General theory thread and motives rehashed #2

[Dion]

I have a hard time believing that Joe would be that determined to steal a gun from Ron.

The only way it makes any sense to me, is if it was promised to Joe for some kind of service rendered or transaction that took place, and when it came time to hand it over, Ron was reluctant to do so, for some reason.

There must be many people who know the real reason why the gun was such an issue. Why did Joe want the gun? Why would he keep trying to get into the house to get the gun if it wasn't his, or promised to him?

Or is this just something they all made up after JO returned home, to provide some kind of reason why someone wanted to get into the house that night?

I don't think it played out the way they said it did, but think the gun had something to do with what happened that night.

 

[lil momma]

I have a hard time believing that Joe would be that determined to steal a gun from Ron.

The only way it makes any sense to me, is if it was promised to Joe for some kind of service rendered or transaction that took place, and when it came time to hand it over, Ron was reluctant to do so, for some reason.

There must be many people who know the real reason why the gun was such an issue. Why did Joe want the gun? Why would he keep trying to get into the house to get the gun if it wasn't his, or promised to him?

Or is this just something they all made up after JO returned home, to provide some kind of reason why someone wanted to get into the house that night?

I don't think it played out the way they said it did, but think the gun had something to do with what happened that night.

ITA! and the thing that boggles my mind is that Ron is very serious when he says that "there was no fight with no cousin over no gun"

So did a gun fight happen or didn't it? i guess it just depends on who you believe....

Poor HaLeigh!

 

[bessie]

LOL, are you trying to make me actually organize my thoughts??????

Yep. Come on, it won't hurt that much.

 

[1Chump]

Cobra should go back and review his tapes. Ron did not say that he put the gun in a ditch or culvert at Hank, Sr.'s house. In fact, he wasn't clear about where he put it, but there are indications that the culvert was at Tommy's house. For one thing, in the Cobra tapes, Ron talks about coming out of his room and walking around the corner to find Joe's girlfriend looking in the culvert. Around the corner from Ron's house would be Tommy's house, not Hank, Sr.'s.
ETA: Art Harris states, "the Croslin's former driveway." That could be a reference to Tommy and Lindsy's house on Tyler.

Thank you, Ger. You're the best. And big thanks to Nomoresorrow who had the patience to transcribe the Cobra tapes.

Ron: joe had his old lady come from wherever she was from in her new cadillac
and when i come down out from my room that day… after i hid it…ok?…after..
i didn`t tell nobody… so he thought that was where it`s at …and I come around the corner and guess where his girlfriend`s at?
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Revisiting the cobra & ronald tapes

I actually think this is true and there was a fight the day Haleigh disappeared.

Because after this part about Joe leaving, Cobra asks Ron who Hank is...IMO, Ron realizes he messed up and admitted the fight was the day Haleigh disappeared.

Because Ron kind of hems and haws then says Hanks is....uh...Misty's Dad...Hank Sr. IMO, that was because Hank Sr. was in the hospital. That sounded like a lie to change the date of the fight/gun stuff Ron had just admitted to.

 

[Emeralgem]

I actually think this is true and there was a fight the day Haleigh disappeared.

Because after this part about Joe leaving, Cobra asks Ron who Hank is...IMO, Ron realizes he messed up and admitted the fight was the day Haleigh disappeared.

Because Ron kind of hems and haws then says Hanks is....uh...Misty's Dad...Hank Sr. IMO, that was because Hank Sr. was in the hospital. That sounded like a lie to change the date of the fight/gun stuff Ron had just admitted to.

Nothing really unusual for me, but I am really confused..

Please , if you will, explain how Ron C realizes he messed up..TYIA

 

[Concerned Papa]

Art Harris has corrected his article and posted the following:

Thanks to a vigilant reader who just pointed out a stupid misspeak or clarification I need to make after writing where the Ronald Cummings black Beretta was found. Last Friday, I wrote:

"But Ronald had put him down a week earlier, humiliated him in front of family, accusing him of stealing a handgun, Hank Croslin, Sr. told me. “I had to keep them apart,” he said. He said Overstreet vowed to get even, and that Cummings sloughed it off after he found the gun where he claims Overstreet hid it, in a drainage pipe that rans under the Croslin’s former driveway.

