Germany/Portugal - Christian Brueckner, 27 @ time of 1st crime (2004), charged with sexual assault crimes, Praia de Rocha, Portugal. #4

[frank-cole]

It is a strange one indeed but as my search engine reveals, not an unusual one as far as German procedures are concerned.
Although I've not taken the time to break the figures down to check how often the forces of law and order (judges) are challenged by the forces of law and order (the prosecution).
Accusations are rife and one or two might even be justified.
Indeed we even had an accusation of bias concerning one of the judges in the first day of the trial CB V the five.

What I'm struggling with is the dropping of all charges

• while the trial continues hearing evidence
• how is it possible to clear the decks of charges without the whole case collapsing

Snip
Impartiality / Lack of bias
Page 7
Judges always aim to avoid being guided by any off-topic considerations when applying the law and searching for justice and the truth. They are aware of their individual traits, their personal development and socialisation. In view of such inevitably subjective imprinting, they strive in any event to achieve the utmost objectivity. They put neither their personal assessments, sympathies or antipathies nor current public opinion above their commitment to democratically developed laws, but critically check their findings, argue from the facts and are open to criticism from third parties.
The fact that the judicial office is basically independent of external controls establishes a particular responsibility. Judges do not consider the independence of their office as a personal right. They are aware of the resulting obligation for their impartiality. Their work is therefore marked by open-mindedness and a willingness to listen to the parties involved, to grasp individual interests and connections and to assess these adequately.

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www.drb.de

That is a very high standard to strive for and to attain. And I don't think the judge in CB v the five did it justice.
She allowed her court to spend a lot of time in discussion of another case entirely; even to the extent of calling witnesses. She was way off-topic. Now I don't know if that could be classed as bias but it can certainly point to the fact none of it should have happened while she allowed procedures of the trial in which she had no locus to continue. The judge had enough on her plate with the five offences she should have been judging and certainly not on a case for which there isn't even an indictment.

There may indeed be further repercussions from that.
My opinion

I think this is part of the basis for their argument around the court making decisions mid-trial. It’s hard to assess a hearing until it’s over. Admissibility, technicalities & motions haven’t all been decided yet, so it’s more challenging to ascertain the balance of the trial as a whole, including the decisions on whether the motions have taken precedent over exploring all the facts. It’ll be more straightforward to review & make moves once everything is heard. Acquittals seem like a foregone conclusion, very unfortunate for the victims. If many threads of evidence have had many motions go the defences way, then the prosecution will have many threads to base appeals.

This trial will certainly have added value to the prosecution in respect of how some things may run in the MM trial. Keeping CB locked up with no soon-to-be freedom date - enables them to bridge those gaps & fill those loopholes. Because afterall - anybody who wants justice for Madeleine *Surely* wouldn’t not want every piece of evidence put forward.

My thoughts

 

[Mex]

I think this is part of the basis for their argument around the court making decisions mid-trial. It’s hard to assess a hearing until it’s over. Admissibility, technicalities & motions haven’t all been decided yet, so it’s more challenging to ascertain the balance of the trial as a whole, including the decisions on whether the motions have taken precedent over exploring all the facts. It’ll be more straightforward to review & make moves once everything is heard. Acquittals seem like a foregone conclusion, very unfortunate for the victims. If many threads of evidence have had many motions go the defences way, then the prosecution will have many threads to base appeals.

This trial will certainly have added value to the prosecution in respect of how some things may run in the MM trial. Keeping CB locked up with no soon-to-be freedom date - enables them to bridge those gaps & fill those loopholes. Because afterall - anybody who wants justice for Madeleine *Surely* wouldn’t not want every piece of evidence put forward.

My thoughts

It was always going to be a difficult one from all points of view to bring five unrelated indictments to trial under the umbrella of five entirely separate trials spanning decades.

