CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #24 *ARREST*

[Charlot123]

RNs cannot prescribe.

My point exactly. Honestly, I don't know how succinylcholine even got mentioned here, unless someone knows more than we do?

 

[Trudie]

Succi


Succinylcholine is a myorelaxant and is used in surgery for intubations. There is no way PF could have it as he, sorry, was a farrier and neither a veterinarian not a doctor. If he had access to it, this in itself is highly illegal, and DEA would be on his case as it is a prescribed substance.

PF is a layman with no vet diploma. OK, he trims hoofs of animals. He has high school education. He has no training to use sedation on animals, tbh. Even use of pharmaceuticals to sedate animals by a person without veterinarian diploma is, probably, illegal.

A farrier does much more than “trim”. IMO, very few choose this profession because it is grueling work, imo.
Anyone noticing there horse to be “off” is inclined (IMO) to call their farrier before the vet if there’s no visible injury.
It’s also not unusual for a farrier to work side by side with a vet.

MOO

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

I

In this video- starting around 10:53, a guy persists with his question if there is an ongoing search for her body. Something about the way she answered gave me the feeling it was an uncomfortable question for her. She seemed to lose her poker face for a second and was briefly shook by having to answer. She made it quick and turned away. It made me wonder if they know there is no body to be found at this point.

I think they may now know where Kelsey is or what remains of her,and it's just a matter of transportation in a respectful manner,and also to not damage the 'sensitive evedence'. MOO.
The 'false Ping' theory was so clever on LE part. It helped lead them to the Hot Idaho Spud (KB'S phone),and IN.
Once they had that,and IN She might have been given imunity for telling everything she knows. Including where Kelsey's body/remains are.
It's the only thing that makes sense as to why she hasn't been arrested.
MOO.

 

[enelram]

Technically speaking, it is a vet's job to administer tranquilizers, but maybe they bend the rules.

But if he used tranquilizers on KB, there would be a separate charge for illegally obtained drugs, too.

But there's no body.

 

[InvSmith]

Most of these civil cases are to ensure no one benefits from the death of the victim.

 

[missy1974]

Actually, it is common to file suit early as there is a 2 year statute of limitations from date of death. The lawsuit however is not likely to move forward until the criminal case against PF is concluded. PF is considered innocent until proven guilty, and I believe KB's family is receiving good advice, and acting in the best interest of the surviving child. MOO

I don't necessarily disagree, but wouldn't they have filed on behalf of the baby then? I am not sure how that works or if they even have the legal authority to do that?

 

[tmar]

Hello everyone. This is my first post. I wanted to thank you all for your insightful thoughts regarding this case as it has been captivating me for a month given the lack of information we have at this point. It is just so very heartbreaking, especially for Baby K.

I’m not sure why it has stuck with me, but I still keep going back to CB’s interview from mid-December where she speaks of Kelsey being excited for Christmas and wanting to get a Christmas tree, but holding off due to PF expressing interest in taking Baby K to get one “themselves.” I feel that shows some control on PF’s part and Kelsey was compliant to his control. A happy, young family would go together and make memories during the holiday season. If IN was in fact in town on Thanksgiving, it makes me wonder if PF wanted to go “alone” so he could get the tree with IN and Kelsey had no idea. MOO.

Welcome karinbean with your first post.
I felt during that interview with CB, that perhaps the plans regarding the Christmas tree, were not confirmed/'up in the air': that Kelsey may also be involved.

 

[Charlot123]

A farrier does much more than “trim”. IMO, very few choose this profession because it is grueling work, imo.
Anyone noticing there horse to be “off” is inclined (IMO) to call their farrier before the vet if there’s no visible injury.
It’s also not unusual for a farrier to work side by side with a vet.

MOO

I understand. It was the custom in the XX century in rural areas, maybe the practice still stays. I even understand why, a farrier living next to his neighbor probably knows the neighbor's horse better than a vet living 30 miles away. And mostly, the cost of treatment dictates the choice of the specialist.

At the same time - PF has school diploma. Not even a vet assistant. Just a local handyman. If he used the tranquilizers on KB and it got known, it probably would make a separate charge.

(Heck, if an anesthesiologist used a "tranquilizer" to kill someone, it, too, would make a separate charge).

 

[24Brix]

I'm not quite sure how to quote a post from an earlier thread (there is no quote link that I see anymore) but I've included the image below from @PommyMommy 's post in #23-61.

Question: Is paragraph 21 in the image below just a legal way of saying that KB is/was a citizen of the State of Colorado? Or could it imply something more? Phrases like "breached the duty of care" in paragraph 20 almost seem to imply a special legal relationship of some sort between the two. MOO, but I'm guessing it's just the necessarily exacting legalese that states she is covered by the laws of Colorado. Thoughts? I've never seen a document like this before...

 

[Hopefullyhelpful]

I don't necessarily disagree, but wouldn't they have filed on behalf of the baby then? I am not sure how that works or if they even have the legal authority to do that?

Until they are granted legal custody, they would not have authority. Right now, the legal authority for that child is the state of Colorado. A GAL has been appointed? Someone please correct me if I’m wrong.

