Deceased/Not Found IL - Yingying Zhang, 26, Urbana, 9 June 2017 #6 *Arrest*

[Ambitioned]

Yup as I said, JMO. This possible escalation was discussed quite a bit in thread #5.

It's my gut feeling simply because I agree with others that its his first abduction but not the first time he's caused harm.

 

[DSM]

Still searching for YY, hoping someone shares some useful info to find her. Wondering if we should start calling media and asking why no one is reporting n this case anymore, (we still have a missing person). So sad they seemed to just sweep this case under the rug. FBI says she is probably dead....so we should just give up? Not me! If she has the slightest chance of being alive, waiting on someone to find her, I think the police, FBI, and public NEEDS to still search in hopes we can save her before she does perish!

 

[AnemoneBrown]

Still searching for YY, hoping someone shares some useful info to find her. Wondering if we should start calling media and asking why no one is reporting n this case anymore, (we still have a missing person). So sad they seemed to just sweep this case under the rug. FBI says she is probably dead....so we should just give up? Not me! If she has the slightest chance of being alive, waiting on someone to find her, I think the police, FBI, and public NEEDS to still search in hopes we can save her before she does perish!

Yep. Worse yet, BC has not been charged with murder, so whatever evidence LE/FB!/U IPD have (that they are not disclosing to the public) is NOT strong enough that she is actually dead. Otherwise, if the evidence of murder was strong, they would have charged him with murder, even if the evidence is circumstantial.

 

[Calzone]

I also would question if perhaps the U of I PD's primary concern might be protecting the reputation of the university moreso than finding Yingying and seeking full justice for her apparent demise. JMO

I don't question that the dedicated officers of the UIPD are concerned about seeking justice. However, one need look no further than Penn State to question whether a major university with the highest number of Chinese students in the country is concerned about its reputation. I suspect this was a contributing factor in who took the lead on this case. If I were CPD chief Cobb, I would gladly let the UIPD take the lead on such a difficult case. As far as resources and expertise, I doubt any local department is fully prepared to take on such a random case and that is why the FBI was called in. None of the local department would have had the manpower for the 24 hour surveillance like the FBI, which ultimately led to an arrest.

 

[Calzone]

Yep. Worse yet, BC has not been charged with murder, so what ever evidence LE/FB!/U of I PD have (that they are not disclosing to the public) is NOT strong enough that she is actually dead. Otherwise, if the evidence of murder was strong, they would have charged him with murder, even if the evidence is circumstantial.

Given what is publicly known, I don't see this as the slam dunk many here do. What we have is YingYing willingly getting into a car that was owned by the accused. That hardly constitutes kidnapping. Then, it is not conclusive that he was the one driving the car, the pictures we have do not show him clearly.

When he was taped talking about picking out other victims, I believe that the FBI felt they needed to act before there was another possible victim but still may not have had more evidence than she got in a car owned by him. Given what is publicly known, the evidence seems weak for even the kidnapping charge. Even despite what he said, he doesn't have to defend his comments. The Feds have to prove that he took her against her will, and what I see is someone who willingly got in a car. Just imagine showing that video in court. "Does Yingying appear forced into the car?", defense attorney X asks of the lead detective. The reply can only be, "No".

Unless there is a body or a WHOLE lot more evidence, murder is a huge stretch.

 

[AnemoneBrown]

Given what is publicly known, I don't see this as the slam dunk many here do. What we have is YingYing willingly getting into a car that was owned by the accused. That hardly constitutes kidnapping. Then, it is not conclusive that he was the one driving the car, the pictures we have do not show him clearly.

When he was taped talking about picking out other victims, I believe that the FBI felt they needed to act before there was another possible victim but still may not have had more evidence than she got in a car owned by him. Given what is publicly known, the evidence seems weak for even the kidnapping charge. Even despite what he said, he doesn't have to defend his comments. The Feds have to prove that he took her against her will, and what I see is someone who willingly got in a car. Just imagine showing that video in court. "Does Yingying appear forced into the car?", defense attorney X asks of the lead detective. The reply can only be, "No".

Unless there is a body or a WHOLE lot more evidence, murder is a huge stretch.

That's certainly possible. My point was to note that even if LE/FBI/UIPD know a whole lot that they are not sharing with the public, they do not know enough to charge him with murder so a continued and vigorous search for YYZ is a logical course of action.

 

[SteveP]

That's certainly possible. My point was to note that even if LE/FBI/UIPD know a whole lot that they are not sharing with the public, they do not know enough to charge him with murder so a continued and vigorous search for YYZ is a logical course of action.