It certainly did nothing to relax the pressure on court time by doing so. Here we are with weeks of hearing evidence still to be heard in a trial which started in February. Now with major changes which might even bring the whole process into disrepute

• the arrest warrant for all five actions being dropped immediately prior to the summer recess and while witnesses are still to be heard
• the addition of hearing witnesses to a charge which did not appear on the charge sheets for this or any other trial

Snip
Braunschweig. The German Christian B., who is also a suspect in the case of the missing girl M, will no longer have to face a trial this year for other allegations of sexual offenses.
Such proceedings will not begin before 2023, the Braunschweig Regional Court announced on Wednesday.
The responsible criminal chamber will now examine in a so-called interlocutory procedure whether the indictment will be admitted and the main proceedings opened.
On Tuesday, the Braunschweig public prosecutor's office had filed charges against the 45-year-old German. He is accused of three cases of aggravated rape and two cases of sexual abuse of children. He is said to have committed the crimes between the end of December 2000 and June 2017 in Portugal.
...
On the basis of the new, more than 100-page indictment for the five sexual offences, the public prosecutor's office has also applied for the issuance of an arrest warrant. "We expect a main hearing in the middle of next year," said the spokesman for the public prosecutor's office. "But that will ultimately be decided by the Braunschweig Regional Court."

Möglicher Prozess gegen Maddie-Verdächtigen Christian B. nicht vor 2023

Schwere Vergewaltigungen und Sexualstraftaten zum Nachteil von Kindern wirft die Staatsanwaltschaft dem 45-jährigen Christian B. vor. Ungeachtet dieser Anklage laufen die Mordermittlungen im Fall der in Portugal verschwundenen dreijährigen Maddie weiter.

www.rnd.de

 

[Davieson]

Not particularly- I got similar vibes from an-other user the other day. The ‘us versus them’ mentality is better placed in the conspiracy gossip clubs. I’m pro-victim so I’ll always want their interests put first. i expect the lawyers that lose a case to appeal the verdict. Although they’re not always used, appeals processes exist for a reason. ‘Bias’ isn’t the only basis for an appeal. HCW has already commented along the lines of assessing the verdicts & making a decision on how to proceed. FF has appealed against several things already. The possibly that either side will appeal a verdict is a very simple takeaway & not indicative of a red or blue who’sthewinner…

As far as I can see you are the only one pursuing this 'us and them line'.
Although interested in the legal procedure, I'm indifferent to the outcome, as I suspect are a few others.
If CB is convicted on one or more charges, then fine. If he is acquitted, equally fine. I trust the system to get it right.

 

[mrjitty]

I am not sure why the race to pre-judge the verdicts

Courts make decisions about detention pre conviction all the time. e.g an arrest warrant is granted by the court. Then later, after an application and hearing, bail is granted. The court makes an assessment of the current state of the evidence and risks. It does not pre-determine the outcome, though it might say something about the preponderance of evidence at the time of the application.

It would certainly make sense to find out if CB is convicted on any/all of these charges before talking about appeals. We don't know which side will be appealing!

MOO

 

[Mex]

As far as I can see you are the only one pursuing this 'us and them line'.
Although interested in the legal procedure, I'm indifferent to the outcome, as I suspect are a few others.
If CB is convicted on one or more charges, then fine. If he is acquitted, equally fine. I trust the system to get it right.

Isn't everything an "us" and "them" when it boils down to it. Even as we have seen with the difficulties within the court system which in my ignorance and innocence, call it naivety perhaps, that the German system was non-combative in finding the truth of the matter being paramount to all else.

This trial got off from the beginning with flaming argument between all concerned which may have coloured everything else occurring between February and July and up to the present day.

It goes to show that everyone is combative and there is always a 'them and us' attitude when people don't follow the herd and expect their opinions to matter. It really is quite difficult maintaining equanimity and impossible to please everyone when one argument is weighed against another.
My opinion

 

[Mex]

I am not sure why the race to pre-judge the verdicts

Courts make decisions about detention pre conviction all the time. e.g an arrest warrant is granted by the court. Then later, after an application and hearing, bail is granted. The court makes an assessment of the current state of the evidence and risks. It does not pre-determine the outcome, though it might say something about the preponderance of evidence at the time of the application.

It would certainly make sense to find out if CB is convicted on any/all of these charges before talking about appeals. We don't know which side will be appealing!

MOO

I am mystified by the cancellation of the arrest warrants in this trial.

The fact that

• the court agreed them when the indictments were laid
• the court withdrew them mid-trial

can be nothing less than prejudicial to the complainants' cases. In fact one wonders the value of continuing with a lost cause since the judges have made their interim opinion very clear indeed.
My opinion

 

[mrjitty]

Was it prejudicial to the defendant's case, when the Court granted an arrest warrant before hearing any of the evidence? If not, why would it be prejudicial to the state now?

