CA - Massive fire at Oakland warehouse party, 36 dead, 2 Dec 2016 #2

[alsleuther]

http://www.crimemapping.com/map/agency/265

I just dropped the warehouse address into this website and it lets you see reported crimes for the past 6 months. You have to search in smaller time frame incidents. It definitely doesn't look like a safe neighborhood, but I couldn't find any incidents right at the location of the warehouse.

I was kind of expecting at least some petty theft or maybe some arrests relating to complaints from their neighbor, the car repair business, but nothing....hmmm.....

Seems that everyone was turning a blind eye to this building.

 

[alsleuther]

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/investiga...nd-Warehouse-Sends-Condolences-404628345.html


"Ng’s daughter Eva and son-in-law Edward Liou refuted claims by fire officials that the building’s makeshift staircase was made out of wooden pallets. They said the staircase was a permitted stairway. Survivors of the blaze said a single, shoddily built staircase hampered efforts to exit the warehouse."

This makes me think that the pallet staircase was one of Derick's "warehouse improvements", after he blocked off the true staircase that led to his living quarters.

Also interesting, the son in law appears to be a successful Bay area executive at a medical device company, per linked in.

 

[Jax49]

http://www.crimemapping.com/map/agency/265

I just dropped the warehouse address into this website and it lets you see reported crimes for the past 6 months. You have to search in smaller time frame incidents. It definitely doesn't look like a safe neighborhood, but I couldn't find any incidents right at the location of the warehouse.

I was kind of expecting at least some petty theft or maybe some arrests relating to complaints from their neighbor, the car repair business, but nothing....hmmm.....

Seems that everyone was turning a blind eye to this building.

Thanks for the link.

I checked for arson around the warehouse for the longest time frame I could get to work (about 5 months).

I don't know if the result is normal or high. None were really close to the warehouse but several in the larger area.

 

[alucardsdream]

I imagine the owner really didn't know what was going on at the warehouse...I'm guessing as long as she got the rent on time, she just didn't care. Of course ignorance is no excuse. One of my friends owns a few commercial properties that he rents out to various businesses, but they're pretty much all restaurants so that means health inspectors are in and out of them each year making sure they're up to code since they're open to the public. That provides a bit of a safeguard that didn't really exist in the case of the warehouse. I feel like the system here just broke done, and if there hasn't been a fire with mass casualties no one would have been any wiser.

 

[JDauxa]

Gitana- my heart aches for you and your family. I am an older sister to 2 brothers who I would go to the ends of the earth for. While I may not personally know you, please know that you and your family are in our hearts.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[CARIIS]

[h=1]Beloved Denver DIY Venue Rhinoceropolis Shut
Down in Wake of Oakland Fire[/h]
Imo this kind of response is only for people who have money to move.

This imo is not the answer.

Maybe a responsible answer would be to do what they are doing inspect more, pikc the most dangerous violation, give em two weeks to fix, then give them the next one on the list.

Of course there places people are living that dont have the latest but to toss people out in the street as the answer is just moving a problem around for the sake of elected officials.

Its how we address everything one shoe bomber go TSA. Same mo knee jerk, fool this masses that your govt is hard at work, go back on vacation, and wait till the next event that requires a bunch a money, only to find in a decade that it changed the problem, cost 1.2 trillion and that a committee needs to be formed to "study" the problem for the next decade.

So worried about everyone safety, why doesn't the govt neg a contract for smoke alarms that come out to 29 cents a piece, buy 15 million of em , give em out free - its a stop gap but running around emptying all these places out is NOT the solution

moo



http://pitchfork.com/news/70344-bel...oceropolis-shut-down-in-wake-of-oakland-fire/

 

[CARIIS]

Thanks for the link.

I checked for arson around the warehouse for the longest time frame I could get to work (about 5 months).

I don't know if the result is normal or high. None were really close to the warehouse but several in the larger area.

Jax

do you know how to get a list of the owners others property in the area??

 

[LaborOfLobe]

http://www.denverpost.com/2016/12/08/fire-safety-eviction-art-colony-denver-brighton-blvd/

Sorry if this has been posted. Here is an example of how the system works in places other than California and exactly what Mr. Lobe the Building Inspector has been saying. LOL I'm going to start calling him that. Anyway, it does not always take weeks or months of court proceedings to remove people from an unsafe environment.
We all have opinions on who is to blame, how much power the city should have over these situations, and that's a-ok. I'm not here to argue with anyone. My husband's job is to ensure the safety of human lives, and he has the power to do that. He cares, and I admire him greatly.

 

[CARIIS]

“We’ve been here 25 years, and if they were bad landlords, we would have known,”

Found some clues as to what they own 13th and Harrison the massage parlor, bakery, nick-knack stores.

