DNA Doe Project - General Discussion

[Mrs. Badcrumble]

Wow! Pat yourself on the back, Gardener1850! Excellent work!

 

[folieadeuxnola]

Thanks, I hope it is the right one-- it's the only one I see off Beckler Road. I understand why she didn't have a thread before-- there is not much to work with on that case. They only have a partial cranium.

I wonder if they will try again to get a non-contaminated/sufficient sample?

Wether they will try again ..... if there is funding available and if it is felt that it will be possible to extract a better sample. We have already seen 2nd attempts occur so let's hope they will try again.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

Something I've been pondering recently in connection with Mill Creek Shed Man and the problems they are having finding matches for him. Obviously the compromised nature of the DNA will be a factor in this, but I seem to recall reading that African Americans were very poorly represented in the family history databases in proportion to their numbers in the general population. If this is true it raises two questions:

1. Why is this? Are African Americans less interested in family history, and if so why?; and

2. Is this likely to affect the cases that DDP choose to take on? Because if the chances of finding matches for black Americans are very much lower it begs the question as to whether such cases are cost effective in terms of money or effort.

Thoughts?

 

[MelmothTheLost]

Updated list of DDP Case threads:

Excellent job there, Gardener. No doubt you will be reposting this periodically with updates, so can I suggest that you highlight the changes each time in a different colour text to make it immediately obvious what the changes are?

 

[Mrs. Badcrumble]

The DDP team is still trying to extract sufficient DNA from Snohomish Jane Doe, although she's not on any official list.

WA - WA - Snohomish Co., WhtFem 516UFWA, 15-22, hitchhiker, 5'10" tall, Aug'77

 

[Mrs. Badcrumble]

Several new cases have been added, according to a post on DDP'S Facebook page + update on current cases. Annie Doe's case might take some time due to too degraded DNA.

-Sheep Flat Jane Doe (NV) – pending confirmation
-Belle in the Well (OH) – genealogical analysis still in progress
-Mill Creek Shed Man (WA) – genealogical analysis still in progress
-Anaheim Jane Doe - genealogical analysis still in progress
-Beckler River Road Doe (WA) – stalled/ insufficient/contaminated DNA
-Sultan Basin Road Doe (WA) – stalled/ insufficient/contaminated DNA
-Annie Doe – DNA too degraded. Needs fresh extraction and sequencing. (DoeFundMe active on website.)
-Butler Co Jane Doe (OH) – at lab for extraction
-Transgender Julie Doe (FL) – at lab for extraction
-Alachua Co, Florida John Doe (Sheriff # 79-2219 ME # CAPHIL 2A79/78-79) at lab for extraction
-Kings Co, CA Jane Doe (woman in tarp) – at lab for extraction
-Orange Socks Jane Doe (Williamson Co, TX) – at lab for extraction
-Rebel Ray John (Williamson Co, TX) – at lab for extraction
-Corona Girl (Williamson Co, TX) – at lab for extraction
-Apache Junction Jane Doe - at lab for extraction
-John Clinton Doe Rock Co – at lab for extraction
-Lavender Doe - at lab for sequencing pending QC

A few others are about to head to the lab, and many others still under discussion.

I'm too stoked for my own good!

 

[Gardener1850]

Updated list of DDP Case threads (Updates in Green):

Sheep Flat Jane Doe (NV) – pending confirmation
NV - NV - Washoe Co., WhtFem 156UFNV, 25-35, Sheep Flats Trail, Jul'82 *Graphic*

Belle in the Well (OH) – genealogical analysis still in progress
OH - OH - Dobbstown, 'Belle in the Well' WhtFem UP6259, 30-60, in cistern, Apr'81

Mill Creek Shed Man (WA) – genealogical analysis still in progress
WA - WA - Snohomish Cty, Male UP 13502, 50-65, Jan 2015 - Mill Creek Shed Man

Beckler River Road Doe (WA) – stalled/ insufficient/contaminated DNA
WA - WA - Snohomish Co, UnkRace Fem, Abt 40 yo, Partial Cranium, Beckler Road, Oct 2009

Sultan Basin Road Doe (WA) – stalled/ insufficient/contaminated DNA
WA - WA - Snohomish Co, WhtMale, 20-50, Sultan Basin Rd, Apr'07

Annie Doe – DNA too degraded. Needs fresh extraction and sequencing.
OR - OR - Cave Junction, 'Annie Doe' WhtFem UP10929, 16-20, Redwood Hwy, Aug'71

Butler Co Jane Doe (OH) – at lab for extraction
OH - OH - West Chester, WhtFem UP13635, 35-60, in woods, dentures, Mar'15

