Australia Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, Jun 1997

[K8g]

Does anyone know- how did Brian confirm no one with the name Remakel had come in or out, besides Marion, since 1970? Is there a searchable database, or is that info that has come from Garry Sheehan?

It's so frustrating that information provided by Garry Sheehan seems inconsistent and unreliable, and also probably now outdated. i.e. I wonder if there's been any Medicare checks since the initial one, etc.

Sally is not in this for the money. I find that offensive to even indicate. I had lunch with her a few weeks ago. She and her husband of many years do just fine. I’d move heaven and earth to find out what happened to a missing parent if it were me. I think you’d all have to agree.

These comments infuriate me too (not by you Mel 1303, I know what you meant) but I mean in general, on Facebook, etc. Marion is missing and she happens to have unused super/unclaimed money. It's Sally's mother FFS. Whether there was $0.10 or $100,000 floating around in Marion's/Florabella's name, I think would be irrelevant to most people when searching for a missing loved one, other than that the money is another avenue to explore to help (or hinder and confuse!) the 22-year-long search for Marion.

 

[Meligator]

The reason the UK money shows as being CBA is because the money was an international transfer conducted by the Commonwealth Bank. Barclays were the Bank CBA processed their international transactions through in that location. So in relation to this transaction, Barclays were just an agent for CBA. When the UK money became dormant Barclays returned the funds to the CBA to action. The Rye address showing on the traceline is the address of the Barclays branch returning the money, it flags to CBA the funds relates to an international transaction and helps them match the return transaction to the original transaction.

When the money was returned to CBA, if Marion was still a customer she would have been contacted by them (CBA) about what to do with the money. If she was no longer a CBA customer (and it looks like this was the case) the funds would have gone straight to unclaimed monies.

A little odd that Marion would be upset about the car sale money that Sally hadn't put into the bank account, yet leaving 20K untouched in a separate account.

 

[Intriguedbyintrigue]

A little odd that Marion would be upset about the car sale money that Sally hadn't put into the bank account, yet leaving 20K untouched in a separate account.

I think the idea that Marion had an actual bank account at Barclays Bank could be a misconception. Others have posted that Marion couldnt have opened a UK bank account because she wasnt a UK citizen/resident.

Its more likely that Barclays (as the agent for CBA in the UK) were holding funds for Marion's collection. We dont know what form the UK money was in. For example, Marion may have pre-purchased pounds or a draft, or travellers cheques in Australia but had them for collection in UK so she didnt have to carry the money with her.

I think what may have been a problem for Marion is that the Barclays money (in whatever form) was in the name of Marion Barter. To collect this money she would have to be formally identified as Marion Barter. How do you do that when your travel documents are all Florabella??
Barclays would have had no access to CBA systems, Marion would not have been able to be identified via her bank cards/records. She may have still had her Marion Australian driver's license but I dont know if that would be acceptable form of identification to an overseas bank (because it cant be verified).

 

[K8g]

A little odd that Marion would be upset about the car sale money that Sally hadn't put into the bank account, yet leaving 20K untouched in a separate account.

Do we know who else knew (at the time) about the car sale arrangement between Sally and Marion?

 

[kbk]

Do we know who else knew (at the time) about the car sale arrangement between Sally and Marion?

Other family members, such as Sallys brother, Grandparents, her partner, possibly even friends of Marion could have known from her mentioning it in passing.

 

[Meligator]

I think the idea that Marion had an actual bank account at Barclays Bank could be a misconception. Others have posted that Marion couldnt have opened a UK bank account because she wasnt a UK citizen/resident.

Its more likely that Barclays (as the agent for CBA in the UK) were holding funds for Marion's collection. We dont know what form the UK money was in. For example, Marion may have pre-purchased pounds or a draft, or travellers cheques in Australia but had them for collection in UK so she didnt have to carry the money with her.

I think what may have been a problem for Marion is that the Barclays money (in whatever form) was in the name of Marion Barter. To collect this money she would have to be formally identified as Marion Barter. How do you do that when your travel documents are all Florabella??
Barclays would have had no access to CBA systems, Marion would not have been able to be identified via her bank cards/records. She may have still had her Marion Australian driver's license but I dont know if that would be acceptable form of identification to an overseas bank (because it cant be verified).

I actually think she left the money in UK (as Marion Barter) on purpose, to give the impression she went missing in UK. It’s unlikely anyone would have known she returned to Australia had the bank employee not blown Marion’s cover and informed Sally that money was being removed from the account. But without that info, the search for Marion would be wholly focused in UK.

