MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #3

[Bishop Black]

Professor Was Accused of Hitting Cop Boyfriend with Car, Leaving Him to Die. Does New Evidence Exonerate Her?

Karen Read has been charged with second-degree murder, motor vehicle manslaughter and leaving the scene of a collision in the death of her off-duty Boston Police Officer boyfriend John O'Keefe.

people.com

Karen Read has been charged with second-degree murder, motor vehicle manslaughter and leaving the scene of a collision in the January 2022 death of her off-duty Boston Police Officer boyfriend John O'Keefe outside a Canton, Mass., home.

She's pleaded not guilty to the charges.

Leading up to his death, the couple of two years reportedly spent the night drinking and bar hopping with friends before Read, 43, dropped O'Keefe, 46, off at the home of a fellow off-duty police officer for an after-party, PEOPLE previously reported.

Prosecutors say as O'Keefe exited the vehicle, Read allegedly proceeded to make a three-point turn during a winter storm, striking her boyfriend in the process before driving off.

After O'Keefe failed to return home hours later, Read allegedly went looking for him, before finding his body in a snowbank outside the home where she allegedly left him.

Thread #1
Thread #2

 

[Knitty]

Please continue the discussion here.

 

[ch_13]

Has anyone seen any cops at this trial? I know the courtroom is too small to accommodate spectators, but there are pro-Karen Read protestors standing outside the buffer zone. I haven't seen any cops. Usually, at the trial of an accused cop killer there are a phalanx of off-duty police officers to make their feelings known.

Of course, this occurred off-duty and the alleged killer was his girlfriend, so that may have something to do with it, but still it's a widely publicized trial.

Actually, come to think of it, I haven't even seen a statement by the Boston police union about this case. I just did a quick google search and nothing recent has come up. Anyone seen one? I'm really surprised they haven't even made any public comment.

 

[themonk]

If the defense has FBI experts that will testify that JO's injuries are not consistent with being hit by a car I think the prosecution will have a very hard time getting to 'beyond a reasonable doubt'.

Most people, for better or worse, tend to give what the FBI says a lot of weight.

 

[ch_13]

If the defense has FBI experts that will testify that JO's injuries are not consistent with being hit by a car I think the prosecution will have a very hard time getting to 'beyond a reasonable doubt'.

Most people, for better or worse, tend to give what the FBI says a lot of weight.

I believe they're actually third-party experts who were retained by the FBI. And I'm not sure that the defense will be allowed to state that the FBI hired them.

I noticed that when the federal grand jury was mentioned the other day, the lawyer called it something like "the grand jury where Mr. Lally was not present".

It seems that the judge wants to keep the jury in the dark about the federal investigation.

 

[themonk]

I believe they're actually third-party experts who were retained by the FBI. And I'm not sure that the defense will be allowed to state that the FBI hired them.

I noticed that when the federal grand jury was mentioned the other day, the lawyer called it something like "the grand jury where Mr. Lally was not present".

It seems that the judge wants to keep the jury in the dark about the federal investigation.

ah thanks for the info. very interesting

 

[HarmonyE.]

I believe they're actually third-party experts who were retained by the FBI. And I'm not sure that the defense will be allowed to state that the FBI hired them.

I'm not sure, but I've read the FBI expert with 3 PHDs is in-house. The defense also listed three biomechanical experts. Lally seemed surprised that they weren't accident reconstructionists.

No, Lally. The defense isn't going to reconstruct an accident they are arguing didn't happen.

 

[ch_13]

I'm not sure, but I've read the FBI expert with 3 PHDs is in-house. The defense also listed three biomechanical experts. Lally seemed surprised that they weren't accident reconstructionists.

No, Lally. The defense isn't going to reconstruct an accident they are arguing didn't happen.