 

[Mex]

Was it prejudicial to the defendant's case, when the Court granted an arrest warrant before hearing any of the evidence? If not, why would it be prejudicial to the state now?

As sleuths with a presumed interest in crime and punishment the presumption must be that any suspect who has been under surveillance by police investigators throughout the years from 2017>2022 and very probably until the present day will have an accumulation of evidence on file against him.

Indeed, some of that information which included identification and evidence used in trial proved his guilt in the vicious rape and torture of an elderly woman.

So one supposes that a similar process of information gathering was employed and submitted when the investigation as stated in #925 above "The responsible criminal chamber will now examine in a so-called interlocutory procedure whether the indictment will be admitted and the main proceedings opened."

Therefore all the information was in place either to have the process proceed or for the process to be discarded for lack of evidence.

At this time far from being prejudicial German Law obliges all relevant case files to be passed over to the suspect's defence team.
Which is definitely out-with the UK procedures with which we are familiar.

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to clarify my opinion of why the lifting of the arrest warrant amongst other issues may be prejudicial to the outcome for the plaintiff's in this trial.

• the judges' supporting statement has at a stroke devalued the quality of the evidence already given
• the judges' collective action suggests a prejudicial opinion which is likely to be supported in judgement
• the judges as well as effectively dismissing witness statements already given, have treated witnesses they had not yet heard with contempt. For example the eye expert whose testimony supported HB's identification of her assailant unequivocally; and the profiler who supported HB's account of her ordeal to the hilt when he compared the sadism with that displayed by CB when he utilised a rarely seen technique to put both her and DM in fear of their lives.

In effect the judges removed the arrest warrant without being aware that HB's unwavering description of piercing blue eyes was spot on. Just as the judges did not hear the compelling argument made by the profiler that HB and DM had been attacked by the same assailant.

 

[Niner]

Thursday, August 15th:
*Trial continues (Day 28) (@ 9am CET) – Germany/Portugal - Hazel Behan (20 @ time/now 40) (in her home, June 16, 2004, Praia de Rocha on the Algarve coast, 10 miles from Praia de Luz, Portimao, Portugal) - *Christian Stefan Brückner (Bruekner) (27 @ time of 1st crime (2004)/45/now 47) charged (Oct. 11, 2022) with sexual assault (suspect held a knife & brutally raped her. The accused then tied & gagged the woman to a table & raped her again. He then whipped the victim on the back with a whip he had brought with him & finally forcibly performed oral sex with the victim. The accused filmed large parts of the events with a video camera he had brought with him). Braunschweig Regional District Court
Germany/Portugal – *Charged (Oct. 11, 2022) & arrest warrant reinstated 11/18/22 - a 14 year old teenager (unknown victim) (on tape: assaulted/hit the naked girl with a whip. Said to have brutally forced the girl to have oral sex. The accused also videotaped this act). Took place between Dec. 28, 2000 to April 8, 2006 on the Praia da Luz, Algarve coast, Portugal.
Germany/Portugal - *Charged (Oct. 11, 2022) & arrest warrant reinstated 11/18/22 - an elderly woman 70-80 yrs old (unknown victim) a Tour Rep (tied up & raped the victim in her holiday apt. He then hit the victim several times with a whip. The accused is said to have recorded the entire event with a video camera). Took place around the same time (between Dec. 28, 2000 to April 8, 2006) on the Praia de Luz, Algarve coast, Portugal.
Germany/Portugal – *Charged (Oct. 11, 2022) & arrest warrant reinstated 11/18/22 - 10 year old German girl (Joana E.) (wearing only shoes & otherwise naked. He grabbed the child's wrist & began to perform masturbation movements on his naked penis). On Salema (Zalema) beach, near Praia de Luz, Portugal, April 7, 2007).
Germany/Portugal – *Charged (Oct. 11, 2022) & arrest warrant reinstated 11/18/22 – Ines VP (11 year old Portuguese girl) (pulled down his trousers & underpants & made masturbation movements on his naked penis in order to sexually arouse himself, until the frightened girl ran to her father for help. The suspect was arrested on the spot by the Portuguese police). Exposed himself in playpark, São Bartolomeu de Messines, June 11, 2017).
Trial began on February 16, 2024. (And continued on Feb. 23rd, Mar. 1st & 14th, Apr. 2nd, 10th, 12th, 17th, 19th, 24th & 26th, May 2nd, 15th, 16th, 17th, 21st, 22nd, 23rd, 28th, 29th & June 4th & 5th & 28th, July 5th, August 5th).
Next Trial dates: August 15, August 16, Sept. 5, 6, 25, 26, 27, Oct. 2, 7, 8, 21 & Oct. 22, 2024.
Presiding Judge Dr. Engemann. Lead Prosecutor Ute Lindermann. Defense attorneys Dr. Friedrich Fülscher, Philipp Marquort, Dennis Bock & Atilla Aykac.
Brueckner is currently serving a 7 year sentence for the 2005 rape on a pensioner; was sentenced in 2019. Release in Spring or Summer of 2026.
Case info & charges & Brueckner info from June 1, 2020 thru Jan. 18, 2024 & Trial Day 1-26 (Feb. 16 thru July 5) & thru July 25, 2024 reference post #781 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...imes-praia-de-rocha-portugal-4.714269/page-40
August 5, 2024, Monday, Day 27: Federal Criminal Police Office [BKA chief profiler expert Harald Dern. Ines VP (11 year old at the time who testified earlier in trial) her then playmate, now 17 years old & her father were heard. Trial continues on Thursday, August 15, 2024.
For more info see post #843 [page 43] & #869 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...imes-praia-de-rocha-portugal-4.714269/page-44

