IN IN - Burger Chef murders, Speedway, 17 Nov 1978

[dotr]

The ISP have eliminated or lost interest in most of the 30 or so suspects that they ever took seriously from what I've seen and been told. Gates are Open was talking about a man named Pruitt when he says "the bearded man". Pruitt is not the only man the ISP looked at that fits that moniker. There was the bearded next door neighbor of Steinke in Franklin, IN. This man is deceased. Kimberlin's sidekick Bowman was known to wear a beard too. Law enforcement has always been unexplainably sure it wasn't these two. Lyons (Cincinnati suspect) wore a beard and lived near Mark Flemmonds. Always wondered just how they eliminated him, but they did.

Welcome to Ws Sven Forkbeard, interesting moniker!

 

[Sven Forkbeard]

Thanks Dotr! I guess no one want's their real name out there if they are discussing living murderers. I had to chime in having read the comments about a gun being in custody and linked to this crime. Gatesareopen and Keys to the Killer seemed to be telling a similar story. Sounds like Gates was an actual police interviewed witness. I've had a harder time determining which witness accounts for what lead the ISP was chasing than who they were chasing. I don't need to know who the witnesses are, but there are a couple of witness claims that intrigue me. The witness who claimed Mark owed 7K to a drug dealer has always piqued my curiosity. I don't believe the claim and I am not finding anyone who knew him that will corroborate it. I'm not certain that the perpetrators arrived in the BC lot in their car. I think they parked fairly near by but too far to drag the 4 kids so one of them put the 4 in Jayne's car while the other walked to their own car. The witnesses that provided the descriptions where sitting in their car when approached not the other way around as some say. Someone saw Jayne's Vega leave the lot but there was no mention of a second car in that testimony that I'm aware of.

 

[folieadeuxnola]

Indiana Cold Case: The Burger Chef Murders
In 1978 at a Burger Chef in Speedway, an employee found the doors unlocked, but nobody inside. It wasn't very long before police knew they were looking for a killer.

Indiana Cold Case: The Burger Chef Murders | 93.1 WIBC

 

[SertumAEnigmA]

I would like to hear more information on Pruitt and the person who reportedly witnessed the abduction from across Crawfordsville Rd. A couple other posters on this thread indicated that a gun was confiscated from Pruitt that matched ballistics to BC Murder. I don't believe this claim. There were also posts implying that Det. Jim Cramer was covering up his cousin's involvement in the crime. I don't buy that either. His cousin did work at that location, that much is true. Since I'm not a cop and I don't have access to the massive BC case file, I have to go theory by theory rule out the bunk as a layman. I would very much enjoy hearing more about what may have been observed from afar that night. I've been researching this case for many months now. I know who the suspects are but so does LE. There needs to be a comprehensive DNA analysis of Jayne's jacket. The ISP still has their clothing. What's it going to take? Mike Pence you got your ears on?

Nothing has indicated that a firearm recovered from Pruitt matched the BC murders. I do believe this claim originated from propaganda created by Carolyn Ann Shreve's people regarding her defense and/or the rumor mill of cases getting twisted up. Cheryl Pruitt(wife of Pruitt) testified that Shreve had confessed to murdering Julie Ann Seyfried during a night of drinking ten years later. Pruitt's name was injected in the trial pretty regularly from what I've been told by those covering it.

Seyfried was shot in the head, execution style, her clothes ripped off and neatly folded beside her and left in a field. Folks suggested that Pruitt may have been in fact the killer of Seyfried and raped her and a jailhouse snitch and Cheryl Pruitt conspired to "implicate" Shreve as cover for her husband. What the rumor mill claims as "evidence", a .22 was recovered that matched the BC murders and then similarities with the Days Inn murders in 1989. Gill and Gilbert were killed with a .22. Peggy Gill's clothes were neatly folded next to her nude body at Days Inn Merrillville and Jeanne Gilbert was abducted from Days Inn Remington and shot and dumped 20 miles away near Brookston. So, that has been perpetuated as "proof" that Pruitt killed Shreve because of vague similarities between homicides spanning half of Indiana and decades apart.

