Halyna Hutchins Shot With Prop Gun - Alec Baldwin indicted & Hannah Gutierrez-Reed charged, 2021 #6

[evilwise]

You state that legally the armorer is entirely responsible for Halyna's death.

Are you saying that the charges against AB are false? And if false do you believe that AB's lawyers will be successful in having a judge throw them out?

Now that I see he was a producer and presumably in a position of authority on-set, there's a real possibility of it going to trial. Depends on the details but considering how long it's been I assume prosecutors have put together a case in this much time.

Like, if he was just an actor performing his role under direction then obviously it would be spurious. However on the far opposite end of the spectrum if he, as their boss, said "I've heard your concerns about the guns and I'm so sure they're safe I'm going to point this one at you and pull the trigger" well then it would be reckless homicide or whatever version of manslaughter New Mexico refers to that as. Real jail time.

 

[DWillS]

My "conspiracy theory" opinion is that the DA charged AB so it doesn't look like he's being given a "celebrity" pass while realizing that criminal negligence charges against him are unlikely to result in jury convictions.

My impression of quotes that I've read is that they are bringing the case against him more as a negligent shooter than a sloppy executive producer. (Although I think he deserves both.)

Given that he believed that it was a "cold" gun I just don't see a prosecutor getting unanimous criminal negligence convictions from a jury. Do I think he actually pulled the trigger? Yes. Is it possible via denial or other mental pretzeling that he has convinced himself otherwise? Yes.

I predict that he walks on the criminal negligence charges.

Then the DA's office can say "we tried" vs. letting him off from the get-go.

MOO

 

[Luna20]

They wouldn't touch either one because they'd be indistinguishable from each other.

I agree with the article @steeltowngirl posted, it's ludicrous to bring charges against an actor for doing their job. Nobody would have brought charges against that guy who shot Brandon Lee on The Crow set. I'm not sure if I think it's because society has changed that much or because Baldwin has deep pockets but either way it sucks.

There was a set armorer, as is industry standard and legally this should be entirely her responsibility. If she was clearly incompetent then it's also the studio's responsibility for putting her in that position. A tiny little theoretical sliver of additional responsibility is distributed among every person who remained in what they knew to be a dangerous set. Baldwin could easily have been the one shot.

(Edited to add that if Baldwin was a producer and had personally dismissed safety concerns about the armorer in that case I could see a manslaughter charge.)

I’m not sure about being completely incompetent but she was definitely not experienced enough. This was only her second assignment and she expressed her concerns over it. AB hired her anyway.

Most of this is posted in the earlier threads. There were also crew members who expressed their concerns over being fatigued because they were housed in the nearest cheap hotel that was about an hour away. A lot of cutting cost which unfortunately resulted in a horrible tragedy.

 

[Luna20]

I think the prosecution has a very good chance of convincing a jury that AB would have known that it was reckless to point the gun at Halyna and pull the trigger under any circumstances because of his own comments.


He knew that relying on someone's claim that the gun was not loaded with live ammunition would not justify pointing a gun at a person and then pull the trigger. JMO.

Alec Baldwin on 'Rust' shooting: 'Someone is responsible ... but I know it's not me'

Baldwin sat down with Stephanopoulos to sift through the series of events that led to Hutchins’ death.

abcnews.go.com

In addition to his “No no no I would never point a gun at anyone” he also stated that he pointed the gun as per Halyna’s directions. It can’t be both, which is it then? His credibility was weakened further due to his contradicting statements in the interviews.

 

[Lonicera]

One thing I don’t understand is that Gutierrez-Reed was hired to handle the guns on this shoot, so why didn’t she check the gun before giving it to this actor? To each his work , to each his specialty .
And it’s not very complicated to check a weapon. So, even if she didn’t have much experience, it wasn’t a job reserved for specialists.