 

[JB1510]

DBM

 

[RichardKimble]

Thursday, August 15th:
*Trial continues (Day 28) (@ 9am CET) – Germany/Portugal - Hazel Behan (20 @ time/now 40) (in her home, June 16, 2004, Praia de Rocha on the Algarve coast, 10 miles from Praia de Luz, Portimao, Portugal) - *Christian Stefan Brückner (Bruekner) (27 @ time of 1st crime (2004)/45/now 47) charged (Oct. 11, 2022) with sexual assault (suspect held a knife & brutally raped her. The accused then tied & gagged the woman to a table & raped her again. He then whipped the victim on the back with a whip he had brought with him & finally forcibly performed oral sex with the victim. The accused filmed large parts of the events with a video camera he had brought with him). Braunschweig Regional District Court
Germany/Portugal – *Charged (Oct. 11, 2022) & arrest warrant reinstated 11/18/22 - a 14 year old teenager (unknown victim) (on tape: assaulted/hit the naked girl with a whip. Said to have brutally forced the girl to have oral sex. The accused also videotaped this act). Took place between Dec. 28, 2000 to April 8, 2006 on the Praia da Luz, Algarve coast, Portugal.
Germany/Portugal - *Charged (Oct. 11, 2022) & arrest warrant reinstated 11/18/22 - an elderly woman 70-80 yrs old (unknown victim) a Tour Rep (tied up & raped the victim in her holiday apt. He then hit the victim several times with a whip. The accused is said to have recorded the entire event with a video camera). Took place around the same time (between Dec. 28, 2000 to April 8, 2006) on the Praia de Luz, Algarve coast, Portugal.
Germany/Portugal – *Charged (Oct. 11, 2022) & arrest warrant reinstated 11/18/22 - 10 year old German girl (Joana E.) (wearing only shoes & otherwise naked. He grabbed the child's wrist & began to perform masturbation movements on his naked penis). On Salema (Zalema) beach, near Praia de Luz, Portugal, April 7, 2007).
Germany/Portugal – *Charged (Oct. 11, 2022) & arrest warrant reinstated 11/18/22 – Ines VP (11 year old Portuguese girl) (pulled down his trousers & underpants & made masturbation movements on his naked penis in order to sexually arouse himself, until the frightened girl ran to her father for help. The suspect was arrested on the spot by the Portuguese police). Exposed himself in playpark, São Bartolomeu de Messines, June 11, 2017).
Trial began on February 16, 2024. (And continued on Feb. 23rd, Mar. 1st & 14th, Apr. 2nd, 10th, 12th, 17th, 19th, 24th & 26th, May 2nd, 15th, 16th, 17th, 21st, 22nd, 23rd, 28th, 29th & June 4th & 5th & 28th, July 5th, August 5th).
Next Trial dates: August 15, August 16, Sept. 5, 6, 25, 26, 27, Oct. 2, 7, 8, 21 & Oct. 22, 2024.
Presiding Judge Dr. Engemann. Lead Prosecutor Ute Lindermann. Defense attorneys Dr. Friedrich Fülscher, Philipp Marquort, Dennis Bock & Atilla Aykac.
Brueckner is currently serving a 7 year sentence for the 2005 rape on a pensioner; was sentenced in 2019. Release in Spring or Summer of 2026.
Case info & charges & Brueckner info from June 1, 2020 thru Jan. 18, 2024 & Trial Day 1-26 (Feb. 16 thru July 5) & thru July 25, 2024 reference post #781 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...imes-praia-de-rocha-portugal-4.714269/page-40
August 5, 2024, Monday, Day 27: Federal Criminal Police Office [BKA chief profiler expert Harald Dern. Ines VP (11 year old at the time who testified earlier in trial) her then playmate, now 17 years old & her father were heard. Trial continues on Thursday, August 15, 2024.
For more info see post #843 [page 43] & #869 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...imes-praia-de-rocha-portugal-4.714269/page-44

