Laura Babcock Murder Trial 10.26.17 - Day 4

[matou]

Also, shocked that today's young witness stated he knew IISHO when the other didn't. I hope they have some sort of witness protection in place as "rats" aren't views very well in street society. :/

Also interesting that he saw Ish and Smich going back into the shed a few times during the summer Laura went missing.

 

[andreww]

Here are some questions that interest me...

- where do Smich and Millard spend their nights during the trial?
- do they travel in the same police van?
- are they in separate holding areas at the courthouse?
- do they eat lunch in separate areas?

I'd just be interested to know if there was a place or time during the day where they might feel comfortable enough to communicate? Granted, Smich likely wouldn't have much to say, but Millard most certainly has some things he'd like to say to Smich.

 

[andreww]

Also interesting that he saw Ish and Smich going back into the shed a few times during the summer Laura went missing.

Wasn't Isho a friend of Smich's? Didn't he introduce him to Millard? The shed meetings could have been simply a place to smoke weed. Or maybe not.

 

[90sbosslady]

Also interesting that he saw Ish and Smich going back into the shed a few times during the summer Laura went missing.

I picked up on that too! Very interesting.

 

[matou]

Wasn't Isho a friend of Smich's? Didn't he introduce him to Millard? The shed meetings could have been simply a place to smoke weed. Or maybe not.

He was smoking and selling weed to the youngsters so I don't think that was it. Gun deal? Coke?

 

[james9]

Question: Are young offender cases not protected, and don't show up on an adult's record? They talked about incidences Cronin was involved in when he was 13.

I suspect the incidents he was talking about did not result in charges. They were probably just incidents that were logged in the police database.

 

[andreww]

Well, she was the complainant in a pending assault/theft/sexual assault case. That should have been a little bit of a red flag.



https://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2014/06/07/dellen_millard_murder_of_laura_babcock_leaves_lingering_questions_for_police.html

Hindsight is always 20/20. Cops investigate missing persons cases based on certain criteria, and the system works decently. Unfortunately for LB it didn't. Its just unfeasible that police hire hundred of detectives and spend tens of thousands of man-hours investigating every single report of a missing person.

 

[FastLikeLight]

When exact had Cronin contacted the vice-principal and police?

Published Friday, May 17, 2013 6:34PM EDT
"Police probe link between Bosma suspect, missing woman

Laura Babcock was 23 years old when she went missing last July. Now, police are probing her relationship with Dellen Millard, the suspect charged with first-degree murder in connection with Bosma’s death.

Millard, 27, was friends with Babcock. The two spent time together and friends say they even had a romantic relationship just before Babcock went missing

Babcock’s phone record, which revealed that she had called Millard 13 times between June 30 and July 3 of last year. The phone records show that her very last call was made to Millard on July 3."
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ELINE-**NO-Discussion**&p=9452635#post9452635

Can someone tell if the video what was shown during this trial and the video circulated in 2013 is same? Any links?

 

[james9]

Can someone tell if the video what was shown during this trial and the video circulated in 2013 is same? Any links?

The rap video that you can find on YouTube is an exhibit from the TB trial. The new rap video in the LB trial has not been publicly released yet to my knowledge, but I'm guessing it will end up on YouTube at some point soon, now that it has been revealed in the trial.

 

[Satchie]

Hindsight is always 20/20. Cops investigate missing persons cases based on certain criteria, and the system works decently. Unfortunately for LB it didn't. Its just unfeasible that police hire hundred of detectives and spend tens of thousands of man-hours investigating every single report of a missing person.

Also, adults have a right to privacy. If I decided to cut off contact with my ex-boyfriend and parents (maybe because I felt they were trying to bully or control me), do police have the right to investigate my phone bills, credit cards, contact my friends, etc, just because they ask them to? This is a sensitive issue for many, we don't want to live in a police state like some countries, where they can pry into your life whenever they want.

 

[FastLikeLight]

The rap video that you can find on YouTube is an exhibit from the TB trial. The new rap video in the LB trial has not been publicly released yet to my knowledge, but I'm guessing it will end up on YouTube at some point soon, now that it has been revealed in the trial.

I meant a different one. Googled it. Found it - in the video [GHOZTED] SM was only acting (aka Dexter), not rapping. The video is very gross.

 

[andreww]

Also, adults have a right to privacy. If I decided to cut off contact with my ex-boyfriend and parents (maybe because I felt they were trying to bully or control me), do police have the right to investigate my phone bills, credit cards, contact my friends, etc, just because they ask them to? This is a sensitive issue for many, we don't want to live in a police state like some countries, where they can pry into your life whenever they want.

Great point!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Woodland]

Hindsight is always 20/20. Cops investigate missing persons cases based on certain criteria, and the system works decently. Unfortunately for LB it didn't. Its just unfeasible that police hire hundred of detectives and spend tens of thousands of man-hours investigating every single report of a missing person.

<modsnip>

'A decent system' is not enough - and never will be when or more people are left behind. What could have been prevented, the two lives that could have been saved are nothing to sweep under the carpet as 'ooops my bad'.

SL went to TPS on 14 July 2012 because LB had dropped off the grid - a red flag in most cases. Yes some people may choose to drop every aspect of their lives and walk away, but how many people is that in any given year?