LE almost always have more evidence than the public is made aware of, and I am sure that is the case here as well, but I tend to agree with you that, at this point, if they had reasonably strong evidence of her death, there would be more charges against him than just kidnapping. JMO

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

 

[TigerJin]

Given what is publicly known, I don't see this as the slam dunk many here do. What we have is YingYing willingly getting into a car that was owned by the accused. That hardly constitutes kidnapping. Then, it is not conclusive that he was the one driving the car, the pictures we have do not show him clearly.

When he was taped talking about picking out other victims, I believe that the FBI felt they needed to act before there was another possible victim but still may not have had more evidence than she got in a car owned by him. Given what is publicly known, the evidence seems weak for even the kidnapping charge. Even despite what he said, he doesn't have to defend his comments. The Feds have to prove that he took her against her will, and what I see is someone who willingly got in a car. Just imagine showing that video in court. "Does Yingying appear forced into the car?", defense attorney X asks of the lead detective. The reply can only be, "No".

Unless there is a body or a WHOLE lot more evidence, murder is a huge stretch.

I think you are absolutely right that her voluntarily getting into the vehicle will be a big factor in court. It's probably the whole reason he is saying he is innocent. But, too, if she's dead, I'm not sure how much that will matter, especially if they got a recording of him saying he killed her.

Also, you have to think that if she is dead or just lost or held up somewhere because of him, that was not what she got into the vehicle for. All evidence shows she wanted to get to the landlord and never arrived. So she went into the vehicle with the intent that she would get to the landlord, not the intent to be murdered or locked in a hole somewhere. So her willingly entering the vehicle is going to count for little. Think of it as this slime ball was doing false advertising: It's not what Yingying signed up for.

 

[Calzone]

That's certainly possible. My point was to note that even if LE/FBI/UIPD know a whole lot that they are not sharing with the public, they do not know enough to charge him with murder so a continued and vigorous search for YYZ is a logical course of action.

Agreed. However, if evidence of kidnapping is a stretch, murder could be a long shot. I hope LE is not relying on his taped comments as evidence of much of anything. Many here have speculated about where she could be, how it could have been done, why she would have participated, etc. What if that is all he was saying on the tape? What if his comments were speculative? It's not evidence.

With the last known location being a moving car and no other clues, a search never was practical.

 

[AnemoneBrown]

Agreed. However, if evidence of kidnapping is a stretch, murder could be a long shot. I hope LE is not relying on his taped comments as evidence of much of anything. Many here have speculated about where she could be, how it could have been done, why she would have participated, etc. What if that is all he was saying on the tape? What if his comments were speculative? It's not evidence.

With the last known location being a moving car and no other clues, a search never was practical.

Yes, you have pointed out the crux of the issue. Love your analysis.

 

[Wookiegruffles]

For a grand jury to indite him and order him held without bail in a federal facility, they must have thought the evidence was pretty strong.

 

[Wrigley's_Human]

For a grand jury to indite him and order him held without bail in a federal facility, they must have thought the evidence was pretty strong.

I don't know how federal grand jury works, but I was on country GJ. In my county, the charging attorneys make the bail requests to the judges, and judges determine bail. I see in the news about GJs investigating and calling witnesses, but my GJ experience was more akin to we would have indicted a ham sandwich. In 2 days/week of cases for 4 months, only literally a handful of "targets" were not indicted by us. There were longer explanations given, but a short one is basically that the prosecutors typically don't take cases to a GJ unless they think the evidence is strong enough to indict. And the GJ I was on only determined probable cause, that is a) a reasonable belief that a crime has been committed and b) that the person under investigation committed the crime. This is the lowest of all standards in court.

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[AnemoneBrown]

For a grand jury to indite him and order him held without bail in a federal facility, they must have thought the evidence was pretty strong.

BC is being indicted for kidnapping not murder. To put it into perspective, he is being charged the same way he would be if YYZ had returned home on that day and was doing fine today.

 

[Wookiegruffles]

BC is being indicted for kidnapping not murder. To put it into perspective, he is being charged the same way he would be if YYZ had returned home on that day and was doing fine today.

Correct. While LE has said they have reason to believe that she is dead, they have never said that BC murdered her. The only charge that he has been inticted for is kidnapping. They may also know enough to know that a search for her remains would be futile. Perhaps that is why they don't appear to be continuing to search. I pray that is not the case.

 

[Shiressleuth]

For a grand jury to indite him and order him held without bail in a federal facility, they must have thought the evidence was pretty strong.

I think he lied initially and said he was at home playing video games. Then they identified his vehicle and he 'remembered' picking her up but let her out when she panicked at a wrong turn. It's the lying and the audio that probably got him held without bail IMO.