Shreve was found not guilty. I do think police consider it closed though, as Seyfried had beat Shreve when she was eight months pregnant and shoved her down some stairs, her baby was born with defects and died. So that probably impacted her verdict. I've dug into the I-65 murders for many years and folks on the street implicate Pruitt, but I do think of all suspects he's been vetted the most(three states and about a dozen agencies). Probably why Indiana State Police keeps saying they get the same two tips every year for the last 30 years.

As far as Burger Chef is concerned, Seyfried or even Steven Pressley- Pruitt may have been involved. Don't know. As far as I-65 murders, it's just not there.

 

[Sven Forkbeard]

I noticed SertumAEnigmA mentioned a .22 was recovered from Pruitt. I'm wondering how the "rumor mill" mistook a .22 for the .38 that killed Ruth Shelton and Danny Davis? I was guessing in my previous posts that Keys to the Killer and Gates are Open where talking about Pruitt based on the limited info they gave: attended Avon with Jayne Friedt, lived near 38th & Georgetown in '88-'90 and was once a person of interest. Pruitt claimed he was in the BC parking lot that night and saw the kids being taken out and loaded in Jayne's car. I'm of the opinion Pruitt just wanted attention. I am more fascinated with several different felons that lived in Mark Flemmonds' apartment complex Big Eagle. The man that was pulled over in front of that same apartment complex the night of the murders at 12:15am and discarded a loaded .38 into a front yard that wasn't discovered until next day is still a person of interest in my book. He was certain he would be charged with the murders when ISP focused on him in early '80. He was closely associated with Mark's neighbor directly below his apartment. This neighbor was a felon and refused to take a polygraph about the crime. Any of you out there have any suspects that lived at Big Eagle?

 

[SertumAEnigmA]

I noticed SertumAEnigmA mentioned a .22 was recovered from Pruitt. I'm wondering how the "rumor mill" mistook a .22 for the .38 that killed Ruth Shelton and Danny Davis? I was guessing in my previous posts that Keys to the Killer and Gates are Open where talking about Pruitt based on the limited info they gave: attended Avon with Jayne Friedt, lived near 38th & Georgetown in '88-'90 and was once a person of interest. Pruitt claimed he was in the BC parking lot that night and saw the kids being taken out and loaded in Jayne's car. I'm of the opinion Pruitt just wanted attention. I am more fascinated with several different felons that lived in Mark Flemmonds' apartment complex Big Eagle. The man that was pulled over in front of that same apartment complex the night of the murders at 12:15am and discarded a loaded .38 into a front yard that wasn't discovered until next day is still a person of interest in my book. He was certain he would be charged with the murders when ISP focused on him in early '80. He was closely associated with Mark's neighbor directly below his apartment. This neighbor was a felon and refused to take a polygraph about the crime. Any of you out there have any suspects that lived at Big Eagle?

It's probably the biggest problem in the whole True Crime genre.

Vast majority of folks are not well versed in facts- as for many it's about being right or at least bolstering their theory. Often baseless accusations and bizarre circumstances are peddled as proof and evidence. Facts and evidence are dismissed as cover-ups and plants. Not sure if you ever went to some of these towns and spoke to folks about some cases you follow, they are worse than the internet. As I said, either people get their head set on someone or they mix up cases.

Since '97 I kept hearing that the bearded guy who was involved in the Burger Chef robbery/homicide was the same guy in the Days Inn murders. I try to just start with the bare facts. Then fill in the question marks with a theory and eliminate it, instead of trying to prove it.

I figured outside of a vague description of suspects and being notorious cases in Indiana, they had nothing in common. The only thing connecting the bearded guy to Burger Chef was a witness who saw one prior to the robbery. Finally, after a long break I went at this one. I will have to face it one day. So, the very first bearded guy I found to be an actual suspect by police and eliminated as the Days Inn killer was Forrester. He had written a 1,200 page confession and the few detectives who are certain he did Burger Chef because he got details right, I figured a confession the size of an encyclopedia is probably going to get details right quite a bit. So I found a few people who would talk and spent a week in Indiana. Several of them named Forrester as "the bearded guy" and then went on to tell me he was the I-65 killer. I already knew this was impossible. Then at the start of this year, an old friend who worked this case connected with someone who was in the know, gave me his info and I took a trip to North Vernon. This guy claimed to have contacted ISP about Pruitt in the 90s, but then I also learned the other guy's name that went to federal prison after the bar tip. It can't be him.

