GUILTY MA - Aaron Hernandez, New England Patriots player, charged with homicides #4

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Mollyandme

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This is my first time posting in this thread. I definitely think he should be found guilty of first degree murder and all other charges based on the evidence presented in court. I was just coming here to post because I am very into football and read a lot of football messageboards and there's one now where people are commenting on the case now that we are in "verdict watch." About half of the posters, some of whom "claim" to be lawyers, think he will be found not guilty of the murder charge because there is too much reasonable doubt and because the judge was so biased. I agree about the judge, but completely disagree about the not guilty verdict especially after hearing the jury instructions. I think everyone knows hernandez did it i just hope the jury can use the evidence and common sense to reach that verdict. Does anyone think it will be a NG verdict?
 

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This is my first time posting in this thread. I definitely think he should be found guilty of first degree murder and all other charges based on the evidence presented in court. I was just coming here to post because I am very into football and read a lot of football messageboards and there's one now where people are commenting on the case now that we are in "verdict watch." About half of the posters, some of whom "claim" to be lawyers, think he will be found not guilty of the murder charge because there is too much reasonable doubt and because the judge was so biased. I agree about the judge, but completely disagree about the not guilty verdict especially after hearing the jury instructions. I think everyone knows hernandez did it i just hope the jury can use the evidence and common sense to reach that verdict. Does anyone think it will be a NG verdict?

Mollyandme,

Thank you and welcome to Websleuths.

Since I was closing the thread where you made your first post I moved it over here. I meant to put it beneath my opening post but ended up on top for some reason.

Thanks for participating.
 

Queen Bee

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This is my first time posting in this thread. I definitely think he should be found guilty of first degree murder and all other charges based on the evidence presented in court. I was just coming here to post because I am very into football and read a lot of football messageboards and there's one now where people are commenting on the case now that we are in "verdict watch." About half of the posters, some of whom "claim" to be lawyers, think he will be found not guilty of the murder charge because there is too much reasonable doubt and because the judge was so biased. I agree about the judge, but completely disagree about the not guilty verdict especially after hearing the jury instructions. I think everyone knows hernandez did it i just hope the jury can use the evidence and common sense to reach that verdict. Does anyone think it will be a NG verdict?
hi molly :seeya: so glad to see you here :)........

i can definitely agree with you about the biased judge.....i don't think i have ever witnessed such a thing.....it was unbelievable and i have quite a number of years of experience in the legal field......cyber and real life........unbelievable!!! :(

but i disagree with those so called "lawyers" on the football forums....i do think there is enough evidence that garsh did allow in to connect the dots and convict him......i think the jury will have some discussions that may get deep......but i think they will find their way....or at least i pray they do.......

when looking at the evidence overall.......in my opinion.....it's pretty damning......

hope to see you for the verdict and around on the boards after this and hopefully we will be celebrating the clanging of wrist irons :D :jail:
 

SStarr33

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This is my first time posting in this thread. I definitely think he should be found guilty of first degree murder and all other charges based on the evidence presented in court. I was just coming here to post because I am very into football and read a lot of football messageboards and there's one now where people are commenting on the case now that we are in "verdict watch." About half of the posters, some of whom "claim" to be lawyers, think he will be found not guilty of the murder charge because there is too much reasonable doubt and because the judge was so biased. I agree about the judge, but completely disagree about the not guilty verdict especially after hearing the jury instructions. I think everyone knows hernandez did it i just hope the jury can use the evidence and common sense to reach that verdict. Does anyone think it will be a NG verdict?

Hey Molly, if you have time, could you ask them what they think about Sultan confessing AH's presence at the crime?
 

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Welcome, mollyandme, although I am a newbie here as well. Words fail when it comes to Garsh imvho. I have never heard of a case where the final words of the victim which named his killer were suppressed. Queen Bee, help me out with that one because I am a civilian only but I was pretty stunned. (Referencing Loyds final text.)
 

Mollyandme

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hi molly :seeya: so glad to see you here :)........

i can definitely agree with you about the biased judge.....i don't think i have ever witnessed such a thing.....it was unbelievable and i have quite a number of years of experience in the legal field......cyber and real life........unbelievable!!! :(

but i disagree with those so called "lawyers" on the football forums....i do think there is enough evidence that garsh did allow in to connect the dots and convict him......i think the jury will have some discussions that may get deep......but i think they will find their way....or at least i pray they do.......

when looking at the evidence overall.......in my opinion.....it's pretty damning......

hope to see you for the verdict and around on the boards after this and hopefully we will be celebrating the clanging of wrist irons :D :jail:


I completely agree. I disagreed with what was posted on those boards too. And his fiancée is just terrible. Absolutely disgusting behavior! She should be in jail
 

Mollyandme

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Hey Molly, if you have time, could you ask them what they think about Sultan confessing AH's presence at the crime?

