Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #160

[GA_Peach]

So where would he linger so the girls can get on the bridge?

As in Abby’s photo he isn’t in that still photo behind them which is interesting as she seems quite a distance from the beginning of the bridge. So he must of given it a bit of time for them to get over half way across imo

I think that he did pass the girls on his way off the bridge. However, he didn't admit to this because he knew that the girls, unlike the others he saw, wouldn't be able to refute his version. Ironically, this may really work against him.

 

[electricuncalm]

The .40 caliber round is likely a .40 caliber SMITH & WESSON.

.40 S&W - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The .40 cal S&W is available in S&W, Glock, Springfield Arms, Sig-Sauer and many other guns. Very common round used by LE, including FBI (until recently) and NCIS. The only round I can think of right off that is attributed to Sig is the .357 Sig-Sauer. Not the same as the .357

I've wondered that, too. I was even wondering if maybe RA got a free box of SigSauer ammo when he bought his P226 and just hasn't put many rounds through it. If it was a SigSauer round I wonder if that's why the previous rumors of it being an Sig were so common. I'd imagine not many people buy SigSauer ammo and much less buy it for a non-Sig gun.

My 9mm non sig is loaded with 9mm sig sauer right now. It was a great price. (I think 20 for 9.99)

 

[MntnHiker]

I agree that I think RA initially walked back off the bridge toward the trail and passed A and L as they came on the bridge. Perhaps there was an odd interaction or he stared at them uncomfortably that already put them on edge or made them feel he was hinky. But then he continues walking on the trail so they brush it off. Once they see him coming back at them on the bridge again, I can only imagine they were scared and knew something was wrong. Why he would be walking back towards them again so soon? MOO

 

[asyousay]

I think that he did pass the girls on his way off the bridge. However, he didn't admit to this because he knew that the girls, unlike the others he saw, wouldn't be able to refute his version. Ironically, this may really work against him.

I assumed he hid out of sight or did go and sit on a bench as he claimed. He had to be sure that nobody else was gonna cross the bridge before he set his plan in motion. He had already come across a woman at the beginning of the bridge.


I can’t but help think what if the adult female had crossed the bridge if he would have gone after her or if it would have foiled his plans with Abby and Libby. Because there was minutes in it where she turned back and walked past Abby and Libby.
Surely being on the first platform and seeing a adult woman arrive on her walk would of thrown him and made him think this was stupid. I guess I am trying to apply logic and there simply isn’t any.


Moooooooooo

 

[ACG2x]

The dots that aren't connecting for me right now but I assume LE knows or can make an educated theory on are:

1. What caused RA to decide to murder these two girls today? HIs attorney makes a point that he has no criminal history, so what was the motive hre? Did he just wake up one day and decide I'm going to kill two teenagers? Doesn't make much sense.
2. If these murders were planned, what are the event(s) that led him to deciding he needed or wanted to kill them? Does the anthony_shots profile play a role here or is that a coincidence? Did RA use it or know of it?
3. Was RA committing the murders on behalf or under orders, direction, plotting with another person? At the PCA hearing, the prosecutor mentioned "others involved" - who are those people and what are their roles?
4. Did RA go to the bridge planning to murder the girls, planning to murder someone, or was this a pure crime of opportunity?

I really hope all this comes out at trial because while I fully believe RA killed A&L, the why part are the dots that aren't connecting right now. Maybe there's more in his past that gives warning signs he's someone who would murder children, but from what we know now it doesn't appear to be visible. It's rare that someone goes from no criminal history to murdering two unrelated children they did not know so the pathway to that is what I'm interested to see play out.

 

[Dre]

For weeks I cannot stop with this train of thought-

Anyone think perhaps RA forced the girls down the hill where he knew TK was already waiting?

In Indiana and other states this would definitely include RA in the murder charge, even if someone else did… parts of the murder as well.
Moo

 

[MistyWaters]

In indiana, being charged with felony murder doesn’t mean they are saying the accused killed the victim directly. One can be guilty of felony murder if a death occurs while the accused is committing another crime, such as kidnapping.

Yes but did you read the charge he’s alleged to have committed, which will have to be proven in court? Sounds pretty direct to me -that Richard Allen did kill another human being….while committing or attempting to commit kidnapping.

I don’t understand why murder that occurred after/during a kidnapping is being downplayed as if it’s some kind of secondary murder charge. Committing two felonies - murder and kidnapping - is more than just one felony and he‘s charged with both IMO.

 

[Emerald1328]

I’ve been following this case behind the scenes so if I’m throwing something out that you guys have already talked about, I’m sorry! I’m very active on the Moscow thread and I know what that’s like. My theory has to do with the bullet and I’ve searched “bullet” in all the threads since we found out about it and didn’t see this mentioned, but again, sorry if so!

