ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #1

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Don't forget the missing firefighter over in California, Mike Hardeman. He walked off barefoot and vanished. Dogs and crews came in for over a week and searched relentlessly. His footprints were found in the creekbed. Finally found him about 1/4 mile UPHILL from where his camp was located. Dogs never found him, a helicopter did. The reason the searchers gave....."We just didn't think he would go up that way"............. please people...........stop the madness.

Especially a little boy would do just that I would think. They dont know any better and would probably love to begin crawling and climbing even if on hands knees.

We here at WS would make a good search crew because we would go in and search all the places nobody would think to look.
 
I'm probably wrong, but does anyone know of a case where a dog actually led LE to a missing person, living or dead? Off hand I can't think of one, and if I recall correctly, they didn't do very well with the recent escapees from upstate New York. Believe me, I want to be wrong so someone please show me a case or two.

As I recall, the bloodhound they used in the Dwight Clark case (Bellingham, WA, - 2010 I believe?) alerted to a beach very near where Dwight Clark's body was eventually found in the water. Video evidence corroborated him walking down the street where that beach was shortly before he died. I was living in the area at the time, and helped with the search efforts and followed the case closely, so I remember it pretty clearly. It did, however, take some time for Dwight's body to surface and be found. If Deorr is in the water, it will probably take some time for his body to surface too. The lake water, like the water in the Puget Sound, is likely quite cold year-round at that elevation.
 
Don't forget the missing firefighter over in California, Mike Hardeman. He walked off barefoot and vanished. Dogs and crews came in for over a week and searched relentlessly. His footprints were found in the creekbed. Finally found him about 1/4 mile UPHILL from where his camp was located. Dogs never found him, a helicopter did. The reason the searchers gave....."We just didn't think he would go up that way"............. please people...........stop the madness.

According to my son's firefighter friends, Mike and his friend were doing Ecstacy. Thus they made irrational choices, sadly enough.
 
I have two of Paulides books and I thought of the "vanishing into thin air" scenario. The missing people found in his books have been gone for some time; I cannot recall him writing about any recent cases. Paulides is a great radio talk show guest. Very interesting and compelling. I thought, too, about the firefighter who vanished in So. California. That was a strange case.
 
It sounds like there are large hills/cliffs going up on both sides of the campsite. If the water does not pan out then I agree searchers need to look directly up those cliffs.

Dont little boys like to climb? I wonder if searchers are making a mistake assuming a little boy would not begin to crawl or climb directly up a mountain.

Most 2-year-olds consider it an accomplishment to climb up onto Mom & Dad's bed. They are still babies at that age and don't have muscle development and strength in their arms.
JMO
 
As I recall, the bloodhound they used in the Dwight Clark case (Bellingham, WA, - 2010 I believe?) alerted to a beach very near where Dwight Clark's body was eventually found in the water. Video evidence corroborated him walking down the street where that beach was shortly before he died. I was living in the area at the time, and helped with the search efforts and followed the case closely, so I remember it pretty clearly. It did, however, take some time for Dwight's body to surface and be found. If Deonn is in the water, it will probably take some time for his body to surface too. The lake water, like the water in the Puget Sound, is likely quite cold year-round at that elevation.

another success story:

http://fox17online.com/2015/06/01/m...ty-wanted-to-pet-k-9-search-dog-when-rescued/
Missing boy followed cat into Allegan woods
POSTED 4:54 AM, JUNE 1, 2015,
ALLEGAN COUNTY, Mich. — A 23-month-old boy spent the night in the Allegan woods after wandering off Friday night.

Preston Johnson apparently wandered off following a cat at about 9:00pm Friday night while his parents were doing yard work. He was found by Allegan deputies and a K-9 unit at about 4:00am Saturday in good health.

After an initial search effort came up empty, a massive police presence was called in to help. That included multiple K-9 teams, local and state police agencies, and a helicopter from Air Care.

Preston spent the night in the woods where temperatures dipped into the 40s and there was periodic falling rain. Preston was found covered in mud and very interested in petting the K-9 Medo when he was found by Deputy Ben Haas. He was found about a quarter-mile from his home.
 
one more:
Missing Children Found Safe Thanks To Search Dog

Updated: Fri 7:54 AM, Jan 31, 2014

http://www.kktv.com/home/headlines/...es/Search-for-Missing-Children-242816571.html

A search and rescue canine is the hero of the day after she tracked down two missing kids.

