CA - Off Duty Police Officer shoots man and parents after altercation in Costco, Corona, June 2019

[jjenny]

Well he wasn't working any security so I fail to see why he would be considered an officer on duty. He was off duty and should be considered as such.
As for being on paid leave, isn't that nice? Like getting an extra vacation time.

 

[fannneee]

Right, but it seems like Officer Sanchez was treated like "an officer on duty". He was not arrested. His name was not released.

It would be interesting to know what his personal life is like...did he have an anger management problem? Argument with his wife, recently? Could a mental state have contributed to his reaction?

Read the link I posted above about the union...Officer Sanchez is now on paid leave.

The one about the Police Protective League? Crazy. There it is in black and white. Wow.
I cannot find a link to it right now but from what I read it looked to me as if LAPD is or was investigating the shooting as an "Officer involved shooting" which says to me same as on-duty.
I saw something else interesting while looking for a link
Corona Costco shooting: LAPD releases name of off-duty officer involved in incident
"A Corona police spokesman said during a news conference shortly after the shooting that witnesses had reported hearing an argument. A statement from the department the following day, however, did not mention a verbal altercation and said the attack was "without provocation."
A different spin after some thought. MOO
#ReleaseTheVideo

 

[jjenny]

I think it's pretty clear there was no argument before the push/shove/slap of the cop by Mr. French. Both family lawyer and cop's lawyer seem to agree on that. Witnesses are often wrong.
Basically, the way I envision the sequence of events right now:
1) Mr. French (for whatever reason, considering he has mental health issues) pushes the cop in the back. Maybe Mr. French thinks cop was taking too long with the chicken samples and wanted to get to that chicken.
2) Cop falls to the ground.
3) Cop gets up.
4) Mr. French's father gets between his son and the cop and tries to explain that his son has mental health issues.
5) Cop identifies himself as a cop and fires multiple shots, hitting father, who is standing in front of the son, son, and the mother who is standing behind her son. And of course, killing the mentally disabled son, Mr. French.

 

[mickey2942]

Well he wasn't working any security so I fail to see why he would be considered an officer on duty. He was off duty and should be considered as such.
As for being on paid leave, isn't that nice? Like getting an extra vacation time.

Of course, he needs all of that paid time off, for consulting with his attorney, going to investigation meetings, depositions. Probably medical appointments for his injuries sustained by the "attack" he suffered from...by the "mentally ill giant", non-verbal, off his meds. Geez, he sounds like "Lennie" in Steinbeck's "Of Mice and Men", and Sanchez, is just like "Curley".

Maybe this whole thing can be written off as "Teriyaki Chicken Derangement Syndrome".

 

[gitana1]

Well I am not sure how accurate that particular witness is. Per the family's lawyer, father stepped between the cop and his son and was trying to explain son's mental condition when the cop started shooting.
"A lawyer for the family of a man fatally shot at a California Costco conceded that the man pushed a police officer. They were standing in line for food samples at the time, and the father of Kenneth French, 32, stepped between his son and the off-duty officer."
Police Officer: Here's Why I Opened Fire at Costco - finance - att.net

I would say that a neutral witness is the most accurate of all. And it makes sense.

Officer says he woke up in the fight of his life.

Family says dad was pleading and standing in between officer and his son.

Witness is in the middle of the two- cop got knocked to the ground, stood up and immediately starred shooting at the decedent.

Nothing about standing there and shooting at the dad after the dad began explaining.

That seems illogical.

 

[jjenny]

The lawyer says that the father stepped between his son and the cop and it's is on video. I tend to believe video way more than witnesses. Video is going to be accurate, witnesses often aren't. Anyhow, it's pointless to argue without seeing the video, about something that is on video and could easily be proven if the video is released.

 

[RANCH]

The lawyer says the the that father stepped between his son and the cop and it's is on video. I tend to believe video way more than witnesses. Video is going to be accurate, witnesses often aren't. Anyhow, it's pointless to argue without seeing the video, about something that is on video and could easily be proven if the video is released.

Did the lawyer actually view the video or is he basing this on what his client told him and since there's video he feels it will corroborate what he was told?

 

[Lilibet]

So (until we see the tape) it sounds as if Sanchez was hit from behind, knocked down, lost consciousness briefly, came to, jumped up and, without time to even figure out what happened, starts shooting.

It’s a little scary to think that if I, a little old lady, accidentally fall against a civilian or off-duty cop carrying a gun and a baby and knock them down, they will automatically assume I’ve attacked them and shoot me. Either French was way more threatening than has been revealed or Sanchez has no business carrying a gun and should face murder charges.

