ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 53

[misscandle]

single bed in that affidavit almost certainly means just one bed in room, and probably does not refer to a size.

In hotel bookings when you book a room with a single bed, it means a single, as in one, full, queen or king size bed, not a "twin" size bed

Interesting, you’re probably right. In the UK we call a twin bed, a single bed. I also initially thought it meant single as in twin, but more likely to mean singular.

 

[Alethea]

Question... so does it sound to anyone else like BK knew beforehand which rooms were X and M's? Sure sounds like he didn't even look in on DM's room. And X's room isn't exactly right by the slider.

Pure speculation but reading the PCA, I think he went upstairs first. DM reported hearing KG's dog "playing around" first and then later reported hearing someone say "there's a man here."

I think BK went upstairs first and killed the girls. I think X noticed BK somehow and said to E, "there's a man here." Then BK came downstairs and was confronted by X or E and killed them both. I think it's more likely DM heard someone on the second floor say "there's a man here" than all the way from the third floor while the dog was making noise.

The PCA says K and M had "visible stab wounds" that the officer himself noticed. The PCA says that X and E were stabbed too as determined by the autopsy. I read that to mean K and M may have had worse injuries, and were laying out in the open, while X and E were killed but laying down and it was less obvious.

The PCA jives with the original story we heard that the roommate thought someone was "passed out." If X and E were face down with their injuries under them, less severe than upstairs, I see how that could be possible.

JMO, obviously a lot of mental leaps.

 

[10ofRods]

My biggest question is how the police could almost immediately say they think there is no danger to the community after an unknown knife murderer just killed 4 people?

Because they knew who he was and had eyes on him.

BAU probably profiled him as well. And they were right about him, as far as we know.

Is there a single thing LE lied about or misrepresented in this case?

Well, yes and no. At the time they said "approximate time of death" was 3-4, they might already have known it was later - maybe not. Maybe that was in fact the first guess and they just let it hang out there.

We now know they had plates and DMV records on the car, but it wasn't a 2011-2013 Elantra. It was 2015. Etc. AFAIK, they did not correct that. Not that most people can tell model years on sight, but still.

IOW, when they made some original statements that the public took as facts, they later learned something else (very quickly too) but did not rescind or correct the original information. For good reasons.

And they don't have to. But some would say that's "misrepresenting," I think.

Agreed. Although in my opinion there is no need to amend flight/fight as freezing is a form of flight behavior; running away in our mind. I do think there was some of this in D's case, but even more so, she clearly didn't have the "benefit" of knowing what we all now know. A few pieces of the puzzle make a lot more sense when the entire puzzle is put together. We all need to have great sympathy for her (as I know we do) and believe that with good counseling and support, she will be able to overcome this tragedy, a tragedy caused not by her in any way but by a madman. MOO.

As a teacher, I don't think it would be an easy sell to today's students to try and convince them (I typically start with videos of various mammals performing these actions, as all mammalian brains have similar wiring in this regard). Flight means "run away." In fact, there are posters in my classroom outlining one's choices in case an assailant attacks us:

1) Hide/freeze under the desks
2) Run away/flight
3) Find an object and fight

These are illustrated by pictures, of course. I always add: think about using furniture in a more creative way than just hiding (such as blockading/obstructing). I also ask how many people have a weapon with them, with interesting results (they are not supposed to have guns, btw - and sometimes a person will still reveal they have one with them). Mostly it's knives, pepper spray, bear spray, and sometimes, even, hair spray (which in a pinch can be weaponized).

I also point out that several doors in my main classroom do not open without a key (which is something I've complained about over and over, and ask them to watch while I demonstrate which doors can be opened from the inside and which cannot). The ones that don't open are class and can be broken from the outside by an assailant with a gun, but they are fairly sturdy and no one anyone could break them easily with anything less than gunfire, IMO.

I then tell them that sitting nearer to an operable door is a good tactic (this changes nothing about where they sit, though - not once). All of them tend to choose their seats on first day, and with rare exceptions, do not change where they sit. They cannot give me their reasoning on this. Or won't tell me, one or the other - I think they would if they could though, as they look thoughtful during the discussion. If you have students in your family, please talk to them.

I have been shocked by all the self-reports of U of ID parents in various places saying that they have not mentioned the murders to their vacationing students, for fear of "worrying them" or '"triggering them." A little worry can be a good thing and if a student is so fragile that they cannot handle a parent's words on such matters, I have no clue how they're handling college professors and the signage and the lessons on "active shooter procedures" that most schools - even elementary schools - are practicing.

I hope everyone talks safety with their families - one more time. Cameras. Cameras are very good.

