Gun Control Debate #5

[Karinna]

You have AR15s for hunting? And previously you said you had them in case of a terrorist attack or (God forbid) a natural disaster where it is dog eat dog.

I have always seen in matters of natural disasters that communities rally together to help each other, and it brings out the best in people, usually.

 

[Jennifer17]

If they amended the amendment they wouldn’t be. After all amendments can and have been amended. If I’m not mistaken, and my US history isn’t great but the 2nd amendment was written in when the US were terrified that the King of England may try to attack. The army in the US was vastly understaffed and under equipt and they needed the civilians in the US to back up the army for numbers and weapons. Now you have a huge armed forces with all the weapons they need, then the general public have no real physical need to keep the Queen of England from your doors, that’s what the armed forces are for. Damn if any country tried to attack the US they would be nuked into oblivion before you could get to a gun safe!

Times change. Laws written two hundred and odd years ago may be outdated and thank goodness or there would still be slavery in the US.

Farmers with guns did not win the War of Independence. The French Navy did.

 

[Jennifer17]

I have always seen in matters of natural disasters that communities rally together to help each other, and it brings out the best in people, usually.

Yes, but Bob posited a different scenario where people were killing other people for food.

 

[Karinna]

If they amended the amendment they wouldn’t be. After all amendments can and have been amended. If I’m not mistaken, and my US history isn’t great but the 2nd amendment was written in when the US were terrified that the King of England may try to attack. The army in the US was vastly understaffed and under equipt and they needed the civilians in the US to back up the army for numbers and weapons. Now you have a huge armed forces with all the weapons they need, then the general public have no real physical need to keep the Queen of England from your doors, that’s what the armed forces are for. Damn if any country tried to attack the US they would be nuked into oblivion before you could get to a gun safe!

Times change. Laws written two hundred and odd years ago may be outdated and thank goodness or there would still be slavery in the US.

I agree, things have changed a lot since then, and a lot for the positive, but not all of it.
I think there is, or rather has been a place for military, but only to protect your own borders from invasion. IMO it is not okay to go and kill innocent civilians who are just like the rest of us in foreign countries, because that is not our fight.
And weapons nowadays are more evolved than they used to be as well, so if some foreign Govt. decides to attack another country, they don't even have to leave their own country to do so.

 

[Blef]

Can anyone clarify something for me. Is there any age limit set for the constitution? When the 2nd amendment was written did it say you had to be over 18 for it to apply to you or does the constitution cover all Americans from birth to death? If there is no age limit why do the gun enthusiasts think that it’s unconstitutional to raise the age of bearing arms from 18 to 21, as it didn’t say it only applies to people 18 and over? If it doesn’t specify an age, then is it ok for a toddler to bear ams unsupervised as per its constitutional rights?

 

[Karinna]

Can anyone clarify something for me. Is there any age limit set for the constitution? When the 2nd amendment was written did it say you had to be over 18 for it to apply to you or does the constitution cover all Americans from birth to death? If there is no age limit why do the gun enthusiasts think that it’s unconstitutional to raise the age of bearing arms from 18 to 21, as it didn’t say it only applies to people 18 and over? If it doesn’t specify an age, then is it ok for a toddler to bear ams unsupervised as per its constitutional rights?

BBM,I think we would just have to use our common sense on that one?

 

[Jennifer17]

Can anyone clarify something for me. Is there any age limit set for the constitution? When the 2nd amendment was written did it say you had to be over 18 for it to apply to you or does the constitution cover all Americans from birth to death? If there is no age limit why do the gun enthusiasts think that it’s unconstitutional to raise the age of bearing arms from 18 to 21, as it didn’t say it only applies to people 18 and over? If it doesn’t specify an age, then is it ok for a toddler to bear ams unsupervised as per its constitutional rights?

Good point. It means restriction are able to be and have been placed on the 2nd Amendment.

 

[Blef]

Farmers with guns did not win the War of Independence. The French Navy did.

Wasn’t the 2nd amendment written AFTER the war of Independence? When America was born? When they were their own nation? Wasn’t it written to ensure numbers and arms to defend against future attacks?

 

[Jennifer17]

BBM,I think we would just have to use our common sense on that one?

But, as we have seen all common sense is not equal.

 

[Jennifer17]

Wasn’t the 2nd amendment written AFTER the war of Independence? When America was born? When they were their own nation? Wasn’t it written to ensure numbers and arms to defend against future attacks?

Of course it was. I am not sure of your point here.

 

[Blef]

BBM,I think we would just have to use our common sense on that one?

Obviously. But by the constitution would someone be infringing on the toddler’s constitutional rights?

Anyway my point was, where in the constitution does it say it only kicks in at 18? Why can’t an age limit if 21 to buy a gun be applied? We don’t let toddlers buy and carry guns, so why not an 18, 19 or 20 year old?

 

[Blef]

Of course it was. I am not sure of your point here.

So it wasn’t about needing to win the war of Independence, it was if they were attacked in the future. Citizens would bolster the army’s size. Hence the 2nd amendment

 

[human]

Nothing wrong with feeling that way but if you're a meat eater then you're simply paying other people to do your killing for you, right?

