Deceased/Not Found AZ - Jhessye Shockley, 5, Glendale, 11 Oct 2011 - #1 *J. Hunter guilty*

[Wanting2Help]

How could the cousin have told the family, they aren't speaking? Jerice stated early on that the cousins are not to be believed, they are angry people (or something to that effect). I find that that statement ironic. After watching the video where she verbally attacks the reporter for asking if she hurt her child ... I'm sorry guys, but I immediately thought, WOW- how would a helpless child feel when facing that. The lunge she made, her face as she spoke. I'm an adult and she frightened me with her reaction.

Gma and Jerice seem to want to hide things and I think it's part of a generational pattern of abusive behavior we are seeing. I also have begun to question Gma's motive in reporting Jerice and Shockley back in 2006. There is something wonky there, or at the very least multiple motives involved, MOO. Anybody else suspect this?

BBM

I thought the same thing about Jerice when I saw that video clip!!

Last night when Gma was on HLN I thought she was more interested in bashing LE and what they "haven't" done than talking about Jahessye. There must be a reason why CPS didn't place the kids with a family member. That is usually the first option. I think if I was in LE I would be VERY reluctant to share any details of the case with her as well.

I wonder if Gma's alibi has been checked out for the day she disappeared...? I agree something is "wonky" here!

 

[Knox]

BBM

I thought the same thing about Jerice when I saw that video clip!!

Last night when Gma was on HLN I thought she was more interested in bashing LE and what they "haven't" done than talking about Jahessye. There must be a reason why CPS didn't place the kids with a family member. That is usually the first option. I think if I was in LE I would be VERY reluctant to share any details of the case with her as well.

I wonder if Gma's alibi has been checked out for the day she disappeared...? I agree something is "wonky" here!

Especially since she had the kids for four years while Jerice served her sentence. I think it was Lynnb that put two and two together; Gma probably did not have permission to give them back.

I just had a thought. Vallejo is in the Bay area, the cost of living there is one of the highest in CA. Pretty sure AZ's benefits would be lower.

Do welfare benefits vary according to the area you live in? There are three regions in the CA-CPI Index, assuming it works the same?

Was Gma collecting benefits for the kids when they were not living with her? Maybe that's the $$ she wired to Western Union for Jerice?

 

[lynnb]

Especially since she had the kids for four years while Jerice served her sentence. I think it was Lynnb that put two and two together; Gma probably did not have permission to give them back.

I just had a thought. Vallejo is in the Bay area, the cost of living there is one of the highest in CA. Pretty sure AZ's benefits would be lower.

Do welfare benefits vary according to the area you live in? There are three regions in the CA-CPI Index, assuming it works the same?

Was Gma collecting benefits for the kids when they were not living with her? Maybe that's the $$ she wired to Western Union for Jerice?

I hate to even type this....but could the family be more concerned with welfare benefits that NO ONE will receive if the children are under CPS care? Is that the reason they bash LE and CPS more in interviews than they talk about Aliayah?

 

[lynnb]

Missing Girl's Mom Gives Birth
http://www.myfoxphoenix.com/dpp/news/local/glendale/missing-girls-mom-gives-birth-10282011
A family friend said Jerice Hunter gave birth on Tuesday and is now back home.

Hmmmmm. Tuesday was the 25th. Wednesday, the 26th....Grandma was on JVM and when asked about the birth played clueless. She knew nothing about it.
Me thinking someone was trying to hide a birth from CPS.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

I totally agree with everything you said. I'm thinking Gma wasn't supposed to give the children back..and she did so..without going through the proper channels. jmo

I'm not to sure about that. There were multiple family members involved in caring for JH's children and JH had to call LE to force Jahessye to be surrendered to her care. JH wouldn't have been able to do that if everything weren't on the up and up.

If it would have been just grandma involved, then I could see that as a possibility. But again there were other family members involved who very early on they made it clear very early on they did not think Jahessye should have been returned to mom. Grandma wouldn't have been able to get them to do that.

I do think that Grandma has been able to get the other relatives to not talk to media about their suspicions that JH abused her children.

Like everyone says there is just so much going on in this family, and especially with mom and grandma.

