bit more concentration and energy but it also comes with a false sense of your abilities..thinking you're doing a better job than you are, getting cocky, getting paranoid(and this is a big one! Ever seen a tweaker keep looking out a window constantly thinking he's heard someone walk down his driveway?) Constantly thinking you're hearing things or being watched is not something you would wan't while dealing with someone you just murdered.


This **** doesn't just happen to full blown addicts. I've seen casual users exhibit this type of behaviour. And they aren't even aware they're doing it. In their head its perfectly normal to be doing it.

Ignoring this because you just compared pot smokers to speed users.

Just a theory based on a bit of past knowledge when someone commented on having to get the victim out quickly. No offence meant re other comment based on my support role experience

 

[Klutch]

Common sense would dictate not to take something that may impair your judgement however you would be greatly suprised at the amount of serial murders taken place while the killer is intoxicated. There is a very interesting research paper I'd suggest a lot of sleuthers on here read "Serial Murder - Pathways for investigation" aside from the fact it is just interesting it gives great insight into how a serial killer operates. everything from victimology to dumping the bodies. A quick google search should bring up a pdf for you to read.

Based from that research "A majority of these offenders (73.9%) also had some type of stressor at some time either prior to their murders or during their series of murders . These were very diversified, with alcohol or drug abuse (23.9%) and legal difficulties (16.7%), being the most prevalent."


We know that the stressor for BRE was marriage/relationship breakdowns, we can also summize from his high school yearbook quote that he was maybe somewhat of a heavy drinker. There never has been any proof whatsoever to suggest BRE took speed and as such is pure conjecture.

Interesting! Will have a read when i get time

I have noticed somewhat of a link between heavy substance abuse and some SK's, and in some cases its been their downfall. (Abuse gets worse which makes them sloppier and ends up with them being caught)

 

[3blindmice]

in about 1999/2000 brad and i were sent up to kalgoolie to do some cabling for north star resources i remember a girl going missing while we were there and joking with brad that he had done it because of him opting out of after works drinks he did not find it funny and got angry at me and i just thought it was not his sense of humor at the time i was not serious but for 2 weeks now i have been wondering if maybe he had done it i called crime stoppers but she did not sound to interested in my claim maybe people can figure it out since you did a great job with the rest of the case the girl lived about 3 minutes from where we were staying at the motel she was about 25 it was long ago so i cant be sure

another thing is brad was not 'pedantic' like people say he was he was just a normal guy he did keep to himself a bit but if you talk about footy and car racing he would open up i dont think there was anything weird about i was shocked when i read that the man arrested was him i worked with him for 5 years and did not even suspect anything

 

[b4u]

Is it possible MM and the guy who briefly looks out the doorway 50 seconds later, is the same person? Both appear to have shirt sleeves rolled up to elbows.

Are the below 3 pics I've screenshot from the CSK ABCTV Australian Story "He who waits" Video/Program either of the Doormen/man, MM, or someone else and JR?

Noting that I have not seen conclusive evidence to support that the approx. 10s of footage these were taken from (see link below), was actually from the night of JR's disappearance at the Conti.

• 26:16 of
  ABC TV Australian Story CSK related
  “He who waits (Full Program 2004)" that is linked on the following page, that also contains the earlier CSK before you leap and other related videos.
  http://www.abc.net.au/austory/specia...p2/default.htm
  with 10 seconds of much better quality footage than the other videos being referred to in this forum.

  
  
  

 

[jessicalouise]

Drugs affect every person differently. So one cant say that taking speed would necessarily make a person sloppy, paranoid and hamper their ability to conduct a murder. Everyone is different. I too have taken speed in the past to help me get through long shifts at work and if anything it has made me more "on point", methodical, in control.

Another thing posters have been posting that has been annoying me is the suggestion of women having greater EQ than men therefore they would be able to pick up on their partners(/family) members being potential serial killers. No, not necessarily. It would never occur to some women to question their "man" or family member. Loyalty, their mind just not "going there", and them thinking the best of people. But contrary to that, there are many many times when women do pick up on something being NQR and dismiss it because we are taught by society to dismiss it because it's "rude" and "what are the chances?" If women were always listening to their gut instincts and suspicions there'd be a lot less abductions, murders, rapes, attacks on them. But we are told to dismiss them. Even now in 2017 we're subliminaly told to dismiss our feelings because "#notallmen" even though many of the worst people who ever existed in history were seemingly ordinary husbands and fathers.

