ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 23

[docfishbone28]

Another thought, maybe M was the target and the killer thought she would be alone not knowing K was back in town

 

[enw10110]

No I m insinuating that they must have this info if they are looking at all the evidence. If your have E&X's blood going up the stairs or on the walls or doorknob or door on the third floor, my conclusion would be that they were killed first and likely the target, if your dont have that then the killer went upstairs first. I dont see the sus killing 2 on the 2nd floor and not tracing blood up to the 3rd if he did the 2nd floor first

Not necessarily. They could've broken in, E heard it and came out, tried to run back to his room, he and X were killed, then the killer went upstairs where he/she intended to go in the first place. OR, they could've broken in, gone upstairs, killed M & K, E heard it and came out, met him/her on their way down, then he/she got X. OR, they could've intended to get them all, started at top, was more brutal up there, then got tired as he/she went on, maybe he/she was over it after the 2nd floor and decided to leave... or maybe he/she didn't know there was anyone else around.

Anyway, the point is there are lots of scenarios and who was killed first doesn't really tell us all that much.

All IMO

 

[isabella88]

Could you please provide a link to the interview you reference? I haven’t seen/read it but would like to. Thanks!

Pretty sure it's one of the many Fox News interviews Kaylee's dad did. IIRC, it was yesterday. Don't have the link but I'm sure it's on the media page by now.

 

[Deleted member 110058]

Could you please provide a link to the interview you reference? I haven’t seen/read it but would like to. Thanks!

No truer words said. There is nothing less predictable than how people react to a traumatic situation. Some cry, some laugh, some have heart attacks...we have seen it all. The brain in trauma does not function like it normally would, people have total personality changes (short term). None of us can put ourselves in their shoes and judge any of these families.

 

[eclecticcowboy]

Not necessarily. They could've broken in, E heard it and came out, tried to run back to his room, he and X were killed, then the killer went upstairs where he/she intended to go in the first place. OR, they could've broken in, gone upstairs, killed M & K, E heard it and came out, met him/her on their way down, then he/she got X. OR, they could've intended to get them all, started at top, was more brutal up there, then got tired as he/she went on, maybe he/she was over it after the 2nd floor and decided to leave... or maybe he/she didn't know there was anyone else around.

Anyway, the point is there are lots of scenarios and who was killed first doesn't really tell us all that much.

All IMO

Perhaps, but if the glass wasn't broke on the sliding glass door, one would assume it was unlocked and easily opened.

 

[docfishbone28]

Not necessarily. They could've broken in, E heard it and came out, tried to run back to his room, he and X were killed, then the killer went upstairs where he/she intended to go in the first place. OR, they could've broken in, gone upstairs, killed M & K, E heard it and came out, met him/her on their way down, then he/she got X. OR, they could've intended to get them all, started at top, was more brutal up there, then got tired as he/she went on, maybe he/she was over it after the 2nd floor and decided to leave... or maybe he/she didn't know there was anyone else around.

Anyway, the point is there are lots of scenarios and who was killed first doesn't really tell us all that much.

All IMO

I think if your can conclude who the target was you can narrow down more on a suspect pool. And if you know which of the 2 were killed first that helps dictate a target and motive. I think it tells us everything

 

[SuziQ]

The odds are staggering. But we do not have enough evidence to assume that this was a Mass Murderer, a Serial Killer or even a person who had a psychotic break. We cannot assume anything at this point.

It is a mass murder.

 

[WildWest]

As to insurance, and claims, as Emerald stated, everyone will be put on notice. General liability, excess, property for the damage and assuming loss of rents up to the policy limit. Property management company, property owner, I assume the college may even get sued. The thing is, even if one of the insurers does not ultimately have to pay the claim, the cost of defending against can be astronomical. Day job also, not claims related. But claims affect everything.

I'm realizing how much damage this killer did to thousands of people, the vicitims & families, student body, school staff, property owner, property mgt company, insurance companies, local businesses that make living off the student body if attendance does drop drastically, I could go on. Terribly sad.

 

[10ofRods]

You can reply directly to me. IMO, that house is a hot mess in that it is built into that hill. Sure, some people may get a thrill out of living in a murder house, but I think the community will want it gone. JMO

But it's not up to "the community," is what people are trying to say. And people may want to live there for other reasons than a thrill, no reason to shade the future occupants of the house.

Thank you. I agree with you (not that that's impressive, lol).

Iirc, Bundy weighed around 140-150 lbs when he pulled off the Chi Omega murders in which he bludgeoned 4 people killing 2...and on the same night/morning he stabbed another young woman.

Rage and psychopathy seems to add quite a bit to expected strength and endurance.

Imho

It sure does. Plus, having prone victims who may be asleep or semi-conscious. The Nightstalker was another lightly built killer - at the time, I'm pretty sure that many of his victims could have taken him down if it were all about physical strength (I wish they would have). The Nightstalker had a terrible childhood (present when a much-admired Green Beret cousin shot his wife in the face; he was at the impressionable age of 13). He then moved in with his sister, whose husband was an excessive Peeping Tom, from whom he apparently learned that "hobby" (criminal behavior). He was introduced to drugs, alcohol, voyeurism and bondage fantasies before he was 14. Not surprisingly became a drug addict. Still managed to kill 13 people and attempt to kill more than that, using a variety of methods.

His first known crimes were against women who were alone at the time (at least one was pulled out of a car) but he soon began killing men as well, at night, in their homes.