WHERE THEY FOUND THE GUN REVISITED:

When Lindsay and Tommy Croslin, Hank Sr. and Lisa Croslin showed me where they said Joe hid the gun--and Chelsea and Misty found it--we were standing in the yard at Tommy and Lindsay's house on Tyler St, where a culvert runs along the front and a drainage pipe runs under the driveway....

Hank and Lisa had moved to Tommy's from their Maganolia house, after Hank's car wreck; he was on crutches with pins in his leg.

The day Haleigh went missing, a family member drove back up to the Gainesville hospital to bring him home in the blue van. And there it was that day, covered in dusty white fingerprint powder in the driveway. More from those interviews later.

http://www.artharris.com/2010/08/20/exclusive-misty-croslin-i-would-have-shot-joe/#more-4625

Vigilant reader? Aww shucks Art.... LOL

I received a message last night that he was going to do this, and true to his word, he did.

Thank You Art.

Now Cobra, show us what you're made of.

 

[Snowbunny]

ITA! and the thing that boggles my mind is that Ron is very serious when he says that "there was no fight with no cousin over no gun"

So did a gun fight happen or didn't it? i guess it just depends on who you believe....

Poor HaLeigh!

Teresa Neves said it happened in the beginning.

 

[Emeralgem]

The day Haleigh went missing, a family member drove back up to the Gainesville hospital to bring him home in the blue van. And there it was that day, covered in dusty white fingerprint powder in the driveway. More from those interviews later. http://www.artharris.com/2010/08/20/...joe/#more-4625


_____________________________________________________________

What in the HELL-O does this mean... ..And there it was that day, covered in dusty white fingerprint powder in the driveway.JMO

Also, Misty claims her father was brought home from Shands by ambulance.
IF Lisa was already at the hospital on Tuesday morning who other than Jo went to the hospital that morning to get Lisa and Hank Sr.? I heard Jo claim in his attorney's office he went to the hospital that morning to visit a relative..... So is Art getting this information from Chelsey or Timmy.. We know Timmy doesn't talk too much other than say.... huh, so it has to be Chelsey....

Was the gun in Chelsey's driveway.. Tommy's driveway? Someone help me out here..

 

[1Chump]

Nothing really unusual for me, but I am really confused..

Please , if you will, explain how Ron C realizes he messed up..TYIA

He told the story about coming down from his room to a fight with Joe and Hank (Tommy). He talks about Joe's ride being there to take him home. The entire story sounds like it happened on Feb. 9...the day Haleigh disappeared.

Cobra asks Ron who Hank is....that is when Ron realizes he messed up and admitted the fight was the day Haleigh disappeared and says Hank is...uuh..Misty's...uhhh...Dad....Hank, Sr. IMO, he changed Hank Jr. to Hank Jr. to Hank Sr. to change the day of the fight. Hank Sr. was in the hospital so if he was at the fight, it couldn't be the day Haleigh disappeared.

 

[kant]

He told the story about coming down from his room to a fight with Joe and Hank (Tommy). He talks about Joe's ride being there to take him home. The entire story sounds like it happened on Feb. 9...the day Haleigh disappeared.

Cobra asks Ron who Hank is....that is when Ron realizes he messed up and admitted the fight was the day Haleigh disappeared and says Hank is...uuh..Misty's...uhhh...Dad....Hank, Sr. IMO, he changed Hank Jr. to Hank Jr. to Hank Sr. to change the day of the fight. Hank Sr. was in the hospital so if he was at the fight, it couldn't be the day Haleigh disappeared.

I see your point. Iow he appeared to be backpeddling to imply another date.

I know Ron has, at least at one point, denied any fight or fight with a gun. So that in itself makes me believe there must have indeed been one.

Also, TN described a fight early on. She's probably since recanted. IDK.

Both of the above points - as small as they may seem- make me think that the date is crucial (relevant) and that there WAS a fight and, perhaps more importantly, a gun in play.

Sometimes it is the smallest things that tip me off to who-done-it. For example, at one point I recall seeing Susan Smith weeping about her children and it was heartbreaking. Then... she described the perp who she claimed jacked her car with the kids in the back and she said, "..at the stop sign he helped me out of the car."

