CA - Hannah,16,Devonte,15,&Ciera Hart,12 (fnd deceased),Mendocino Cty,26 Mar 2018 #6

[waschbaer]

Why do you suppose police have no records of the death threats and stalking?

IMHO because they never happened. These people were not shy about calling the cops over noise and other petty neighborhood business, from what we have read in other media reports. So if someone vandalized their home or threatened them, they would have called. Or you know what, for a cross burning or graffiti on a building, a neighbor probably would have called! But it never happened.

 

[gitana1]

Be very careful around her. Try to keep her as far away from you and your world as you can.

She reminds me of a friend of mine who I had let stay with me on multiple occasions (6months, 1 year, etc) who returned from living in London for 8 years and, unbeknownst to me, returned with some heavy duty psychological problems. Our friendship ended in court when she attempted to get a restraining order against me for hacking her emails, phone, and anything else she could think of. It was insane. The judge ruled in my favor because she had zero reason to believe I had done anything, much less proof. I have heard that she has since turned her mother’s church against her, taken a cousin to court, and created problems for everyone who has been kind enough to give her a place to stay. I wish her family would find a way to get her the professional help she desperately needs.

Anyway, lol sorry for the rant, but I can’t stress how dangerous people like that can truly be to those who help them.


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Thanks for the advice! I need to be cautious. I've seen her as relatively harmless but she did try to join our business at one point. My partner and I were like, hell no.

She's very sweet but it's all super odd.

 

[bluesneakers]

Why do you suppose police have no records of the death threats and stalking?

You can't go to the police with anonymous internet harassment, and the alleged more vicious in-person stuff never happened.

So what they couldn't report they didn't and what they could have reported didn't happen. JMO

 

[StephanieH]

To be fair, I am the same age as the Hart women and there are few people from before college who would be able to say much about me. My grandparents did the bulk of raising me and they are all gone now. My mom went off to find herself (speaking of hippie nonsense) and my dad just went off. I got a scholarship to a college thousands of miles away and went out there, married a boy I met there, moved another thousand miles. Didn't keep in touch with high school people after a couple years. Have been a SAHM most of my adult life, so no coworkers. People in my neighborhood would talk about me, people from the kids' stuff, but no one from before about 2000.

I mean...who keeps in touch with people from high school (outside of facebook)?

 

[Stunned]

Why do you suppose police have no records of the death threats and stalking?

Cause there wasn’ any.

 

[katydid23]

That forever in your life friend would apsolutely have me backing away!

I think we should put that 'be in their lives forever' thing in another possible context.

We don't know what the conversation was, that made that word come up. I say that as an adoptive Mom, because one of the main things we are concerned with, is the possibility of triggering abandonment issues in our children. It is very hard on them to get close to someone emotionally, and see that person back away or ghost them.

So I do wonder if maybe the adoptee, who brought up the idea of being a mentor, was trying to assure the Moms that she would not get emotionally close to the kids and then disappear.

I really do not think that this woman just met them once, and suddenly out of nowhere, asked to help them do their hair, and wanted to be their forever mentor. I think there was more to it than that.

 

[mtnlites]

I mean...who keeps in touch with people from high school (outside of facebook)?

If you live in a small town? Pretty much everyone. My mom is 71 and still has her same core group of friends from high school. I live in a county with only 3,000 people. There's one elementary school, one middle school, and one high school. People rarely leave and almost nobody moves in. When you're looking at a geographic thing like that, it's natural to keep up with people from high school. Personally? I don't. I've from the next county over, had a much different experience, and I could care less what most of those folks are up to, though my best friend from elementary school is still my best friend (and my insurance agent). I don't think it's weird at all for someone not to keep up with people from high school. It's natural to move on-healthy, even.

 

[gitana1]

It's also something about the word "forever" that sets off alarm bells, as in the relatively new acquaintance telling JH that she felt a connection with her kids and wanted "to be in their lives forever."

I don't know, maybe I just watched The Shining too many times at an impressionable age, but that makes me squirm. JH obviously had other reasons as well for excluding strangers, but I would be wary of this offer as well.

I agree. But at these events there's this narrative that everyone is love and perfect and peace and there's no room for paranoia or suspicion. So effusive, intimate connections may be made more readily. Which can be dangerous if kids are involved.

No I certainly wouldn't look askance at that parenting decision. EXcept so much fits a pattern for me. Of isolation and carefully construcred appearances.

 

[bluesneakers]

She may not have filed any. I haven't with any of mine. I've complained to FB and they've removed things but I've never gone to the police. Now, if someone shows up at my door or threatens to come to my door, or if they do anything to dox me or harm my livelihood in any way then I'll file a report*. For the most part, however, these are one-off comments that are just meant to irritate the person. The first few you get are really hurtful and scary. After that, you mostly just shrug them off and tighten your inner circle. It's taken me years to be able to shrug them off, however. I can definitely see how they'd become overwhelming and how someone could get paranoid. I did reach a point in which I was even afraid to check my email. I was tired of the negative ones that I went 2 months without checking my messages. Once I did, I found 2 television show offers. Luckily, the producers were sympathetic.

