Forensic Astrology - Haleigh Cummings #1

[Salem]

Salem,

There are at least 5 or 6 local RSO's (if not more) that are under intense scrutiny by LE, and with Kyle Johns in such close physical proximity to the Cummings house, you can bet he is near the top of the list.

I looked at charts of Kyle Johns, Timothy Loucakis and Donald Lee Sapp. They are all evil. If I had to prioritize them in terms of how their charts interaspected both Haleigh's natal and the 911 Call (the only chart for which we have a known, verified time), I would alert as follows:

1. Donald Lee Sapp
2. Timothy Loucakis
3. Kyle Johns

However --- and this is important --- this does not mean that any of them is the perp, as the perp could be anyone, including someone who isn't even registered as a SO. In fact, with SATURN Rx in the event & horary charts, I get the sense the perp could very likely be someone who up until now has been able to "hide" (retrograde) his evil behavior from authorities.

That said, I still believe all the RSO's in the neighborhood as well as their homes should be gone over with a fine tooth comb by LE, and then gone over again.

Thanks,
Soulscape

Thanks Soulscape - here's why I asked......

Tuba's location charts indicates Haliegh went in a North Northeast direction, BUT subsequent posts indicate this may not be accurate and that Haleigh could have gone in a North Northwest direction.

When looking at the Google map and charting both points, it appears that 212 Monroe is in a NNE direction, but the actual directions say go NNW...

Sometimes I think there is something to these misconceptions

Also, has anyone done a chart for approximate distance? I admit I'm behind in all the posts and I'm trying to catch up, but Haliegh is only one of 3 children I am following at the moment

Salem

ETA: Google link (hope it works) http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&sou....574521,-81.674155&spn=0.004507,0.006673&z=17 Hope this one works

 

[Zoe Bogart]

This Sapp guy is the dude Tuba & I were Euwwwwwwwwwwwwwww-ing about, and #1 on my list in above post.


See Chart:
http://i428.photobucket.com/albums/...mings/Tri-WheelSappwithHaleighnataland911.gif


Thanks,
Soulscape

I got chills when I first saw this guy's picture and thought he'd be the one I'd look up FIRST - PRONTO.

We could be wrong, but he could be one of those guys Mish was describing - going for younger and younger....... And he's not terribly old that Misty would turn him away if he paid the slightest attention to her.

I hate saying bad about people but that girl just isn't a sharpie. With her background, low self-esteem, and limited common sense, added to the drugs, I can see where her intense stupidity put poor the child at risk.

 

[Khaki_Pants]

Let me expound on my thoughts a bit.... If the families involved with Haleigh have no issue with a 20yr old dating/sleeping with/having kids with, a 14 yr old, or no problem with a 24 yr old dating/sleeping with a 16 year old, then would the criminal records of the RSO's around them offend them much? What is their opinion of "child", I guess is what I am thinking about. A criminal record that shows sexual assault etc., with a child may not be a big deal in their mind even if the child is 12? Do you see my thinking on this? Or am I doing brain flips and going kooky?

 

[Zoe Bogart]

Khaki, I see what you're saying. The lack of notice of men with young girls (age 16, 17) is beyond my comprehension. No one seems to care. I was quite shocked when I read Haleigh's grandmother was born in 1960. That's younger than me and I don't have grandchildren, but then I realized Haleigh is only five and 1960 was (gasp!) nearly 50 years ago. But still......

Yes, their lack of age recognition plus the DRUGS has to be part of the entire situation in that area.

 

[Drivenon]

Soulscape-

(Bolding mine) Wanted to address this one aspect for consideration-

While this SO may or may not be related to this particular case, let me offer what I've learned about "preferences" in relation to SO's. (must admit this info resurrects memories I would have rather forgotten; I once had a beautiful student in 1st grade "teach" me about this. The illness of others is the reason she is no longer alive...)

Sexual relations in and of itself is not considered wrong when it falls in the acceptable parameters of societal norms. The law presents us with age limits for what is considered lawfully acceptable and an individual that desires an age range below those benchmarks, we qualify that desire as abnormal. The age range "preferences" when compared to societal norms, usually denotes the level/degree of psychological illness.

So...when a SO begins to lower the age from his past "preference", it usually means the psychological illness has intensified. (my stomach is queasy typing this) And the chance of physical harm to the victim skyrockets exponentially as a five year old child isn't physically matured to endure the trauma of rape, meaning death as a result is much more probable. Nothing could be worse than a SO lowering his age preferences...

Hope I was able to explain that; I just couldn't use some of the vocabulary that might have articulated this better. I feel like vomiting just typing this, but also felt this was needed info as I doubt this will be the last time we encounter this evilness on WS's.

-Mish

I think God and I need to have a chat, right now, because I just don't understand the depravity that seems to be escalating in this world of ours.