How its translated a BZ article says Dern is to continue giving evidence today.

Was Christian B. mit Serienmörder Ted Bundy gemeinsam haben soll

Der Prozess gegen den Maddie-Verdächtigen wird Donnerstag fortgesetzt. Der BKA-Chefprofiler erstattet dann weiter sein Gutachten. Die Staatsanwaltschaft will nicht nachlassen, dass Christian B. verurteilt wird.

www.braunschweiger-zeitung.de

 

[RichardKimble]

​

Prozess gegen Christian B. – Anwälte kritisieren BKA-Chefprofiler

Im Prozess am Landgericht Braunschweig sieht ein Gutachter Parallelen zwischen einer angeklagten Tat und einem früheren Urteil gegen Christian B.. Die Verteidigung widerspricht vehement.

www.braunschweiger-zeitung.de

​

Litigation against Christian B. – Lawyers criticize BKA chief profilers​

Braunschweig. In the trial at the Braunschweig Regional Court, an expert sees parallels between an accused act and an earlier judgment against Christian B..

In the trial against the also in Maddie case suspicious Christian B. has reported an expert on the possible connections between two rapes and has received harsh criticism of the defense. There are similarities in the two acts in Portugal that occur very rarely, said the head of the operational case analysis at the Federal Criminal Police Office, Harald Dern.

He referred to a rape the accused is said to have committed against an Irish woman in Portugal in 2004. He drew parallels Rape of a 72-year-old American, for which the 47-year-old German was convicted by the Braunschweig Regional Court in 2019 and continues to be detained. The 63-year-old expert explicitly did not say that the 47-year-old is also the perpetrator in the first case. But with his analysis he comes to the conclusion that there is a lot to be said for common perpetrator behavior. Such behaviors are extremely rare to see, there are striking similarities, according to the BKA expert.

His job at the court was to check whether the two acts might belong together. The BKA investigator sees common ground in the course of the deeds. In addition, the perpetrator was not concerned with sexual satisfaction, but with the use of violence. The fact is that both crime scenes in Portugal were in the Algarve. Just like the four other acts accused in the current trial –, two rapes and two cases of sexual abuse in children.

Defenders of Christian B. doubt the results of the reviewer​

The defense lawyers significantly questioned the results of the assessor on Thursday before the criminal chamber. In their view, the process will soon end with an acquittal.

In the case of the 72-year-old American, B. was essentially convicted of having found a hair at the scene. According to the latest information from the judiciary, the sentence for this was served in spring 2025.

 

[Niner]

How its translated a BZ article says Dern is to continue giving evidence today.

Was Christian B. mit Serienmörder Ted Bundy gemeinsam haben soll

Der Prozess gegen den Maddie-Verdächtigen wird Donnerstag fortgesetzt. Der BKA-Chefprofiler erstattet dann weiter sein Gutachten. Die Staatsanwaltschaft will nicht nachlassen, dass Christian B. verurteilt wird.

www.braunschweiger-zeitung.de

Thanks for that info & translation of the article!

 

[RichardKimble]

Just an update of so far.