That gave me the chills and I said to myself (bc I talk to myself but have yet to answer myself so I'm still running loose in public and as of yet not committed) at that point I thought, "She's lying."

Iow, for me, it's all about the little things.


moo

.

 

[doobiedoo52]

Art Harris has corrected his article and posted the following:



Vigilant reader? Aww shucks Art.... LOL

I received a message last night that he was going to do this, and true to his word, he did.

Thank You Art.

Now Cobra, show us what you're made of.

Gee thanks Art, except according to the lien documents from Shands, Hank wasn't released until Feb 11th.

 

[lonetraveler]

ITA! and the thing that boggles my mind is that Ron is very serious when he says that "there was no fight with no cousin over no gun"

So did a gun fight happen or didn't it? i guess it just depends on who you believe....

Poor HaLeigh!

I sure would like to see a LVA done on Ron Cummings statements.........

 

[lonetraveler]

The day Haleigh went missing, a family member drove back up to the Gainesville hospital to bring him home in the blue van. And there it was that day, covered in dusty white fingerprint powder in the driveway. More from those interviews later. http://www.artharris.com/2010/08/20/...joe/#more-4625


_____________________________________________________________

What in the HELL-O does this mean... ..And there it was that day, covered in dusty white fingerprint powder in the driveway.JMO

Also, Misty claims her father was brought home from Shands by ambulance.
IF Lisa was already at the hospital on Tuesday morning who other than Jo went to the hospital that morning to get Lisa and Hank Sr.? I heard Jo claim in his attorney's office he went to the hospital that morning to visit a relative..... So is Art getting this information from Chelsey or Timmy.. We know Timmy doesn't talk too much other than say.... huh, so it has to be Chelsey....
Was the gun in Chelsey's driveway.. Tommy's driveway? Someone help me out here..

LOL, LMAO. You really have a way with words and you are so right.:crazy:

 

[lonetraveler]

I've seen two different times for the gun story, one is the day before Haleigh was reported missing and one was a week prior to Haleigh missing. I tend to think it was the day before Haleigh was missing. Again, the players in this case appear to purposefully keep the date and day & week out of the conversation.

 

[Emeralgem]

I've seen two different times for the gun story, one is the day before Haleigh was reported missing and one was a week prior to Haleigh missing. I tend to think it was the day before Haleigh was missing. Again, the players in this case appear to purposefully keep the date and day & week out of the conversation.[/QUOTE]


And you know this may have been solved many moons ago IF this infomation had been revealed..And I cannot think of one good reason that it hasn't but I can think of some bad ones...JMHO

 

[krkrjx]

Sometimes it is the smallest things that tip me off to who-done-it. For example, at one point I recall seeing Susan Smith weeping about her children and it was heartbreaking. Then... she described the perp who she claimed jacked her car with the kids in the back and she said, "..at the stop sign he helped me out of the car."

That gave me the chills and I said to myself (bc I talk to myself but have yet to answer myself so I'm still running loose in public and as of yet not committed) at that point I thought, "She's lying."

Iow, for me, it's all about the little things.


moo

.

(snipped and BBM)

---------

You are so right that the little things--things that might not seem significant at all--can be very telling. I'll add my own Susan Smith example:

A co-worker and I were discussing the supposed carjacking and child abduction, and I mentioned Smith's composure, body language, eye contact, etc., during televised interviews seemed slightly off to me. I said I thought she cried inappropriately and that her tears seemed forced. My co-worker vehemently objected to my position, so I went on to explain that all Smith ever said was I want my kids home, please bring them home safe, etc. And she would always say it through tears--tears that didn't ring true to me. My co-worker was appalled at what I was saying about this young mother, the victim of a crime who had just lost her children at the hands of some madman.

In Haleigh's case, TN gave interview after interview and never really said much of anything: Ron's doing as well as he can, he's depressed and wants Haleigh home. BUT...whenever she was asked an in depth question, TN would scrunch up her face and squeeze out a couple tears and just say, "I just want Haleigh to come home."

People who must distract are usually hiding something. They do not want to say anything for fear of saying too much. Often they use tears as the distraction and as a means of ensuring the interview will be short and not too probative. They appear inconsolable in hopes it will make them look more like a victim and thus, to many, less like a perp.

So, I agree; the little things often provide a wealth of information.