I don't think it was one person with three PhDs. I believe it's these three gentlemen who were on the defense witness list:

75. Daniel Wolfe, Ph.D. ~ ARCCA, Inc. — Penns Park, PA
76. Andrew Rentschler, PhD. ~ ARCCA, Inc. — Penns Park, PA
77. Seott Kline, BSME ~ ARCCA, Inc. — Penns Park, PA

So actually 2 PhDs and a BS. There's also a third PhD, but he was retained separately by the defense before they knew about the FBI experts.

All three list "Accident Reconstruction" as one of their areas of expertise. I think, however, Kline is the actual reconstructionist: his bio says

• Accredited as a Traffic Accident Reconstructionist by ACTAR

Here's the ARCCA page if you want to look them up: Our Experts | ARCCA | Experts in Forensic, Scientific & Engineering Solutions

 

[HarmonyE.]

I believe it's these three gentlemen who were listed on the defense witness list:

75. Daniel Wolfe, Ph.D. ~ ARCCA, Inc. — Penns Park, PA
76. Andrew Rentschler, PhD. ~ ARCCA, Inc. — Penns Park, PA
77. Seott Kline, BSME ~ ARCCA, Inc. — Penns Park, PA

So actually 2 PhDs and a BS. There's also a third PhD, but I believe he was retained separately by the defense.

All three list "Accident Reconstruction" as one of their areas of expertise. I think, however, Kline is the actual reconstructionist: his bio says

• Accredited as a Traffic Accident Reconstructionist by ACTAR

Here's the ARCCA page if you want to look them up: Our Experts | ARCCA | Experts in Forensic, Scientific & Engineering Solutions

Most experts like this have PHDs. However, when talking about the FBI expert Yannetti said this individual had 3 PHDs.

 

[ch_13]

Most experts like this have PHDs. However, when talking about the FBI expert Yannetti said this individual had 3 PHDs.

It's confusing the way Yannetti stated it, but I'm positive when he said "3 PhDs" he meant three different people with PhDs.

In any case, I've looked up all the expert witnesses on the prosecution and defense lists and there's no one on them who's directly employed by the FBI nor anyone who holds three PhDs.

 

[housewife]

MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #2

Two points. First, Occam's Razor only applies after giving both sides a fair hearing. Until you've heard all the trial testimony, then it's inappropriate to use it. Second, Occam's Razor is not the appropriate standard for a criminal trial. The proper standard is "guilt beyond a reasonable...

www.websleuths.com

I'm having trouble confirming that KR and the defense "recruited" the problematic news blogger?
I've looked at the blog and he sources all his material related to this trial. Is his info inaccurate?
I don't know anything about his behavior but it sounds problematic, which is unfortunate.

 

[Charlot123]

I have a practical question. Unless in the course of the process they find out who was that SODDI who killed JO, I shall still have suspicion about KR.

But, this is my subjective human opinion. KR simply can not be ruled out as the culprit. Yet logically, unless there is a video showing how KR hits JO with the car, I think there is no solid case. No witnesses, no video. Maybe there is circumstantial evidence, but...Yanetti has circumstantial evidence, too. The Googles of JMc, for example. Mainly, you can't consider it a good investigation when the investigator admits in texts to his friends that he is not going to enter the house of BA because "they are cops". This is such a violation of any ethics. Now Yanetti states that JO was killed in the basement of BA's house. Personally, I am not sure. There may be dosens of reasons while the carpet is replaced. (Increases the property value before the sale, i think. BA doesn't look that fit, sleep apnea i'd guess. Maybe he was sleeping there drunk, maybe kids made a mess there). However, since Proctor never entered that basement, never set foot inside the house, it is impossible to disprove any defenses' statements.

So what happens in such cases? In CO, in case of BM, the case was "dismissed with prejudice."

Is this the way this case is going? Or, do you think the charges will be simply dismissed? Or, will there be a mistrial?

 

[ch_13]

I have a practical question. Unless in the course of the process they find out who was that SODDI who killed JO, I shall still have suspicion about KR.