Braunschweig: Trial against Christian B. – that has happened so far​

Freispruch für Christian B. – die Chronologie des Prozesses

Braunschweigs Staatsanwaltschaft warf dem Maddie-Verdächtigen Vergewaltigungen und sexuellen Missbrauch vor. So lief der Prozess von Februar bis Oktober 2024.

www.braunschweiger-zeitung.de

 

[RichardKimble]

Tomorrows proceedings are cancelled .

landgericht-braunschweig.de

Proceedings before the 2nd Criminal Division in connection with five offenses against sexual self-determination - file number 2 KLs 213 Js 52790/18 (15/22) - continuation date of August 16, 2024 has been canceled
Regarding the proceedings 2 KLs 213 Js 52790/18 (15/22), which began on February 16, 2024 (see separate press preview for 2 KLs 15/22), the continuation date tomorrow, Friday, August 16, 2024, has been canceled.
The next continuation date is scheduled for:
Thursday, September 5, 2024, 9:00 a.m.
Please note that the overview of dates is not binding. Any changes will be posted in the court and will also be announced by the press office via a press release.

 

[Davieson]

Interesting concept that the proceedings are so dragged out.
It does mean that judges and lawyers have ample time to consider witness statements and prepare further questions at leisure.
Very different to a jury trial where lawyers have to think on their feet and may miss or omit to question some crucial piece of evidence.

 

[Mex]

Interesting concept that the proceedings are so dragged out.
It does mean that judges and lawyers have ample time to consider witness statements and prepare further questions at leisure.
Very different to a jury trial where lawyers have to think on their feet and may miss or omit to question some crucial piece of evidence.

A reasonable concept.
But is the process really as dragged out as all that considering that there are five separate trials underway; that days have been expended when questioning took place on unrelated incidents designed to shake the reliability of witnesses, but also to attempt access to the MM files;

• May 2, 2024: Mark Draycott is a Scotland Yard investigator working on the Maddie case. On the twelfth day of the trial, his testimony was heard. He contradicts a statement by key witness Helge B. In addition, it becomes known on this day that the Göttingen Regional Court has rejected the application for a retrial against Christian B. from 2019 as inadmissible.
• March 14, 2024: On the fourth day of the trial, ... Later, the defense filed a motion to be granted access to all investigation files against Christian B. – including the Madeleine McCann case. It is already clear that the trial will probably not end in June, but will take longer.

and there has been at least one delay due to illness.

• May 22, 2024: On day 17, the head of the BKA's operational case analysis was supposed to testify. The Federal Criminal Police Office has compared the rape of Hazel B. with the rape of the 72-year-old American woman, for which Christian B. was convicted. But: The chief profiler is missing for reasons of illness. Christian B.'s lawyers file a motion for rejection – due to bias.
• June 28, 2024: At the end of June, some trial dates are cancelled due to the illness of a person involved in the judiciary.

The exposure incident in the Messines playground is interesting from the point of view of the gap between the then child witnesses being interviewed.
Difficult to determine only from the headline ... but was there any suspicion that an issue of perjury might have been suggested?

• April 12, 2024: On the eighth day of the trial, an alleged victim has his say for the first time: the then eleven-year-old in front of whom Christian B. is said to have masturbated. The now 18-year-old and the father are switched from Portugal to the Braunschweig district court.
• April 26, 2024: On the eleventh day of the trial, another witness from Portugal is heard. The man had held the defendant on a playground in 2017 until he was arrested by the police. According to his descriptions, Christian B. first tried to move away and then claimed that he had only urinated.
• August 5, 2024: The trial continues after a summer break. BKA chief profiler Harald Dern testifies. He talks about the similarities and differences between the rape of the 72-year-old American woman, for which B. was convicted, and the act against Hazel B. In addition, the court is again concerned with the latest alleged sexual abuse in Portugal: A former playmate of the victim and her father will be connected to Braunschweig.

What a strange headline!
Is it merely a poor translation? Or is it yet another try by CB's defence to employ the witness contradiction (and worse) ploy which has been in use to taint testimony since the start of the trial.

Christian B: Have parents talked their children into abusive work?
Braunschweig. In 2016, the Maddie suspect went into hiding in Portugal. He was arrested in 2017. He is said to have masturbated in front of children. Or was everything completely different?

Christian B. in Braunschweig: Wurde Kindern Missbrauch eingeredet?

2016 tauchte der Maddie-Verdächtige in Portugal unter. 2017 wurde er verhaftet. Er soll vor Kindern masturbiert haben. Oder war alles doch ganz anders?

www.braunschweiger-zeitung.de

 

[frank-cole]

Goo

Interesting concept that the proceedings are so dragged out.
It does mean that judges and lawyers have ample time to consider witness statements and prepare further questions at leisure.
Very different to a jury trial where lawyers have to think on their feet and may miss or omit to question some crucial piece of evidence.