As "wachbear" says below, though, they most likely never happened. If someone had vandalized their property it seems like they should have called the police.

*If someone continues to harass you or cyberstalk you, that's a different thing altogether. You should absolutely call the police. I would literally be filing a dozen or more reports a week, however, if I took them all seriously. You have to learn to spot the real threats from the trolls just be trolly.

If you have children or pets I think it's important to make contact with LE early so they're aware. (What prompted me to finally report my harassers was fear they would do something to my cat.) Anyway, IME most stalkers and trolls know exactly how far they can go without doing anything traceable or illegal so they slither all the way up to the line but never cross it.

Also in my experience it's difficult for people who haven't been on the other side to understand how vicious people can be.

I believe the Harts were harassed and threatened online but I doubt anyone showed up at their house or made an actual, credible sort of threat they could go to LE with.

 

[gitana1]

The only “ friends “they had were people they met at festivals. There was an article posted that said that even their “good friends” never went to their house.

People define friends in different ways. I would say they are aquaintances. Maybe not even that deep.

It is of startling note that they met Alexandra on FB and went to stay with her with six kids for two weeks. It is startling because they withheld food and punished kids for laughing.

This was parenting they felt could be a show. I cannot even imagine what life behind closed doors was.

I imagine Alexandra had something they wanted. I really wonder how much stuff they got from people in terms of money, clothing, vacations.

I am thinking of a woman I know who I have known for forty years who I only figured out a couple of years ago is someone who knows how to get stuff. She is an alternative healer with lots of skills that she uses .

I see vacations, expensive clothes she posts that she has received. So I wonder about the amazing Hart tribe. So deserving because of such tragic lives.

Shudders.

 

[bluesneakers]

It's also something about the word "forever" that sets off alarm bells, as in the relatively new acquaintance telling JH that she felt a connection with her kids and wanted "to be in their lives forever."

I don't know, maybe I just watched The Shining too many times at an impressionable age, but that makes me squirm. JH obviously had other reasons as well for excluding strangers, but I would be wary of this offer as well.

I mean no offense meant to hippies, but a lot of people in a natural alt-hippie love and peace sort of lifestyle talk like that. It's hard to read into it without knowing more. She might have been 100% sincere and was expressing the connection she felt to the children and the Hart family. (Source: My hippy siblings and west coast childhood.)

 

[bears10]

Here’s a news video clip of Jens good friend. She shared a very short video clip she took of Devonte at his house. I think it might have been on his birthday. He’s calls her by name. It looks like he might have been coached what to say.

https://youtu.be/bMgD0G9bEso

Wow. The denial is real. It’s like she’s trying to convince herself that they were parents because she doesn’t want to believe the truth. I mean has she not read about the abuse conviction and other CPS interactions? I am side eyeing.

 

[gitana1]

Here’s a news video clip of Jens good friend. She shared a very short video clip she took of Devonte at his house. I think it might have been on his birthday. He’s calls her by name. It looks like he might have been coached what to say.

https://youtu.be/bMgD0G9bEso

So that super articulate, charming kid will never be able to leave home, marry orbhave kids and that friend thinks THAT makes sense! Deluded.

General Question for anyone: just say the hate mail, threats, stalking were true. What kind of people would be doing this? And what would the hate mail say? No one knew then what we know about the photo being staged. Devonte was crying hugging a police officer. What were the haters interpreting? Im dumbfounded.

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Man just go on yahoo or YouTube comments and you'll see so much crazy it's insane. Racist. Misogynistic. Homophobic. Etc. It's crazy. It skewered my view of humanity for a secondnj til I realized how prolific trolls are and how they don't represent most people. But they can be savage.

The "hate mail" could very well have been from trolls making general, nasty comments. I posted about this earlier and spoke of my experiences (I have a job that necessitates a great amount of public interaction, most of which occurs online). I receive "hate mail" just about every day, even though what I do has nothing to do with politics, religion, or other polarizing topics. On my FB page yesterday I shared some examples of troll mail I've received this week alone. One person made fun of my hair (it's very blonde). Another person wrote and told me that they hoped someone would murder me because, well, I don't really know why. Just because. My 6-year-old is in the media a lot. Every time she gets out there, we are barraged with emails and calls from people who are literally just making fun of her, threatening her (or us), or hating on her looks (she is quite beautiful). As I shared in my other post, I once received a public comment from someone saying that she was "an abomination but still rapeable." She was 3 at the time.