 

[Mo Thuairim]

Alec Baldwin shot a woman on set. He’s now facing involuntary manslaughter charges. What changed?​

Nearly 15 months after the fatal shooting, investigators announced criminal charges over the on set fatal shooting of Rust cinematographer Halyna Hutchins. Bevan Hurley explains the complicated case

What changed in the Alec Baldwin shooting case?

Weeks before Alec Baldwin was due to stand trial for the manslaughter of Rust cinematographer Halyna Hutchins, the charge was sensationally dropped. Bevan Hurley explains the complicated case

www.independent.co.uk

Alec Baldwin will continue to film Rust as he faces involuntary manslaughter charges in the on-set shooting of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins.

Melina Spadone, an attorney for the production of the western, confirmed the news on Friday to CNN, adding that “on-set safety supervisors and union crew members ... will bar any use of working weapons or any ammunition.

Alec Baldwin in Instagram spat as Rust to resume filming despite charges

Alec Baldwin, Hannah Gutierrez Reed and David Halls face charges over the fatal on-set shooting of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins

www.independent.co.uk

 

[evilwise]

I’m not sure about being completely incompetent but she was definitely not experienced enough. This was only her second assignment and she expressed her concerns over it. AB hired her anyway.

Most of this is posted in the earlier threads. There were also crew members who expressed their concerns over being fatigued because they were housed in the nearest cheap hotel that was about an hour away. A lot of cutting cost which unfortunately resulted in a horrible tragedy.

I expect that, legally, Baldwin will have provably needed to know she was incompetent to know that there was a likelihood of the gun being live and so to be guilty of manslaughter. If an actor pushes another actor off a building as part of a scene and the net fails is the actor guilty of manslaughter?

 

[AliceInPain]

I’m not sure about being completely incompetent but she was definitely not experienced enough. This was only her second assignment and she expressed her concerns over it. AB hired her anyway.

Most of this is posted in the earlier threads. There were also crew members who expressed their concerns over being fatigued because they were housed in the nearest cheap hotel that was about an hour away. A lot of cutting cost which unfortunately resulted in a horrible tragedy.

bbm - there's another way to put this.
HGR accepted a job she knew she wasn't 100% competent to do.
jmo

 

[Mo Thuairim]

Hadn't read about HGR's reaction to the charges until now...

'Rust' Armorer Speaks Out About Criminal Charges: 'We Intend to Bring the Full Truth to Light'

On Thursday, Jason Bowles and Todd J. Bullion, attorneys for 25-year-old Gutierrez-Reed, said in a statement: "Hannah is, and has always been, very emotional and sad about this tragic accident. But she did not commit involuntary manslaughter."

"These charges are the result of a very flawed investigation, and an inaccurate understanding of the full facts," they added. "We intend to bring the full truth to light and believe Hannah will be exonerated of wrongdoing by a jury."

(...)

Rust Armorer Speaks Out About Criminal Charges: 'We Intend to Bring the Full Truth to Light'

'Rust' armorer Hannah Gutierrez-Reed's attorneys said the involuntary manslaughter charges are 'the result of a very flawed investigation'

people.com

 

[mickey2942]

There may be evidence that the prosecution has, that we are unaware of...that led to these charges. I don't think AB did himself any favors by doing all of the interviews. If his story changed at all...he has some problems.

I can see the reasons for the charges, they have the weapon, the shooter, and a dead person. Why wouldn't the DA press charges with a case like this?!

 

[RANCH]

I expect that, legally, Baldwin will have provably needed to know she was incompetent to know that there was a likelihood of the gun being live and so to be guilty of manslaughter. If an actor pushes another actor off a building as part of a scene and the net fails is the actor guilty of manslaughter?

This case is more like an actor pushes another actor off a building while rehearsing a scene but there's no net to catch anyone who falls.

The actor then claims that "They told me there would be a safety net." "Did you look to see if the net was in place?" "No, its not my job to put the net up." JMO.