 

[lynnb]

Dr Drew covering Jhessye again

 

[lynnb]

Dr Drew has breaking news...he has the court documents from Mom's arrest for child abuse.
(oh brother!)

kids that are abused are more likely to run away and stay away.
more at risk for victimization from strangers
JVM is a guest. saying family is upset because LE has blinders on.
Grandma saying mom changed since her arrest

 

[lynnb]

JVM -so many unanswered questions. not calling her a suspect
DD -abuse does not mean you don't love your child
family very critical of LE for not paying more attention
JVM- Mom upset cuz media/LE keep focusing on Mom
JVM-seeing the same thing with the baby Lisa case
family may initially have had a point...but LE has been doing everything they can
DD-hundreds are lost every day and media can only focus on certain cases
very hard to focus on hundreds a day
JVm-vast majority are found. very small percent of stranger abductions. it does happen ex. Elizabeth Smart
DD- first 2 days are critical

moving on to Michael Jackson

 

[lynnb]

I'm not to sure about that. There were multiple family members involved in caring for JH's children and JH had to call LE to force Jahessye to be surrendered to her care. JH wouldn't have been able to do that if everything weren't on the up and up.

If it would have been just grandma involved, then I could see that as a possibility. But again there were other family members involved who very early on they made it clear very early on they did not think Jahessye should have been returned to mom. Grandma wouldn't have been able to get them to do that.

I do think that Grandma has been able to get the other relatives to not talk to media about their suspicions that JH abused her children.

Like everyone says there is just so much going on in this family, and especially with mom and grandma.

I'm not 100% sure I understand the whole child placement situation.
Grandma was in California with the older children. Jhessye was in Arizona with the cousins....correct?
Since Jhessye was in Arizona...would that mean any decisions made by CPS in California were either unknown or void to CPS/LE in Arizona since it was a different jurisdiction? I don't know if I'm explaining it right.
I'm also wondering if Grandma actually had the LEGAL custody of Jhessye but she stayed with the cousins anyway. I wonder if Grandma showed up with LE and Jerice when LE came to take J back. Legally they would have to return J to Grandma if they had custody of her illegally....correct? and if the cousins had nothing legally saying they had custody, J would have had to be taken out of the home. I just can't figure out why J went back to Mom.
It is soooo confusing to me that CPS can pick and choose which children stay with Mom and which ones don't. Something just isn't right with the whole custody explanation the family is telling. I wish LE or someone would clarify it, but I guess it's all confidential.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

If CPS comes in and removes this baby....Grandma is going to go through the roof!

No kidding!

Didn't Grandma have some kind of meeting with CPS about what is going on with the other kids? I'd be really interested to know if interactions between JH and her mom have changed since then. Ya know, grandma now knows more about what was going on in the home than JH told her when Jahessye first went missing?

Abuse? Drugs were in the home? Mom is shacked up with another SO?

 

[daisy.faithfull]

Just starting Dr. Drew now. Grandma is not going to be happy at all with his opening statements... O boy!

 

[daisy.faithfull]

I'm not 100% sure I understand the whole child placement situation.
Grandma was in California with the older children. Jhessye was in Arizona with the cousins....correct?
Since Jhessye was in Arizona...would that mean any decisions made by CPS in California were either unknown or void to CPS/LE in Arizona since it was a different jurisdiction? I don't know if I'm explaining it right.
I'm also wondering if Grandma actually had the LEGAL custody of Jhessye but she stayed with the cousins anyway. I wonder if Grandma showed up with LE and Jerice when LE came to take J back. Legally they would have to return J to Grandma if they had custody of her illegally....correct? and if the cousins had nothing legally saying they had custody, J would have had to be taken out of the home. I just can't figure out why J went back to Mom.
It is soooo confusing to me that CPS can pick and choose which children stay with Mom and which ones don't. Something just isn't right with the whole custody explanation the family is telling. I wish LE or someone would clarify it, but I guess it's all confidential.

Unfortunately JH had completed whatever process and jumped through the hoops, did her time etc. and was given her children back. It is very, very difficult to wrap our minds around, but it happens all the time. It makes not one bit of sense, but it is how the system works.

Family members did not want want to return Jahessye, but they had no choice. For all we know it was the same with the other children, but because the focus of the story is on Jahessye the family members only discussed her.

We know that the children had family members that were watching out for them, and know of at least one instance where they contacted CPS. I think if JH had any of the children illegally they would have alerted the appropriate authorities and made some noise.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/LaurieRoberts/146522

Hunter pleaded no contest to four counts of corporal punishment of a child. She went to prison shortly after giving birth to Jhessye in Arizona. While the grandmother took custody of the older children in California, Hightower says she and three other cousins took Jahessye.