A 13-year-old girl and 10-year-old boy disappeared from their home in Black Forest around 11 a.m. Thursday. Their mother says she returned from running an errand to find a note left by her children that they were in a playhouse on their property. But when she went to look, the kids were gone.

That where Halo stepped in. The newest member of the El Paso County Search and Rescue smelled the children's clothing inside their home and then followed the scent until she found them about a mile and a half from the house. This was her first find since joining the team.

The kids were reunited with their mother shortly before 4 p.m.
 
I'm clear back on post 200, but one thing pops to mind and that is that most 2-almost-3 year olds never.stop.talking. My kids were asking questions every 10 seconds at that age, or screaming,/shrieking or giggling, or crying, or making car sounds or animal noises.......you get the point. My twin niece and nephew were the same way when they were that age a year ago - except they were even louder because they had to out-talk each other lol.

So I am just wondering how it wouldn't be immediately apparent that he was gone simply due to the silence it would have created.
My son never spoke at that age (as opposed to my daughter at 2). He would have just made a bee-line to whatever caught his eye.

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Most 2-year-olds consider it an accomplishment to climb up onto Mom & Dad's bed. They are still babies at that age and don't have muscle development and strength in their arms.
JMO

I think it depends on the child. My four kids have all been climbers. Between 18-20 months, they all started dragging chairs to climb higher. We didn't keep much on tables or counters, we removed chairs from tables and secured them elsewhere, yet my kids still tried to climb. My kids have scaled dressers and closest shelves well before two years. At three years old, one of my sons was climbing over our privacy fence. I wouldn't exclude any nearby areas from the search!
 
That story by HLN about human cremains being dumped in the reservoir is really bothering me. I want more information, but haven't seen it reported by any other media station. Could HLN be wrong in its reporting? It's a pretty wild story for them to be wrong about.
Icky. And I'm pretty sure its illegal to scatter human remains in a reservoir.

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Don't forget the missing firefighter over in California, Mike Hardeman. He walked off barefoot and vanished. Dogs and crews came in for over a week and searched relentlessly. His footprints were found in the creekbed. Finally found him about 1/4 mile UPHILL from where his camp was located. Dogs never found him, a helicopter did. The reason the searchers gave....."We just didn't think he would go up that way"............. please people...........stop the madness.


It's just that with such a small toddler one doesn't think they'd have the stamina to scramble up a hill or mountain - without food and drink too. It's not the first thing one thinks of, is it?
 
I would love to see the area leading up that he could have climbed. A picture is worth a thousand words!
 
I understand your speculation since it seems he would want his blanket with him just before a nap, but the article below indicates he didn't even have it with him.


I understand the parents are not considered suspects at this time and perhaps the blanket was accidentally left in the truck earlier that day, but still I feel there are a lot of inconsistencies in what's been stated.
I agree, also I have never known a 2 year old that is wandering and interested in something to stop, say wait minute, let me go get my blanket, then I will finish following that bird/frog/bug etc. Blankets are for comforting, not exploring. I think the parents are desperate and grasping on to any slim hope that he was taken as opposed to a fatal accident. I know I would.

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Not saying this is the case here, but his more than glowing praised about the Sheriff, LE, S&R could be a conscious or subconscious attempt to "butter them up" in hopes that it would make it harder for them to suspect any foul play on the part of the family. Not saying this would work at all but perhaps in the mind of someone with something to hide the saying "keep your friends close and your enemies closer" could come into play. Like hoping if you rave on and on about how great the Sheriff is, Sheriff will be so grateful and flattered that it will somehow look at Dad/family in a more positive light.

I dunno. Just seems odd to me, your little boy is missing x 5 days and there is not so much as a trace/clue/hint of him........and you're going to glorify those in charge of finding him, so profusely? Seems like overkill to me, or 'laying it on too thick' for some reason.

Just trying to put myself into the shoes of parents who's little one has gone missing in this type of scenario. While I would be ever grateful to those who have worked so hard to help search, after 5 days and finding NOTHING, I would not be able to have any peace for I'd worry if somehow "someone" missed something.

I initially wasn't able to view the entire extended version of the interview w/ parents....but have been able to now. The tears welling up in the Dad's eyes, at the end, do seem very real and heartfelt.

On the other hand, I found it frustrating that toward the end of that interview when the poor Mom was pleading, in the event that someone had taken her little boy, for them to please just drop him off somewhere, anywhere.....like a store, or a place where someone would find him and then get him back home....well Dad kept talking over her and trying to change the subject........I found that odd. What she was saying was important (in the event that he'd been abducted, however I don't believe he has been)...but Dad just kept piping up and interrupting her. Very odd. Strange dynamics between the 2 of them? Perhaps he's used to doing all of the talking and she usually just has little to say because he does all of the talking.