To her tenants scattered in tiny storefronts throughout Oakland, Chor Ng is the quiet, unobtrusive landlord who shows up once a month in her white Mercedes-Benz to politely collect her rent checks.
By all accounts, the 62-year-old Ng doesn’t interfere in those little businesses, which include a bakery, a florist shop, a Buddhist Temple and a massage parlor offering foot and body rubs for $35 an hour.

[FONT=&quot] building on 13th and Harrison streets

$5 million Oakland property portfolio

En Moda clothing shop in another warehouse

business was damaged by water during the firefight and she’s probably going to be closed through Christmas, she said she holds no ill will toward Ng or her adult daughter, who handles some of the properties’ affairs.


After the fire, she said, “the Ng family emailed us to say they’ll take care of us, will help us reopen as soon as we can. They’ll help us get engineers in to work on the damage.
“For the most part, they — the family — do OK by us.”

they planned to terminate the lease, which was set to expire in November 2018, he said.

owned the two-story, 4,000-square-foot structure since 1988.

another example of clearing the issue:
Alameda County placed a $1,684 lien on the property, citing “substandard, hazardous or injurious conditions.” The lien was released in 2009 after the issues were abated.

another :

Eva Ng responded in an email dated Sept. 21, 2014, that the lot next to the warehouse had become a “dumping ground” but that she was working on the cleanup.

new name in the mix

Ng’s daughter Eva and son-in-law Edward Liou






[/FONT]


http://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/...rehouse-owner-A-polite-hands-off-10787291.php

 

[CARIIS]

A former warehouse owner interviewed by the NBC Bay Area Investigative Unit said a mish mash of conflicting laws enables these artist colonies to exist

......... took him nearly a decade of legal fighting to get out from the problems created when an artist colony moved into his warehouse. The move was done without him giving his approval or even knowing about it.


When we finally got into the building we found a commercial kitchen, we found hazardous materials," the former owner said.

.
"As the landlord we are in a catch-22. We can't even get into our own building much less see what's going on," the former owner said.

The former owner said the current housing shortage will prevent any real reform from actually taking place.

t. We even found one building where AirBnb was listing room within the warehouses for rent," he said.


the former owner said he could not evict the tenants because the middle man who leased the building was considered the landlord. The former warehouse owner could not even go into his own building.


........ why he believes Oakland building code inspectors couldn't get into the Ghost Ship building as well. The people who had taken up residence there simply would not agree to let them in for an inspection


Source: Conflicting Laws Enable Artist Colonies in Warehouses: Former Owner | NBC Bay Area http://www.nbcbayarea.com/investiga...es-in-Warehouses-404875985.html#ixzz4SS9rjQqn
Follow us: @NBCBayArea on Twitter | NBCBayArea on Facebook

 

[McMunn]

I came across this story last night while looking for survivor stories. Not sure if this is even a legitimate story, since TMZ is known to be tabloidish. Anyone else read about this?

http://www.tmz.com/2016/12/08/oakland-fire-commune-leader-survivors/


Oakland Fire Survivors Reunite with Commune Leader

Some of the Oakland fire survivors broke bread with Derick Ion Almena for the first time since the tragedy -- despite him getting blasted for alleged dangerous conditions in the building.

Witnesses tell us the group sat down at a Denny's in Oakland Wednesday night, had a meal ... then went to the Red Cross to pick up some clothes. We're told the entire meal was comped by the Denny's staff.

Our sources tell us ... the people gathered around Almena were residents of the commune who got out of the building the night of the inferno that killed at least 36 people.

The woman next to him is his wife, Micah, who was staying at a hotel the night of the fire.

 

[CARIIS]

They owned these

San Francisco’s Lombard Street houses apartments and a dry cleaning business

cant figure out which is which but nothing looks unatteneded here

https://www.google.com/search?q=San+Francisco%E2%80%99s+Lombard+Street+houses+apartments&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS702US702&espv=2&biw=907&bih=441&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjTtoC9hurQAhXINSYKHVcsCNkQ_AUIBigB

 

[CARIIS]

Forgive me computer acting weird gonna do it chunks casue of computer weirdness!

omplaint about wires sparking had been lodged to no avail. A smoke detector required by code was not in place. The fire spread rapidly, trapping the victims.
The blaze occurred in 1997 and killed four young children and a grandmother. A San Francisco public housing agency that owned the building was held primarily accountable. A jury awarded family members $15 million — $3 million for each of the dead.