 

[justus4all]

I've seen two different times for the gun story, one is the day before Haleigh was reported missing and one was a week prior to Haleigh missing. I tend to think it was the day before Haleigh was missing. Again, the players in this case appear to purposefully keep the date and day & week out of the conversation.

IT COULD BE....(my :twocents: worth.)..that the LE DO KNOW these dates..and had their lips sealed tight about them.

That is the whole reason...I...have so much trouble and confusion putting this all together...I DO NOT know...what the LE has...

It seems I can be shown the "coming attractions", but not seeing the "movie"

Totally frustrating

 

[kant]

(snipped and BBM)

---------

You are so right that the little things--things that might not seem significant at all--can be very telling. I'll add my own Susan Smith example:

A co-worker and I were discussing the supposed carjacking and child abduction, and I mentioned Smith's composure, body language, eye contact, etc., during televised interviews seemed slightly off to me. I said I thought she cried inappropriately and that her tears seemed forced. My co-worker vehemently objected to my position, so I went on to explain that all Smith ever said was I want my kids home, please bring them home safe, etc. And she would always say it through tears--tears that didn't ring true to me. My co-worker was appalled at what I was saying about this young mother, the victim of a crime who had just lost her children at the hands of some madman.

In Haleigh's case, TN gave interview after interview and never really said much of anything: Ron's doing as well as he can, he's depressed and wants Haleigh home. BUT...whenever she was asked an in depth question, TN would scrunch up her face and squeeze out a couple tears and just say, "I just want Haleigh to come home."

People who must distract are usually hiding something. They do not want to say anything for fear of saying too much. Often they use tears as the distraction and as a means of ensuring the interview will be short and not too probative. They appear inconsolable in hopes it will make them look more like a victim and thus, to many, less like a perp.

So, I agree; the little things often provide a wealth of information.

bbm

A similar discussion took place at my work and I was called heartless, but in that initial ron-drops-to-his-knees interview, TN struck me the same way that SS struck you.

With TN.. her affect -- it all was just off somehow, forced, contrived, and it didnt ring true for me. And subsequently her other actions and words have only added to and bolstered the suspicions. Yes, at times there seemed to be true grief, -- grief as in, my grandchild is dead and I already know it... and I know who did it. -- with the implied addition of, "And I wish it werent so." (Well, of course, she wishes that. What a horrible thing.)

The squeezing out tears as a distraction is an apt description too, imo. The other familiar refrain of TN and Ron and others when asked a pertinent question that makes her/them uncomfortable (or hits too close to home) is to become all indignant and exclaim, "This is about Haleigh, not about my life and things that I do." (Or "...things that Ronald does," as the case may be.)

Oh, I do beg to differ.

moo


.

 

[krkrjx]

bbm

A similar discussion took place at my work and I was called heartless, but in that initial ron-drops-to-his-knees interview, TN struck me the same way that SS struck you.

It was just off somehow and it didnt ring true for me. And subsequently her other actions and words have only added to and bolstered the suspicions.

The squeezing out tears as a distraction is an apt description imo. The other familiar refrain of TN and Ron and others when asked a pertinent question that makes her/them uncomfortable (or hits too close to home) is to become all indignant and exclaim, "This is about Haleigh, not about my life and things that I do." (Or "Ronald does," as the case may be.

Oh, I do beg to differ.

moo

Yes, that was all designed to steer the interviewer in a more comfy direction. Ron's indignance was reminiscent of Scott Peterson: This is about Lacy; asking about my life takes the focus off Lacy...

 

[kant]

Yes, that was all designed to steer the interviewer in a more comfy direction. Ron's indignance was reminiscent of Scott Peterson: This is about Lacy; asking about my life takes the focus off Lacy...

Indeed. And there were other attempts at manipulation with the addition of a snide, "Well, at least **I** (insert undue emphasis here) care about where Haleigh is... about finding Haleigh" with the implication being that the questioner/interviewer does NOT have Haleigh's interest in mind in making the inquiries, which is, of course, absurd.

That always crawls all over me.

A similar retort (with the insinuating implication included) is the all too familiar, "Well SOME of us only care about finding Haleigh" with the unspoken erroneous addendum of, "...and by asking me these questions (that put me in the hot seat).. you clearly DON'T care."

gack

and moo


.