But, this is my subjective human opinion. KR simply can not be ruled out as the culprit. Yet logically, unless there is a video showing how KR hits JO with the car, I think there is no solid case. No witnesses, no video. Maybe there is circumstantial evidence, but...Yanetti has circumstantial evidence, too. The Googles of JMc, for example. Mainly, you can't consider it a good investigation when the investigator admits in texts to his friends that he is not going to enter the house of BA because "they are cops". This is such a violation of any ethics. Now Yanetti states that JO was killed in the basement of BA's house. Personally, I am not sure. There may be dosens of reasons while the carpet is replaced. (Increases the property value before the sale, i think. BA doesn't look that fit, sleep apnea i'd guess. Maybe he was sleeping there drunk, maybe kids made a mess there). However, since Proctor never entered that basement, never set foot inside the house, it is impossible to disprove any defenses' statements.

So what happens in such cases? In CO, in case of BM, the case was "dismissed with prejudice."

Is this the way this case is going? Or, do you think the charges will be simply dismissed? Or, will there be a mistrial?

I don't see this judge dismissing the case or entering a directed verdict. The most likely scenario is that the trial will continue until the jury reaches a verdict or it hangs.

Personally, I don't think we'll ever know who killed John O'Keefe for sure. If KR is found guilty some people will always believe she was framed. If she's found not guilty others will think she got away with murder.

They'll eventually be articles and books and podcasts each with their own theory of whodunnit: whether that's Karen, Brian Higgins, one of the Alberts or even some other person who's never been mentioned to date.

People are still trying to figure out who killed Jon Benet Ramsey and that's been almost 30 years.

 

[housewife]

I have a practical question. Unless in the course of the process they find out who was that SODDI who killed JO, I shall still have suspicion about KR.

But, this is my subjective human opinion. KR simply can not be ruled out as the culprit. Yet logically, unless there is a video showing how KR hits JO with the car, I think there is no solid case. No witnesses, no video. Maybe there is circumstantial evidence, but...Yanetti has circumstantial evidence, too. The Googles of JMc, for example. Mainly, you can't consider it a good investigation when the investigator admits in texts to his friends that he is not going to enter the house of BA because "they are cops". This is such a violation of any ethics. Now Yanetti states that JO was killed in the basement of BA's house. Personally, I am not sure. There may be dosens of reasons while the carpet is replaced. (Increases the property value before the sale, i think. BA doesn't look that fit, sleep apnea i'd guess. Maybe he was sleeping there drunk, maybe kids made a mess there). However, since Proctor never entered that basement, never set foot inside the house, it is impossible to disprove any defenses' statements.

So what happens in such cases? In CO, in case of BM, the case was "dismissed with prejudice."

Is this the way this case is going? Or, do you think the charges will be simply dismissed? Or, will there be a mistrial?

I am still stunned this was brought to trial in the first place.

Before this trial I assumed that any one of the circumstances below would be cause for a legal do-over:

-Main investigator is under IA, FBI review

-Multiple experts citing JO's injuries don't match a vehicle strike.

-The worst beer pong cup usage ever

-Media relaying false propanganda from the prosecution, reporting a recording existed of KR's car striking JO.

Each day I kind of hope the FBI interrupts the trial mid-stream and shuts it all down.

 

[shotgun09]

I am still stunned this was brought to trial in the first place.

Before this trial I assumed that any one of the circumstances below would be cause for a legal do-over:

-Main investigator is under IA, FBI review

-Multiple experts citing JO's injuries don't match a vehicle strike.

-The worst beer pong cup usage ever

-Media relaying false propanganda from the prosecution, reporting a recording existed of KR's car striking JO.

Each day I kind of hope the FBI interrupts the trial mid-stream and shuts it all down.

Can we please add that the DA of MA, Mr Morrisey attempted to intervene with the IA and FBI investigation, in order to protect certain players?

See...none of that shady business will be allowed into this trial.

"Pretend it didn't happen, mmkay?"