Very respectfully Mish, that profile does not fit this crime. This offender is not an "escalator or changer of proclivity" because they talk themselves into believing people have it wrong and they generally "love" these kids. I completely agree that exists, but imo, this is not that guy. This guy took a baby, with very specific intentions, with a depraved motive that is not describable on here. He is the rarest of the rare, but very prevalent in similar cases. I am not aware of a homicidal, predatory pedophile that "works alone"
that moves his "target" whatsoever. Sadly, I think your seeing that in a few of the charts..

 

[sweetmop]

I wonder if Ron and Misty knew about these guys, and has had them over before to party...something about Timothy (well all of them) but Timothy in particular bothers me to the core...is it possible that there was more than one abductor? These guys have a common interest...

With the obvious knowlege we have on Ron's intense anger issues, would he be hanging out with possible RSOs? I can't see that going on. Or is he oblivious to that fact?

 

[Salem]

Let me expound on my thoughts a bit.... If the families involved with Haleigh have no issue with a 20yr old dating/sleeping with/having kids with, a 14 yr old, or no problem with a 24 yr old dating/sleeping with a 16 year old, then would the criminal records of the RSO's around them offend them much? What is their opinion of "child", I guess is what I am thinking about. A criminal record that shows sexual assault etc., with a child may not be a big deal in their mind even if the child is 12? Do you see my thinking on this? Or am I doing brain flips and going kooky?

I hear what you are saying Khaki and I think you have a point. BUT I do think these families would be horrified if the child was less than a teenager in age. I feel certain that if they knew the SO liked children younger than 13 or so, they would be horrified, just like we are.

Generally - girls grow up fast in these circumstances, but I think most of the guys that are involved are from other KNOWN families in the same circumstances. Now, mind you, I said GENERALLY. But the guys are known from early high school days, or the parents know each other from work, etc. So the 20 year old dating the 14/15 year old does not seem really scary to the parents. I'm sure they don't like it, but they probably know the boy's family in some way. Unlike when this happens in larger, more urban areas and the girl's family has no idea where that boy is coming from. Okay - that is meant to very, very general. I have no idea how all of these people in this story met or got to know each other. But it does appear to be a small, rural community and it sounds as if it is pretty tight knit. Also - I'm not making excuses for anyone, just making an observation.

Salem

 

[Capri]

With the obvious knowlege we have on Ron's intense anger issues, would he be hanging out with possible RSOs? I can't see that going on. Or is he oblivious to that fact?

Sorry to jump in the middle here, but isn't his landlord, Sapp, a RSO? I guess there may be a difference - landlord vs. friend, but ....

 

[sweetmop]

Let me expound on my thoughts a bit.... If the families involved with Haleigh have no issue with a 20yr old dating/sleeping with/having kids with, a 14 yr old, or no problem with a 24 yr old dating/sleeping with a 16 year old, then would the criminal records of the RSO's around them offend them much? What is their opinion of "child", I guess is what I am thinking about. A criminal record that shows sexual assault etc., with a child may not be a big deal in their mind even if the child is 12? Do you see my thinking on this? Or am I doing brain flips and going kooky?

Good post, I think, Khaki_Pants.:clap:
No! You are no kook with a flippy brain, LOL!
I am in shock over all of these adult men and their 'encounters' with these very young girls, g i r l s! They are not women. It seems to be widely accepted and sadly quite common place.
Even my 16 year old daughter commented on this! "Good grief Mom that is soooo sick!" she said. And yes it is sick indeed. Haleigh's biological mom was 14 when she had Haleigh! That's very disturbing. Where does this mentality come from that this is alright and is accepted?
So I certainly see where you're coming from, Khaki_Pants. And your feelings are mine as well. As I believe the majority here feel that same way. Sex with children, drugs, and children having children is a dangerous combination of wrongs, something horrible was bound to happen! This is another case where the poor child really didn't have a chance, and I am saddened and sickened of these type of cases !
It's very tragic.

 

[Lovejac]

Bringing this over from the Haleigh thread.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3315665&postcount=281

 

[sweetmop]

I hear what you are saying Khaki and I think you have a point. BUT I do think these families would be horrified if the child was less than a teenager in age. I feel certain that if they knew the SO liked children younger than 13 or so, they would be horrified, just like we are.

Generally - girls grow up fast in these circumstances, but I think most of the guys that are involved are from other KNOWN families in the same circumstances. Now, mind you, I said GENERALLY. But the guys are known from early high school days, or the parents know each other from work, etc. So the 20 year old dating the 14/15 year old does not seem really scary to the parents. I'm sure they don't like it, but they probably know the boy's family in some way. Unlike when this happens in larger, more urban areas and the girl's family has no idea where that boy is coming from. Okay - that is meant to very, very general. I have no idea how all of these people in this story met or got to know each other. But it does appear to be a small, rural community and it sounds as if it is pretty tight knit. Also - I'm not making excuses for anyone, just making an observation.

