ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 15

[CFProfiles]

Please disregard....this individual turned themselves into.

So I keep thinking about the knife threat back in September and really think it is related. Someone in the community has become unhinged and I think they were close to doing something that day in September and thought better of it (awake targets are not as easy to deal with as sleeping ones.) Depending on where along the path (articles state between the steam plant lot 14 and the student rec center) the incident happened, it is roughly a 16-20 minute walk to 1122 King Road. It seems clear that this individual is extremely familiar with this area. I feel like it would be hard for a student to pull something like this off without being recognized, I get the feeling it is not, but that is my opinion.

 

[The Observer]

Many students drop out of sororities their junior or senior year. The initial excitement has gone away and they are starting to think about finances.

True, but the timing may be more than a coincidence.

 

[Cryptic]

Lol. I get it. It sounds ridiculous to us as grown adults. But if a sorority suddenly loses its ability to throw parties, that’s devastating to 20 year olds who are paying a small fortune to live in that sorority house.

Then factor in not only the monetary loss, but the sense of betrayed trust or loyalty directed at the possible whistle blower.

I would not be surprised if every biker club, fraternity, sorority, sports team etc. has some members who invest disproportionate amounts of their self esteem, money, time into the group.

These same members also derive disproportionate amounts of their social standing from the group and can takes things like real or perceived betrayal of or disloyalty to the group, well..... "more seriously" than others.

Though I am not comparing biker to Greeks directly, at their core, both are groups of humans who pledge to support each other and then spend alot of time and money doing so. This can generate similar expectations.

My fraternity (Sigma Omega Lamda Nu- Socially Awkward Library Nerd) did not permit much contact with Greeks. I do, however, remember one fraternity on my campus with a reputation for being "rough around the edges". Members were rumored to engage in night club fights, and known to aggressively intimidate student referees at intramural sports.

Perhaps such a fraternity could have a larger number of intense members? To paraphrase a famous police saying: "The murderer only needs to have a motive. It does not need to be a good motive".

Even still, and as you imply, it seems like a stretch. But... somebody had a motive.

 

[Wallendo]

I would like to know what happened at 4 AM. We have frequently been told this happened between 3 and 4, possibly between 2 and 4. What happened that LE was able to pinpoint this as the latest possible time from almost the very beginning.

Since the bodies weren’t found until noon, there must be some other evidence to pin down this time even before the autopsy.

 

[sds71]

“it was fast and nobody suffered and nobody felt like that kind of pain”

Goncalves said the victims suffered "large punctures" from a "brutal weapon."

He said he only found out about his daughter's untimely demise from family members on campus before police confirmed her death, and tried to call Madison — Kaylee's best friend for years — only to find that she wasn't responding either.


The call apparently came after Kaylee and Madison's friends were not able to reach them after incessantly calling and texting their numbers.

Dad of slain Idaho student pleads with public for help: 'I have to have my justice'

The father of Kaylee Goncalves, one of the four University of Idaho students mysteriously stabbed to death in an off-campus house, speaks to ABC News.

abcnews.go.com

Video Father of slain Idaho student speaks out

Steve Goncalves, the father of 21-year-old victim Kaylee Goncalves, sheds new light on what he believes happened the night of the quadruple murder.

abcnews.go.com

Father of one of the murdered Idaho students says they didn't suffer

Steve Goncalves, the father of 21-year-old Kaylee Goncalves, revealed on Tuesday that his daughter did not suffer in her final moments.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Blinkoncrim]

“Aaron Snell, communications director for Idaho State Police, would not answer a question on Monday related to whether the surviving roommates had guests over at the time of the crimes.”

Idaho coed murders: Sorority sister recalls victim's hours before tragedy, 'a normal night in Moscow'

University of Idaho students Ethan Chapin, 20; Kaylee Goncalves, 21; Xana Kernodle, 20; and 21-year-old Madison Mogen were stabbed several times and killed on November 13

www.foxnews.com

 

[jackthejester]

Then factor in not only the monetary loss, but the sense of betrayed trust or loyalty directed at the possible whistle blower.

I would not be surprised if every biker club, fraternity, sorority, sports team etc. has some members who invest disproportionate amounts of their self esteem, money, time into the group.

These same members also derive disproportionate amounts of their social standing from the group and can takes things like real or perceived betrayal of or disloyalty to the group, well..... "more seriously" than others.

Though I am not comparing biker to Greeks directly, at their core, both are groups of humans who pledge to support each other and then spend alot of time and money doing so. This can generate similar expectations.

My fraternity (Sigma Omega Lamda Nu- Socially Awkward Library Nerd) did not permit much contact with Greeks. I do, however, remember one fraternity on my campus with a reputation for being "rough around the edges". Members were rumored to engage in night club fights, and known to aggressively intimidate student referees at intramural sports.