Transgender Julie Doe (FL) – at lab for extraction
FL - FL - Clermont, WhtMale UP6030, 24-32, transgender, breast implants, Sep'88

Alachua Co, Florida John Doe (Sheriff # 79-2219 ME # CAPHIL 2A79/78-79) – at lab for extraction
FL - FL - Alachua Co., WhtMale Skeletal UP5286, 22-40, noose in tree, Feb'79

Kings Co, CA Jane Doe (woman in tarp) – at lab for extraction
CA - CA - Kings Co., WhtFem, 42-87, near canal, adult diaper, edentulous, May'15

Orange Socks Jane Doe (Williamson Co, TX) – at lab for extraction
TX - TX - Williamson Co., 'Orange Socks' WhtFem 33UFTX, 15-30, off I-35, Oct'79 *GRAPHIC*

Rebel Ray John (Williamson Co, TX) – at lab for extraction
TX - TX - Williamson Co, WhtMale, 27-37, "Rebel Ray" Ball Cap, Broken Nose, Oct '88

Corona Girl (Williamson Co, TX) – at lab for extraction
TX - TX - Williamson Co., WhtFem 74UFTX, 20-30, 'Cinco de Corona' TShirt, Sep'89

Anaheim Jane Doe:
CA - CA - Anaheim, WhtFem Skeletal 22UFCA, 15-19, off Riverside Fwy, Aug'87

Snohomish Jane Doe (although she's not on any official list-- Extraction underway?):
WA - WA - Snohomish Co., WhtFem 516UFWA, 15-22, hitchhiker, 5'10" tall, Aug'77

Apache Junction Jane Doe - at lab for extraction
AZ - AZ - Apache Junction, HispFem UP6349, 16-18, in desert near Hwy 60, Aug'92

John Clinton Doe Rock Co – at lab for extraction
WI - WI - Clinton, 'River Guy' WhtMale 1207UMWI, 17-20, 'Venom' TShirt, Nov'95

Lavender Doe - at lab for sequencing pending QC
TX - TX - Kilgore, 'Lavender Doe' WhtFem 483UFTX, 17-25, in woods, burned, Oct'06

 

[MelmothTheLost]

Updated list of DDP Case threads (Updates in Green):

Excellent - many thanks

Annie Doe – DNA too degraded. Needs fresh extraction and sequencing.
OR - OR - Cave Junction, 'Annie Doe' WhtFem UP10929, 16-20, Redwood Hwy, Aug'71

I wonder how they go about a second attempt to extract DNA in such a case? Do they use a completely different bone in case DNA degradation differs between one part of the body and another, or the same bone with the expectation that 2 equally degraded results will nonetheless between them produce a clearer profile?

It's interesting to see that several LE jurisdictions have jumped in with enthusiasm, eg Williamson Co, TX and Snohomish Co, WA. They obviously really believe in the technique and are probably trying to get their cases into the pipeline before the awareness of it spreads.

 

[Mrs. Badcrumble]

Iwonder how they go about a second attempt to extract DNA in such a case? Do they use a completely different bone in case DNA degradation differs between one part of the body and another, or the same bone with the expectation that 2 equally degraded results will nonetheless between them produce a clearer profile?

Tooth pulp, perhaps? They had problems extracting usable DNA for Snohomish Jane Doe, as well, but are going at it again by trying to extract it from her hair instead.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

From the DDP facebook page:

"Lavender Doe" (Gregg County Sherriff's Office cold case) has undergone extraction and passed QC. She is now ready for DNA sequencing once we have the funds available.

As of yesterday they had raised around half of the funds required.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

1. Why is this? Are African Americans less interested in family history, and if so why?

Thoughts?

OK, the not unexpected crickets here. I am of course fully aware of the elephant in this particular room but just wanted to see if anyone else would post along the lines I'm thinking.

Obviously there is a massive racial element here.

The reality is that the vast majority of black Americans who trace back their family history will find slave ancestors. It's very possible that slavery in the abstract is painful enough, but to find individual ancestors whose names you know makes it all just too personal and even more painful on a human level. It's no longer just "some of my ancestors were slaves" but "great-great-great aunt X was a slave in Y".

I suspect it's also the case that once an African American hits slavery it's likely to become much more difficult to take research back any further, ie I wouldn't be surprised if records relating to individuals are sparse from that era and the researcher may well find it almost impossible to go back any further.

In the end, maybe for African Americans the foreseeable result of family history research is just somewhere they don't want to go, and if this is the case it's going to make it much more difficult for DDP and other similar organisations to justify taking on such cases if the chances of success are that much smaller.