I would but I don't comment, i just read usually when it pertains to the Eagles. I think it's also important to note that it's mostly men on those boards. I am not trying to stereotype at all but when I have discussed cases i follow with my husband or guy friends, most of them tend to say "yea that persons probably guilty but I dunno I think there could be reasonable doubt"....it's so maddening!
 

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Welcome, mollyandme, although I am a newbie here as well. Words fail when it comes to Garsh imvho. I have never heard of a case where the final words of the victim which named his killer were suppressed. Queen Bee, help me out with that one because I am a civilian only but I was pretty stunned. (Referencing Loyds final text.)
it basically boils down to the fact that the defendant doesn't have the opportunity to cross exam the person making the utterance (yeah i know)....it depends on the state if those type of final declarances are allowed.....there is a case in WI that was quite nationally followed and on here....are you familiar with the julie jensen murder? she wrote a letter thinking her husband was trying to kill her and told how....he did by poisoning her with anitfreeze.....the letter was allowed in his trial.....he was convicted.......the conviction was overturned....just an example.....it's a highly debated issue state to state and a highly appealed issue as well
 

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I haven't followed this case much but I've seen repeated reports about the defendant seeming totally at ease, swaggering, acting like he's happy as a clam. That truly bothers me. If nothing else, someone has been killed. How dare he treat the situation so casually?
 

Queen Bee

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I haven't followed this case much but I've seen repeated reports about the defendant seeming totally at ease, swaggering, acting like he's happy as a clam. That truly bothers me. If nothing else, someone has been killed. How dare he treat the situation so casually?
hi gitana :seeya: good to see you!

oh it's been sickening :furious: he's a psycho imo........i feel so badly for odin's mother and family and girlfriend........

would you please look at the post above and see if i properly explained why odin's text was not allowed? i did my best :D
 

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I haven't followed this case much but I've seen repeated reports about the defendant seeming totally at ease, swaggering, acting like he's happy as a clam. That truly bothers me. If nothing else, someone has been killed. How dare he treat the situation so casually?

I agree, have you read about the behavior between him and his fiancée after the jury went into deliberations? That really made my blood boil! There are tweets about it on the previous thread but basically they were flirting heavily with eachother
 

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Softail

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Hoping for a guilty verdict!

Sorry guys... I'm kind of a mes.... Got home from hubby's surgery..... Mom was there. After feeling everything went good....Get a call from mom... she is in the er... can't breathe.... shortness of breathe;;;;;;

:sigh:
 

Queen Bee

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Hoping for a guilty verdict!

Sorry guys... I'm kind of a mes.... Got home from hubby's surgery..... Mom was there. After feeling everything went good....Get a call from mom... she is in the er... can't breathe.... shortness of breathe;;;;;;

:sigh:
:therethere: she's where they can take care of it.....now YOU breathe!!!!

it will be okay.........calm down.......keep us posted :heartbeat:
 

Queen Bee

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I just re-listened to about 10 minutes or so of Sultan's closing and he said "we know" at least 5 times.

I don't understand why the defense is allowed to say "we know" and the prosecution is not.

ummm because she's a #$%^&? :D
 

gitana1

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hi gitana :seeya: good to see you!

oh it's been sickening :furious: he's a psycho imo........i feel so badly for odin's mother and family and girlfriend........

would you please look at the post above and see if i properly explained why odin's text was not allowed? i did my best :D

That's a perfect explanation for why such a statement wouldn't come in. Some states allow hearsay from dead people under the exception "declarant unavailable" and Mass. is one of them. However, only certain types of statements would come in under that exception:
Section 804. Hearsay Exceptions; Declarant Unavailable(a) Definition of Unavailability. “Unavailability as a witness” includes situations in which the declarant