Hunter served about half of her eight-year sentence before being paroled in May 2010, according to the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation. (Shockley remains in prison.) She was given unsupervised parole.

Hightower says Hunter and the child who had been so severely beaten came to Arizona shortly after she was paroled. She says the mother wanted Jhessye and became angry when the four cousins wouldn't immediately hand her over. Hightower says Jahessye was returned to her mother on Aug. 18, 2010, after police showed up and said they had to surrender the child.

Phoenix police spokesman Steve Martos couldn't confirm that police were dispatched but added that a report wouldn't necessarily have been written.

Hightower says she had concerns about the older child's wellbeing and called California CPS in February.

“I couldn't understand why Jerice was able was to get (the older child) back due to the fact that abuse to (the older child) was the reason why she was in prison from the beginning,” she said.
She says a California CPS worker told her that the agency was no longer involved and advised her to call Arizona CPS.

Hightower said she talked with an Arizona CPS caseworker several times between February and early May, to report the family's concerns that the two girls were being abused, including suspicions that Jahessye's two bottom teeth had been knocked out. She says the caseworker visited the older girl's school and Hunter's home but said there was nothing she could do.

“She basically said that the kids told her there was no abuse,” Hightower said.

I think the fact that everything was "legal" made it all the more horrifying for the family members who love these children. I hope with all my heart that they know that they did everything possible to keep those children safe and give them the love that they need and deserve.

I do not know for sure what happened to Jahessye, but I do know for sure that her family will wonder for the rest of their lives if they did everything they could for her. They did.

Now CA and AZ CPS, that's another story...

 

[belimom]

http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/LaurieRoberts/146522


I think the fact that everything was "legal" made it all the more horrifying for the family members who love these children. I hope with all my heart that they know that they did everything possible to keep those children safe and give them the love that they need and deserve.

I do not know for sure what happened to Jahessye, but I do know for sure that her family will wonder for the rest of their lives if they did everything they could for her. They did.

Now CA and AZ CPS, that's another story...

But do we know if it was really "legal" or not - when they came and got Jhessye? I wonder if it's possible that the mom convinced LE to go get her daughter from relatives, and they did without really checking? And now that it's in AZ, then CA doesn't want to get involved.

Just a thought that's been nagging at me for a few days.

ETA: Okay, just reading a few posts above - that the other kids were in CA with grandma and Jhessye was in AZ with cousins. I'm thinking that AZ had no idea that the kids had been taken away in CA - and probably had no idea of mom's arrest/incarceration for the abuse. So when she went to LE and said 'get my kid', then they did. With no communication with CPS/LE in California. Again, just speculation.

 

[belimom]

Sorry - two posts in a row here.

I'm beginning to think that CPS removed the older kids, but Jhessye may have been an unofficial arrangement - and not on record in CA as not supposed to be in the mom's custody.

We don't know the specifics and they all could have been legally returned to her, but I have my serious doubts.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

But do we know if it was really "legal" or not - when they came and got Jhessye? I wonder if it's possible that the mom convinced LE to go get her daughter from relatives, and they did without really checking? And now that it's in AZ, then CA doesn't want to get involved.

Just a thought that's been nagging at me for a few days.

ETA: Okay, just reading a few posts above - that the other kids were in CA with grandma and Jhessye was in AZ with cousins. I'm thinking that AZ had no idea that the kids had been taken away in CA - and probably had no idea of mom's arrest/incarceration for the abuse. So when she went to LE and said 'get my kid', then they did. With no communication with CPS/LE in California. Again, just speculation.

I would think that LE would be able to put in JH's name into the system and her record would pop right up. I can't believe that LE would require children to be surrendered to a parent or any person without some kind of legal documentation.

Some kind of documentation would have had to be in effect for Jahessye to have lived with the cousins while JH was in prison right? I mean, the courts would have appointed someone to be her guardian wouldn't they?

Edit to add: Since the courts would be involved how could it be "off the books" so to speak? I mean CPS has been really irresponsible of late, but that irresponsible not to assigned guardianship? Did mom have Jahessye while she was incarcerated?