And as for the war thing, and killing people, I don't think anyone loves it. The biggest reason that we seem to be in a never ending war is due to religious beliefs, and the fact that some people of the Muslim religion hate and want to kill anyone who isn't of the same religion.

To tie this back in with the gun control topic, the threat of being attacked here in the United States by terrorists is one of the main reasons I can think of why some people may want to have AR-15's and high capacity magazines.

The other reason would be some sort of natural disaster such as an earthquake, hurricane, tsunami, volcanic eruption, etc., in which power is out for weeks, or months, roads are impassible, no food, no water, etc. In this kind of situation there will be people trying to steal whatever you may have. Law enforcement won't be able to help and if the bad guys have AR-15's, I'd want to have one as well.

Just some of my thoughts on that since so often I hear people say "why would anyone NEED a rifle like that, or a high capacity magazine?"

Puerto Rico had a horrible natural disaster. No water, no electricity. Have we heard anything about roving hoards of people killing? They have a very sad slum in San Juan.

Vanuatu had hurricane Pat that took out their vegetation so they do not have fruits and veggies. Do we hear about roving hoards? Japan has had tsunamis. Have we heard anything about people being killed with knives for food?

 

[bobcat]

You have AR15s for hunting? And previously you said you had them in case of a terrorist attack or (God forbid) a natural disaster where it is dog eat dog.

No, I don't own an AR-15 and never have. I generally like accurate rifles that only hold 3 or 4 cartridges in the magazine, not rifles that are made to just shoot up a whole lot of ammo as fast as possible. I'm too cheap to have fun doing that.The gun I mentioned previously that I have is a Ruger 10/22 which uses a "22 long rifle" cartridge, generally used for hunting small game like rabbits and squirrels. I don't use it for hunting, just have it because my dad passed it down to me. I actually haven't even shot it myself, but my two daughters have and they enjoy it. They liked the 25 round magazine and shooting 25 rounds as fast as they could pull the trigger. 22 Long Rifle ammo is cheap so that I don't mind.

 

[bobcat]

Can anyone clarify something for me. Is there any age limit set for the constitution? When the 2nd amendment was written did it say you had to be over 18 for it to apply to you or does the constitution cover all Americans from birth to death? If there is no age limit why do the gun enthusiasts think that it’s unconstitutional to raise the age of bearing arms from 18 to 21, as it didn’t say it only applies to people 18 and over? If it doesn’t specify an age, then is it ok for a toddler to bear ams unsupervised as per its constitutional rights?

It seems to me that Constitutional rights would apply to all adults, which is considered to be the age of 18.

 

[Jennifer17]

No, I don't own an AR-15 and never have. I generally like accurate rifles that only hold 3 or 4 cartridges in the magazine, not rifles that are made to just shoot up a whole lot of ammo as fast as possible. I'm too cheap to have fun doing that.The gun I mentioned previously that I have is a Ruger 10/22 which uses a "22 long rifle" cartridge, generally used for hunting small game like rabbits and squirrels. I don't use it for hunting, just have it because my dad passed it down to me. I actually haven't even shot it myself, but my two daughters have and they enjoy it. They liked the 25 round magazine and shooting 25 rounds as fast as they could pull the trigger. 22 Long Rifle ammo is cheap so that I don't mind.

I wouldn't be proud of my daughters if they thought it fun to shoot guns that have killed so many people.

 

[Jennifer17]

It seems to me that Constitutional rights would apply to all adults, which is considered to be the age of 18.

No mention of adults in the constitution.

 

[Blef]

It seems to me that Constitutional rights would apply to all adults, which is considered to be the age of 18.

So you would say that children have NO constitutional rights until they are 18 then?

 

[Jennifer17]

Puerto Rico had a horrible natural disaster. No water, no electricity. Have we heard anything about roving hoards of people killing? They have a very sad slum in San Juan.

Vanuatu had hurricane Pat that took out their vegetation so they do not have fruits and veggies. Do we hear about roving hoards? Japan has had tsunamis. Have we heard anything about people being killed with knives for food?

Stephen King book. Fiction, but many people that it could become a thing.

 

[rsd1200]

Can anyone clarify something for me. Is there any age limit set for the constitution? When the 2nd amendment was written did it say you had to be over 18 for it to apply to you or does the constitution cover all Americans from birth to death? If there is no age limit why do the gun enthusiasts think that it’s unconstitutional to raise the age of bearing arms from 18 to 21, as it didn’t say it only applies to people 18 and over? If it doesn’t specify an age, then is it ok for a toddler to bear ams unsupervised as per its constitutional rights?

I think that it is because, at the age of 18, you are legally an adult. You can be tried for the death penalty, you can sign up to serve in the armed forces, (where you may be called to fight/die for your country), you can consent to sex, you can marry, sign binding contracts, most have their license to drive by then, and are able to work at most any job, legally, and buy a pack of smokes, so that age, applies, to many things in a young adults life, with the exception of drinking alcohol. One can become emancipated from their parents as early as age 14 too. Maybe the country needs to redefine legal adult?