Good point, it probably does have an effect. It enables more time to reflect. In a case of a serial sexual offender, involving multiple crimes - perhaps the trial, in 1 block - (4-6 week ish) - reflects the serial nature of the offending and therefore can be displayed more effectively in court. Long gaps could perhaps render evidence & witnesses to be perceived independently rather than taken into wider context of a 1 offender 1 area 5 sex crimes.

My opinion

 

[Lilly b]

A reasonable concept.
But is the process really as dragged out as all that considering that there are five separate trials underway; that days have been expended when questioning took place on unrelated incidents designed to shake the reliability of witnesses, but also to attempt access to the MM files;

• May 2, 2024: Mark Draycott is a Scotland Yard investigator working on the Maddie case. On the twelfth day of the trial, his testimony was heard. He contradicts a statement by key witness Helge B. In addition, it becomes known on this day that the Göttingen Regional Court has rejected the application for a retrial against Christian B. from 2019 as inadmissible.
• March 14, 2024: On the fourth day of the trial, ... Later, the defense filed a motion to be granted access to all investigation files against Christian B. – including the Madeleine McCann case. It is already clear that the trial will probably not end in June, but will take longer.

and there has been at least one delay due to illness.

• May 22, 2024: On day 17, the head of the BKA's operational case analysis was supposed to testify. The Federal Criminal Police Office has compared the rape of Hazel B. with the rape of the 72-year-old American woman, for which Christian B. was convicted. But: The chief profiler is missing for reasons of illness. Christian B.'s lawyers file a motion for rejection – due to bias.
• June 28, 2024: At the end of June, some trial dates are cancelled due to the illness of a person involved in the judiciary.

The exposure incident in the Messines playground is interesting from the point of view of the gap between the then child witnesses being interviewed.
Difficult to determine only from the headline ... but was there any suspicion that an issue of perjury might have been suggested?

• April 12, 2024: On the eighth day of the trial, an alleged victim has his say for the first time: the then eleven-year-old in front of whom Christian B. is said to have masturbated. The now 18-year-old and the father are switched from Portugal to the Braunschweig district court.
• April 26, 2024: On the eleventh day of the trial, another witness from Portugal is heard. The man had held the defendant on a playground in 2017 until he was arrested by the police. According to his descriptions, Christian B. first tried to move away and then claimed that he had only urinated.
• August 5, 2024: The trial continues after a summer break. BKA chief profiler Harald Dern testifies. He talks about the similarities and differences between the rape of the 72-year-old American woman, for which B. was convicted, and the act against Hazel B. In addition, the court is again concerned with the latest alleged sexual abuse in Portugal: A former playmate of the victim and her father will be connected to Braunschweig.

What a strange headline!
Is it merely a poor translation? Or is it yet another try by CB's defence to employ the witness contradiction (and worse) ploy which has been in use to taint testimony since the start of the trial.

Christian B: Have parents talked their children into abusive work?
Braunschweig. In 2016, the Maddie suspect went into hiding in Portugal. He was arrested in 2017. He is said to have masturbated in front of children. Or was everything completely different?

Christian B. in Braunschweig: Wurde Kindern Missbrauch eingeredet?

2016 tauchte der Maddie-Verdächtige in Portugal unter. 2017 wurde er verhaftet. Er soll vor Kindern masturbiert haben. Oder war alles doch ganz anders?

www.braunschweiger-zeitung.de

It's actually quite difficult to get children to lie about something imo, what do you think?

 

[Mex]

It's actually quite difficult to get children to lie about something imo, what do you think?

In the present circumstances I think because of the ages of the children and their lack of understanding of what was going on makes it a very difficult thing to quantify.
At the time at least one of the children knew something was amiss causing her to alert her father. At the time I think the adults may have been more alarmed than the children were. Therefore I think it is a bit unfair to expect the now teens to give a comprehensive account of what happened particularly as they now have a different perspective and it must be difficult for them to differentiate between then and now and to put it all into words.

Perhaps more reliance should have been put into knowledgeable questioning back in 2017 by child protection experts for the record. Maybe it was? But who could have foretold that no trial would happen till seven or eight years down the line.

Sad that the newspaper headline suggests collusion might be indicated; but the time lapse seems to make the suggestion a player despite CB's en flagrante arrest.
My opinion