Jahessye may not have had the same type of file with CPS that her older siblings had because she had not been born when JH tortured her children, but if Jahessye was born after JH was arrested.... they would have had to have been involved some how, right?

 

[lynnb]

I would think that LE would be able to put in JH's name into the system and her record would pop right up. I can't believe that LE would require children to be surrendered to a parent or any person without some kind of legal documentation.

Some kind of documentation would have had to be in effect for Jahessye to have lived with the cousins while JH was in prison right? I mean, the courts would have appointed someone to be her guardian wouldn't they?

You would think so, but J was so young it probably would have been pretty easy to work around the system. She wasn't in school yet. But the cousins would have had something in order to get medical care right? Can a cousin take an infant in for checkups or when they're sick and get treatment?

 

[belimom]

I would think that LE would be able to put in JH's name into the system and her record would pop right up. I can't believe that LE would require children to be surrendered to a parent or any person without some kind of legal documentation.

Some kind of documentation would have had to be in effect for Jahessye to have lived with the cousins while JH was in prison right? I mean, the courts would have appointed someone to be her guardian wouldn't they?

Wasn't JH charged/incarcerated in CA? And somehow Jhessye was with cousins in AZ - is that correct? So what I'm thinking is that: LE/CPS took the kids away from JH after the charges. She was still pregnant with Jhessye. When she had Jhessye, I wonder if she handed her to cousins and they went back to AZ. Maybe the placement with them was 'legal' through the CA court system, or maybe just a placement JH made on her own so that CPS would be satisfied that Jhessye had a safe place.

But then, JH returned to AZ upon getting out of prison. It really is so hard to get records transferred and kept straight from state to state. So what I'm wondering is if LE in AZ didn't know the extent of what had happened in CA. Maybe they didn't look into it, or didn't look hard enough.

But if you go to LE (not through the courts, necessarily), but you get an officer to accompany you to someone's home and say 'that' MY child and I want to take her', then perhaps the person handed Jhessye over, when LE didn't really look into it, kwim?

Really, I'm just speculating here. But I have a very hard time believing that JH was able to get unsupervised visitation, much less custody, of any of her children. At least that quickly and that simply. JMHO

ETA: I think we were discussing this a few pages back - how there is no 'national' CPS system. It's all state by state. So there is no national database of 'this child should not be living with this person'. We really need something like that.

I know what it's like calling another school district (and sometimes one in another state) to get records of a child in special ed.
- can't be released without parents requesting it (talking about the school records and my job)
- then:
- 'let me transfer you to so-and-so'
- 'I don't have that'
- 'I can't send that to you'
- 'I don't know who would handle that. Try this other number.'
- 'we don't have it under that name. is there another spelling?'
- 'I'll take your name and number and get back with you'

I can only imagine how hard it would be to track down something like this from AZ back to CA, and then try to find the right person, for a child who wasn't born when she was charged, whose name isn't on any record in CA (more than likely), etc, etc. See where this could have fallen through the cracks?

 

[Knox]

Sorry - two posts in a row here.

I'm beginning to think that CPS removed the older kids, but Jhessye may have been an unofficial arrangement - and not on record in CA as not supposed to be in the mom's custody.

We don't know the specifics and they all could have been legally returned to her, but I have my serious doubts.

Jahessye was born in AZ. Wonder how that relates to the custody agreement?

Hunter pleaded no contest to four counts of corporal punishment of a child. She went to prison shortly after giving birth to Jhessye in Arizona. While the grandmother took custody of the older children in California, Hightower says she and three other cousins took Jahessye.
http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/LaurieRoberts/146522

Every time I read about what JH did to that seven-year old, I want to vomit. Add, she was nude during and the SF was an RSO? I'll wager everything that happened to those children was not divulged.

 

[belimom]

Jahessye was born in AZ. Wonder how that relates to the custody agreement?

So, let me get this straight just to make sure I understand now that I've typed up my 'theory' - LOL!

- Mom was charged/incarcerated in CA
- other kids were with her in CA
- they were removed from her care in CA
- JH had Jhessye in AZ
- JH left Jhessye in AZ and returned to CA to serve her sentence
- JH got out of prison and collected her kids from her mother
- JH returned to AZ
- JH collected Jhessye from the cousin(s)

I can easily see a breakdown in communication with 'the powers that be'. Kwim? It's heartbreaking but I think it happens often.