<modsnip: gun control discussion is not allowed>

 

[jjenny]

Did the lawyer actually view the video or is he basing this on what his client told him and since there's video he feels it will corroborate what he was told?

Well that's what the lawyer said. To me that sounds like he saw the video.
"Before the officer fired his gun, there was a gap in time when he declared he was a police officer and French’s father stepped between the two men. Galipo said the security video showed that interaction."
Costco shooting: Did LAPD officer face ‘imminent threat’ when he opened fire?

 

[Lilibet]

Well that's what the lawyer said. To me that sounds like he saw the video.
"Before the officer fired his gun, there was a gap in time when he declared he was a police officer and French’s father stepped between the two men. Galipo said the security video showed that interaction."
Costco shooting: Did LAPD officer face ‘imminent threat’ when he opened fire?

BBM

I don’t understand why Sanchez declared he was a police officer in this context. He’s just a guy with a baby who got knocked down. Being a police officer doesn’t seem relevant except to intimidate and preemptively excuse shooting his gun in a crowded store.

 

[RANCH]

Well that's what the lawyer said. To me that sounds like he saw the video.
"Before the officer fired his gun, there was a gap in time when he declared he was a police officer and French’s father stepped between the two men. Galipo said the security video showed that interaction."
Costco shooting: Did LAPD officer face ‘imminent threat’ when he opened fire?

It would have been nice if he stated that he personally viewed the video.

Oh well. I'll wait and see for myself when the video comes out.

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

BBM

I don’t understand why Sanchez declared he was a police officer in this context. He’s just a guy with a baby who got knocked down. Being a police officer doesn’t seem relevant except to intimidate and preemptively excuse shooting his gun in a crowded store.

Exactly!

 

[Lilibet]

<modsnip: gun control discussion is not allowed>

Oops! Sorry.

 

[apricotpeach]

I don’t understand why Sanchez declared he was a police officer in this context. He’s just a guy with a baby who got knocked down. Being a police officer doesn’t seem relevant except to intimidate and preemptively excuse shooting his gun in a crowded store.

I wonder if the LAPD has a policy whether off-duty cops need to identify themselves if they need to take out their gun when off-duty? Just as a precautionary measure to alert everyone? I can imagine a scenario where a "good guy with a gun" thinks an off-duty cop is an active shooter and the situation becomes even worse than it already is. I would think just the simple act of stating that you are a police officer would/could make a person stop from approaching (it may not stop everyone, but it may stop some people).

There's some unconfirmed details in this LAIST article that I haven't seen published elsewhere. Like the cop's attorney says he didn't say he was an officer. The family's attorney says he did, and that the cop was still on the ground when shooting. Also, the mother supposedly was shot in the back.

LAIST: What We Know, And Don't Know, About The Fatal Costco Shooting By An Off-Duty LAPD Cop

 

[mickey2942]

I wonder if the LAPD has a policy whether off-duty cops need to identify themselves if they need to take out their gun when off-duty? Just as a precautionary measure to alert everyone? I can imagine a scenario where a "good guy with a gun" thinks an off-duty cop is an active shooter and the situation becomes even worse than it already is. I would think just the simple act of stating that you are a police officer would/could make a person stop from approaching (it may not stop everyone, but it may stop some people).

There's some unconfirmed details in this LAIST article that I haven't seen published elsewhere. Like the cop's attorney says he didn't say he was an officer. The family's attorney says he did, and that the cop was still on the ground when shooting. Also, the mother supposedly was shot in the back.

LAIST: What We Know, And Don't Know, About The Fatal Costco Shooting By An Off-Duty LAPD Cop

Ugh! The reason Sanchez was not arrested, "the Corona police had a lot of people to interview". Seriously?

"Did Corona police show deference to a fellow police officer by not arresting Sanchez? Chief Johnstone said they decided not to arrest Sanchez at the time of the shooting for several reasons, "including the need to interview numerous witnesses and review evidence."

Wow, how do any shooters get arrested when there are SO many PEOPLE to INTERVIEW?!

 

[jjenny]

Ugh! The reason Sanchez was not arrested, "the Corona police had a lot of people to interview". Seriously?

"Did Corona police show deference to a fellow police officer by not arresting Sanchez? Chief Johnstone said they decided not to arrest Sanchez at the time of the shooting for several reasons, "including the need to interview numerous witnesses and review evidence."

Wow, how do any shooters get arrested when there are SO many PEOPLE to INTERVIEW?!

Good question. I guess in any mass shooting, they would just have to let the shooter go until they interview all the witnesses. Right?