 

[Firstsnow4]

Is there any possible way that the following could be true, just hear me out:

1. The timeline seems very tight - by the time the car pulled in King Road at 4.04am did all of the manuoevres (parking, turning around, up and down queen road) it must have been at least 4.10 - then he has to get in the house commit the crime and be speeding off by 4.20am.
2. Could he have staged the whole thing to make it look like he was the killer - stalking beforehand, phone pings nearby, car nearby, switched his phone off on purpose, used his own car, handled the knife sheaf, travelled to a possible disposal site. But in fact the actual killer was someone else in the car with him. Just to have it played out in a court to see if he was in fact clever - justice prevailing and all that.

I would be interested to see if they have more evidence at the crime scene that matches with BK - victim fingernail scrapings, blood dna, footprints that match with his, dna in his car etc etc.

I am not saying his innocent - not in a million years - just playing devils advocate.

I know you probably thing I’m a burger short of a Big Mac for suggesting it but I needed to put it out there. Please shoot me down if I’m talking nonsense!

 

[jcamh]

Mods - please remove if this is not allowed:
Another thought I had. I find it interesting that LE found a sheath to the knife because in one of the online discussions, the online persona had an intense discussion about the killer leaving a sheath behind at the murder scene.

Based on the information in the PCA: It seems that M was killed first (if that is where he took his knife out of the sheath). 2) K would probably have been second based on proximity. 3) X would have been third, since she was found in the hallway. I wonder if she was coming back from getting her Door Dash food. 4) E was killed 4th. I wonder if E woke up or he was killed in his sleep.

So, I wonder if M was the target and K, X and E were collateral damage?

 

[XtremeScorpio]

I was going to say, in all the many pages here discussing his appearance, I don't recall anyone saying he had bushy eyebrows.

That being said, I have no doubts this is the guy. MOO

Maybe they just stand out more when his other facial features are covered up

 

[finkleiseinhorn]

This doesn’t account for the dog barking beginning at 04:17 though imo

Commotion from a slamming door/screaming as he enters Xana's room would definitely make my dog start to bark, even in a different part of the house.

 

[CityKid]

Personally, I think it's possible that it was indeed the house and its situation that ultimately made BCK's mind choose a target. I wanted to insert an adjective before "mind" but resisted.

(snipped for focus) I also think the house was the focus. From the back, with some room lights on, it's very noticeable, and easy (slider) ingress points are visible. I believe he chose a house that he could get in and out of easily. MOO.

 

[chrisinmd]

Well I don't see how his defense attorney can explain away his DNA on the knife cover with any creditable explanation?

You could explain his DNA being present in the house if he was there at a party for example. Or even if it was under one of the females fingernails or on there bodies he could claim he meant them somewhere and had a sexual relationship with one of them as in a one night stand. Those circumstances you could at least come up with a explanation that could be plausible.

But his DNA being on the knife cover I don't see how that can be explained away?

Thoughts?

 

[LoveyluvsThurston]

She merely opened her door and looked out per the doc. I doubt she even crossed the threshold of her room.

This makes sense. I went back and read it again. It never says in the PCA that he saw her, so I agree.
As for her hearing crying- she may have been hesitant because, as others have written, she did not realized the magnitude of the situation. Maybe she thought X and E were fighting and the crying was due to that. At 20, I would stay out of an argument. And I lived in a party house in college. Always lots of antics and people wandering in and out who were not roomies. I’m sure it did frighten her to see a masked stranger, but she may have assumed he was a visitor (maybe a Sig Chi) visiting X & E- and locking the door was normal to keep drink visitors from stumbling into a room. Hard to say, but this also could be possible.

 

[LaineyJ]

I understood Aug 2022 the start of the fall semester.

If so, seems he was often in their area very soon after moving to WA. He would’ve found out about, or possibly interacted with any of them fairly quickly.

 

[XtremeScorpio]

Also does the fact that D thought she heard Kaylee say there's someone in the house indicate he originally came in for peeping Tom goal of k or m and then everything escalated?? That would explain carelessness n literally parking right outside ? Obsessed intruder to just be a peeping Tom wudnt need to be as careful as preplanned murder, cud he have gone there originally to SA maybe believing x n m to be alone in their rooms

She didn't say someone was in house. She said it sounded like she said someone was here. She could have heard somebody stopping in front of the house or seen headlights or something like that

 

[Cindizzi]

They let 1 person film and that 1 person points the camera at the judge the majority of the time… couldn’t make it up.

Well it is pretty standard to have the camera on whoever is speaking in Court proceedings.

Could seem prejudicial if it stayed on the Defendants.

We don’t want to have cameras not allowed at all, like in the Frazee trial. His Defense complained that the cameras stayed zoomed in on him and folk were making fun of his pink handcuffs. ( it was true).