Based on eyewitnesses’ testimony, it seems like RA could have been with the girls for quite a long period of time, which is awful to think about. My theory (hope?) is that it was over quick for them and RA knew that the bullet had been ejected from the gun and spent the rest of his time at the crime scene looking for the bullet. He finally had to give up and left.

 

[pseudo_hum]

For weeks I cannot stop with this train of thought-

Anyone think perhaps RA forced the girls down the hill where he knew TK was already waiting?

IMO, certainly possible. But I would of thought that they would have a better plan than RA walking along the road back to his car. IMO. But who knows how a person, capable of such heinous crime, would be thinking?

 

[asyousay]

I’ve been following this case behind the scenes so if I’m throwing something out that you guys have already talked about, I’m sorry! I’m very active on the Moscow thread and I know what that’s like. My theory has to do with the bullet and I’ve searched “bullet” in all the threads since we found out about it and didn’t see this mentioned, but again, sorry if so!

Based on eyewitnesses’ testimony, it seems like RA could have been with the girls for quite a long period of time, which is awful to think about. My theory (hope?) is that it was over quick for them and RA knew that the bullet had been ejected from the gun and spent the rest of his time at the crime scene looking for the bullet. He finally had to give up and left.

Unfortunately this doesn’t fit because he would have know he left a bullet behind and when questioned he actually Said he had never loaned his gun to anybody. The bullet I believe found by the girls completely blindsided him which is why he never had a cover story.


IMO

 

[taylorss]

The dots that aren't connecting for me right now but I assume LE knows or can make an educated theory on are:

1. What caused RA to decide to murder these two girls today? HIs attorney makes a point that he has no criminal history, so what was the motive hre? Did he just wake up one day and decide I'm going to kill two teenagers? Doesn't make much sense.
2. If these murders were planned, what are the event(s) that led him to deciding he needed or wanted to kill them? Does the anthony_shots profile play a role here or is that a coincidence? Did RA use it or know of it?
3. Was RA committing the murders on behalf or under orders, direction, plotting with another person? At the PCA hearing, the prosecutor mentioned "others involved" - who are those people and what are their roles?
4. Did RA go to the bridge planning to murder the girls, planning to murder someone, or was this a pure crime of opportunity?

I really hope all this comes out at trial because while I fully believe RA killed A&L, the why part are the dots that aren't connecting right now. Maybe there's more in his past that gives warning signs he's someone who would murder children, but from what we know now it doesn't appear to be visible. It's rare that someone goes from no criminal history to murdering two unrelated children they did not know so the pathway to that is what I'm interested to see play out.

I wonder about this too … it’s such a switch from employed family man to double murderer!

Plus there are details that make it even odder - it seems planned IMO ‘with malice aforethought,’ and why is a hardworking family man who suddenly decides to become a double murderer going to plan it nearly in his own backyard…. against two local children who’d immediately be missed…. and not even make any attempt to hide the bodies & delay crime’s discovery ??? Imo

Def not saying he didn’t do it - taking as true what we’ve heard so far I’m totally convinced he did it. I just honestly cannot imagine what he could’ve been thinking

Jmo

 

[Emerald1328]

Unfortunately this doesn’t fit because he would have know he left a bullet behind and when questioned he actually Said he had never loaned his gun to anybody. The bullet I believe found by the girls completely blindsided him which is why he never had a cover story.


IMO

Maybe he was hoping if he couldn’t find it, LE couldn’t find it. Or he didn’t think there was a way to match the bullet to him, especially if he didn’t fire it. You’re most likely right, but on this I prefer to bury my head in the sand

 

[Le Singe]

Agreed

Although it seems stupid and absurdly risky, this loosely fits many other similar abduction crimes.

It's not unusual for victims to be abducted opportunistically from places where people are around - e.g right off the street, or in a park. Usually there is a second crime scene where the killer will feel more comfortable and hidden from view, where the attack takes place. The killer will feel he has control over his victims at this location. Then a third crime scene which is the disposal ground where the bodies are left.

In this case there is no disposal ground - the final crime scene is also where the attack took place.

But otherwise it seems fairly standard for a sex attacker. This will be a place he knew well, and he will have planned it out. The victims are likely just the first suitable targets who came along.

I'm not a psychologist, but its my suspicion that there is probably a "thrill" element for this guy. The thrill of it be a super risky is part of what he likes. But, just off the top of my head really risky crimes seem to rarely be the offenders first. Like they need something risky when the basic isn't doing it for them anymore (like a drug addict). I know we have no evidence to suggest this but it really really seems like this isn't this guys first super serious crime (I know he has no record or anything). It just seems really atypical for some one in their mid 40s to wake up one day start with this.

 

[Elley Mae]

I feel like there were enough ppl around that area/trail system that if he fired that gun someone would have heard it.

Jmo

 

[MistyWaters]

I wonder about this too … it’s such a switch from employed family man to double murderer!

