Possible Victim: Valerie Mack, 24, Manorville Jane Doe #6, missing 2000, found Nov 2000 & Gilgo Beach Apr 2011

[Blueeyedbrowngirl]

Sally, I think we're actually both right. I saw a post on the Valerie memorial FB page by her half sister which sounds like the 4 children referenced in the court case do not include Valerie. She was the child of a different father and therefore her birth name was probably not Fulton. The 4 siblings in the court case are 3 girls and 1 boy. The girls' initials are T, S, and D. I do not know the boy's name.

Boy was W; now deceased.

 

[Tora Gahan]

"It’s so sad Valerie and basically her entire family are dead at this point. She wears the pain of her short life in her mugshots. For years I constantly looked for updates on the Jane Doe she was once known as. Constantly checking NamUs. I’ve been following the LISK case since the GB4 were found. This case has haunted me since they were first found. I’m a lifelong Long Islander and it’s harrowing to think that while my friends and I enjoyed our time at Gilgo Beach, those poor girls were rotting only a few hundred feet away."


Lifelong LI-er here as well. I spent nearly every weekend of the summers of 2009-2011 at Robert Moses, and taking Ocean Parkway as a "shortcut" (AKA lesser traffic) over to Long Beach and Massapequa Park. Your point rings true with me too. I'm glad some of the unidentified victims are finally being given their names back. Hoping the Whole case has resolution, someday.

ETA - Sorry, phone konked out. Thus was a reply to ab earlier post on this thread.

 

[Blueeyedbrowngirl]

Valerie’s sister shared this high school photo of her on social media. She was a beautiful girl.

 

[coldcaser]

Valerie’s sister shared this high school photo of her on social media. She was a beautiful girl.

Was just going to post this myself. She was so beautiful. She looks full of life and healthy here. I really do wonder what happened in her life between the time this photo and the mugshots were taken.

 

[Blueeyedbrowngirl]

Was just going to post this myself. She was so beautiful. She looks full of life and healthy here. I really do wonder what happened in her life between the time this photo and the mugshots were taken.

Valerie’s case gives me hope that we’ll soon have the real names and faces of/for Peaches, Cherries, and the remaining Doe men and women awaiting identification. It’s incumbent upon every person who cares about this case to keep it moving; say the names of the victims, share their faces, and tell their stories. Remember: you don’t have to know someone personally to care and act on their behalf; that they’re fellow humans worthy of respect, dignity and justice is what matters.

 

[coldcaser]

Another photo of Valerie, shared by her sister.

 

[coldcaser]

Valerie’s case gives me hope that we’ll soon have the real names and faces of/for Peaches, Cherries, and the remaining Doe men and women awaiting identification. It’s incumbent upon every person who cares about this case to keep it moving; say the names of the victims, share their faces, and tell their stories. Remember: you don’t have to know someone personally to care and act on their behalf; that they’re fellow humans worthy of respect, dignity and justice is what matters.

I'm sure we'll learn their names too in the coming years. There have been so many well known Jane/John Does identified in this year alone. Technology and forensics can only get better, and genetic genealogy has already helped give many back their names and bring others to justice.

I'm glad we already know quite a bit about Valerie so soon. I hope we learn more as time goes by. It's so important to remember the victims and their stories. I'm thankful there's been so much focus on LISK victims and their lives. I'm happy we know so much about the victims, with the exception of Jessica Taylor. We still know next to nothing about her, and she's been identified for 17 years. I'm sure every family has their reasons for remaining silent, but I feel like we're the only ones in her corner. 17 years later and all we have are two mugshots, two photos with her pimp, and a few scarce details. I'm not even sure if we're exactly sure where she went missing from.

 

[SharD]

Valerie looked happy once..

I actually think this guy will be caught in not too long. There is so much material with his marks on. He can't hide forever.

 

[SharD]

Has it ever been clarified why the composition drawing doesn't look like Valerie at all? Was she found without a jaw? Or without hair? Why does she have a strongly arced nose on the drawing? Does the Fire Island doe look like her drawing?

LE seriously screwed up here for some reason.

 

[coldcaser]

Has it ever been clarified why the composition drawing doesn't look like Valerie at all? Was she found without a jaw? Or without hair? Why does she have a strongly arced nose on the drawing? Does the Fire Island doe look like her drawing?

LE seriously screwed up here for some reason.

I think I might have a few answers but also a lot of questions too. We know that in 2000, hunters found everything but her head, hands, and right foot. In April 2011, her head, hands, and foot were found on Gilgo. But somehow in 2000 , they managed to determine she was a brunette even though her head was still missing? Pubic hair isn't always a good indicator for head hair color. And I'd think that by 2011 her skull wouldn't have hair.

Forensic reconstructions are by no means a perfect science, but they do have calculations to determine skin and muscle thickness, nasal projection, etc. I think much of the time that would yield a reconstruction that looks somewhat like a person, if only in face shape. But Valerie's doesn't look anything like her IMO. Part of her skull might have been missing due to animal activity, but I'm leaning more toward fractures from being beaten due to just how poorly her reconstruction resembles her. That's just my educated guess. I don't think police have revealed what kind of state her skull was found in?