 

[Ray_of_hope]

I've been trying to play catch up on this Mother's Day and watched the opening arguments and a few early days of the trial footage on court tv. I feel so heartbroken for JO's mom and dad. But on this Mother's Day, Peggy O'Keefe has only one child left of 3 and I just burst into tears watching her and her husband at the trial. This family has caused no harm to anyone. The children have all worked hard for wonderful careers. Their daughter that died of a glioblastoma was a vice president at State Street Bank in Boston and their son, JO, was a Boston Police officer. They have one son left and 2 grandchildren. The next holiday will be Father's Day. How absolutely heartbreaking. They look so broken and in so much pain. My heart goes out to them both. Oh my...

 

[arielilane]

January 28, 2022, KR, JOK and friends are at the Waterfall Bar & Grill in Canton.

January 29, 2022, (at 4-5 am) while heavy snow was falling JOK’s niece called JMc, and a friend of JOK. The niece said KR was “distraught because John had not come home and wasn’t answering his cellphone.

Questions:
Why did KR decide to go look for JKO early that fateful morning?
There was bad blizzard type weather - KR had dropped John off earlier that morning- why didn’t she think that John was most likely staying put at Brian’s house until the snow let up?

Why did KR panic?
What made KR worried about JKO not being home?

Why did KR want to go back to the (crime) scene? Why did KR bring an entourage back with her to Brian’s property?
Why did KR mention a plow may have hit him?

https://www.cbsnews.com/boston/news/karen-read-trial-timeline-john-okeefe/

 

[arielilane]

The Commonwealth case has been weak thus far. Hope they end their case strong. If not, she walks.
However, she should walk. Solid proof needs to be there -- it is not there - beyond a reasonable doubt.
Poor - very poor handling of evidence. contamination. Not good.
That alone, means game over. moo

That JOK was killed in the home and dragged to the front yard - makes no sense.
The arm injuries - dog bites - where are the teeth marks?

The vehicle hit by accident - makes the most sense.

Apparently the state can't provide it. Case should never have gone to trial.

Poor KR, modern day LB.

All Speculative

 

[ch_13]

Why did KR decide to go look for JKO early that fateful morning?
There was bad blizzard type weather - KR had dropped John off earlier that morning- why didn’t she think that John was most likely staying put at Brian’s house until the snow let up?

Why did KR panic?
What made KR worried about JKO not being home?

Sure, I can believe that John would not come home and choose to stay over because of the weather.

These days though, we have cell phones. From everything I've read about John he seems like the kind of person who would call and let Karen know, especially with minor children at home. And he certainly doesn't seem like the type to ghost her and let all her calls go to voicemail.

I'm sure there are other guys out there who wouldn't think twice about something like that and would wander in whenever, figuring that they can dump the kids on their girlfriend. But those kind of guys wouldn't take on the responsibility of raising their sister's kids in the first place.

So, I can understand why Karen would start panicking when he went incommunicado.

 

[AppleTreeGreen]

A part of me does wonder if some of the DNA/forensic evidence could have been the possible result of cross-contamination?

For example, it is possible that trace evidence, including hair, fibers and pieces of glass, can be dispersed or transferred by multiple actions including movement, collisions or getting stuck on the fiber’s of one’s clothing.

For example, KR discovered her broken tailgate when she was still at JO’s home and then later she attempted CPR on JO when she found him on the snow. I wonder if it is possible some of the evidence, such as JO’s hair and microscopic glass pieces from the taillight could have been transferred from KR or her friend when they attempted to resuscitate JO and then later when KR is panicking and walking back and forth between the back of her car and the police cruiser?

DNA, accounts of strained relationship at center of case against Karen Read, documents show

Prosecutors unveiled new evidence Thursday in the run-up to the trial of Karen Read, including long-awaited DNA evidence from the scene, as they argued why they feel the murder case over the killing of John O’Keefe in Canton, Massachusetts, should move forward. The office also shared witness...

www.nbcboston.com

Trace Evidence: Introduction

www.forensicsciencesimplified.org

Secondary Transfer of DNA in Forensics

Secondary DNA transfer occurs when DNA is transferred to an object or person through an intermediate.

www.news-medical.net