 

[Lilibet]

I wonder if the LAPD has a policy whether off-duty cops need to identify themselves if they need to take out their gun when off-duty? Just as a precautionary measure to alert everyone? I can imagine a scenario where a "good guy with a gun" thinks an off-duty cop is an active shooter and the situation becomes even worse than it already is. I would think just the simple act of stating that you are a police officer would/could make a person stop from approaching (it may not stop everyone, but it may stop some people).

There's some unconfirmed details in this LAIST article that I haven't seen published elsewhere. Like the cop's attorney says he didn't say he was an officer. The family's attorney says he did, and that the cop was still on the ground when shooting. Also, the mother supposedly was shot in the back.

LAIST: What We Know, And Don't Know, About The Fatal Costco Shooting By An Off-Duty LAPD Cop

Thanks for your reasonable explanation. Interesting article. We really need that video, don’t we.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

I wonder if the LAPD has a policy whether off-duty cops need to identify themselves if they need to take out their gun when off-duty? Just as a precautionary measure to alert everyone? I can imagine a scenario where a "good guy with a gun" thinks an off-duty cop is an active shooter and the situation becomes even worse than it already is. I would think just the simple act of stating that you are a police officer would/could make a person stop from approaching (it may not stop everyone, but it may stop some people).

There's some unconfirmed details in this LAIST article that I haven't seen published elsewhere. Like the cop's attorney says he didn't say he was an officer. The family's attorney says he did, and that the cop was still on the ground when shooting. Also, the mother supposedly was shot in the back.

LAIST: What We Know, And Don't Know, About The Fatal Costco Shooting By An Off-Duty LAPD Cop

That changes things if the officer was still on the ground when he fired shots at the men who were only 5 to 7 feet away. I can understand where he could still perceive there was a threat.

 

[MsFacetious]

I dont buy the cops story at all. Makes no sense. And if it's true, he was Extremely reckless to pop up and start shooting 6-7 shots.
Remember there was no injuries on his or the childs side.

I want to see the tape. LE lies all the time. Look at what the officers in Pheonix who claimed to be scared for their life of the young couple, but the tapes shown they attacked the couple and threatened to kill them and their children.

Absolutely. I want to see the video. I cannot even imagine shooting several shots in a busy Costco! That's just insanity. I'm guessing he knew where his wife and child were before he started shooting.

How does an infant fall to the floor when the adult holding him is knocked unconscious, and sustain zero injuries?

Same way one just hangs with an unconscious father on the side of the road for several hours without wandering away?

Even if the infant/child was uninjured, if the shooter was fearing for his life, why would he take out a gun and shoot someone with his child in his arms? If the other person had a gun or weapon, his child could be killed. Not making sense to me. I would be rolling over on top of my child to protect them.

Hopefully, there was blood drawn from the victim and shooter to test for alcohol or drugs.

I highly doubt there was blood taken from the shooter, even though he went to the hospital. I hope I'm wrong.... but on duty, off duty and still in uniform cops haven't been tested so I doubt he was either.

That's a good question. Especially considering if cop was knocked out from behind, he would have likely fallen face first, on top of the child. Yet reportedly child had no injuries.

That's just crazy. How would he know the kid had no injuries if he was knocked out? How would he know the kid didn't land on it's head?

Not the first time the officer has been in a tense situation. This time (below) he didn't fire his weapon.

http://da.lacounty.gov/sites/default/files/pdf/JSID_OIS_Carranza, Hernandez.pdf

Nobody touched him in that case. I can see why he didn't fire.

The woman interviewed in the NYTimes article says the shooter fell with a loud thud (she thought he had a heart attack), got up, took out his gun, and started shooting. I am sure it is not as neat and clean as that but her eyewitness testimony for 10 feet away is pretty convincing.

Edited: I forgot a comma.

That is just so disturbing.
Especially if the sequence of events is correct.
Stood up.
Took out his gun.
Started shooting.

I don't think he was purposefully shooting the parents. I have a feeling they got in the way trying to protect their son.

And I would have done the same thing.

 

[jjenny]

BBM

I don’t understand why Sanchez declared he was a police officer in this context. He’s just a guy with a baby who got knocked down. Being a police officer doesn’t seem relevant except to intimidate and preemptively excuse shooting his gun in a crowded store.

It might be relevant in the civil suit. If he claimed to be a cop, surviving family members presumably could sue the city and LAPD (or at least it will be easier for them to sue). Which is presumably why family's lawyer claims he believes that SS did claim he was a cop, and SS's lawyer denies that.