GUILTY CA - Lydia Schatz, 7, beaten to death, sister injured, Paradise, 5 Feb 2010

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Pure and simple, "Spare the rod and spoil the child" has NOTHING to do with beating a child to DEATH! If these parents don't know or understand the difference, they need to be locked up for the rest of their lives for being STOOPID (spelled incorectly on purpose). If they did understand the difference, they need to be charged with premeditated murder and killed!

When will our society finally treat child murderers like any other murderers. Poor babies.
 
I was trying to post excerpts from the Pearls' book (which BTW, I was going to order until my husband reminded me that I would be giving them money--I told him to look at Goodwill for me). Thankfully, someone has gone to the trouble to synopsize some of the Pearls' greatest "pearls". These are comments that really cannot be taken out of context. They stand alone in their clarity and cruelty:

http://stoptherod.net/ttuac.html

http://stoptherod.net/index.html (some comments by survivors of this parenting)

http://www.topix.net/forum/source/paradise-post/TR5961JLU624GE9KS (numerous comments about the Pearls' methods)


You know, if the Pearls are sending out 74,000 newsletters bi-monthly (2006-07 figures), we've got big problems. What in heaven's name are going to become of the children who are raised this way? A comment is made on the Topix forum above as to why has this not been on Oprah or on 20/20? Why not? Not everyone reads Salon.com.
 
I don't think they murdered their daughter (not by definition of law), so I doubt they'll receive sentences appropriate for murder. Unless more comes out with the investigation, that is.

A high school classmate adopted a four year old boy from Liberia (they are Southern Baptists). For the first year, her husband openly expressed regret. Their biological son was a sweet natured obedient boy, but the little fellow from Liberia was a street child, and coped with his life in a VERY different way. His very being was alien to his new parents. He came up with things the parents never DREAMED, and they were horrified. It was a rough transition, to put it lightly. The father wanted to reverse the adoption (not a real flexible kind of guy) but now the boy is eleven or twelve, and apparently they have all adjusted to each other.

I wonder what part this same scenario played for the Schatz's, street smart survivor children suddenly placed in such an authoritarian environment, with parents who don't have a lot of psychological flexibility or competency to deal with "differences".

I wonder if the expectation of the parents is that the poor child will be filled with gratitude for being rescued, and compliant and ready for their "new life". I wonder what role that plays out in the subsequent problems of adjustment. A street savvy kid, a survivor who learned early that they could only trust themselves, suddenly plopped in a patriarchal, culturally naive fundamentalist Christian family and is expected to be "grateful" and compliant. Holy smokes!
 
Thank you PeteyGirl, my views exactly. Sometimes it works but often it does not. I've posted about our own horrors with a Haitian adoption. Actually, I've only barely scratched the surface as many people honestly would not believe what traumatized children can do. There would be many who would not believe me....unless they've been there.

IMO, the mix of older, institutionalized and internationally adopted children with patriarchal Fundamentalist "quiverfull" families is fraught with danger and heartbreak. You add in the permission, even admonition, granted by the Pearls to beat a child who is either strong willed or not yet imprinted with pleasing a parent they have yet to attach to until they submit and you've got a death on your hands.

I have wondered since this story broke about the adoption agency which handled this adoption. I found this interesting bit of info. As I suspected, the agency was willing (for whatever reason) to look the other way when it came to the Schatz's discipline techniques. Best practice in adoption home study would be to go over this subject at length and to question the other children in the home privately about the family rules.

Being that the biological children in this family have, by their own admission, been disciplined in a similar fashion for their entire lives, someone in the family lied or the adoption agency did not do their job.

http://poundpuplegacy.org/node/42746

".....It would appear that the Schaltz fraudulently lied to Heartsent Adoptions Inc. concerning appropriate accepted discipline methods or Heartsent Adoptions Inc. failed to investigate the Schaltz family properly by perhaps questioning them and their children concerning all methods used in discipline....."



And an excellent blog by an appalled former Quiverfull mom, concerning Michael Pearl's
response to his critics:

http://blogs.alternet.org/vyckie/tag/kevin-and-elizabeth-schatz/


“It has come to my attention that a vocal few are decrying our sensible application of the Biblical rod in training up our children. I laugh at my caustic critics, for our properly spanked and trained children grow to maturity in great peace and love.”