The whole "it must be Pruitt" deal sounded suspect just based on how it was handled by police from the start. Narrative sounds like many "wrongful convictions". Nothing connects him to the Days Inn murders aside from his loose connection to Burger Chef based on his beard.

The one thing that sticks out the most, is the palm print of Flemmonds' brothers friend on the trunk of Friedt's car. It could be explained that Flemmonds' brother and this guy went to Burger Chef to mess with Mark and they leaned on her car while they were talking in the parking lot or maybe she gave them a ride and they had something in the trunk. Seems that police believe it was the product of one of the two robbery crews. Now the one criminal organization that the one gang was affiliated with, it doesn't seem like they would be this sloppy.

What is unsettling is why in the hell they would abduct them and not kill them on the spot with shots rapidly and flee? Even if they went into elimination mode, abducting four people and driving with them not only increases the chances of getting caught, but the longer they can leave evidence in the car. The more risk they might jump out of the car or fight you and you shoot them driving down the street. I'm far from well versed in this case, but it's intriguing. The theory I've seen put out by law enforcement is pretty far from being grounded or rational. Certainly not pros. Organized crime certainly has never been happy when a crew starts killing kids and potentially bringing that kind of heat.

I wonder how far they followed the friend of Flemmond's brother? Did they consider an inside job gone wrong? Also, if you got firearms, why are you running down victims and beating and stabbing them? Thinking about it, maybe one or two of these killings were personal?

Very strange.

 

[Sven Forkbeard]

It's probably the biggest problem in the whole True Crime genre.

Vast majority of folks are not well versed in facts- as for many it's about being right or at least bolstering their theory. Often baseless accusations and bizarre circumstances are peddled as proof and evidence. Facts and evidence are dismissed as cover-ups and plants. Not sure if you ever went to some of these towns and spoke to folks about some cases you follow, they are worse than the internet. As I said, either people get their head set on someone or they mix up cases.

Since '97 I kept hearing that the bearded guy who was involved in the Burger Chef robbery/homicide was the same guy in the Days Inn murders. I try to just start with the bare facts. Then fill in the question marks with a theory and eliminate it, instead of trying to prove it.

I figured outside of a vague description of suspects and being notorious cases in Indiana, they had nothing in common. The only thing connecting the bearded guy to Burger Chef was a witness who saw one prior to the robbery. Finally, after a long break I went at this one. I will have to face it one day. So, the very first bearded guy I found to be an actual suspect by police and eliminated as the Days Inn killer was Forrester. He had written a 1,200 page confession and the few detectives who are certain he did Burger Chef because he got details right, I figured a confession the size of an encyclopedia is probably going to get details right quite a bit. So I found a few people who would talk and spent a week in Indiana. Several of them named Forrester as "the bearded guy" and then went on to tell me he was the I-65 killer. I already knew this was impossible. Then at the start of this year, an old friend who worked this case connected with someone who was in the know, gave me his info and I took a trip to North Vernon. This guy claimed to have contacted ISP about Pruitt in the 90s, but then I also learned the other guy's name that went to federal prison after the bar tip. It can't be him.

The whole "it must be Pruitt" deal sounded suspect just based on how it was handled by police from the start. Narrative sounds like many "wrongful convictions". Nothing connects him to the Days Inn murders aside from his loose connection to Burger Chef based on his beard.

The one thing that sticks out the most, is the palm print of Flemmonds' brothers friend on the trunk of Friedt's car. It could be explained that Flemmonds' brother and this guy went to Burger Chef to mess with Mark and they leaned on her car while they were talking in the parking lot or maybe she gave them a ride and they had something in the trunk. Seems that police believe it was the product of one of the two robbery crews. Now the one criminal organization that the one gang was affiliated with, it doesn't seem like they would be this sloppy.

What is unsettling is why in the hell they would abduct them and not kill them on the spot with shots rapidly and flee? Even if they went into elimination mode, abducting four people and driving with them not only increases the chances of getting caught, but the longer they can leave evidence in the car. The more risk they might jump out of the car or fight you and you shoot them driving down the street. I'm far from well versed in this case, but it's intriguing. The theory I've seen put out by law enforcement is pretty far from being grounded or rational. Certainly not pros. Organized crime certainly has never been happy when a crew starts killing kids and potentially bringing that kind of heat.