Salem

Wow. I still think 20 or 21 year old males being attracted to a 13 or 14 year old girl is really strange, personally. It says alot about that male to me. And it is against the law.

 

[sweetmop]

Bringing this over from the Haleigh thread.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3315665&postcount=281

Lovejac, please disect this for me.
Pretty please.

 

[sweetmop]

Sorry to jump in the middle here, but isn't his landlord, Sapp, a RSO? I guess there may be a difference - landlord vs. friend, but ....

Capri, I don't even know all of the 'players names' enough to comment here. LOL! I just thought if there had been a group of people hanging out at the Cumming's on that MON. evening and several were known SO that Ron wouldn't take too kindly to that fact. But the more I read about the community there, the more I just might be way off on that thought!

 

[john's mom]

Good post, I think, Khaki_Pants.:clap:
No! You are no kook with a flippy brain, LOL!
I am in shock over all of these adult men and their 'encounters' with these very young girls, g i r l s! They are not women. It seems to be widely accepted and sadly quite common place.
Even my 16 year old daughter commented on this! "Good grief Mom that is soooo sick!" she said. And yes it is sick indeed. Haleigh's biological mom was 14 when she had Haleigh! That's very disturbing. Where does this mentality come from that this is alright and is accepted?
So I certainly see where you're coming from, Khaki_Pants. And your feelings are mine as well. As I believe the majority here feel that same way. Sex with children, drugs, and children having children is a dangerous combination of wrongs, something horrible was bound to happen! This is another case where the poor child really didn't have a chance, and I am saddened and sickened of these type of cases !
It's very tragic.

Bold and underline, mine..............
I think Haleigh's mom is 23, so she was 18 when she was born. Her Myspace page has pics from her birhday. Just sayin.....

ALSO, do we even know for sure that the community in general KNOWS that all these guys are SO's? I wouldn't know if any were in my neighborhood unless I looked at the map for my area. I do that every so often, but does everyone?

 

[beckaroozie]

Bold and underline, mine..............
I think Haleigh's mom is 23, so she was 18 when she was born. Her Myspace page has pics from her birhday. Just sayin.....

ALSO, do we even know for sure that the community in general KNOWS that all these guys are SO's? I wouldn't know if any were in my neighborhood unless I looked at the map for my area. I do that every so often, but does everyone?

Johnsmom you're correct - I was just about to post that. She evidently LIED to LE about her YOB. I think it might have something to do with how young Misty is...maybe....who knows. She did lie though and told them she was 19 on the police report.

 

[Dihan]

Any possibility she (Misty) is being blackmailed in some way?

(OT: off to run errands and wishing I could drag my laptop w/ me LOL; wish something would break in this case. They seem to have brought in the Top Guns of abduction, Tim Miller is there...they have the best of the best on the ground with this nightmare...wish a miracle would happen... God? -anytime You're ready!)

-Mish

Lovejac: that name Carr rings familiar, any ideas?

Few years ago a guy named Carr shot his son,when the cops took him he had a hidden handcuff key and shot the cops and escaped to a gas station where he killed himself,it was big story here in fl ,if the wife had told the truth (his real name) they would have been prepared, think it ..

was earl carr

 

[john's mom]

Johnsmom you're correct - I was just about to post that. She evidently LIED to LE about her YOB. I think it might have something to do with how young Misty is...maybe....who knows. She did lie though and told them she was 19 on the police report.

Did she LIE, or is it a typo or just a misunderstanding? You know, transcribe error, innocent mistake? We really don't know............

 

[sleutherontheside]

FWIW...... 212 Monroe (Tallahassee ?) is a South Monroe address....which is a clothing store. I can not find any record of a 212 N. Monroe. New construction on that but been on it a million times and that location is smack dab downtown with banks, gas stations..... FWIW North Monroe turns into Highway 27 on the way to Havana (Gadsden County). Hope that helps??? Also.....the Bannerman bluff address for the RSO is considered to be NE Tallahassee.

 

[Lovejac]

Johnsmom you're correct - I was just about to post that. She evidently LIED to LE about her YOB. I think it might have something to do with how young Misty is...maybe....who knows. She did lie though and told them she was 19 on the police report.

What reason could she possibly have for lying about her year of birth? I don't get it.

 

[Salem]

Wow. I still think 20 or 21 year old males being attracted to a 13 or 14 year old girl is really strange, personally. It says alot about that male to me. And it is against the law.

You are absolutely right sweetmop! I don't argue that at all.

However, I do believe Haliegh's mom was 18 or 19 when Haliegh was born. Haliegh is 5 now and her mom is 23 according to her myspace and other information - unless I am missing something?

Salem