If you scroll down, you can read how you totally train a tiny child to forevermore resist all temptation. IMO, about the only place I see this type of training having any use is with working dogs where life and death play a factor.

"........Michael Pearl suggests tempting a child with a bite of their favorite food ~ placing a morsel within the child’s reach ~ and when said child instinctively reaches out for the food ~ Switch their hand once and simultaneously say, ‘No.’ Repeat as many times as necessary until the child is trained not to automatically grab for whatever he or she wants ~ but rather, to automatically look to the parent for permission before reaching out to take the desired food...."
 
He does use it on dogs!!

http://blogs.alternet.org/vyckie/tag/kevin-and-elizabeth-schatz/

"...You think that Michael Pearl’s lunatic ranting cannot possibly get any worse? Think again:

“Even my chickens are laughing . . . well, actually it is more like cackling, because they just laid another organic egg for my breakfast and they know that it was that same piece of ¼ inch plastic supply line that trained the dogs not to eat chicken.”

Shameless and unrepentant, Michael Pearl shows not an ounce of remorse or regret ~ not even an inkling of pity for Lydia Shatz or her parents who are living the nightmare of knowing they killed their child for the glory of God."
 
In doing some research on Heartsent Adoptions (which looks as if they have discontinued their Liberian program), I learned that they actually validate that many older, internationally adopted children might have some challenges. The Schatz family must have skipped the program outlined below and opted for the cheaper version of just purchasing Michael Pearl's books:

http://heartsent.org/heartsent_learning_solutions.html

"Research clearly shows that unless a child is moving around in their world, the wiring in their brain does not make complete connections. Without complete and connected wiring, without integration of the infant reflexes, everything these children do is such HARD WORK. The child struggles, until one day they reach a place where there is literally more expected of them than their systems can handle, and they shut down.

This shut down can look like ADHD, or learning disabilities, or autism, or depression, or rebellion, or drug and alcohol abuse … it has several different faces. The bottom line is the underlying neurodevelopment was not complete, no more ‘learning’ can be piled on that weak system, and it collapses."

and

"There is an answer for these children and the families who love them: Heartsent Learning Solutions. This is a neurologically based program of movement therapy and academics. Heartsent Learning Solutions provides a program of playful activities that stimulates the necessary brain development - coupled with academic instruction as is appropriate for the child's age and grade level.

We will suggest you bring your child to us, for a few weeks. The average program is 6 weeks: 2 hours a day, 4 sequential days each week - for a total of 48 hours. The average cost is $3580: $700 for the initial assessment, program development, reassessment, and all conferencing; plus $2880 for the (average of) 6 weeks of instruction. The end result is lasting improvement for your child in the areas s/he needs....."



Remember, that this is ON TOP of the very expensive costs of international adoption, $10,000-25,000. Why am I not getting this? People yell and scream that domestically adopted children have been brutalized by our system. That can be true. But this sort of cost is mind-boggling when it comes to parenting a special needs child. And keep in mind that many of these families have 6-20 children adopted internationally.
 
Missizzy said:
-snip-

"........Michael Pearl suggests tempting a child with a bite of their favorite food ~ placing a morsel within the child’s reach ~ and when said child instinctively reaches out for the food ~ Switch their hand once and simultaneously say, ‘No.’ Repeat as many times as necessary until the child is trained not to automatically grab for whatever he or she wants ~ but rather, to automatically look to the parent for permission before reaching out to take the desired food...."
Click to expand...

:furious: What a pathetic :censored: .

Shame on him. There's even a Bible verse that teaches against that sort of thing! I can't remember the specifics, but it's something like, "Fathers, do not [frustrate/tempt] your children." ...does anyone else remember it?

Ugh. Boy, would I like to see a real man - a real father with true wisdom, take a rod upside the head of this ...D0u$hB@g. :furious:
 
Maybe there's a page or two missing from the Pearl's Bible:


Ephesians 6:4 (New International Version)

"Fathers, do not exasperate your children; instead, bring them up in the training and instruction of the Lord."


Colossians 3:21 (New International Version)

"Fathers, do not make your children resentful. Otherwise, they'll become discouraged."


and my favorite:

Matthew 19:14 (New International Version)

Jesus said, "Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these."
 