I wonder how far they followed the friend of Flemmond's brother? Did they consider an inside job gone wrong? Also, if you got firearms, why are you running down victims and beating and stabbing them? Thinking about it, maybe one or two of these killings were personal?

Very strange.

The man that ISP went to question upon receiving the tip from the man shooting his mouth off in the Greenwood bar is easy to find. He was incarcerated at Terre Haute for possessing a sawed off .20 gauge after they questioned him, but he served his time and was out in the early 80s. He’s on Facebook and lives in Columbus Indiana. His bearded accomplice is dead, the bar informant is dead, but the fair haired guy is alive and well on Facebook and living in Nineveh. Most everything that can be known about these two is public record. I’m researching the felons that lived at Mark’s apartments. If it wasn’t Tim and Gregg from the robber gang or Donald and roommate then someone was robbing what they thought was a major weed network’s secret drug drop at the BC. They may have been after Mark.

 

[folieadeuxnola]

Man hoping memorial trees will honor Burger Chef murder victims

The Burger Chef murders are still among the most notorious killings in the city’s history.

Back in November of 1978, fast food workers Ruth Shelton, 17, Daniel Davis, 16, Jayne Friedt, 20, and Mark Flemmonds, 16, were kidnapped from a west side Burger Chef restaurant and killed. Their bodies were found a few days later in Johnson County. To this day, their killer has never been caught, but now one local man is trying to keep their stories alive.

Alex Wisemiller grew up on the west side, hearing stories about what happened to those four young restaurant workers.

“Whenever the anniversary comes up, it’s always ‘Oh, it’s still unsolved,’” Wisemiller said

 

[Sven Forkbeard]

It's probably the biggest problem in the whole True Crime genre.

Vast majority of folks are not well versed in facts- as for many it's about being right or at least bolstering their theory. Often baseless accusations and bizarre circumstances are peddled as proof and evidence. Facts and evidence are dismissed as cover-ups and plants. Not sure if you ever went to some of these towns and spoke to folks about some cases you follow, they are worse than the internet. As I said, either people get their head set on someone or they mix up cases.

Since '97 I kept hearing that the bearded guy who was involved in the Burger Chef robbery/homicide was the same guy in the Days Inn murders. I try to just start with the bare facts. Then fill in the question marks with a theory and eliminate it, instead of trying to prove it.

I figured outside of a vague description of suspects and being notorious cases in Indiana, they had nothing in common. The only thing connecting the bearded guy to Burger Chef was a witness who saw one prior to the robbery. Finally, after a long break I went at this one. I will have to face it one day. So, the very first bearded guy I found to be an actual suspect by police and eliminated as the Days Inn killer was Forrester. He had written a 1,200 page confession and the few detectives who are certain he did Burger Chef because he got details right, I figured a confession the size of an encyclopedia is probably going to get details right quite a bit. So I found a few people who would talk and spent a week in Indiana. Several of them named Forrester as "the bearded guy" and then went on to tell me he was the I-65 killer. I already knew this was impossible. Then at the start of this year, an old friend who worked this case connected with someone who was in the know, gave me his info and I took a trip to North Vernon. This guy claimed to have contacted ISP about Pruitt in the 90s, but then I also learned the other guy's name that went to federal prison after the bar tip. It can't be him.

The whole "it must be Pruitt" deal sounded suspect just based on how it was handled by police from the start. Narrative sounds like many "wrongful convictions". Nothing connects him to the Days Inn murders aside from his loose connection to Burger Chef based on his beard.

The one thing that sticks out the most, is the palm print of Flemmonds' brothers friend on the trunk of Friedt's car. It could be explained that Flemmonds' brother and this guy went to Burger Chef to mess with Mark and they leaned on her car while they were talking in the parking lot or maybe she gave them a ride and they had something in the trunk. Seems that police believe it was the product of one of the two robbery crews. Now the one criminal organization that the one gang was affiliated with, it doesn't seem like they would be this sloppy.