 

[coldcaser]

Sorry for the double post, but this really got me wondering if any of the GB4, Manorville victims, or other potential LISK victims had damage to their skulls from being beaten. I don't think that's something that has ever been revealed to the public. I think we have some vague details of potential mutilation with some GB4 victims and we know the Manorville victims were mutilated, but nothing regarding damage or lack thereof done to their skulls. Does anyone have any info on this? I apologize for going a bit off topic.

 

[coldcaser]

Here’s another photo of young Valerie that was shared on her memorial Facebook page.

 

[Fabra]

Here’s another photo of young Valerie that was shared on her memorial Facebook page.

So bittersweet to see Valerie looking happy, healthy, and well cared for. Happy in that she looks loved, but sad in that so much potential ripped out from under her.

I'm glad her family is posting these pictures and humanizing her. I grew up not too far from Valerie, and am about the same age. I can imagine being friends with her in high school. Guess it just hits really close to home.

Thanks for sharing, coldcaser.

 

[cvdixon29]

I think I might have a few answers but also a lot of questions too. We know that in 2000, hunters found everything but her head, hands, and right foot. In April 2011, her head, hands, and foot were found on Gilgo. But somehow in 2000 , they managed to determine she was a brunette even though her head was still missing? Pubic hair isn't always a good indicator for head hair color. And I'd think that by 2011 her skull wouldn't have hair.

Forensic reconstructions are by no means a perfect science, but they do have calculations to determine skin and muscle thickness, nasal projection, etc. I think much of the time that would yield a reconstruction that looks somewhat like a person, if only in face shape. But Valerie's doesn't look anything like her IMO. Part of her skull might have been missing due to animal activity, but I'm leaning more toward fractures from being beaten due to just how poorly her reconstruction resembles her. That's just my educated guess. I don't think police have revealed what kind of state her skull was found in?

From my understanding, Her head, hands, and one foot was in a plastic bag when found. If it hadn't been opened up where air could get in, then the decomposition was slowed down considerably. I look at her mug shot and It's like you can see the fear in her face and pain. Poor girl, only 24, and her life just wiped out. I was born in 1976 too and I remember being 24 and my life was just starting, So sad about this.

 

[coldcaser]

From my understanding, Her head, hands, and one foot was in a plastic bag when found. If it hadn't been opened up where air could get in, then the decomposition was slowed down considerably. I look at her mug shot and It's like you can see the fear in her face and pain. Poor girl, only 24, and her life just wiped out. I was born in 1976 too and I remember being 24 and my life was just starting, So sad about this.

That totally makes sense. I suspect that might be way the killer started using burlap. Burlap allows for more aeration so decomposition will occur faster but burlap also blends in well in the brush and bramble along Ocean Parkway.

 

[coldcaser]

Here is my diagram which illustrates the condition in which Valerie's remains were found. I'm making a diagram for each victim whose remains were found dismembered to serve as a visual aid for those of us who process information better visually.

 

[turanna25]

Here is my diagram which illustrates the condition in which Valerie's remains were found. I'm making a diagram for each victim whose remains were found dismembered to serve as a visual aid for those of us who process information better visually.

I wonder if any of the other victims had similar/same dismembering..

 

[Blueeyedbrowngirl]

I apologize that there’s no sensitive way to say this but I’d like to know the nature and style of the dismemberments. Those factors are (usually) clear indicators of the killer’s skills, profession and/or hobbies, and preferred tools.

If you recall the Black Dahlia murder, Elizabeth Short was bisected in a smooth cut/clean line manner, indicating that her killer was either a highly skilled craftsman or a surgeon (With Dr. Hodel being a key suspect).

But with Gilgo and Manorville, I’m sure law enforcement will continue to sit on any information describing the nature and style of the dismemberments until an arrest is made and rightfully so.

 

[coldcaser]

I apologize that there’s no sensitive way to say this but I’d like to know the nature and style of the dismemberments. Those factors are (usually) clear indicators of the killer’s skills, profession and/or hobbies, and preferred tools.

If you recall the Black Dahlia murder, Elizabeth Short was bisected in a smooth cut/clean line manner, indicating that her killer was either a highly skilled craftsman or a surgeon (With Dr. Hodel being a key suspect).

But with Gilgo and Manorville, I’m sure law enforcement will continue to sit on any information describing the nature and style of the dismemberments until an arrest is made and rightfully so.

How they were dismembered, what instruments were used, and the skill with which it was done are very important details. If they were dismembered at the joint, that might indicate that the killer is familiar with anatomy, butchering, and might be a hunter. If the bones themselves were cut through, whatever instrument was used could tell us something. If the cuts themselves were jagged, that could speak to his skill level and perhaps a disorganized, impulsive personality.

I wish SCPD would release for information regarding the condition of all the victims' bodies, how some victims were dismembered, their cause of death, etc. They might be withholding that information for good reasons though. I guess we'll find out in the future.

 

[Sallyla]

Here is my diagram which illustrates the condition in which Valerie's remains were found. I'm making a diagram for each victim whose remains were found dismembered to serve as a visual aid for those of us who process information better visually.

This info on her nose has given me a horrible feeling.

In her mugshot, up to 2000, there was no visible sign of a broken nose or changes in the nose that might have been caused by that. Her facial reconstruction was based on the broken nose, so looked very different, probably hampering her identification.

The time scales compared to her mugshot. It makes me feel like LISK broke her nose but held her captive long enough for it to heal.