We home school our children. They're very good kids. They're both unusually mild, easy going people by nature. They didn't belong in public school because the noise, bad behavior from students and staff, and lack of personal attention really short-changed them educationally.

That being said, everyone should not home school. Every child should not be home schooled. If a parent is stressed out, s/he should probably enroll the kids in school. If a particular child proves to be too much of a handful at home, getting help from the public schools is a viable option. It's OK for some of a family's children to be home schooled, and others not.

I believe I read that the type of kidney damage the children suffered is often experienced by victims of crush injuries. (It happened quit a bit in the wake of the Haiti earthquake.) The damaged muscle tissue must be reabsorbed by the body, and it puts strain on the kidneys. It seems really vicious to deliberately inflict injuries of that extent to a child.

It also seems completely inappropriate to punish a child for an academic error, as opposed to misbehavior. In general, I find that a low-key, non blaming response is better for addressing academic error and confusion. Calm, happy, trusting kids give a better academic effort than stressed ones.

Adopting kids from the third world has become very fashionable for Evangelicals and Baptists. One quite reasonably wonders if some of them are doing it in order to conform to the expectations of their church, or simply to seem holier than the run of the mill parishioner. Perhaps it would be wise for adoption agencies to explore these questions before handing children over to flamboyant, outwardly religious parents. Many of these families aren't as happy on the inside as their public image suggests.

Authorities should be aware that it's very easy to tell the difference between a normal home school family and the rare abusive one. Abusive home schoolers will not associate with the rest of us. Normal home school families are extremely social, and get together regularly for field trips, co-ops and social events. Abusive ones are severely insular.
 
Annie Mouse--That was a great post and very informative. You just reaffirmed what I suspected--that the hardcore disciplinarians who home school rarely socialize with our garden variety home schoolers. Home schooling is very common in our town and the families do lots of cool stuff together. We even have a separate learning center for the kids who are home schooled so that they can get together. I've seen it and it's really fabulous--a huge garden, lots of animals, etc.

I, too, have been highly concerned about the growing "trend" of third world adoptions among Evangelicals. I sense that there is an almost palpable competition as to who can parent the most. My take on it (an I am what I would term mainstream/liberal Christian) is that it's an extension of mission work. They're just bringing the "unsaved" home. I laughed when I read your adjective "flamboyant" as I typically assign that word to certain gay guys. I think I get a pass on that one as one of my sons identifies himself as "flaming". To me the word means highly conspicuous and over the top. I'm sorry if it offends. I'd actually like to borrow it as it fits perfectly for some of the families I've seen.

My husband has always had a litmus test as to how to tell if children in a family have sufficient autonomy. It's if every boy is wearing identical shirts and every girl wearing identical dresses. Maybe OK for the occasional photo but just not healthy on a day to day basis IMO. I read one comment about the Schatz girls that said that they dressed alike. That worries me.
 
When you were telling what they do to a baby re the food, my first thought oh, that's a trick we taught our dog... but never did it involve hitting.... ever.

This guy Pearl is deranged. Too bad the only knows to get his children to behave is to beat it into them.

We know why they only do this in private, they would be arrested in public.
Just once, just once I'd like to see one of these sobs hit a 1 year old baby in front of of me. It would be worth getting arrested to use every ounce of anger I am carrying around right now reading this.

I found a question and answer section and copied and pasted some snippets but after finding the following I deleted all of them. This is a piece of an article, a woman who is clearly depressed after a miscarriage and part of Michael's reply. This (I don't know what to call him, he's not a man IMO) this creature masquerading as a man. He disgusts me.

Sad Woman:

Even now I have nightmares every night. I dream that my baby is crying and when I go to take care of him, I can’t find him. I look everywhere but I can’t find my baby. I have even woken up my husband asking him to help me find our baby. I have dreamed that my baby was beautiful and healthy. I would wake up deciding how my baby and I are going to spend the day and I realize that there is no baby.

Michael answers:

Are you thinking about what is best for your child, or what you think is best for yourself? Do you know that this little one would be born whole to live a normal life? Do you know that he/she would not suffer from a chronic disease? Do you know that you child would have grown up to honor God and life a fruitful life? If your child was not going to be saved, would you still want him/her to come into the world and live such a short time just to spend eternity in hell? How can you be so sure that you know what is best? Like Job you need to be humbled and face the fact that your world has revolved around you. It is time you resigned as chairman of the universe and leave it to God to do a little “baby sitting” until you get there to take over for him. I am sure your baby is in the best of hands.

http://www.nogreaterjoy.org/letters/questionsanswered/archive/2008/january/18/miscarried/

I guess because he is such a a godly man he knows what is best for the universe. One, just one ounce of sympathy or respect for her regarding her severe emotional pain. But no, just like the rest of his comments; only he knows best.