 

[SandyQLS]

Most of these civil cases are to ensure no one benefits from the death of the victim.

I have been wondering if CO has a no financial benefit from criminal acts statute. I know some states do, but perhaps not all of them. My searches are failing for lack of proper terms...

 

[LovesPeace2]

Personally imoo I think this is all to do with sweet baby k and money as his motive kb would have life insurance who ever had baby k would have the money . Could cb be filing the civil to stop pf from collecting anything

 

[InsightfulSage]

<modsnip: quoted post was removed>Obviously those involved in a murder like this are not of strong moral fabric. On the other hand, at least in the case of IN (assuming she knew what was going on) she may have justified it all somehow & could still maintain integrity in other areas of her life such as her career.

 

[Trudie]

Personally imoo I think this is all to do with sweet baby k and money as his motive kb would have life insurance who ever had baby k would have the money . Could cb be filing the civil to stop pf from collecting anything

Life insurance would be paid to the beneficiary. If baby K is the Bennie, how would P profit? Moo.

Wonder if CB’s civil atty thinks someone else might go after P? Early bird gets the worm, they say.

 

[tmar]

Berreth’s parents file wrongful death suit against fiancé


The wrongful death suit makes me think of succinylcholine that immobilizes an animal or person to a point where they know everything that’s going on but can’t react, respond or move to protect themselves in any way. If he had access to veterinary drugs or sources that could supply him with such....then I’m completely shattered for KBs family. Utterly.


“Succinylcholine is safely used each day during surgical procedures to paralyze patients. This drug causes total muscle relaxation. Unfortunately, when insufficient doses of sedatives are used, paralyzing agents like succinylcholine are also the drugs responsible for anesthesia awareness.

But exposure to succinylcholine and its terrifying effects has a sinister history. In the 1960s and 1970s, this drug was used as an experimental form of aversion therapy. In the ’60s, patients in Atascadero State Hospital—a maximum security clinic for mentally ill and criminally insane males that is still open—were chosen for therapy if they exhibited “acting out” behaviors. Succinylcholine was administered with the goal of initiating paralysis . . . and a brief (one-minute) period of apnea (breathing cessation). Patients remained completely conscious but totally helpless as doctors lectured them about their behavioral issues.”

Why would drugs of this type be used: couldn't Kelsey have been harmed easily without drugs?
Is there something that points to PF using them?

 

[Jazzy5980]

I have been wondering if CO has a no financial benefit from criminal acts statute. I know some states do, but perhaps not all of them. My searches are failing for lack of proper terms...

Yes, CO passed “Son of Sam” statute preventing defendants convicted of committing a crime from profiting from his/her illegal acts.

Colorado Revised Statutes Title 24. Government State § 24-4.1-201 | FindLaw

 

[Trudie]

Until they are granted legal custody, they would not have authority. Right now, the legal authority for that child is the state of Colorado. A GAL has been appointed? Someone please correct me if I’m wrong.

Since K is unmarried, the way I read the civil suit procedure, her child/parents are next in line. Surely the attorney is aware of the law. Imo

 

[InvSmith]

One if the verified attorneys said in the last thread it would be illegal during the criminal investigation. Also if CB is a witness in the criminal trial, and certain details indicate she will be, LE cannot share anything with her. JMO they can ask for everything after the criminal trial.

*
ETA: Read PrairieWind's concerns last thread pages 57-61. This below is post#1129 page 57 thread#23:

"The prosecutor can have NO involvement with this civil case. If they were it could seriously jeopardize the criminal case. I bet this is a total surprise to the prosecutors."

There is nothing wrong with filing the civil case. It will be filed and worked on but not proceed until the criminal case is plead or tried. Now, we know robbery has been mentioned by LE. The death penalty has not been taken off the table in this case. I would fully expect, a plea opportunity. This would mean the civil case would need to move as well. All of this could be fast or slow. So far, it has all been fast. Painful but fast.

 

[Kapua]

She might have immunity for talking. Can anyone think of a scenario where PF hands you a phone and asks you to throw it away and you just agree and promptly throw it away without asking why, or what's wrong with it, who's is it?

I can't think of one, and I really don't want to jump to any conclusions regarding KK's alleged involvement. I hope she had no knowledge of KB's murder. IF she did dispose of the phone, she would have taken it sometime between Nov. 22 and Nov. 25. I like to believe that she was horrified when she discovered that PF was suspected of murdering KB and went to LE on her own, as Amber Frey did in the Scott/Laci Peterson case. But this could play out much differently. We shall see. MOO

 

[missy1974]

I have been wondering if CO has a no financial benefit from criminal acts statute. I know some states do, but perhaps not all of them. My searches are failing for lack of proper terms...

I think it's called the 'Slayer Statute' in Colorado. I found this article: A Killer Cannot Profit from His or Her Own Wrong | Fiduciary Law Blog

and also found an article in regards to the slayer statute and CW: Shanann Watts' family could secure estate with slayer statute, or civil lawsuit if no conviction

So it's possible that he was a beneficiary on a life insurance, or possibly even the baby, and if there is even a remote chance that PF could walk, they may be preventing him from benefiting at all, directly or indirectly.

JMO