 

[Kelliepat]

Hi everyone! Long time lurker first time poster!

Something I've been pondering lately. I was under the impression that the unclaimed $20k was from Marions Barclays account she set up in the UK, which I did think was odd because if that was the case, even with Marion being an Australian citizen, an overseas bank would never transfer untouched money to another bank. Let alone another bank in another country. That makes no sense. They would just keep it in their own unclaimed account at Barcleys. So, after reading all of Sally's replies on her Facebook page and looking at the screen grab of the payment, the unclaimed $20,000 seems to actually be from Marions CBA account (it was being held in CBA's unclaimed funds unit) but the forwarding address listed was for the Barclays Bank in Rye. So the money didn't actually come from an untouched account in the UK. Meaning Marion (or someone claiming to be Marion) at some point, most likely when she returned to Australia and was withdrawing the $5k a day, changed her address with the CBA so that her mail would be forwarded to the UK. And if that was the case, when she came back to Australia, she fully intended on going back to the UK. I was also thinking about the conversations Gary had in the beginning. He said that noone had ever left Australia again using the Florabella passport. But he never specifically said that noone has ever left using Marion Barters passport. Unless I missed that bit?

Marion's Passport was changed by Deedpoll so she didn't have a passport in Marion Barter. The passport that came back to Australia on 2/8/97 never left again. It expired in 2007.

Sally asked me to pass on her thanks to all of you Websleuths.

 

[Intriguedbyintrigue]

I actually think she left the money in UK (as Marion Barter) on purpose, to give the impression she went missing in UK. It’s unlikely anyone would have known she returned to Australia had the bank employee not blown Marion’s cover and informed Sally that money was being removed from the account. But without that info, the search for Marion would be wholly focused in UK.

Interesting idea. That could also be why the super was untouched. You cant access Super without it being reported to the ATO. It seems like a lot of money to forgo to maintain a coverstory but then we dont know how much money Marion had at her disposal.

 

[Meligator]

Interesting idea. That could also be why the super was untouched. You cant access Super without it being reported to the ATO. It seems like a lot of money to forgo to maintain a coverstory but then we dont know how much money Marion had at her disposal.

Also, this plan doesn’t exclude the possibility she was behaving under coercion and/or met with subsequent foul play. I’m just theorizing about a plan for disappearing.

 

[Meligator]

Marion's Passport was changed by Deedpoll so she didn't have a passport in Marion Barter. The passport that came back to Australia on 2/8/97 never left again. It expired in 2007.

Sally asked me to pass on her thanks to all of you Websleuths.

Without another passport, there is a good likelihood she remained in Australia (unless she obtained a fraudulent passport, which seems like something way outside Marion’s wheelhouse). This could be why Marion tells bank officer not to look for her in Byron Bay b/c she is far away . If she really is far away, why would she mind them searching Byron Bay?

 

[Itsapuzzle]

Monday morning spontaneous thoughts ......wondering if Fernand knows about The Lady Vanishes podcast, and if so has he been listening to it. H'mm, starting to wonder too why he won't/doesn't want to clear his name, it is only adding to the suspicion that he knows something .... he may just be very stubborn and cranky about the situation, but I reckon the time has passed for all that .... it's time. Or maybe he is enjoying the notoriety - a quick look at the graph above shows a flatline of interest till the podcast came along. Fernand, if you're following along on the websleuths page we'd love to hear what you've got to say, drop in anytime, that'd be just great. Back from holidays, will catch up on the posts today.

 

[Intriguedbyintrigue]

Without another passport, there is a good likelihood she remained in Australia (unless she obtained a fraudulent passport, which seems like something way outside Marion’s wheelhouse). This could be why Marion tells bank officer not to look for her in Byron Bay b/c she is far away . If she really is far away, why would she mind them searching Byron Bay?

Odd choice of words "Dont search for me in Byron, I'm far away" rather than "don't search for me, I dont want to be found". Not terribly convincing either, you can see why Sally is focused on Bryon! Maybe Marion wanted to be located?

At this point her UK cover is effectively blown. Her family know she's been back so why not reclaim the UK money (and later) super? It makes me very concerned for Marion's safety. If she were being coerced/manipulated they would want that money too. If she were acting alone it would help her support herself

 

[JerseyGirl]

This thread has reached it's limit. I'll move over some recent posts and close this one shortly.

Please continue here: Australia - Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, June 1997 #2