Plus there are details that make it even odder - it seems planned IMO ‘with malice aforethought,’ and why is a hardworking family man who suddenly decides to become a double murderer going to plan it nearly in his own backyard…. against two local children who’d immediately be missed…. and not even make any attempt to hide the bodies & delay crime’s discovery ??? Imo

Def not saying he didn’t do it - taking as true what we’ve heard so far I’m totally convinced he did it. I just honestly cannot imagine what he could’ve been thinking

Jmo

I think it’s impossible to predict what is going on in people’s head at the time. Some murderers who have been convicted admit to it but still say they don’t know why they did it. Not every murder has a motive, just that they took advantage of the opportunity that was there at the time. JMO

 

[taylorss]

IMO, certainly possible. But I would of thought that they would have a better plan than RA walking along the road back to his car. IMO. But who knows how a person, capable of such heinous crime, would be thinking?

Yeah I’ve thought of this many times, just reluctant to mention here & bring on the condemnation of the no-Klines posters….

Really can only imagine any Klines actually present at the scene is if this was some sort of “project” - like if the crime was committed not for personal motivation but for money or some other reason… EG (just speculating) say KAK feared he’d told Libby too much about his illegal activities & thought he needed to eliminate her as a potential witness against him MOO just made-up speculation

Remembering the peeper two weeks later does make me wonder if there was some sort of organized group activity going on around there that involved Klines…. cuz that girl was communicating with A_S but the peeper’s description didn’t sound like KAK (not obese)…. JMO

 

[Dre]

IMO, certainly possible. But I would have thought that they would have a better plan than RA walking along the road back to his car. IMO. But who knows how a person, capable of such heinous crime, would be thinking?

Yeah I’ve thought of this many times, just reluctant to mention here & bring on the condemnation of the no-Klines posters….

Really can only imagine any Klines actually present at the scene is if this was some sort of “project” - like if the crime was committed not for personal motivation but for money or some other reason… EG (just speculating) say KAK feared he’d told Libby too much about his illegal activities & thought he needed to eliminate her as a potential witness against him MOO just made-up speculation

Remembering the peeper two weeks later does make me wonder if there was some sort of organized group activity going on around there that involved Klines…. cuz that girl was communicating with A_S but the peeper’s description didn’t sound like KAK (not obese)…. JMO

I think KK, TK and RA took separate parts of this crime in order to stall LE and make it nearly impossible to connect dots. If the person who kidnaps them isn’t the one who initially lures them OR kills them, then everything seems to fall apart evidence-wise for LE.

I think the plan was to obtain video/imagery as their drop-box had been bringing in a lot of interest..

MOO

 

[taylorss]

I think it’s impossible to predict what is going on in people’s head at the time. Some murderers who have been convicted admit to it but still say they don’t know why they did it. Not every murder has a motive, just that they took advantage of the opportunity that was there at the time. JMO

Yeah totally true…. Also remembered I don’t actually know anything about the crime scene (except vague remarks like “staged”). Without any info about what was found, really can’t even guess at what happened. It’s possible that parts of the crime scene would answer any & all of these questions.

Moo

 

[Jade]

I wonder about this too … it’s such a switch from employed family man to double murderer!

Plus there are details that make it even odder - it seems planned IMO ‘with malice aforethought,’ and why is a hardworking family man who suddenly decides to become a double murderer going to plan it nearly in his own backyard…. against two local children who’d immediately be missed…. and not even make any attempt to hide the bodies & delay crime’s discovery ??? Imo

Def not saying he didn’t do it - taking as true what we’ve heard so far I’m totally convinced he did it. I just honestly cannot imagine what he could’ve been thinking

Jmo

Where is this characterization of a hard working family man coming from?

Beyond just basically employed I don’t see where he was any standout.

Not much of a family man considering his daughter’s age and similarity to A & L.

His wife seems to have pasted a persona on him and gone with that because he obviously had a active fantasy life she wasn’t aware of if this is premeditated.



How does anyone know this is his first time?

I think he was thinking about being a pervert.

He didn’t attempt to conceal because then his staging would be ruined.

The crimes discovery was delayed. He spent considerable time with the girls.

Why not in his own backyard? He’s sneaky.









All imo

 

[taylorss]

I think KK, TK and RA took separate parts of this crime in order to stall LE and make it nearly impossible to connect dots. If the person who kidnaps them isn’t the one who initially lures them OR kills them, then everything seems to fall apart evidence-wise for LE.

I think the plan was to obtain video/imagery as their drop-box had been bringing in a lot of interest..

MOO

Yeah this makes sense. Tho have to say… if the Klines were involved, THEY sure took steps to cover up - hidden identities, many phones, fleeing to Vegas etc. But RA doesn’t seem to have taken any planning steps beyond parking his car semi-hidden, waiting around for the girls, & getting himself into an evil headspace as he went to stalk them. That idiot didn’t even try to put together an alibi! IMO

Maybe KAK / Klines really are CSAM pros & it was his / their venture… just needed a nearby sucker to do the public part for pay??
just speculating MOO