What is unsettling is why in the hell they would abduct them and not kill them on the spot with shots rapidly and flee? Even if they went into elimination mode, abducting four people and driving with them not only increases the chances of getting caught, but the longer they can leave evidence in the car. The more risk they might jump out of the car or fight you and you shoot them driving down the street. I'm far from well versed in this case, but it's intriguing. The theory I've seen put out by law enforcement is pretty far from being grounded or rational. Certainly not pros. Organized crime certainly has never been happy when a crew starts killing kids and potentially bringing that kind of heat.

I wonder how far they followed the friend of Flemmond's brother? Did they consider an inside job gone wrong? Also, if you got firearms, why are you running down victims and beating and stabbing them? Thinking about it, maybe one or two of these killings were personal?

Very strange.

I would like to compare notes with you some time if your willing. I have several thousand hours invested in researching this crime. Each primary ISP investigator had their own person or persons of interest. My end goal is to generate enough momentum to provoke LE to finally test their clothing for foreign DNA. I share info that I gather with ISP regularly. The 40 year anniversary is rapidly approaching. I’m of the opinion you may have some critical details that would help my research. If anyone is interested please feel free to email me at svenforkbeard8@gmail.com Thanks

 

[Glace Entertainment PR]

Celebrity Publicist Toni Embry To Investigate Burger Chef Murders During 40th Anniv. Of The Crimes - Press Release Here - - - > https://www.prlog.org/12722806-celebrity-publicist-toni-embry-to-investigate-burger-chef-murders-during-40th-anniv-of-the-crimes.html

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

I think it was someone known to the victims. The abduction,stabbing,and beating is so vengeful, and personal.
I hardly think any robbers would be that extreme over $600. They want to get the money and get the Hell out. Not waste time on anything extra.
Like abduction, beating,stabbing,and execution style shooting,and chance getting caught.

 

[Ibiz]

It's hard to say. It may be that two of the victims were killed by a differant individual. I must say, it seems that a lot of stock was placed in the two men the witness saw in the parking lot around 10 PM.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

Really sad that this was not solved,

This is what I learned below:

"I've said many times, down through the years, unless someone confesses, or some policeman proves differently, I'll go to my grave still believing that they killed those kids,” said Detective Ken York.

York was a state police detective on the case from the start. After witnesses helped create composite drawings and clay busts of two men seen at the restaurant just before closing, a tip from an informant led York to a group of men who'd been robbing fast food restaurants. Facing unrelated robbery and firearms charges, the two most likely Burger Chef suspects were offered a deal.

“Total immunity if they would tell what they knew about the Burger Chef case and take a polygraph to back that up, if either one of them could say that neither one of them inflicted a killing injury on one of the victims. Both of them went to prison rather than take a polygraph test or talk about it,” said York.

(This is on page 1 of the thread for reference)

My questions:

1.) When were these men convicted in their crimes in relation to the Burger Chef murders?
2.) What were their crimes and sentences in their convictions? I understand none of them were tried for the Burger Chef murders.
3.) How much time did they serve?
4.) Are any of them still alive? Free now?

The LE investigator believes that these men convicted in the unrelated case could be the Burger Chef kidnappers and killers. My understanding was that the following morning, the restaurant was cleaned up of the blood evidence. Had that not have happened, that evidence could have been help find out who did this horrible crime, and if it was the two suspects in the unrelated conviction who did this. I read somewhere that there may have been up to four perpetrators involved in the Burger Chef murders.

Satch

I wonder if the clean up was really a misunderstanding,or intentional. Seems mighty strange to me,and certainly garners further scrutiny. I could be wrong,but all angles need consideration.
Also look into victimology. Who knew who? Directly,or peripheraly.
The viciousness of this crime is so up front,and personal.
I think the robbery might have been secondary,or a red herring. To throw off investigation.
It's all just too extra to be a robbery.
Imo

 

[Glace Entertainment PR]

From Toni's Social Media Post Yesterday As She Officially Started Researching:
"I just got off the phone with the Communications Officer for ISP discussing #BurgerChefMurders. I am very thankful that I will have their cooperation. Allowing access to the case file and photos etc. will be a huge help ✔! There are so many theories and possibilities in this case and so much information that I now see why it has been unsolved. It is also why I am approaching it from a reconstruction aspect. Taking it step-by-step as it happened factually NOT what people have alluded to over the years. I'm looking forward to putting together this labyrinth of a puzzle and getting to know the people that this crime affected. So far across the internet and globe I have received an outpouring of people giving me information and sharing their stories and I'm elated to be part of it. There are many people who choose to investigate crimes from a very "cold"standpoint involving no emotion...I am not one of those people and I'm proud to not be." - Toni Embry - Posted By Social Media Team GlacePR