(Fingers crossed that I haven't put my foot in it.)

 

[Alleykins]

Gardener, ty so much for the updates.

 

[ClockworkLemon]

I just heard about this non profit yesterday via The Charley Project. I’m so glad this is being done. They’ve identified four people already, looks like a pace of about one person a month. Let’s hope they keep it up!

 

[Mrs. Badcrumble]

Giving a little shoutout to the new thread MelmothTheLost started recently in this forum!
Just like DDP, Parabon Nanolabs also uses DNA and genealogy in their work, but unlike DDP, PNl are more directed at solving crimes.

Parabon - General Discussion

 

[MelmothTheLost]

Bringing this across from Orange Socks's thread.

The attempt to extract DNA from her fingernails has apparently failed.

TX - TX - Williamson Co., 'Orange Socks' WhtFem 33UFTX, 15-30, off I-35, Oct'79 *GRAPHIC*

 

[MelmothTheLost]

Giving a little shoutout to the new thread MelmothTheLost started recently in this forum!

Thank you Mrs B. I must admit I've not followed any of their cases in particular so far but no doubt they will be hitting the news sooner or later.

 

[Gardener1850]

Here's the latest update:

Hi folks,
This is just a bit of update on what’s happening in the DDP world, since we’ve been pretty quiet and someone just asked if we had “stopped.”

We don’t know how to stop! The cases that come to us are really tough. At any given moment there could be a dozen people working on each, sometimes around the clock. These take hundreds, sometimes thousands of hours to solve, if indeed they’re solvable. Not all will be. Meanwhile, since we are pioneering methods for working with degraded DNA, our bioinformatics team is developing tools to get every scrap of these DNA profiles for us, so that closer relatives will show up on the match lists. That was the key to solving the Chandler case. Tool development is an exciting by-product of the DDP Think Tank!

Other DDP news: Our Colleen Fitzpatrick will be on the Today Show in NY next Thursday Sept 20. Then we’ll both be In Washington DC at the Kin Finder Symposium Friday and Saturday Sept 21-22, giving a workshop on our process, geared toward Law Enforcement. There are still some seats: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/dna-and-forensic-genealogy-kin-finder-symposium-registration-48398500217

The following week we’ll be presenting at ISHI 2018, then finally back home to help solve cases (unless the team solves them all while we’re gone!)

Coming soon: we’re making arrangements with a T-shirt company to sell DDP T-shirts and mugs (etc) where a chunk of the proceeds comes to us to help fund future cases. Watch for an announcement here, and a Store tab on our website.

Sheep Flats Jane Doe’s identity has been confirmed. It is up to the agency to make the announcement when they are ready. There is now an active homicide investigation, so they’ll decide when best to do so. Please be patient!

Annie Doe is undergoing new extraction from bone. Funds were raised to cover this cost, and we’re making progress on the sequencing funds that will be needed next. She has a button on our website for donations or if you can find her post here, Facebook accepts donations on her behalf (and they’re good about mailing us checks with no fees taken out.) When we’ve reached that goal her buttons will be removed.

Other case updates: We’re now trying to keep up with these using the pinned Welcome post at the top of our page. You have to scroll down a mile and a half, but we’re including any cases that have actually shipped to a lab. So watch that post for changes in status.

As always, thank you all for your support and interest, and for your deep and profound caring. We can’t solve all the world’s problems. But we can take heart in trying to solve the ones we can.

DNA Doe Project

 

[mpnola]

Wow. Amazing how much work gets done by b private people as opposed to waiting for a government agency to do it. I love this organization.

 

[Kaley Smith]

I've had my DNA analyzed (Health & Ancestry), and it is truly amazing. The information gleaned and predictions made were 95% right on (You have blue or green eyes, wavy hair, no dimples, a longer ring finger than index finger, twitch muscles, etc. etc.)

 

[MelmothTheLost]

Updates:

1. DDP now has the support of the Trans Doe Task Force: Trans Doe Task Force

2. The second attempt to extract DNA for Julie Doe (transgender) has failed and DDP are reviewing their options.

2nd round of extraction failed. Considering lab options. We will certainly keep trying with her if we can raise the funds.

3. Kings County Jane Doe is off to the lab.

Kings Co, CA Jane Doe (woman in tarp) – extraction complete - on way to sequencing

4. Butler County Jane Doe - ditto.

Butler Co Jane Doe (OH) – extraction complete - on way to sequencing.

Update from the DDP Facebook page here:

DNA Doe Project