Their biography claims 5 children and 14 grandchildren (more to come!). Really? They know this because??

Michael Pearl is a narcissist, possibly deranged and a cruel, evil, excuse for a man. I'm so sorry this child has died, but if her death exposes this monster for what he is her death at least was not in vain. Maybe her death, will save the rest.
 
missizzy said:
i too wonder how anyone has time to do anything if they are homeschooling and chastising all day. If you are following the quiverfull philosophy, you'd have a houseful of little ones to feed and keep clean too.

But isn't this almost identical to the flds? One could eat off their floors, they were so clean. I guess the angst has to go somewhere.

I'm christian and i agree that jesus would be ashamed and appalled. Remember, he's the one who showed great mercy on the children. I'm often driven to say, "that's not my jesus you're talking about".
Click to expand...

FLDS? is this the off shoot from LDS?

My oldest daughter was raised Christian by me, with the Catholic influence thanks to my parents and as a teen joined the Mormons, which meant I was "Mormon by association" meaning she did not get my permission to go off and join a religion I knew next to nothing about, without doing as many of the functions as possible with her - and if I couldn't be there I knew who she was with and felt comfortable with them. Her best friends mother talked with me often, answered my questions - even the ones that I was was raised well enough not to ask. LOL

But eat off their floor? No. thank. you. They were mostly too busy raising kids to worry about the cleanliness of their floor. I will give credit where it is due - her ward bishop, I'd eat off that floor - but I kinda doubt she washed it herself.
 
LCoastMom--I don't think we're going to see the end of the Pearls until the Evangelicals and Fundamentalists run him out on a rail. One does not have to approve of or agree with a particular dogma to respect that faith. There are many faith and belief systems which I believe are misguided and just plain wrong but which I can easily respect as they do not break society's laws. When a group embraces (to the tune of 1.5 million per year) a man who touts child abuse, I lose respect for that entire faith. They are allowing a monster to stay in their "fold".

I happen to believe that there are hundreds of thousands of Evangelicals and Fundamentalists who are fine and loving parents and who would never espouse this form of abuse. It is time for them to speak up and to expose this wicked man for what he is.

I'd really like to ask them the cliche but oh so pertinent question:

What would Jesus do?
 
A thought provoking commentary by the hometown newspaper where little Lydia Schatz was murdered. This discusses the moral, if not legal, responsibility which the Pearls must bear. I don't think this has been linked:

http://www.paradisepost.com/ci_14427374?source=rss_viewed

A huge difference between abuse and discipline

"There are few stories that enrage people more than the senseless abuse of children. In Paradise that took form in the murder of the 7-year-old adopted girl allegedly at the hands of her parents.

The same parents are alleged to have also nearly beaten their 11-year-old adopted daughter to death. She's in a North State hospital and is expected to recover. We have learned several things since that tragic Saturday morning. One of those things is the tool the family allegedly used was quarter-inch plumbing supply line and it seems the idea was inspired by No Greater Joy Ministries...."

more at link
 
A snip I found from the Pearl book. I swear if I didn't know better, I'd think I'd stumbled upon some S&M erotica for consenting adults:

http://www.nogreaterjoy.org/article...//in-defense-of-biblical-chastisement-part-2/

"Our goal is to cause the child to voluntarily surrender his will. We want to impress upon him the severity of his disobedience. It takes time and thoughtfulness for the child to come to repentance. I have told a child I was going to give him 10 licks. I count out loud as I go. After about three licks, leaving him in his position, I would stop and remind him what this is all about. I would continue slowly, still counting, stop again and tell him that I know it hurts and I wish I didn’t have to do it but that it is for his own good. Then I would continue slowly. Pretending to forget the count, I would again stop at about eight and ask him the number. Have him subtract eight from ten, (a little homeschooling) and continue with the final two licks. Then I would have him stand in front of me and ask him why he got the spanking. If his answer showed that he was rebellious and defiant, he would get several more licks. Again he would be questioned as to his offense. If he showed total submission, we put it all behind us, but if he were still rebellious, we would continue until he gave over his will."