Judge boots cameras from Patrick Frazee hearing over missing Woodland Park woman Kelsey Berreth

No cameras will be permitted in court Friday, May 24, 2019, when Patrick Frazee of Florissant, Colorado, is arraigned on first-degree murder charges in the disappearance and presumed killing of

gazette.com

 

[jcamh]

Playing devil's advocate for a moment, if I were the defense I would wonder why there
Was DNA found only on the button on the sheath--since it was a bloody scene why
Isnt there more blood found on the sheath?

That's all the DNA that we know about so far. For the PCA, they just have to put him at the scene and prove it's him - bare minimum. I feel certain at trial, they will have a boatload of more evidence.

 

[EJB123456]

Is there a single thing LE lied about or misrepresented in this case?

They reiterated that they didn’t have a suspect when they did

They stuck with murders occurring between 3am-4am when they had evidence to the contrary
They said the surviving roommates were asleep and didn‘t wake until later that day
From the top of my head…
All with good reason so as not to tip BK off.

Oddly that the dog was found at the house that night (When it was on body cam video that midday when they got there). That they were all likely asleep (Xana had just had food delivered and was likely watching TikTok).

 

[kittythehare]

Well I don't see how his defense attorney can explain away his DNA on the knife cover with any creditable explanation?

You could explain his DNA being present in the house if he was there at a party for example. Or even if it was under one of the females fingernails or on there bodies he could claim he meant them somewhere and had a sexual relationship with one of them as in a one night stand. Those circumstances you could at least come up with a explanation that could be plausible.

But his DNA being on the knife cover I don't see how that can be explained away?

Thoughts?

He could say it was stolen from him.
he could say he was cruising with friends and one of them wanted to visit somebody in the murder house and he was merely the driver.
He could say his friend resembled him closely and even had bushy eyebrows...

i don't see any of it washing though?

 

[arielilane]

Idaho murders timeline: Suspect arrested in killings of 4 University of Idaho students​

Saturday, November 12​

Kaylee Goncalves, Madison Mogen, Ethan Chapin and Xana Kernodle were students at the University of Idaho who lived at a nearby off-campus residence in Moscow, a college town of about 25,000 people.

They had two other roommates at the residence, a three-floor, six-bedroom apartment.

Goncalves posted a series of photos on her Instagram at some point with the caption "one lucky girl to be surrounded by these ppl everyday." One of the photos shows Mogen sitting on Goncalves' shoulders, with Chapin and Kernodle standing next to them.
That night, Chapin and Kernodle went to a party on campus, and Mogen and Goncalves went to a downtown bar, police said.

Sunday, November 13​

Mogen and Goncalves ordered at a late-night food truck at about 1:41 a.m., the food truck's live Twitch stream shows.

They ordered $10 worth of carbonara from the Grub Truckers and wait for about 10 minutes for their food. As they waited, they could be seen chatting with each other and with other people standing by the truck.

Joseph Woodall, 26, who manages the truck, said the two students did not seem to be in distress or in danger in any way.

Mogen, Goncalves, Chapin and Kernodle returned to the home at some point in the early morning hours.

At about noon Sunday, a call came in to 911 about an unconscious person at an off-campus residence. Police did not say who called 911.

Arriving officers found the door to the residence open and discovered the bodies of four fatally stabbed students.

"It was a pretty traumatic scene to find four dead college students in a residence," Latah County Coroner Cathy Mabbutt later told CNN affiliate KXLY.

There was no sign of forced entry or damage, police said.

Moscow Police issued a statement saying four people were found dead in a home off campus. University of Idaho President Scott Green announced that the four victims were students and canceled classes on Monday.


Idaho murders timeline: Suspect arrested in killings of 4 University of Idaho students

 

[esayer]

Here's an illustration from the Daily Mail that might make it a bit easier to discern the timeline.

View attachment 392867

How Idaho cops linked Kohberger to scene where students were murdered

Damning evidence from an unsealed affidavit shows how police were able to link Bryan Kohberger to the crime scene - after he 'stalked' out the college home twelve times before the murders.

www.dailymail.co.uk

The knife and clothes he was wearing are in the river 100%.

 

[Ilex]

This makes sense. I went back and read it again. It never says in the PCA that he saw her, so I agree.
As for her hearing crying- she may have been hesitant because, as others have written, she did not realized the magnitude of the situation. Maybe she thought X and E were fighting and the crying was due to that. At 20, I would stay out of an argument. And I lived in a party house in college. Always lots of antics and people wandering in and out who were not roomies. I’m sure it did frighten her to see a masked stranger, but she may have assumed he was a visitor (maybe a Sig Chi) visiting X & E- and locking the door was normal to keep drink visitors from stumbling into a room. Hard to say, but this also could be possible.

Given the mask I would have assumed some fraternity prank, locked my door and gone to bed too. Or assumed that maybe someone didn't want to be recognized so they were hiding their face while doing the walk of shame.

 

[cheetostock]

Seems I missed a lot today