 

[JBA512]

in about 1999/2000 brad and i were sent up to kalgoolie to do some cabling for north star resources i remember a girl going missing while we were there and joking with brad that he had done it because of him opting out of after works drinks he did not find it funny and got angry at me and i just thought it was not his sense of humor at the time i was not serious but for 2 weeks now i have been wondering if maybe he had done it i called crime stoppers but she did not sound to interested in my claim maybe people can figure it out since you did a great job with the rest of the case the girl lived about 3 minutes from where we were staying at the motel she was about 25 it was long ago so i cant be sure

another thing is brad was not 'pedantic' like people say he was he was just a normal guy he did keep to himself a bit but if you talk about footy and car racing he would open up i dont think there was anything weird about i was shocked when i read that the man arrested was him i worked with him for 5 years and did not even suspect anything

Welcome interesting story!
Do you have any photos of BRE during your 5 years working together? if so could you post them

 

[b4u]

in about 1999/2000 brad and i were sent up to kalgoolie to do some cabling for north star resources i remember a girl going missing while we were there and joking with brad that he had done it because of him opting out of after works drinks he did not find it funny and got angry at me and i just thought it was not his sense of humor at the time i was not serious but for 2 weeks now i have been wondering if maybe he had done it i called crime stoppers but she did not sound to interested in my claim maybe people can figure it out since you did a great job with the rest of the case the girl lived about 3 minutes from where we were staying at the motel she was about 25 it was long ago so i cant be sure

another thing is brad was not 'pedantic' like people say he was he was just a normal guy he did keep to himself a bit but if you talk about footy and car racing he would open up i dont think there was anything weird about i was shocked when i read that the man arrested was him i worked with him for 5 years and did not even suspect anything

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...y/news-story/5c3654df079a092ed9f3a29960b8844e

[FONT=&quot]

WERE bikies responsible for Lisa Govan’s murder or did someone else snuff out her life?
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]In an enduring and puzzling case, cold case detectives are reviewing all the evidence surrounding her disappearance on October 8, 1999.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And her parents have reached out again to the WA public for any morsel or snippet of information that could lead to a breakthrough.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Their beloved daughter, then 28, vanished in Kalgoorlie, where she’d been living and working for a few years.

Ms Govan was last seen about 7.30am near the Foundry Hotel bottle shop.

Despite a $50,000 reward being posted, extensive inquiries by police and her family, Lisa’s whereabouts remain unknown.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Nobody has ever been charged in connection with her suspected murder.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Mr Govan recalled how in December 2000, two anonymous callers phoned Crime Stoppers with specific information about his daughter’s disappearance.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Police pleaded for the callers to phone again.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]One of them did, but the information they gave couldn’t be verified.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]

Was 3Blindmice one of the 2 callers to Crimestoppers referred to in the above. The one that apparently never called back again? [/FONT]

 

[janwa]

Interesting! Will have a read when i get time

I have noticed somewhat of a link between heavy substance abuse and some SK's, and in some cases its been their downfall. (Abuse gets worse which makes them sloppier and ends up with them being caught)

All good bud. I've been a drug user(Everything and Anything - I like trying new experiences) for about 10 years now with absolutely no addictions. I've been around the "party" scene for an equal amount of time so i've come across all forms of users for recreational businessman to full blown junkies living in a squats.

Here's a little story for you...Back in my teenage years i went to a party in gnangara pine plantation. A friend whipped out a baggie halfway through the night and we all talk turns having a few lines. Throughout the night, i had this overwhelming sense that i was being watched through the trees. I kept seeing movement in my peripheral vision..but it was only enough to make me go "...what was that?", i heard gravel being walked on behind me multiple times too.

My friends heard and saw none of it. I've never had any sort of paranoia from drugs except from this night, so i put it down to circumstances of being in a creepy ****ing forrest. My point being - These types of circumstances makes emotions/feelings and thoughts unpredictable and harder to deal with. Another good example is that a friend of mine once lost his car keys at a party, he proceeded to rage out and lash out at everyone over stupid **** until he found his keys, then proceeded to profusely apologise to everyone. Normally, he's a really chill dude. Get him on speed and he gets easily agitated. Never got violent, but just couldn't control his emotions properly.

Could you imagine having to deal with murdering someone, hiding the body, covering up the evidence while dealing with paranoia and heightened emotions like that? I couldn't do it, it would make it so much harder than the situation would need to be.

Who knows, you could be totally right, he could be one of the few people who get very little negative side effects, but from my experience in life its doubtful. I just really, really cannot see this guy as an amphetamine user.

It may be completely irrelevant or maybe he gets the urge and can only go through with it topped up.

My theory is that at some point early on in the piece he was seeing a professional about his urges and eventually he became a catcher for a group of high profile abusers may explain why he's smiling expecting a return of favours.

Those footsteps could have been real you may have had heightened hearing. It's a popular place for assaults I know of at least 2 girls bashed senseless and raped by the same person there but he's Teflon coated.

Enough rambling

 

[3blindmice]

yes that girl

i dont think i have photos camera phones were rare brad did not come to work break ups often and that is only time i can think he would have had his photo taken for work i will look at some old pics just in case