 

[Luna20]

bbm - there's another way to put this.
HGR accepted a job she knew she wasn't 100% competent to do.
jmo

Correct, both are at fault but I feel AB as an older actor with years of experience should have used better judgement. I appreciate that she said anything at all, being as she is young, eager and wants the opportunity to work with AB.

It’s common sense to me. Do I want to cut corners and take a chance for the sake of saving dollars? My answer is No when others are involved. Its not like trying to decide on getting the higher or lower cost version of paper towels.

 

[Luna20]

One thing I don’t understand is that Gutierrez-Reed was hired to handle the guns on this shoot, so why didn’t she check the gun before giving it to this actor? To each his work , to each his specialty .
And it’s not very complicated to check a weapon. So, even if she didn’t have much experience, it wasn’t a job reserved for specialists.

She attempted earlier on to explain why she wasn’t with the gun. There was mention of her having a dual role, making it difficult to be with the gun at all times. Nothing has surfaced in writing yet to back that up but if it is true then AB has further legal problems. If she was hired for the sole purpose of being an armorer then there is no excuse or way around it. It’s very simple, anywhere the gun is she should be with it.

 

[Betty P]

Correct, both are at fault but I feel AB as an older actor with years of experience should have used better judgement. I appreciate that she said anything at all, being as she is young, eager and wants the opportunity to work with AB.

It’s common sense to me. Do I want to cut corners and take a chance for the sake of saving dollars? My answer is No when others are involved. Its not like trying to decide on getting the higher or lower cost version of paper towels.

I was just recalling some of the early discussion about this tragedy. One of the facts that was revealed was that there were/are 6 producers for the movie "Rust".

Who are the producers behind deadly ‘Rust’ film?

Safety questions had been raised about another film involving two of the producers.

www.latimes.com

Rust - IMDb

Rust “Produced by” credits

m.imdb.com

IIRC, producers are assigned to different specialty areas of production, based on experience. IIRC, Baldwin was not in charge of budget or hiring. He was supervising the artistic aspects of the movie, script, story, etc. Some were financial backers who probably kept an eye on the budget, but not day to day operations. If people want to assign blame for production team hiring decisions, it would make more sense to find out which producer/exec producer was in charge of that.

‘Rust’ EPs Disavow Responsibility For Troubled Alec Baldwin Movie: “No Involvement With The Physical And Day-To-Day Production”

UPDATED: As the Santa Fe Sheriff’s Department continues to probe the fatal shooting of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins on the set of the Alec Baldwin Western indie Rust last week, the questio…

deadline.com

 

[Luna20]

I was just recalling some of the early discussion about this tragedy. One of the facts that was revealed was that there were/are 6 producers for the movie "Rust".

Who are the producers behind deadly ‘Rust’ film?

Safety questions had been raised about another film involving two of the producers.

www.latimes.com

Rust - IMDb

Rust “Produced by” credits

m.imdb.com

IIRC, producers are assigned to different specialty areas of production, based on experience. IIRC, Baldwin was not in charge of budget or hiring. He was supervising the artistic aspects of the movie, script, story, etc. Some were financial backers who probably kept an eye on the budget, but not day to day operations. If people want to assign blame for production team hiring decisions, it would make more sense to find out which producer/exec producer was in charge of that.

Yes I expect that this info will be revealed in detail as the case progresses. Not sure how the tiers work so I should refrain from pointing to AB only when I don’t know the the specifics of the production parties.

Since they didn’t charge others, aside from the three, I assumed AB was the overall authority.

 

[Laughing]

She attempted earlier on to explain why she wasn’t with the gun. There was mention of her having a dual role, making it difficult to be with the gun at all times. Nothing has surfaced in writing yet to back that up but if it is true then AB has further legal problems. If she was hired for the sole purpose of being an armorer then there is no excuse or way around it. It’s very simple, anywhere the gun is she should be with it.

iirc, there was a text exchange linked way up-thread that involved HGR, armorer, and another person in a supervisory capacity on this set.