 

[ArmChairDet]

I am shocked by that. I am shocked they don't have cameras. I am familiar w/ several at other schools and EVERYTHING has cameras except rooms.

Fraternity is probably private residence. Most colleges greek systems are off campus.

 

[SuziQ]

Perhaps, but if the glass wasn't broke on the sliding glass door, one would assume it was unlocked and easily opened.

Sliding glass doors can be broken into several ways without breaking a window or being unlocked. Imo

 

[Colorado303]

Yes and I'm sure that is being done. But we were discussing tracking records on the kids who did not return to school.
That would be 3-5K kids.

““Students that decided not to come back to school, I’m sure they’re looking at all of them and see if there’s any relationship or any conversations they were had via social media, direct messaging, cellular intercepts,” said DePaul, former commander of the U.S. Marshal Service’s New York/New Jersey Regional Fugitive Task Force. “Regardless of how any connection was made, they’re going to look at everybody.”

My interpretation of the above quote wasn’t that they’d be looking at records of all the absentee students but following up on any of those folks that had relationships or communications w/the victims. And eventually any prime suspects they identify.

I could be wrong but that seemed like the practical interpretation to me.

 

[lucidium]

The odds establishing a relationship (or even a brief encounter) with someone capable of brutally slashing FOUR people to death is staggering. It appears to be the exact opposite. Someone with these traits actively SOUGHT OUT these victims based on OPPORTUNITY alone. So we have a MASS-and or- SERIAL KILLER in this situation. MOO.

Do you mean the odds encountering someone with the mental capability? You must, but I don't see anything meaningful about that.

It doesn't necessarily take any significant physical strength to attack and kill people while they're sleeping.

 

[Deleted member 110058]

It is a mass murder.

It is a murder of 4 people. That does not mean that this person has ever murdered before. We would need to see a larger pattern of murder in order to call this person a Mass Murderer. And we do not have that information - yet.

 

[Deleted member 110058]

““Students that decided not to come back to school, I’m sure they’re looking at all of them and see if there’s any relationship or any conversations they were had via social media, direct messaging, cellular intercepts,” said DePaul, former commander of the U.S. Marshal Service’s New York/New Jersey Regional Fugitive Task Force. “Regardless of how any connection was made, they’re going to look at everybody.”

My interpretation of the above quote wasn’t that they’d be looking at records of all the absentee students but following up on any of those folks that had relationships or communications w/the victims. And eventually any prime suspects they identify.

I could be wrong but that seemed like the practical interpretation to me.

For LE's sake...I certainly hope so

 

[SuziQ]

Serial Killers vs. Mass Murderers - Crime Museum

Serial Killers vs. Mass Murderers - Some would say 19th century Jack the Ripper is synonymous with James Holmes the Aurora, Colorado movie theater shooter.

www.crimemuseum.org

 

[Colorado303]

Looks like he may have been a tad ambushed, and I'm sure both LE and his national chapter told him not to talk to media, particularly if there could be any involvement there.

My opinion.

I agree. And it’s a heck of a thing for a college kid to wake up one morning and suddenly be the spokesman for a national media swarm. I thought he did a terrific job frankly. (It’s probably not his fault they don’t have cameras).

 

[LizWords]

LE said that Brian Laundrie wasn't a suspect for a long time and they actually put up cameras in his neighbors yard to keep an eye on him, also had unmarked cars watching him. That said.....he still got away to go kill himself.

North Port Police Installed Hidden Cameras Outside Laundrie Family Home

Some of the devices went up before 23-year-old Brian Laundrie disappeared; others were installed after.

www.newsweek.com

But the most notable distinction between Laundrie and this case is LE saying they've been cleared, or more specifically "believed not to be involved". They didn't say that about Laundrie, they may have been hiding their cards, but they weren't putting out convoluted lies about him not being involved. And while your point about him being able to disappear and kill himself is SO valid, Laundrie didn't seem like a danger to the public the way a deranged mass stabbing murderer would be.

On top of that, even if LE claiming certain people are cleared was some sort of super rare master strategic misinformation investigative tool, I highly doubt that the mayor and the prosecutor would have started reinforcing the "targeted" statements that were initially pretty strongly made by LE just so LE could release two conflicting qualifying statements to the tune of "it wasn't that sort of targeted". It's just too much to believe it was orchestrated, and would be too poorly executed if it was some sort of super manipulative plan on LE's part.

Nah, nope, I don't buy it even a little. I think LE initially thought, for valid reasons, it was more specifically targeted, but their investigation thus far has not provided them any evidence of this. I think they likely regret how those first few press conferences were phrased because other than some more extensive wounds on K, they have no evidence of person-specific targeting after a whole lot of investigating... MOO

 

[SuziQ]

It is a murder of 4 people. That does not mean that this person has ever murdered before. We would need to see a larger pattern of murder in order to call this person a Mass Murderer. And we do not have that information - yet.

I just posted the definition of mass murder vs serial killer. This case is a mass murder. Imo

 

[Ghostwheel]

True. That would be pretty insane. Also, they cannot access people's phone records without authorization. That is an odd statement on the part of the Marshall, IMO

Not sure if anyone mentioned it yet. A cellular intercept is not a phone record. It's a monitoring device where you can listen in on people's phone calls. Not sure if they are legal in Idaho.

Yeah, tech isn't all everyone thinks it is. It's certainly not private, IMO.