Perhaps such a fraternity could have a larger number of intense members? To paraphrase a famous police saying: "The murderer only needs to have a motive. It does not need to be a good motive".

Even still, and as you imply, it seems like a stretch. But... somebody had a motive.

To add some more antecdotal context to the Greek life aspect of all this, I was in a fraternity at what seems to be a similar school and graduated in 2018. There were tons of rules regarding what we could and could t do socially: every official party had to be registered with the school, no kegs were allowed at parties, we were supposed to be carding everyone and only serving alcohol to those over 21, etc. My fraternity was put on probation a multitude of times and the way the school found out about infractions was almost always public social media posts. In example, a picture with a keg next to our fraternity letters. What I’m getting at is that I don’t totally buy the whistleblowing theory. I doubt their sororities were put on probation for anything particularly scandalous. Could be something as simple as one of the girls getting alcohol poisoning at a registered function and having to go to the hospital. All of this is imo, of course.

 

[Blinkoncrim]

I would like to know what happened at 4 AM. We have frequently been told this happened between 3 and 4, possibly between 2 and 4. What happened that LE was able to pinpoint this as the latest possible time from almost the very beginning.

Since the bodies weren’t found until noon, there must be some other evidence to pin down this time even before the autopsy.

I think because they ate and the digestive process is a clock

 

[OldCop]

I did research the map, and here are my thoughts, FWIW and not much else:

1. the murders didn't happen at the university, so why get all that extra footage? they're looking for way in and way out, and because of the location of the home, it's possible to easily define the four access points. if you look on the map, you will see that there are NO other ways into and out of the house's location without crossing one of those roads, and even on foot or bike, the killer had to come across the perimeter. They didn't ask for more for this purpose because they'd have more to sort through, and they only want to know what made it over the perimeter.

2. I think their screenshot that goes all the way down 95S past W Palouse River Dr to the 2700 block is just providing perspective. It's not to be reinterpreted and AFAIK they have not requested any other boundary. ICBW, probably am, but if they wanted Wasankari Construction camera, wouldn't they just ask for it and not leave people to interpret the difference between map and screenshot?

Interesting perspective. I CBW, too. Like everyone here, we are all really playing a guessing game with what few facts we have. My thoughts on your thoughts:

1) I realize the murders didn’t happen at the university, but if you truly don’t know the direction of escape or even approach of the killer, you center the crime scene in the square or circle and work your way out. Because the crime scene in their radius is located in the northern most section of their search area, it tells me they know the killer likely headed south after the attacks. This may have been because he was disposing of evidence or he was truly leaving town.

2) I think they did have camera footage from Wasankari or one of the other businesses in that area. That’s the point I was trying to make. It was LE who said that it was W Palouse River Dr that was the southern boundary. They would have squared off their own graphic using the boundaries they provided to make the square search area. Or they could have not given specific boundaries and simply just said, “Please. Take a look at this map and if you have any footage or unusual activity here between 3:00 am and 6:00 am please report it.”
I think LE is pointing us in a direction. “If you want to help us, don’t bother looking there. Look here.”
JMHO

 

[Blinkoncrim]

I don’t know if this is a thing anymore, but back in the day, young men who may have dates with young women sometimes would bring along a third wheel in the hops of that person getting lucky with a girl. I can remember many times seeing young men act out if they didn’t get lucky. But I suppose if this were the case they would have a suspect by now.

 

[Blinkoncrim]

When LE said a while back that video recordings would speak volumes based on what it did not show as opposed to what it might show. I assume what they are getting at is that the attacker may have not traveled far and may be in a nearby residence. I am sorry I do not have the quote regarding the video comment.

 

[SpitfireRedhead]

I imagine Instagram and Facebook can see who is viewing your profile which feeds into their algorithm. If the killer was stalking Kaylee or one of the other victims, surely there is data on the back end that could lead to an IP address and ultimately a suspect.

 

[BrownRice]

C

I would like to know what happened at 4 AM. We have frequently been told this happened between 3 and 4, possibly between 2 and 4. What happened that LE was able to pinpoint this as the latest possible time from almost the very beginning.

Since the bodies weren’t found until noon, there must be some other evidence to pin down this time even before the autopsy.

Could be what didn’t happen at 4:00 and thereafter. Maybe Apple Watch or other smart watch stopped syncing, maybe phone calls not answered etc

 

[Blinkoncrim]

Interesting perspective. I CBW, too. Like everyone here, we are all really playing a guessing game with what few facts we have. My thoughts on your thoughts:

1) I realize the murders didn’t happen at the university, but if you truly don’t know the direction of escape or even approach of the killer, you center the crime scene in the square or circle and work your way out. Because the crime scene in their radius is located in the northern most section of their search area, it tells me they know the killer likely headed south after the attacks. This may have been because he was disposing of evidence or he was truly leaving town.