HGR stated that AB had failed to report for assigned gun safety training -- for the third time.

imho, this exchange shared with jurors would help HGR and hurt AB. Especially if there is sufficient indication of three attempts by Armorer to provide this training to Actor.

But -- then AD Dave Halls should not have handed any gun to Actor.

I can't imagine this young Armorer walkng to the set to say "Actor, I cannot deliver any sort of gun to a set for you until you complete the safety training. We've apparently had some sort of mis-communication on the 3 previously scheduled safety training sessions. What is a good day & time for you? "

Can anyone find the link? I can find articles about the lawsuit that includes the claims, but thought we saw screen shots earlier.

 

[Dotta]

The very fact that Union workers left the set tells me what kind of working conditions and safety rules were there.

What a shame!

It is time to take responsibility.

JMO

 

[clearskies1]

IMO Baldwin has credibility issues. He first told LE that it was Hannah who handed him the gun. (See 45:20 below). He was quite clear about that. But later in the Stephanopolous interview said that it was Halls who handed him the gun and that Halls said cold gun. Why did his account change?? Was he worried that LE would not look kindly on it if he told them that he relied on a first Assistant Director (Halls) rather than the armorer? I don't know. Could he have simply misremembered?

He also said in the Stephanopolous interview that he did not pull the trigger and that he would not point a gun at someone and pull the trigger. But he clearly pointed the gun at Halyna and, per the FBI, the gun would not discharge unless the trigger was pulled. JMO.

 

[Luna20]

iirc, there was a text exchange linked way up-thread that involved HGR, armorer, and another person in a supervisory capacity on this set.

HGR stated that AB had failed to report for assigned gun safety training -- for the third time.

imho, this exchange shared with jurors would help HGR and hurt AB. Especially if there is sufficient indication of three attempts by Armorer to provide this training to Actor.

But -- then AD Dave Halls should not have handed any gun to Actor.

I can't imagine this young Armorer walkng to the set to say "Actor, I cannot deliver any sort of gun to a set for you until you complete the safety training. We've apparently had some sort of mis-communication on the 3 previously scheduled safety training sessions. What is a good day & time for you? "

Can anyone find the link? I can find articles about the lawsuit that includes the claims, but thought we saw screen shots earlier.

In some capacity I foresee there being a debate between HG and AB. There is the training issue and the possible dual role. Was she not informed that a rehearsal was taking place? Did she have a script schedule to follow spelling out Scene 2 rehearsal at 3pm on set?

The peer pressure aspect regarding the training session of what you described is understandable to me. Had it been someone older and more experienced it may have not been intimidating for them to confront AB or other senior roles.

 

[clearskies1]

In some capacity I foresee there being a debate between HG and AB. There is the training issue and the possible dual role. Was she not informed that a rehearsal was taking place? Did she have a script schedule to follow spelling out Scene 2 rehearsal at 3pm on set?

The peer pressure aspect regarding the training session of what you described is understandable to me. Had it been someone older and more experienced it may have not been intimidating for them to confront AB or other senior roles.

Lawsuit filed by HG-R:

"[H]er lawsuit appeared to cast some blame on the actor, saying he failed to attend training and pointing to his handling of the weapon. The lawsuit says Gutierrez-Reed asked Baldwin to schedule the training on October 15, less than a week before the fatal shooting but she never heard back from the actor....

The lawsuit says no one called Gutierrez-Reed back into the church when Baldwin began rehearsing the scene, which involved a cross draw, even though her presence was required for any gun-related filming or rehearsing.

"Hannah did not see the weapon, nor did she have custody of it for approximately 15 minutes," the lawsuit says."

Alec Baldwin ignored 'Rust' armorer's request to attend 'cross draw training' just days before the shooting, lawsuit says

The "Rust" armorer, Hannah Gutierrez-Reed, has sued the film's ammo supplier, alleging the company mixed live ammunition and dummy rounds.

www.insider.com