CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #4

[10ofRods]

I wish they would call the FBI. She crossed state lines so they could very well do that.

Only if they can show a crime was committed. For missing persons, it's kids only, I believe. If LE can find any crime at all that RT committed over state lines, then yes. Or, if she is the victim of some other person, located only in California, but she went missing on federal land - it does become a federal case.

It's actually really interesting that, since it's a preserve and not a park, there's no local federal LE presence like in the National Parks. And...that's one reason we no longer go out there to camp. We had a really unpleasant experience in Nevada, in an out of the way hotel, and after that, we realized that we'd witnessed a few crime and suspicious activities in some remote campgrounds, too...and so now...we don't do that. It would be so awful for our kids, who implore us not to do risky things as they don't want to be the clean-up crew. I get that now.

 

[lonetraveler]

BBM

Did RT have a life insurance policy on Barbara ?
Anyone know ?

Would also like to know if the new truck and fifth wheel had life insurance policy that would pay them off if one of them died.

 

[10ofRods]

Maybe she mistook a wash for a trail? That seems easy enough, they're going to look similar on the ground.

The way that usually works is that someone mistakes another trail for a trail (often an animal trail, but in this case, there is literally a web of trails). Then, dehydrated, scared, confused and over-heated, the person decides they need higher ground and go up a wash to scout. She would have been really scared to have to do that, and completely turned around. It happens.

Many variables. If this is what happened...but to get into a wash, she had to be way off course from the RV and the road. We have to think about why she would wander so far away. The major dry washes are obvious places for helicopters to check and recheck (and they are also a place that animals take bones). I do think SAR people and others who know about this will go walk those washes next spring and see what they see.

 

[chihuahua]

I hope she's found asap.
We don't know what LE knows. Plain and simple.
I hope RT is being honest.
If there's no activity on these threads for BT, IMO that's not good.
Keeping her info in the publics' "eye" is important.
I'll read along for now as I've been thru the mountain lion theory many times before.
In the Karen Swift case, that's never been officially solved, the hit and run wasn't found to be true. As much as they've searched for any sign of BT, imo something indicating she had been hit would've been discovered.
Also, and I cringe typing this, IF she's out there deceased, there are animals and birds that would be active in their capacities in that regard.
LE so far says there's no proof of abduction.
What in the world has happened here?
Jmo respectfully,
Chi waiting on official reports

 

[bradfordsleuth]

The Bee with The Healing Center Needles.
Paid Partnership
·
#KaiserSpringsSearchandRescue

Wednesday (7/31) — On Late Tuesday (7/30) afternoon, the Mohave County Sheriff’s Office received a call from a 63-year-old male reporting that his 60-year-old female friend had become separated from him while hiking near Kaiser Springs and he was unable to locate her. They had gone hiking down the wash and at some point ran out of water. He began to have symptoms of heat exhaustion and took cover under a tree while she headed back towards their vehicle to get water. After some time had passed and she had not returned, he made his way back to the vehicle and was unable to locate her. Due to the remoteness of this area, he was unable to make a call out for help on his cell phone and flagged down a passing vehicle requesting them to call for help.
More at link

News brought to you by The Healing Center
#TheBeeTHC | www.thebee.news
~Photo Credit MCSO Search and Rescue ~




I can't help but draw a parallel between this successful rescue and the search for Barbara.

Note; SAR was able to locate and follow this woman's tracks, which led to her rescue.

Thank you for posting this!

I have bolded your last sentence because I think it speaks volumes about what this SAR team was able to do. A great job done finding her!!

Do you know how far this rescue was from where Barbara disappeared?

I am very interested to know if the terrain is similar.

 

[kay74]

Only if they can show a crime was committed. For missing persons, it's kids only, I believe. If LE can find any crime at all that RT committed over state lines, then yes. Or, if she is the victim of some other person, located only in California, but she went missing on federal land - it does become a federal case.

It's actually really interesting that, since it's a preserve and not a park, there's no local federal LE presence like in the National Parks. And...that's one reason we no longer go out there to camp. We had a really unpleasant experience in Nevada, in an out of the way hotel, and after that, we realized that we'd witnessed a few crime and suspicious activities in some remote campgrounds, too...and so now...we don't do that. It would be so awful for our kids, who implore us not to do risky things as they don't want to be the clean-up crew. I get that now.

Thanks, I didn't know that about the FBI.