And don't try this in public!!

"Don’t be so indiscreet as to spank your children in public—including the church restroom. I get letters regularly telling of trouble with in-laws who threaten to report them to the authorities. Parents have called the Gestapo on their married children. Church friends who have noses longer than the pews on which they perch can cause a world of trouble. If you cannot get them trained before going out in public, stay home and read our four books again."


I'm sorry guys, but I still can't get past this garbage. I don't know the Pearls but I'm almost starting to think that they could write S&M erotica. We're talking about little children and total submission.

So exactly where does that leave the kids as far as defending themselves against a pedophile in position of authority? You know, like at church?
 
these people are twisted. and they use god as there excuse, and im sick of it. every psycho seems to use god to justify his/her actions these days.
 
LCoastMom said:
When you were telling what they do to a baby re the food, my first thought oh, that's a trick we taught our dog... but never did it involve hitting.... ever.

This guy Pearl is deranged. Too bad the only knows to get his children to behave is to beat it into them.

We know why they only do this in private, they would be arrested in public.
Just once, just once I'd like to see one of these sobs hit a 1 year old baby in front of of me. It would be worth getting arrested to use every ounce of anger I am carrying around right now reading this.

I found a question and answer section and copied and pasted some snippets but after finding the following I deleted all of them. This is a piece of an article, a woman who is clearly depressed after a miscarriage and part of Michael's reply. This (I don't know what to call him, he's not a man IMO) this creature masquerading as a man. He disgusts me.

Sad Woman:

Even now I have nightmares every night. I dream that my baby is crying and when I go to take care of him, I can’t find him. I look everywhere but I can’t find my baby. I have even woken up my husband asking him to help me find our baby. I have dreamed that my baby was beautiful and healthy. I would wake up deciding how my baby and I are going to spend the day and I realize that there is no baby.

Michael answers:

Are you thinking about what is best for your child, or what you think is best for yourself? Do you know that this little one would be born whole to live a normal life? Do you know that he/she would not suffer from a chronic disease? Do you know that you child would have grown up to honor God and life a fruitful life? If your child was not going to be saved, would you still want him/her to come into the world and live such a short time just to spend eternity in hell? How can you be so sure that you know what is best? Like Job you need to be humbled and face the fact that your world has revolved around you. It is time you resigned as chairman of the universe and leave it to God to do a little “baby sitting” until you get there to take over for him. I am sure your baby is in the best of hands.

http://www.nogreaterjoy.org/letters/questionsanswered/archive/2008/january/18/miscarried/

I guess because he is such a a godly man he knows what is best for the universe. One, just one ounce of sympathy or respect for her regarding her severe emotional pain. But no, just like the rest of his comments; only he knows best.

Their biography claims 5 children and 14 grandchildren (more to come!). Really? They know this because??

Michael Pearl is a narcissist, possibly deranged and a cruel, evil, excuse for a man. I'm so sorry this child has died, but if her death exposes this monster for what he is her death at least was not in vain. Maybe her death, will save the rest.
Click to expand...

BBM -
mmmmmmmmmm - I think I can guess who'll spend their eternity in Hell....and it's not the babies.

Where does this jerk get this carp?? None of the evangelical/fundamentalist religions I'm familiar with believe little kids go to Hell....they believe in that whole "age of accountability" thing - which doesn't include babies or toddlers!!

It's monsters like this that end up with followers who are looking for validation for what they might not do w/o encouragement.

(And I'm gonna stop now because I don't wanna get a TO.)

ETA: One more thing -- what about the law of the land? where does this butthead get off telling people to break the law & hide it? How Biblical is that teaching? :mad:
 
You know, TM, you're right. Christians (that I know of anyway) believe that children reach the age of "reason" and then can make a decision for themselves. That's when "accepting Christ" and possible baptism occurs.

So, did Mr. Pearl totally change another tenet of the Bible without telling the rest of us? My grandbaby died 6 hours after her birth and I happen to know where she is. She is in her Great Grandpapa's arms. I'm getting a strong feeling Mr. Pearl's never going to get the pleasure of meeting her or my Daddy.
 
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