 

[Glace Entertainment PR]

Toni's Social Media Poat From Today (day 2 of investigation)

I started victimology profiling the #BurgerChefMurders today. I think that soooo much of this case EARLY ON was a TON of assumption ✔. Victimology is always the hardest part of case review for me. I think it is because it is the part of the case that humanizes the case. It is the part of the case where you see the impact of the crime. Though this is the hard part emotionally, this is the part that fuels the rest of the investigation for me. By humanizing it I see that the victims are human, whereas before they were a case #. Now the drive to investigate is more personal ❤! - Toni Embry - Posted By Social Media Team GlacePR

 

[Glace Entertainment PR]

Photo Of The Burger Chef Restaurant where the Burger Chef Murders occurred. Photo Taken by Chief Celebrity Publicist Toni Embry For Glace Entertainment Public Relations on 8/24/18 as part of her on-going 40 Year Anniversary Investigation. - Posted By GlacePR Social Media Team - For More Info Please See Press Release [URL='https://www.prlog.org/12722806-celebrity-publicist-toni-embry-to-investigate-burger-chef-murders-during-40th-anniv-of-the-crimes.html']---> https://www.prlog.org/12722806-celebrity-publicist-toni-embry-to-investigate-burger-chef-murders-during-40th-anniv-of-the-crimes.html[/URL]

 

[noodler2]

So, so horrible a crime! I had not tho't of it for decades til' I saw this thread.

 

[Ibiz]

Well, I hope you get somewhere with your investigation. I found it bizarre that the police called to the burger chef would have thought that these people who had no connection to one another, would have left all their stuff behind and took off with all that money to have a party.

I think that $500.00 back then would be about $4000.00 today. This would hardly be a petty theft.

 

[Glace Entertainment PR]

Well, I hope you get somewhere with your investigation. I found it bizarre that the police called to the burger chef would have thought that these people who had no connection to one another, would have left all their stuff behind and took off with all that money to have a party.

I think that $500.00 back then would be about $4000.00 today. This would hardly be a petty theft.

I agree with you soooo damn much @Ibiz!! So much of why this crime is unsolved is bc of the way the crime scene was treated and the lack of preservation of it. The police who responded were WAY off calling this "embezzlement". Even if it was initially labelled embezzlement the scene should have still been preserved. $500 was about $4,000 which, like you said, is NOT petty theft. Also, the items left behind by the victims weren't in-sequential items at all. 2 of the items were the female victims purses! Who the hell would go "party" without their ID and purse and leave it behind to be discovered by the company you stole from?!?! Additionally, the employee's statement (Brian Kring) that returned that night to discover the scene and report it to police should have been MORE than enough to substantiate this NOT being embezzlement. He stated that the manager's office was completely disheveled (not normal), the back door was unlocked (not normal), and he even speculated while police were there that the 4 employees were ambushed while taking out the trash. ALL of this should have made this a crime scene and the scene been preserved (prints other evidence gathered). All of this being said, it is unfortunately the case that the scene was not at all preserved. It is what I have found to be 1 of the main reason this case was never solved and remains cold.

When I see an ALARMING reasons that something/someone is preventing evidence from being gathered, it immediately raises a red flag to me. It makes me wonder, in this case, was there a local police officer involved with this from the jump?!?! While I continue with the evidence and statements that are available, I am NOT ruling out the fact that responding police officers completely made any subsequent processing/investigation of this crime scene impossible and therefore may very well be connected to it somehow. - Toni

 

[Sven Forkbeard]

I would like to ask Cilene about her knowledge of the Mary Ann Higginbotham and Tim Willoughby case. This case and BC does have a connection. This isn’t speculation. It is fact. The connection does not mean that Kellams and Tomasik had anything to do with BC. A known BC witness implicated someone close to the Mary Ann & Tim case. Cilene determined that her friend was not the person who told ISP about Kellams and Tomasik. I would love to have a conversation with Cilene. There is a chance that we each have info the other may find helpful.