I have a very non-polarizing job. My job literally just requires me to entertain people. That doesn't stop the trolls from trollin'. The "haters" don't have to "interpret" anything. If you do something that puts you out in the public eye, even for a second, then you're opening yourself up to a world of miserable people who simply want to be mean.

Ok that comment about your three year old. I'm sick. I hope you reported it.

 

[mtnlites]

So that super articulate, charming kid will never be able to leave home, marry orbhave kids and that friend thinks THAT makes sense! Deluded.



Man just go on yahoo or YouTube comments and you'll see so much crazy it's insane. Racist. Misogynistic. Homophobic. Etc. It's crazy. It skewered my view of humanity for a secondnj til I realized how prolific trolls are and how they don't represent most people. But they can be savage.



Ok that comment about your three year old. I'm sick. I hope you reported it.

Yep. Me and just about everyone else on my list. It still makes me sick to think about it. The entire comment read: "(my name), you may very well have the ugliest child ever spawned. I say that with the utmost sincerity. By the way, go ahead and set all of your pics to private. I already shared this pic about 3 hours ago and it's already all across the internet. But I don't know, some guys on 4chan seem to think it's "a horrible abomination but still rapeable". Smile (my name), your kid's famous."

I started to share the screenshot on here but figured it wasn't allowed.

Anyhoo, this is an example of how awful people can be. I reported it and FB investigated. Turned out to be a 16 year old kid just trolling around. That was 6 years ago, however, and I'm still shaken by it.

I have no doubt that the Harts received hate-filled mail after that picture went viral. It happens a LOT. (And yeah, You Tube and Topix will make you fear for humanity if you stay too long.) But even so, I think they embellished a lot of what they said, if not made it up altogether. They liked to document things. If they had "proof" wouldn't they have shown it for the sympathy? I took screenshots of the worst of mine.

 

[gitana1]

Why do you suppose police have no records of the death threats and stalking?

Because it was not true. Oh I have no doubt trolls made threats or said things on line. But anything in the mail, etc.? They were hiding from CPS by then. No one knew where they lived outside a few people. IMO.

 

[bears10]

You can't go to the police with anonymous internet harassment, and the alleged more vicious in-person stuff never happened.

So what they couldn't report they didn't and what they could have reported didn't happen. JMO

You can go to the police and report anything. Just like you can sue for anything. It doesn’t mean LE will investigate, but you can certainly report any crime to the police. I encourage anyone who’s being harassed or bullied online to report it to the police, and at least get it on the record.

 

[human]

To be fair, I am the same age as the Hart women and there are few people from before college who would be able to say much about me. My grandparents did the bulk of raising me and they are all gone now. My mom went off to find herself (speaking of hippie nonsense) and my dad just went off. I got a scholarship to a college thousands of miles away and went out there, married a boy I met there, moved another thousand miles. Didn't keep in touch with high school people after a couple years. Have been a SAHM most of my adult life, so no coworkers. People in my neighborhood would talk about me, people from the kids' stuff, but no one from before about 2000.

But high school people would have something to say

 

[whoopiecushions]

That forever in your life friend would apsolutely have me backing away!

Did she really make a comment about wanting to be in their lives forever? If she actually said that I'd feel differently. But I don't recall reading that. I was under the impression that they met and bonded and she casually offered to help the girls with their hair. That's the article I read. Perhaps there's another article with more information about this woman but this article didn't give me the impression that her offer was weird.
http://www.thenewstribune.com/news/local/article208294694.html

 

[gitana1]

She may not have filed any. I haven't with any of mine. I've complained to FB and they've removed things but I've never gone to the police. Now, if someone shows up at my door or threatens to come to my door, or if they do anything to dox me or harm my livelihood in any way then I'll file a report*. For the most part, however, these are one-off comments that are just meant to irritate the person. The first few you get are really hurtful and scary. After that, you mostly just shrug them off and tighten your inner circle. It's taken me years to be able to shrug them off, however. I can definitely see how they'd become overwhelming and how someone could get paranoid. I did reach a point in which I was even afraid to check my email. I was tired of the negative ones that I went 2 months without checking my messages. Once I did, I found 2 television show offers. Luckily, the producers were sympathetic.


As "wachbear" says below, though, they most likely never happened. If someone had vandalized their property it seems like they should have called the police.


*If someone continues to harass you or cyberstalk you, that's a different thing altogether. You should absolutely call the police. I would literally be filing a dozen or more reports a week, however, if I took them all seriously. You have to learn to spot the real threats from the trolls just be trolly.

Geez. I'm getting the picture you're painting. How do you think this kind of thing would affect people who are otherwise paranoid/anti-government and feel persecuted?

Im really sorry that you have had to go through all that. It's chilling.

 

[human]

I mean...who keeps in touch with people from high school (outside of facebook)?

Me. I am retired and have friends since elementary, jr, senior high, college.