One thing to add........in one of the more recent intereviews with the Sheriff, where he says that the parents have been cooperative and he has no problems with them and they have no problems with him..............this may be true, it may not be. It wouldn't be the first time that LE lead a missing child's parents to believe that they were not in anyway suspects when behind the scenes, they were being watched and investigated.

Oh and another thing (lol)........based on the media video showing the reporter driving into the campground, showing the rough gravel road into there, given that the campground does seem more on the remote side, I really find it impossible to believe that anyone would have abducted this little boy. Not exactly a location for a quick getaway, IMO.

Has it been reported how many other campers were there at the campground at the time this family was there/the little boy went missing? I understand that this isn't the type of campground where campers have to register, but even LE would have quickly been able to figure out how many other campers were there?

Was there only one way in/out of this campground?...........just the one road?

When the call came in that he was missing, did LE quickly set up a checkpoint on the road going into/out of the campground to interview people coming and going? Though perhaps that wouldn't have mattered, IF it's true that in actuality this little boy had been missing for an HOUR before LE had been called.

If it had been an hour............did the parents calculate that period of an hour from the time they allegedly left the campsite to go on their walk, to the time they returned, found he was missing, did their 20-30 minute search and then called 911?

Just jumping off your post...

and WARNING to all Sleuthers.... I am behind in my reading of this thread...:sigh:

But... here are some questions I feel could be important (aside from those already asked)...:

- How long had the family been camping?

- How much longer were they intending to camp?

- What were the sleeping accommodations?
(i.e. Tents?... trailer(s)?... Car camping?

- Were they really camping?...
Or had they gone there for a "Day" camp? (This doesn't seem likely... But could be the case.... as we have no dates of the full camping trip as yet... AFAIK...)

- Were there signs of DK Jr.'s suitcase/duffel bag/etc. of clothes, diapers, undies, toys, etc.?

Do we know the home city/address of JM and DK Sr?

Does DK Jr. live with them?

All... JMO...
 
IHAVENOCLUE, I don't think we have answers to most of your questions. It seems like they had just arrived at the campground the day DeOrr disappeared and were planning to spend the weekend. However, that hasn't ever really been confirmed. Nothing has been said about his belongings. I read someplace that DeOrr Sr.'s father mentioned that they had been living with him for a year or so, but I can't find that article again. Don't know what their current living arrangements are.

ETA: jmcgladr gives the source for the comment about living with his father below.
 
Just jumping off your post...

and WARNING to all Sleuthers.... I am behind in my reading of this thread...:sigh:

But... here are some questions I feel could be important (aside from those already asked)...:

- How long had the family been camping?

- How much longer were they intending to camp?

- What were the sleeping accommodations?
(i.e. Tents?... trailer(s)?... Car camping?

- Were they really camping?...
Or had they gone there for a "Day" camp? (This doesn't seem likely... But could be the case.... as we have no dates of the full camping trip as yet... AFAIK...)

- Were there signs of DK Jr.'s suitcase/duffel bag/etc. of clothes, diapers, undies, toys, etc.?

Do we know the home city/address of JM and DK Sr?

Does DK Jr. live with them?

All... JMO...

I think I can answer your last question at least. Grandpa was quoted as saying that DK Sr., JM and DK Jr. all lived with him. Read that today. Can try to find the article or quote...

ETA: here's the article http://www.hlntv.com/article/2015/07/17/deorr-kunz-missing-family-fear-abducted
 
How close to 3 years old is this toddler? When my son was 3 years old, one mintue he was playing in the back yard, next minute he walked a few doors down, stole a tricycle and went on a 1/2 mile adventure. He was fine when I found him an hour later playing with some kids in their front yard. It happens... toddlers cannot be left out of your sight for even seconds.

I think this little one ventured down to the creek, drowned and was possibly dragged away by an animal... yes within minutes these things can happen. My heart breaks for this family, I can't imagine how they are holding up.
 
Hummm on her FB page there are two other children. I thought they were a family of five. MOO

Those other kids keep getting mentioned, it's quite mysterious. Is it possible they are not her kids but cousins of DK Jr.? I haven't looked at her FB page yet. DK and JM have not mentioned any other kids, not once!

ETA: checked out her FB page and there are indeed a lot of pics of another 2 kids. Maybe they are 1/2 siblings to DK Jr. And live with another parent?
 
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