2) I think they did have camera footage from Wasankari or one of the other businesses in that area. That’s the point I was trying to make. It was LE who said that it was W Palouse River Dr that was the southern boundary. They would have squared off their own graphic using the boundaries they provided to make the square search area. Or they could have not given specific boundaries and simply just said, “Please. Take a look at this map and if you have any footage or unusual activity here between 3:00 am and 6:00 am please report it.”
I think LE is pointing us in a direction. “If you want to help us, don’t bother looking there. Look here.”
JMHO

Great observation! Looking south as you suggest I see Nez Perce Reservation. But perhaps the killer never went that far.

 

[GRT]

I am not sure anyone was targeted. Whoever resisted most might have invited more anger, but it doesn’t mean, targeted. I don’t see the reason to kill four people if you are after one. Maybe the guy was so cold-hearted that he needed one, killed the other one in the room, and the other two, to complicate matters for the police?

But if someone was, it really makes sense to think of people permanently living in the house. To kill a man in his GF’s room is very mafia-like style, sorry. And really, it takes a lot of stalking.

To kill a person who randomly stopped at the house, like K, “now or never” style, takes a lot of preparation.

The other two girls are more traceable because they live there.

I can imagine someone hiding in the house in advance, but not dressed for murder. I think he walked in. JMO. Good luck to Idaho police and FBI.

I agree with the emboldened. The idea that the attack was targeted bothers me.

If you're after one person, it makes more sense to wait and catch that person alone, whether at home or when they're out and about. JMOO But, risking exposure by killing the target in a situation whereby you have to kill all four seems way too risky.

Unless all four were the targets, but that seems unlikely.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I would like to know what happened at 4 AM. We have frequently been told this happened between 3 and 4, possibly between 2 and 4. What happened that LE was able to pinpoint this as the latest possible time from almost the very beginning.

Since the bodies weren’t found until noon, there must be some other evidence to pin down this time even before the autopsy.

I have wondered if one of the victims was wearing a Fitbit or Apple Watch. Those can tell when a heartbeat end.

 

[Snoop Sister]

Agree. Going into a house with a knife knowing that there are at least four people inside (and a dog)… that takes some type of extreme motivation and confidence... and he is still out there, somewhere!

That’s why I think it was someone who knew them and had been in the house before.

 

[mrsdue]

Idaho coed murders: Sorority sister recalls victim's hours before tragedy, 'a normal night in Moscow'

University of Idaho students Ethan Chapin, 20; Kaylee Goncalves, 21; Xana Kernodle, 20; and 21-year-old Madison Mogen were stabbed several times and killed on November 13

www.foxnews.com

So, Maddie and Xana both dropped out of their sorority last semester? What's up with that?

 

[jackthejester]

I agree with the emboldened. The idea that the attack was targeted bothers me.

If you're after one person, it makes more sense to wait and catch that person alone, whether at home or when they're out and about. JMOO But, risking exposure by killing the target in a situation whereby you have to kill all four seems way too risky.

Unless all four were the targets, but that seems unlikely.

I believe that there was only one target and here’s why: It’s not super uncommon for girls of this age to sleep in the sand bed in a non sexual manner, especially when coming back from the bars; I know plenty of pairs of girls that lived together in college that would do this. When you factor in that KG was graduating early and getting ready to leave it wouldn’t surprise me if they were in the same room. Especially when you look at the fact that they both called the ex boyfriend. Perp walks in the sliding glass doors in the back, up the stairs to whichever girls room was the target, finds both MM and KG, stabs them both, as perp is walking back downstairs, EC hears the disturbance and confronts them, he’s murdered, <modsnip: rumor> and XK is stabbed as well as she witnessed EC’s murder. This explains the girls downstairs being spared as well. Just my opinion

 

[girlhasnoname]

IIRC X and E left the Frat party early. Her Father says that around midnight they werejust ‘hanging out at home,watching movies.’ But then the timeline has them returning almost exactly when K and M doas well.

So sometime after speaking to her Dad, X and E headed out again…but where to…a bar, back to Sigma Chi, another private party?…and why? If LE knows, it’s interesting that they haven’t specifically updated the timeline, in order to solicit more information?

And when they returned, did they return alone? Sort of curious that they all returned about the same time….

I stated several threads back that perhaps X&E picked up K&M from the food truck and that is how they knew all of them arrived around 1:45 (1:56).

MOO