(1) is exempted by ruling of the court on the ground of privilege from testifying concerning the subject matter of the declarant’s statement, or
(2) refuses to testify [exception not recognized], or
(3) testifies to a lack of memory [exception not recognized], or
(4) is unable to be present or to testify at the hearing because of death or then-existing physical or mental illness or infirmity, or
(5) is absent from the hearing and the proponent of a statement has been unable to procure the declarant’s attendance by process or other reasonable means.
A declarant is not unavailable as a witness if the unavailability is due to the procurement or wrongdoing of the proponent of a statement for the purpose of preventing the witness from attending or testifying.
(b) Hearsay Exceptions. The following are not excluded by the hearsay rule if the declarant is unavailable as a witness:
(1) Prior Recorded Testimony. Testimony given as a witness at another trial or hearing of the same or a different proceeding, or in a deposition taken in compliance with law in the course of the same or another proceeding, if the party against whom the testimony is now offered, or in a civil action or proceeding, a predecessor in interest, had an opportunity and a similar motive to develop the testimony by direct, cross-, or redirect examination.
(2) Statement Made Under Belief of Impending Death. In a prosecution for homicide, a statement made by a declarant-victim under the belief of imminent death and who died shortly after making the statement, concerning the cause or circumstances of what the declarant believed to be the declarant’s own impending death or that of a co-victim.
(3) Statement Against Interest. A statement which was at the time of its making so far contrary to the declarant’s pecuniary or proprietary interest, or so far tended to subject the declarant to civil or criminal liability, or to render invalid a claim by the declarant against another, that a reasonable person in the declarant’s position would not have made the statement unless believing it to be true. In a criminal case, the exception does not apply to a statement that is offered to exculpate the defendant or that is offered by the Commonwealth to inculpate the defendant, and that tends to expose the declarant to criminal liability, unless corroborating circumstances clearly indicate the trustworthiness of the statement.
(4) Statement of Personal History.
(A) A statement concerning the declarant’s own birth, adoption, marriage, divorce, legitimacy, relationship by blood, or ancestry, even if the declarant had no means of acquiring personal knowledge of the matter stated.
(B) A statement regarding foregoing matters concerning another person to whom the declarant is related [exception not recognized].
(5) Statutory Exceptions in Civil Cases.
(A) Declarations of Decedent. In any action or other civil judicial proceeding, a declaration of a deceased person shall not be inadmissible in evidence as hearsay or as private conversation between husband and wife, as the case may be, if the court finds that it was made in good faith and upon the personal knowledge of the declarant.
(B) Deceased Party’s Answers to Interrogatories. If a party to an action who has filed answers to interrogatories under any applicable statute or any rule of the Massachusetts Rules of Civil Procedure dies, so much of such answers as the court finds have been made upon the personal knowledge of the deceased shall not be inadmissible as hearsay or self-serving if offered in evidence in said action by a representative of the deceased party.
(C) Declarations of Decedent in Actions Against an Estate. If a cause of action brought against an executor or administrator is supported by oral testimony of a promise or statement made by the testator or intestate of the defendant, evidence of statements, written or oral, made by the decedent, memoranda and entries written by the decedent, and evidence of the decedent’s acts and habits of dealing, tending to disprove or to show the improbability of the making of such promise or statement, shall be admissible.
(D) Reports of Deceased Physicians in Tort Actions. In an action of tort for personal injuries or death, or for consequential damages arising from such personal injuries, the medical report of a deceased physician who attended or examined the plaintiff, including expressions of medical opinion, shall, at the discretion of the trial judge, be admissible in evidence, but nothing therein contained which has reference to the question of liability shall be so admissible. Any opposing party shall have the right to introduce evidence tending to limit, modify, contradict, or rebut such medical report. The word “physician” as used in this section shall not include any person who was not licensed to practice medicine under the laws of the jurisdiction within which such medical attention was given or such examination was made.
(E) Medical Reports of Disabled or Deceased Physicians as Evidence in Workers’ Compensation Proceedings. In proceedings before the industrial accident board, the medical report of an incapacitated, disabled, or deceased physician who attended or examined the employee, including expressions of medical opinion, shall, at the discretion of the member, be admissible as evidence if the member finds that such medical report was made as the result of such physician’s attendance or examination of the employee.
(6) Forfeiture by Wrongdoing. A statement offered against a party who forfeits, by virtue of wrongdoing, the right to object to its admission based on findings by the court that (A) the witness is unavailable; (B) the party was involved in, or responsible for, procuring the unavailability of the witness; and (C) the party acted with the intent to procure the witness’s unavailability.
(7) Religious Records. Statements of fact made by a deceased person authorized by the rules or practices of a religious organization to perform a religious act, contained in a certificate that the maker performed such act, and purporting to be issued at the time of the act or within a reasonable time thereafter.
(8) Admissibility in Criminal Proceedings of a Child’s Out-of-*Court Statement Describing Sexual Contact. General Laws c. 233, § 81, was adopted prior to the United States Supreme Court’s decisions in Crawford v. Washington, 541 U.S. 36 (2004), and Davis v. Washington, 547 U.S. 813 (2006), as well as the Supreme Judicial Court’s decisions in Commonwealth v. Gonsalves, 445 Mass. 1, 833 N.E.2d 549 (2005), cert. denied, 548 U.S. 926 (2006), and Commonwealth v. Amirault, 424 Mass. 618, 677 N.E.2d 652 (1997). These decisions call into question the constitutionality of this subsection.http://www.mass.gov/courts/case-leg...ide-to-evidence/article-viii-hearsay.html#804
 

gitana1

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I agree, have you read about the behavior between him and his fiancée after the jury went into deliberations? That really made my blood boil! There are tweets about it on the previous thread but basically they were flirting heavily with eachother

I heard that he was staring at her but not exactly that they were flirting. Ick.
 

geevee

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Hoping for a guilty verdict!

Sorry guys... I'm kind of a mes.... Got home from hubby's surgery..... Mom was there. After feeling everything went good....Get a call from mom... she is in the er... can't breathe.... shortness of breathe;;;;;;

:sigh:

When it rains, it pours, huh? Really sorry life has been so stressful for you, hope your Mom is alright and hub recovery is smooth and fast.
 
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