 

[wary]

okay - so now you guys have me obsessing on this mountain lion speculation. God forbid the poor woman was attacked by a mountain lion - wouldn't RT have heard it?

I think it’s very unlikely that she was—but no, I believe it can be a very silent attack—visualize strong jaws with long fangs, closing around your throat. (I may have just given Roses another round of nightmares.)

But, they don’t attack humans often, and I doubt that the Mohave desert is prime territory for them—they hunt large prey primarily, deer, mountain sheep, etc.

P.S. I should say that I love mountain lions—magnificent cats.

 

[MassGuy]

okay - so now you guys have me obsessing on this mountain lion speculation. God forbid the poor woman was attacked by a mountain lion - wouldn't RT have heard it?

It would be nearly unprecedented, and would have left clear signs.

The odds of this happening are less than 0% in my opinion, the fact that no such thing exists, notwithstanding.

 

[Mind your biscuits]

Really agree with, and enjoy your posts, 10-of-Rods,

Was also doing research on mountain lions, and am almost convinced it could have been the reason for BBolick's disappearance.
Was also considering it for this "into thin air" BThomas scenario.

Either of these women could have crouched down to pick something up on the ground.
Park Rangers have always said to me, "oh yeah, we look like prey to the puma", when a human crouches down.

YES, mountain lions hunt during the day.
YES, mountain lions stalk and pounce very silently, and can kill quickly with a single bite to the neck. That method is in their DNA.

Although very uncommon, here's some tips to surviving an attack and some interesting quotes about mountain lion behavior:
The videos are amazing.
The anecdotal stories (esp. the one about the group in the cave) will send chills along your spine.

Understanding Mountain Lions When Hiking (2019) - HikingGuy.com

Trail Safety for Mountain Lion Encounters and Attacks

Mountain Lion Cougar, Panther or Puma - DesertUSA

​

That was really interesting, thanks for posting.

 

[LietKynes]

I'd like to know what LE knows ; and I'm sure it's far more than what we have at this time.

Took a brief look around comments on msm site, and many people have the exact same questions as we do.
Waiting for more news......

 

[LietKynes]

okay - so now you guys have me obsessing on this mountain lion speculation. God forbid the poor woman was attacked by a mountain lion - wouldn't RT have heard it?

BBM
Agreed.

A cougar attack would be the last possibility; in my mind.
Of course, so would abduction.

My first thought would be -- "Where did she go ? I'd better check and give a shout !"

One would think RT could hear screams, and there'd be blood evidence, correct ?

Past posts said RT had (I think) called for her and "waved his arms".... his words, not mine.
If a brief moment had passed where he lost sight of her and she'd wandered away-- couldn't she hear him yelling and see his arms flailing ?

And RT would've heard an animal attack-- because no one would be dragged away in complete silence. There'd be excruciating pain, for one thing.
MOO

 

[rosesfromangels]

I think it’s very unlikely that she was—but no, I believe it can be a very silent attack—visualize strong jaws with long fangs, closing around your throat. (I may have just given Roses another round of nightmares.)

But, they don’t attack humans often, and I doubt that the Mohave desert is prime territory for them—they hunt large prey primarily, deer, mountain sheep, etc.

Omg, yes. Adding to the nightmare indeed. I am now eyeing my cat with suspicion. I’m sure they all collude. ; )
What you are describing reminds me of what happened to poor Roy from Siegfried and Roy. Right to the neck; you are right. Shudder.
However, the general consensus on the thread seems to statistically dismiss the possibility.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[MsFacetious]

You cannot scream when an animal is clenched around your throat. You just can't.

 

[Liwthe]

I'd like to know what LE knows ; and I'm sure it's far more than what we have at this time.

Took a brief look around comments on msm site, and many people have the exact same questions as we do.
Waiting for more news......

Yes, I believe that’s because the titles ‘69yo in bikini with beer! Husband failed polygraph! Says he’s prime suspect!’

It’s not exciting otherwise. I went to Mike Galanos (whoever that is) that was linked here and that was pretty much all he said. It sure made it more exciting than mentioning that no foul play was suspected, and that the police did not have a suspect.

 

[rosesfromangels]

I want to focus on a different line of thinking, and see if it goes anywhere.

The road that BT would have supposedly crossed in bikini with beer in hand. Going on both directions, where is the first major destination? How thoroughly was this possibility explored?