 

[Calzone]

There could be additional factors contributing to the lack of additional charges.
The Law requires a speedy trial. Time is on the side of the accused if the Feds are continuing to gather evidence. If the Feds bring another charge, the clock starts over. It could be in their best interest to delay. He is in custody and not doing any harm.
Provided the Feds have all the evidence they need to charge murder, there is another hurdle to overcome. Murder committed in the act of kidnapping is a potential capital offense. The only person who makes the determination to seek the death penalty in a federal case is the Attorney General. In the best of times, it doesn't strike me as if that is a simple phone call to the AG. Presently, the AG seems a little busy with other matters. The system makes sense. The AG has the final decision on the penalty to seek so that the death penalty is evenly applied throughout the country. However, the AG was a Senator this time last year and will need to be educated on how the penalty has been applied in order to ensure fairness.
Another wrinkle could very well be political. How would a decision to seek the death penalty or not be viewed by China? Do we care? Some countries have refused to extradite to the US because of the potential death penalty and the US has had to guarantee no death penalty to get those countries to extradite. I know this is different than that but the point is that politics sometimes plays a role in these decisions.

 

[Calzone]

As I sit here on my deck on this beautiful Sunday in Champaign just blocks from the apartment where BC lived, I have to wonder whether accomplices in this or other cases contribute to or follow this forum.

I found this site looking for more information about this mystery that took place in my town, at my alma mater. Did/does the perpetrator do the same thing?

Hundreds of posts ago, I offered that there were abandoned strips mines nearby (one of which was recently searched for a possible drowning victim). Did I unknowingly offer a possible location to hide a body? If not this case, then another?

We post and follow this forum as interested parties in solving mysteries or hoping to gain insight but we don't know who each other is. Has anyone else wondered about who is lurking or contributing and why?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-33859134

Karen Buckley murder: Man admits 'evil' killing of Irish student in Glasgow (2015)

Lord Advocate Frank Mulholland QC, prosecuting, told the court that after murdering Ms Buckley, Pacteau then drove to his flat in Dorchester Avenue and took her body inside to his room.
He used his mobile phone to look up the properties of a chemical called sodium hydroxide, or caustic soda.
He then bought quantities of the chemical from B&Q and Poundstretcher along with masks and gloves.
-.-.-
Pacteau later burned his mattress and other items at the farmland, before taking the barrel, with Ms Buckley's body inside, to his car.
He bought padlocks, then made his way to the farm, where he arranged to rent two storage units for a week, before moving the barrel into one of the units.

 

[SteveP]

As I sit here on my deck on this beautiful Sunday in Champaign just blocks from the apartment where BC lived, I have to wonder whether accomplices in this or other cases contribute to or follow this forum.

I found this site looking for more information about this mystery that took place in my town, at my alma mater. Did/does the perpetrator do the same thing?

Hundreds of posts ago, I offered that there were abandoned strips mines nearby (one of which was recently searched for a possible drowning victim). Did I unknowingly offer a possible location to hide a body? If not this case, then another?

We post and follow this forum as interested parties in solving mysteries or hoping to gain insight but we don't know who each other is. Has anyone else wondered about who is lurking or contributing and why?

I think it is pretty much a given that some perps in crimes discussed here have kept up with, or at least checked on their own cases here. At this very moment, 1174 people are on this website, and only 163 are members. While I would think very few take the step to join and post (although it probably has happened), I would think it highly likely that at least some viewing this site at any given time may have been involved in one or more of the cases listed here. As to having given BC an idea as to what to do with Yingying's body, assuming he killed her, and most of us do, I feel like he had already disposed of her by the time this thread was started. JMO

 

[AnemoneBrown]

There could be additional factors contributing to the lack of additional charges.
The Law requires a speedy trial. Time is on the side of the accused if the Feds are continuing to gather evidence. If the Feds bring another charge, the clock starts over. It could be in their best interest to delay. He is in custody and not doing any harm.
Provided the Feds have all the evidence they need to charge murder, there is another hurdle to overcome. Murder committed in the act of kidnapping is a potential capital offense. The only person who makes the determination to seek the death penalty in a federal case is the Attorney General. In the best of times, it doesn't strike me as if that is a simple phone call to the AG. Presently, the AG seems a little busy with other matters. The system makes sense. The AG has the final decision on the penalty to seek so that the death penalty is evenly applied throughout the country. However, the AG was a Senator this time last year and will need to be educated on how the penalty has been applied in order to ensure fairness.
Another wrinkle could very well be political. How would a decision to seek the death penalty or not be viewed by China? Do we care? Some countries have refused to extradite to the US because of the potential death penalty and the US has had to guarantee no death penalty to get those countries to extradite. I know this is different than that but the point is that politics sometimes plays a role in these decisions.

That's interesting. This article contradicts your view claiming that often times the only way to make a perp finally give up the location of a victim's body is precisely by having him face a capital murder charge. In other words, it seems prosecutors find that certain defendants will only give up the location of a body when they have been charged with a death penalty case, and they then use telling authorities where the body is to bargain themselves down from a potential death penalty sentence. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/diane-dimond/no-body-murder-cases_b_137791.html