Lawsuits against property owners have produced huge verdicts — and often years of efforts to recover the money. In some cases, criminal charges have been filed, with mixed results.

http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-oakland-legal-fire-20161205-story.html

 

[CARIIS]

I came across this story last night while looking for survivor stories. Not sure if this is even a legitimate story, since TMZ is known to be tabloidish. Anyone else read about this?

http://www.tmz.com/2016/12/08/oakland-fire-commune-leader-survivors/


Oakland Fire Survivors Reunite with Commune Leader

Some of the Oakland fire survivors broke bread with Derick Ion Almena for the first time since the tragedy -- despite him getting blasted for alleged dangerous conditions in the building.

Witnesses tell us the group sat down at a Denny's in Oakland Wednesday night, had a meal ... then went to the Red Cross to pick up some clothes. We're told the entire meal was comped by the Denny's staff.

Our sources tell us ... the people gathered around Almena were residents of the commune who got out of the building the night of the inferno that killed at least 36 people.

The woman next to him is his wife, Micah, who was staying at a hotel the night of the fire.

I dont know, that pic sure does not look it was taken i a Dennys!!

Compare and contrast !! Funny!

Ha

 

[Jax49]

Jax

do you know how to get a list of the owners others property in the area??

Not a clue. I'll look around and see if I can find anything.

 

[human]

[h=1]Beloved Denver DIY Venue Rhinoceropolis Shut
Down in Wake of Oakland Fire[/h]
Imo this kind of response is only for people who have money to move.

This imo is not the answer.

Maybe a responsible answer would be to do what they are doing inspect more, pikc the most dangerous violation, give em two weeks to fix, then give them the next one on the list.

Of course there places people are living that dont have the latest but to toss people out in the street as the answer is just moving a problem around for the sake of elected officials.

Its how we address everything one shoe bomber go TSA. Same mo knee jerk, fool this masses that your govt is hard at work, go back on vacation, and wait till the next event that requires a bunch a money, only to find in a decade that it changed the problem, cost 1.2 trillion and that a committee needs to be formed to "study" the problem for the next decade.

So worried about everyone safety, why doesn't the govt neg a contract for smoke alarms that come out to 29 cents a piece, buy 15 million of em , give em out free - its a stop gap but running around emptying all these places out is NOT the solution

moo



http://pitchfork.com/news/70344-bel...oceropolis-shut-down-in-wake-of-oakland-fire/

After reading about fires, I think it should indicate a smoke alarm is going to do nothing in a building that is engulfed in seconds . The fire is psread because of all of the easy ways it can devour the building quickly. The materials, the cavities, the stairs acting as chimneys and so on.

When cities are faced with millions of dollars of lawsuits, they cannot simply turn a blind eye to code violations . The codes have been determined for a reason.

This is an immense problem. No one is going to tolerate that their city has to raise taxes or cannot provide services because of lawsuits

 

[human]

Jax

do you know how to get a list of the owners others property in the area??

If there is a city assessor site online, enter the property address

 

[alsleuther]

I don't think the gov't would buy smoke detectors and hand them out b/c then they would be assuming responsibility for them. You can't just have smoke detectors. You have to place them in the appropriate places according to code, and then you have to maintain them, test them weekly (per many leases I've seen) and change out the batteries once a year.

In these warehouses where people are living illegally and smoking meth (as Derick's Father in Law claimed) the first thing they would do is probably take the batteries out so they could smoke dope without the alarm going off....

 

[McMunn]

I dont know, that pic sure does not look it was taken i a Dennys!!

Compare and contrast !! Funny!

Ha

I found a picture of the inside of the Dennys in Oakland. Looks like similar color walls, floors, and the picture of the Golden Gate Bridge in the background. I can't figure out how to post the picture here, but go to this link, and the first picture with the lime greenish colored walls is the one that I'm referring to.

https://www.google.com/maps/uv?hl=en&pb=!1s0x808f85eab41dc619%3A0xad28be3edc7ad08a!2m19!2m2!1i80!2i80!3m1!2i20!16m13!1b1!2m2!1m1!1e1!2m2!1m1!1e3!2m2!1m1!1e5!2m2!1m1!1e4!3m1!7e115!4shttps%3A%2F%2Fpicasaweb.google.com%2Flh%2Fsredir%3Funame%3D103387962947586215596%26id%3D6340614815564306722%26target%3DPHOTO!5sdennys%20hegenberger%20-%20Google%20Search&imagekey=!1e3!2s-muudHVFF1w0%2FV7Rz0TIrA6I%2FAAAAAAAANME%2FoMYrRyonoRQtMdAXadmfdt6oQK-1sqWDgCJkC&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj3zfuflurQAhWowVQKHZJBCiAQoioIbjAK

 

[Thyme]

Sure looks like it huh??

Thanks CARIIS. They look very odd to me. I worked on a seismic retrofit of a school back in the late 90's....school was built in the early 60's...never came across anything like this. Have even searched for images of something similar...nothing. Mind you I am no electrician.