When a young female stops using social media, something they did on a daily basis, her phone, stops accessing her bank account, leaves a dog behind that she took everywhere as well as material belongings in her room at her parents place - it's a red flag. These things were a red flag in 2012, prior to 2012 and since 2012. SL feared that something had happened to LB - not just that he could not find her - and the mechanism to start an investigation is to let LE know she has dropped of the grid.

Using the term 'missing' so loosely is enabling imo. Enabling predators to continue to prey on vulnerable people because they are 18 years-old. The average Canadian citizen can in fact choose to have the view that a 'missing' person is a run of the mill occurrence, but LE does not, cannot have this luxury. What TPS would have discovered in LB's case was that they could not find her anymore than her family and friends - which should have been a red flag!

To top it all off, in Nov 2012 WM turns up dead in his home and LE initially buys into the suicide explanation that DM gave them - the same DM that SL was trying so desperately to point out was the last person LB was known to have contact with. And of course the blinders LE chose to wear then led to TB's brazen murder with a trail of breadcrumbs to long it was pathetic. DM and MS were so enabled by LE at this point they saw no need to cover anything the did imo.

This is why so many TPS officers will not be called to testify imo - it would be leading lambs to a slaughter. Something not necessary at the moment, but does need repeating time and time again to prevent it from happening time and time again.

<modsnip>

 

[Velma]

We're back!

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 15s15 seconds ago
Crown Katie Doherty is questioning the next #Babcock witness, Andrew Gordon, 27. Being sworn in now.

 

[Velma]

Oct 26 2017 2:24 PM
Shannon Martin
We are back in session now, and the Crown has called Andrew Gordon.

He knows Dellen Millard, they met through friends in high school in 2008.

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 33s33 seconds ago
Gordon knows Dellen #Millard. Met through friends in high school. Early 2008, in Gr 12, at Millard house. He's been there many times since

Shannon Martin&#8207; @ShannonMartinTV 13s13 seconds ago
Andrew Gordon met Dellen Millard in 2008, they were (are?) friends.

marianne boucher&#8207; @CityCourtsTO 23s23 seconds ago
Smich and Millard murder trial continues , Andrew Gordon next witness. Knows Millard from high school, was at his house 50-plus times.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNFYeLkVQAAOU-V.jpg

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 29s29 seconds ago
He and #Millard were friends up until 2011, Gordon says. He's been to #Millard's condo in the distillery district, and the hangar at Pearson

 

[Velma]

AG and DM would not have been in high school together (too far apart in age). DM would have been 23(ish).

 

[Velma]

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 2m2 minutes ago
The last time he saw #Millard was winter 2011, he says. Remembers the Etobicoke house on Maple Gate. "It's mostly one big level"

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 1m1 minute ago
There was a gaming room with 7 TVs, and 7 Xboxes. Judge stops him for "mangling syntaxes" like others of his age. #Babcock

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 36s36 seconds ago
They would smoke in #Millards bedroom where he had a vaporizer surrounded by chairs. The basement was being re-modeled into a bar.

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 55s55 seconds ago
#Millard and his dad lived there, and briefly, two of his other friends from high school, Gordon says. #Babcock

marianne boucher&#8207; @CityCourtsTO 4s4 seconds ago
Gordon hung out at Millard home in Etobicoke, several TV's and XBox's. Went to his condo in Distillary. Last saw him 2011. Never saw dad.

Shannon Martin&#8207; @ShannonMartinTV 13s13 seconds ago
Crown Katie Doherty takes Gordon through questioning, establishing his friendship with Millard. He says they were friends from 2008-2011.

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 10s10 seconds ago
When Gordon was there he never once saw #Millard father. It was years before he knew Millard Sr. had been home when he was there.

 

[DavidCronin]

Hopefully justice will be served for Laura.

 

[Velma]

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 26s26 seconds ago
Gordon always went to #Millard's house with a group, at least 4-5 people, sometimes as many as 60 for parties. Always high school friends

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 7s7 seconds ago
Generally #Millard was the oldest one there, except for a couple others including Laura #Babcock. They would play games, smoke, drink.

Shannon Martin&#8207; @ShannonMartinTV 4s4 seconds ago
Gordon says he met Laura Babcock at Millard's house on a few occasions.

marianne boucher&#8207; @CityCourtsTO now
Gordon discovered later Millards dad lived there too. Always w a group of ppl. up to 50 highschool friends at his home. Ages 20-21.

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 12s12 seconds ago
When he says smoke, he means "weed," he clarifies. Only met #Babcock at #Millard house. Didn't know her well. Understood they were dating

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 1m1 minute ago
Once #Babcock and #Millard went into a bedroom for about 40 minutes alone. Gordon was dating Christina Noudga.

Lisa Hepfner&#8207; @HefCHCHNews 16s16 seconds ago
Gordon dated Christina Noudga from 2008 until 2010, he says. Andrew Michelski was a friend of his and Dellen #Millard's, he says.

 

[Sillybilly]

marianne boucher&#8207; @CityCourtsTO 4s4 seconds ago
Gordon hung out at Millard home in Etobicoke, several TV's and XBox's. Went to his condo in Distillary. Last saw him 2011. Never saw dad.

<rs&bbm>

Am I missing something here? DM bought the Distillery condo in 2013 (iirc, it closed the day after Tim went missing).