Second, does anyone know if her passport, cards, etc have been used?
Any suitcases, clothes, or makeup missing?

Has RT volunteered to have the home searched?

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[GordianKnot]

It would be nearly unprecedented, and would have left clear signs.

The odds of this happening are less than 0% in my opinion, the fact that no such thing exists, notwithstanding.

Agree 1,000%, the fact that no such thing as 1,000% exists either, notwithstanding.

I put the odds at -.000000000001% that a mountain lion attacked her and carried her off, carefully leaving no tracks, blood or any other signs behind.

BTW, I think there IS such a thing as negative probability.

At least, I saw a movie called, "Less than Zero" once, anyway.

JMI.

 

[Liwthe]

I want to focus on a different line of thinking, and see if it goes anywhere.

The road that BT would have supposedly crossed in bikini with beer in hand. Going on both directions, where is the first major destination? How thoroughly was this possibility explored?

Second, does anyone know if her passport, cards, etc have been used?
Any suitcases, clothes, or makeup missing?

Has RT volunteered to have the home searched?

Amateur opinion and speculation

I want to focus on a different line of thinking, and see if it goes anywhere.

The road that BT would have supposedly crossed in bikini with beer in hand. Going on both directions, where is the first major destination? How thoroughly was this possibility explored?

Second, does anyone know if her passport, cards, etc have been used?
Any suitcases, clothes, or makeup missing?

Has RT volunteered to have the home searched?

Amateur opinion and speculation

I would say her cards etc have not been used considering the police don’t believe an abduction occurred and don’t suspect foul play. It would be pretty irresponsible if a kidnapper of seniors was on the loose and they lied to the public.

Re. RT and searches, I’d say highly likely as he was frightened by the police with the bogus polygraph and feared they didn’t believe him (this is my speculation). But I doubt he’s going to put himself on the news again given the response.

 

[rkendmar]

You cannot scream when an animal is clenched around your throat. You just can't.

Certainly there would be blood and other marks if an animal attacked her.

 

[MassGuy]

I would say her cards etc have not been used considering the police don’t believe an abduction occurred and don’t suspect foul play. It would be pretty irresponsible if a kidnapper of seniors was on the loose and they lied to the public.

Re. RT and searches, I’d say highly likely as he was frightened by the police with the bogus polygraph and feared they didn’t believe him (this is my speculation). But I doubt he’s going to put himself on the news again given the response.

We have no idea if they suspect foul play or not.

They might not have enough evidence to prove that foul play occurred, or don’t want to tip their hand if they do.

 

[diggndeeperstill]

I want to focus on a different line of thinking, and see if it goes anywhere.

The road that BT would have supposedly crossed in bikini with beer in hand. Going on both directions, where is the first major destination? How thoroughly was this possibility explored?

Second, does anyone know if her passport, cards, etc have been used?
Any suitcases, clothes, or makeup missing?

Has RT volunteered to have the home searched?

Amateur opinion and speculation

Sadly I don’t think we know much of that.

I’ll add this though. Personally I’d think rather than she being a target in her bikini I’d think their 5th wheel would be the biggest target for theft. I wonder if she’d feel safe and approach the rig if another vehicle was parked nearby that wasn’t there before.

 

[GordianKnot]

It’s possible a body won’t be found, but other important evidentiary items would be. Info about their relationship from close friends, neighbors, relatives that are involved in their lives, motives re. finances, possibly even clues left by the victim herself if she felt threatened, behavior of the spouse afterwards (new gf? Spending lots of money? Life insurance?).

You don’t need a body to know there has been foul play, and many cases are won of circumstantial evidence, even if prosecutors prefer to have the body.

Right.

Which is exactly why the searches in that location were suspended after LE found 0 evidence BT was ever there in the first place.
There were no evidentiary items found in that location.
I think LE drew some logical inferences from that.
LE is not going to assume on the basis of 0 evidence that she got lost in that desert, wandered off, and expired.
Especially not after 9 days of exhaustive searching.

They are going to be looking elsewhere for evidence now.

They are still fully engaged in the investigative process, as evidenced by the fact that Detectives from the Specialized Investigations Division have assumed the investigation.

They're making a change of tack.

I have no doubt LE is taking a hard look at all of those areas you identified above, in addition to gathering digital evidence to see if they can retrace the movements of BT and RT in the hours between she was last seen and when he reported her missing.

JMO.